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Old 09-25-2006   #61
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Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
I think it is a lack of talent...it isn't scheme. Great talent with a vanilla scheme will give you some results. Great schemes with poor talent will not matter.
I watched a good portion of the Den/NE game last night & the LB's were picking up their RB pass responsibilities as they came out of the backfield. The secondary did the same, they didn't let their reciever just run free. All this came together forcing brady to hold a split second longer, The Texans LBs & secondary aren't doing that, they're chasing theirs out & around. With the exception of Demeco & Dunta, these other LBs & DBs just aren't that good in zone pass coverage.

I did notice however that the DC blitzed more often than ours, but for the most part their D-line wasn't pressuring brady all that much by themselves either.

Last edited by Mr teX; 09-25-2006 at 03:19 PM. Reason: Left out something
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Old 09-25-2006   #62
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Mario is raw and I agree that his instincts and technique both need work. He is "NFL ready" in the sense that he's functional but then again this is only a surprise to you if you forget that he came out as a junior from NcSt ... hardly a football mecca or a notable schedule. We drafted him for his physical gifts and for his upside, not because he had 14.5 sacks against a bunch of nobodies. Whether or not it was the right draft decision, it's the one we made and there were a lot of good reasons for it.

Nobody is content to just write off poor play and his salary as a learning curve and accept it, but you have to recognize what he came into the league as; a freak athlete who admittedly from the jump was going to need a lot of coaching and technique work. If he improves his technique he stands to be the monster we all hope he will be.

OTOH throwing a blitz now and then might help free him or his teammates up for a sack or two. Defensively we are in the bottom half of the league talent-wise, and there have been many instances where I have watched tape and seen someone clearly overpursue, botch a tackle, or make some other variety of personal error, but scheme is a big, big part of defensive success, or lack of it, and right now we're flat out not putting our guys in a position to make plays.
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Old 09-25-2006   #63
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I watched the game again last night...I specifically watched mario and the defense...He was single handedly owned on 2 touchdowns...It's going to take some time people, deal with it.

I agree this guy is very green, but he has great strength and speed...I don't know if you saw this play, but he did run down santana moss from the opposite side of the field !!!

Saunders did a good job preparing his guys and making Mario look like a rookie ...In fact, Saunders called an excellent game against us and made Rick Smith look like a jack*****, especially the prevent defense that gave up the touchdown up the gut to Portis just before halftime.

Rediculous calls like that are part of the problem and the players know it.
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Old 09-25-2006   #64
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Hell to the No.
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Old 09-25-2006   #65
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MW is #1 pick and play like rookie Free Agent. LOL
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Old 09-25-2006   #66
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Don't worry Lance on 610 won't be an NFL evaluator of talent anytime soon. He is just another ***** with an opinion like us the difference is someone thought it would be a good idea to put a microphone in front of his pie-hole.
Sometimes opinions reflect reality...and in this case, nothing can be provided as evidence that these opinions are not based in reality.

While a rookie, green, inexperienced, whatever, the simple fact of the matter is that Mario has yet to give us even ONE "wow" play in three games. Heck, he hasn't even given us an "oh" play (meaning "oh, I see why they chose him with the first overall pick").
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Old 09-25-2006   #67
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So here is my question: Are we rushing him into the starting lineup? We have some decent backup DEs, so why not start them and let Williams sit for a few weeks? Is it the media? Is it his confidence? Right now I actually think he is more of a liability than threat, and I would rather play Babin or Peek than continue getting poor play from someone just because he's getting $60+ million

I hope that isn't the case for a 32nd ranked defense in 2005 that couldn't stop anyone and we draft DL #1 overall and he has to sit because he needs to learn the game.

I hope that isn't the case. If that was the case, we should have just traded down some spots and took whatever draft picks that they would have given us
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Old 09-25-2006   #68
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C'mon....Rushing the QB instead of playing the run ??? If he wanted the QB so bad he'd blitz more.....Thats an exscuse...Mario hasn't played well so far because he isn't good...yet...or at all...take your pick...
Yes..... I see very little concern for the run game from our front 4 against Washington. It looked like the four DLinemen were individually going for the QB on every play... except maybe Seth... he had a better game than I expected.

But they are rushing upfield(or trying to) leaving big holes for the run game.

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no offense, but we watched two different games I guess. Williams looked lost to me. He was pretty much invisible.
No...... maybe different expectations.... Like Xtruroyalty said.... when I rewatched the DVD-R....... He looks like a mOnster.... physically. His Power, his speed.....

His instincts are like you say..... poor. I don't beleive you can teach those, but you can teach him on certain plays, it's not a good idea to run the tackle/TE around the QB. Instead, in some situations........ it's better to close off the end.

