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Old 02-08-2014   #161
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Originally Posted by bah007 View Post
Basically, if he was surrounded by premier talent he looked like a premier QB. But he couldn't elevate the talent around him. They actually elevated him.So when he got to the NFL and every team had similar talent, his flaws became magnified.
& just because McCarron didn't have to doesn't mean he couldn't.

Just because Manziel & Bridgewater could in college, when they were clearly the best player on the team (& Manziel was on a much more talented team), doesn't mean they can when the talent level is more "similar."

I contend that A.J. McCarron was a bigger part of Alabama's success than McElroy & JWP. Nowhere near the MVP type player that Manzeil & Bridgewater were for their team.

From what little bit I've learned of what O'Brien wants in a QB, no one comes as close as Aj McCarron.
Quote:
The University of Alabama coaching staff might have only just begun introducing players to Michigan last week, but quarterback AJ McCarron has seen plenty more of the Wolverines on his own.

The junior quarterback, along with many other UA players, logs hours watching film on his own time. McCarron has seen so much Michigan film, he probably looked around for popcorn.

“Summer, I broke everybody down. I kind of work with one of our GAs, Jeff Norrid. He helps me a bunch. He knows everything there is about defense,” McCarron said. “Through the summer, we broke each opponent down week-by-week, but probably in the past two, 21⁄2, we’ve watched a ton of film on (Michigan). Me and him are up here at least 31⁄2, four hours a day. We’ll come an hour or so before practice and then the rest after. So we’ve done a tremendous amount of breaking them down.”
Quote:
The Wolverines’ third down defense is what UA coach Nick Saban called “pro-style.”

McCarron said that, more than anything, means complex attempts to confuse the quarterback.

“They like to do a bunch of crazy things, try to confuse you,” he said. “They’ll spread everybody out, walk them around. Show different one way, blitz another. Do a bunch of different things, but I feel like our coaching staff has done a really good job of breaking them down, what they like to do. I guess we’ll see what else they have in store for us come Saturday.”
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Old 02-08-2014   #162
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

Yeah, I actually I agree with you, at least to some extent. Manziel has the higher ceiling because he has a special skill set. He could actually be a one in a generation kind of player.

But he has a much lower floor than Bridgewater. Manziel might very well go the Vince Young way or get injured early. The faster game with better competition will hurt his style of play, the question is how fast can he adjust to it and how much punishment can his body take.

Bridgewaters floor IŽd say is Alex Smith - something like an ultimate game manager. Doesn`t take many chance, doesn`t do many mistakes, can buy time in the pocket and run when he has to, but won`t take many shot downfield. A QB that won`t get you miracle comebacks, but one the can finish the game in a positive way for you.
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Old 02-08-2014   #163
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Yeah, I actually I agree with you, at least to some extent. Manziel has the higher ceiling because he has a special skill set. He could actually be a one in a generation kind of player.

But he has a much lower floor than Bridgewater. Manziel might very well go the Vince Young way or get injured early. The faster game with better competition will hurt his style of play, the question is how fast can he adjust to it and how much punishment can his body take.

Bridgewaters floor IŽd say is Alex Smith - something like an ultimate game manager. Doesn`t take many chance, doesn`t do many mistakes, can buy time in the pocket and run when he has to, but won`t take many shot downfield. A QB that won`t get you miracle comebacks, but one the can finish the game in a positive way for you.
You had me until you mentioned Vince Young in relation to Manziel.

Vince Young's biggest problem, was that he was a big baby. When they were winning, Vince was one of the more promising up & coming QBs. Yeah, he gets a lot of hate around here, but it is what it is. When they started losing, he didn't know how to deal with it & it snowballed from there.

I don't know how Manziel is going to react when things get tough. I don't know how Bridgewater is going to react when things get tough. Just like I didn't expect to see Keenum regress when things weren't going his way... things he had absolutely no control over.

Give either of these kids $15M & tell them it's up to them to save a franchise... it can have some damning effects on a person.

All that to say I agree with you, Manziel has the lower floor.... but it has nothing to do with any Vince Young syndrome.
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Old 02-08-2014   #164
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
& just because McCarron didn't have to doesn't mean he couldn't.

Just because Manziel & Bridgewater could in college, when they were clearly the best player on the team (& Manziel was on a much more talented team), doesn't mean they can when the talent level is more "similar."

I contend that A.J. McCarron was a bigger part of Alabama's success than McElroy & JWP. Nowhere near the MVP type player that Manzeil & Bridgewater were for their team.


From what little bit I've learned of what O'Brien wants in a QB, no one comes as close as Aj McCarron.
I agree with all of the bolded. Despite what everyone is saying about O'Brien's QBs, I don't think anyone has enough info to be able to figure out exactly what he is looking for. It's all guesswork. But the fact that McCarron studied so much film to prepare for Michigan can certainly not be taken as a negative.

My point in the previous post was not to demean McCarron. Only to point out that using Leinart to prop him up does not help your argument. Leinart failed. Just because he was drafted high doesn't mean he was worthy of being drafted high.

His flaws/question marks were the same flaws/question marks that most people see in McCarron. That doesn't make it an absolute truth or anything that McCarron will end up the same. But pointing out that a similar prospect who busted was drafted high doesn't help.
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Old 02-08-2014   #165
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Originally Posted by bah007 View Post

My point in the previous post was not to demean McCarron. Only to point out that using Leinart to prop him up does not help your argument. Leinart failed. Just because he was drafted high doesn't mean he was worthy of being drafted high.
Cool. I think differently. I think Lienart failed, because he didn't have that drive that we think Bridgewater & Manziel have... that drive that Tom Brady developed. Like I said in my previous post, you give a kid $15M to sign his name & that can kill a lot of "drive."