I understand he is raw...... but I see more problems with what RichardSmith is asking him to do, not only does it look like his instincts are poor, but his focue is off........... when we expect a run...... go get the RB. When we expect a pass, go get the QB..... try to teach him to recognize the reverse..... etc... etc...... I wonder what exactly are they talking about through the week.... Looks like they are working on his Bench, and shuttle time.
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Old 09-25-2006   #69
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You stated that the Skins were barely able to "survive the Mario Onslaught". Kubiak said point blank that he didn't play well and there are some people saying that Kubiak is calling him out publicly also (CP show). You go on believing whatever you are spewing.
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Old 09-25-2006   #70
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After thinking about the situation with Mario for a while two things come to mind.

1. It isn't the plays where Mario gets close to the quarterback but is too late that disappoint me, it's ALL of the other plays where he's a non-factor. He simply hasn't impacted the way the opposing team goes about their business. There's a handful of plays where he used his abilities to get close to the QB or the RB, but there's 20 plays for each of those where he just gets stood up or takes himself out of the play. It's unacceptable at this point, and I'm not sure it's going to get better this year.

2. Is it me or has nobody looked good on our defense this year? We do have talent on the defensive side of the ball.... Dunta isn't a pro-bowler but he's quite talented, as is Anthony Weaver. Even the people we know to be talented players have looked like street free agents to this point. That allows me to hold out some hope for Mario that maybe, just maybe if we can fix the things that are going on fundamentally and game-planning wise with this defense, he could show us that he's better than we think he is at this point.
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Old 09-25-2006   #71
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all i read in this message board this offseason was how mario is 6'7 300 pounds with a 42 inch vertical leap and runs a 4.6. who cares this guy makes no plays and shouldnt even be on the field the only reason he starts is because he was the number one pick. if he was drafted in the 5th round you would hardly see this guy on the field.hey lets stop the hate on the local kid vy. hes not shown any reason to think he will be bust unlike mario. wheres all the walli lundy fans during the preseason they were all over the board bragging about how we dont need bush we got lundy and in this sytem any back can put up 1500 yards.right now our offense stinks the defense is even worse and the future doesnt look much better. we are now 2-17 our last 19 games freaking pathetic.maybe this organization should focus on bringing in good football talent instead of trying to prove how much smarter they are compared to other organizations. theres not one team in the league who would have taken mario number one and i dont think there is another team that would have stuck with carr this long
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Old 09-25-2006   #72
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Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
You stated that the Skins were barely able to "survive the Mario Onslaught". Kubiak said point blank that he didn't play well and there are some people saying that Kubiak is calling him out publicly also (CP show). You go on believing whatever you are spewing.
Yeah, the "Mario Onslaught" was a bit of hyperbole... & yes, Kubiak said he didn't play well..... he also said David didn't play well.

There were somethings David did well...... getting AJ involved early in the game.... hitting 6(??) recievers....... managing the no huddle, hurry up offense.

But there were some things he didn't do well, that makes his overall game poor.

Same with Mario..... he got up the field, he made a play of two.... he showed good hustle.....

But he was indecisive...... didn't contain the reverse (didn't stay at home).... didn't shed blocks........ failed to identify the run..... etc.

I think Mario has shown that he belongs in this league..... he was a half a second away from his first sack on several occasions, and was actually robbed of a sack by an offensive hold....


I'd love for him to have a rookie season like JuliusPeppers, JevonKearse & Darren Howard.... he still has 13 games to do so.

We will see.
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Old 09-25-2006   #73
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I think it is a lack of talent...it isn't scheme. Great talent with a vanilla scheme will give you some results. Great schemes with poor talent will not matter.
Umm.... I thought we could take 6th round talent to the probowl with the right scheme....... 2000 rushing yards and all.
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Old 09-25-2006   #74
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No its a lack of playcalling. Nobody is successful rushing a straight forward 4-3 in the NFL anymore. That means rushing from the same front 4 positions and without using blitzes. If you can find an example please post it.
If our guys could cover their recievers for 2 seconds, we'd get sacks.

Did you guys not notice the recievers coming out of the backfield were open??

When David does those dinks & dunks, we criticize him and blame him for our inept offense....... at least I do.

but both Philly & Washington hung 500 yards on our back 7 with dinks & dunks... are they that much talented than us at runningback....... tightend....... & fullback??

They are more talented, with Clinton Portis, and Brian Westbrook, but while they are running in 34 yard screens & shouvle passes, our guys are getting dropped at the spot they caught the ball... why?? Because their Linebackers & Safeties are actually helping their defensive lines.
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Old 09-25-2006   #75
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Sometimes opinions reflect reality...and in this case, nothing can be provided as evidence that these opinions are not based in reality.

While a rookie, green, inexperienced, whatever, the simple fact of the matter is that Mario has yet to give us even ONE "wow" play in three games. Heck, he hasn't even given us an "oh" play (meaning "oh, I see why they chose him with the first overall pick").
Bull......

The play where Mario was held, was a wow play. the Play where he tossed Runyan to chase McNabb out of the pocket(McNabbs only rush for a first in the philly game) was a wow play. there are actually several Wow plays.... unfortunately, they haven't paid off.....

Open your eyes, as soon as we stop giving up 30+ yards on screens(the responsibility of the people who are supposed to cover the recievers who regularly catch screens) & 50+ yards on underneath routes...... routes that don't take but 2 seconds to develop...... then you'll see Mario, TJ, Babin & Peek get multiple sacks per game.

I honestly can't see how people can go back and watch the game.... tivo'd or what ever & not see why we picked him #1. There is no question. He's definitely worth the pick, and he's going to be something all Texans can be proud of........
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Old 09-25-2006   #76
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After thinking about the situation with Mario for a while two things come to mind.

1. It isn't the plays where Mario gets close to the quarterback but is too late that disappoint me, it's ALL of the other plays where he's a non-factor. He simply hasn't impacted the way the opposing team goes about their business. There's a handful of plays where he used his abilities to get close to the QB or the RB, but there's 20 plays for each of those where he just gets stood up or takes himself out of the play. It's unacceptable at this point, and I'm not sure it's going to get better this year.

2. Is it me or has nobody looked good on our defense this year? We do have talent on the defensive side of the ball.... Dunta isn't a pro-bowler but he's quite talented, as is Anthony Weaver. Even the people we know to be talented players have looked like street free agents to this point. That allows me to hold out some hope for Mario that maybe, just maybe if we can fix the things that are going on fundamentally and game-planning wise with this defense, he could show us that he's better than we think he is at this point.

1. How many sacks did Darren Howard get against us?? None. How many batted balls?? None..... he was basically a non factor the whole game. Jevon Kearse only got one sack..... no batted balls, no forced fumbles..... one tackle... he was a non factor for the other 30 some odd snaps?? He & Howard both were on the sideline for three of the 5 sacks.

2. You can not be watching our games, if you think Weaver is amoung the more talented players on our Jason Babin, I think is our best DE....... he's got the power & the speed to get to the QB. TJ is playing very well, Sanders is playing very well...... Earl is playing well........ Demeco is making an impact...

Dunta & Weaver are closer to the bottom of the list so far.

Last edited by thunderkyss; 09-25-2006 at 09:01 PM.
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Old 09-25-2006   #77
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1. How many sacks did Darren Howard get against us?? None. How many batted balls?? None..... he was basically a non factor the whole game. Jevon Kearse only got one sack..... no batted balls, no forced fumbles..... one tackle... he was a non factor for the other 30 some odd snaps?? He & Howard both were on the sideline for three of the 5 sacks.

2. You can not be watching our games, if you think Weaver is amoung the more talented players on our D. Babin, I think is our best DE....... he's got the power & the speed to get to the QB. TJ is playing very well, Sanders is playing very well...... Earl is playing well........ Demeco is making an impact...

Dunta & Weaver are closer to the bottom of the list so far.
Sanders is playing well? Now I can't read the rest of the post.
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Old 09-25-2006   #78
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all i read in this message board this offseason was how mario is 6'7 300 pounds with a 42 inch vertical leap and runs a 4.6. who cares this guy makes no plays and shouldnt even be on the field the only reason he starts is because he was the number one pick. if he was drafted in the 5th round you would hardly see this guy on the field.hey lets stop the hate on the local kid vy. hes not shown any reason to think he will be bust unlike mario. wheres all the walli lundy fans during the preseason they were all over the board bragging about how we dont need bush we got lundy and in this sytem any back can put up 1500 yards.right now our offense stinks the defense is even worse and the future doesnt look much better. we are now 2-17 our last 19 games freaking pathetic.maybe this organization should focus on bringing in good football talent instead of trying to prove how much smarter they are compared to other organizations. theres not one team in the league who would have taken mario number one and i dont think there is another team that would have stuck with carr this long


Stop watching ESPN.... tape the games.... a VCR will work, and rewatch the game. Slow mo it...... time the QBs release. Mario is playing like a #1 pick. I'd love to hear what the OLines of the Eagles, the Colts, & the Redskins have to say about him. Most likely they'll say once Mario gets his head in the game, he'll be hell on legs......

Vy....... I love Vince. I wish we would have drafted him. But I don't think Mario was a bust, & I don't think it was a mistake to Draft Mario.

& Lundy would do well....... anyone can run for 1500 yards in this system..... but we aren't running the ZBS, and haven't since the Denver preseason game.
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Old 09-25-2006   #79
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Sanders is playing well? Now I can't read the rest of the post.
Sanders is playing well. Not very well, but well. He's our best Corner through three games. in passing defense...... against the run, it's Dunta hands down....
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Old 09-25-2006   #80
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give me a break... i dont care if your watching espn fox cbs on a vcr or tivo. it is so easy to see that mario doesnt make plays consistently gets handled at the line of scrimmage and really doesnt play with enough intensity to be consistent. if you think this guy is playing like a number one pick i think your about the only one have another sip because you got more than kool aid in that cup. but i understand no matter how he performs your gonna see what you want to see
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