He had his moments in 2006. Kubiak thought enough of him to bring him here. Then he went to the Raiders, then Buffalo... Surely he was getting those chances based on something.

Still... tomato, tomahto..... he failed, as some prospects will even if graded accurately. Those guys on TV only make it look easy.
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Old 02-10-2014   #166
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Context doesn't matter, if you are saying you don't like a guy because he can't do anything better then he already does at the age of 21 then you are just reaching for reasons to hate on a guy you obviously already don't like (which is Bridgewater in thunders case).

I say again, every player has room for improvement. The leap from college football to the NFL is so vast that you have to improve so much just to even make a roster.

Seriously, the discussion in this place has gotten so weird...we aren't even analyzing a players actual abilities anymore and instead just making up talking points that aren't even there...I swear by the end of this month we will be talking about which QB is the best looking and whether or not that will effect his confidence and spill over into games. Not pointing fingers, we all are doing it. I can't wait until at least the combine has passed so we have some more actual data to analyze .
You know what they say about guys with ugly girlfriends right? No confidence. We need to find picks of his GF.

But honestly, I agree with you. When people are saying he is too good now, it is pretty wack IMO.

Think of the NFL as a business and think of yourself as the boss of the business.

You've got 2 guys to choose for the job promotion... 1 guy goes into work every morning on time, and stays late every day, can be relied on 100%, goes above and beyond his job requirements and gets the job done. Comes in Saturdays, and takes short lunches if you ask, he puts in the work and wants you to see it.

The other is really smart, possibly smarter although we haven't really seen it consistently. He calls in sick all the time, comes in late, leaves early, you can't find him at his desk half the time, but dude is smart, and the dude is good at his job. Can't be denied. If he puts his mind to it and gives everything he has he can be amazing, but he doesn't. Maybe it's because he doesn't have to. He does just enough to make it through the day, but at the end of the day he still does a great job and gets the numbers you want.

Who do you promote to management AKA who do you draft?

Oh yeah, and a 21 year old is NEVER maxed out on how much they can improve. Were any of you at 21?

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
If he goes to the Patriots, or Steelers in the 6th. Going to the Cardinals or Bills, or one of these other QB black holes... not so much.
I believe that if AJ McCarron goes to the Cardinals he CAN BE successful. I think that would be a premium spot for him to land. Great WRs, Incredible Defense, Solid run game that seems to be improving.

Last edited by TexansFTW; 02-10-2014 at 11:59 AM.
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Old 02-11-2014   #167
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

AJ McCarron Scouting Report: NFL Outlook for Alabama QB
Quote:
Positives
...
Negatives
...
NFL Comparison: Matt Schaub, QB, Houston Texans

Collegiate Statistics
...
Personal Notes

Second-team All-SEC 2013
Maxwell Award 2013
Johnny Unitas Golden Arm Award 2013
Second-team All-SEC 2012
Third-team All-American 2012
BCS National Championship MVP 2012
Redshirted 2009
Team captain as a senior
36-4 record as a starter
Graduated with a degree in health studies

Overall

Following a prolific college career in which he won two national titles and several personal accolades, AJ McCarron will be out to prove that he can be an effective starting quarterback in the NFL.

While his decision not to perform at the Senior Bowl disappointed fans and scouts alike, he will have a chance to show teams what he can do later in the process.

An efficient, intelligent and accurate passer, he would fit best in a West Coast offense. Though he appears to have the makings of a strong backup, he possesses starter potential in the right spot.

Draft Projection: Third round
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Old 02-20-2014   #168
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

Ian Rapoport ‏@RapSheet
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Alabama QB AJ McCarron is planning on doing everything at @NFL Scouting Combine. Had sat out @seniorbowl, scouts eager to see him throw
Measured 6'3 1/4", 220 lbs., 10" hand.

James Palmer ‏@JPalmerCSN
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AJ McCarron said if he could compare himself to one NFL QB in terms of body build and perception coming out of the draft it'd be Tom Brady.

"New England is the Alabama of the NFL." AJ McCarron on Saban and Belichick similarities
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Scott Kacsmar ‏@FO_ScottKacsmar
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Ask McCarron if he knows who Ken Dorsey is.

Last edited by Playoffs; 02-21-2014 at 02:11 PM.
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Old 02-23-2014   #169
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

Gabriel prefers Bieber...

Rob Rang ‏@RobRang
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30 yr NFL vet. RT @greggabe I'll take McCarron over Bortles 100% of the time. I've have liked AJ since I started doing tape on him in Aug.
Greg Gabriel ‏@greggabe
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People criticize McCarron because the QB's at 'Bame before him failed in NFL. That's BS evaluation

I know McCarron had great players around him, but his receivers weren't close to being top players. Not close to what LSU had

knows what he can't do. Leader, seldom forces things. Makes plays etc etc

By tomorrow the "experts" will have McCarron back in the 1st

McCarron is doing a good job shutting up the critics today
Joel Klatt ‏@joelklatt
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For QB's the amount of guys that are struggling with 7 step drop is staggering today. Bortles, McCarron, & Garoppolo doing well
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These are pretty good post-corners from McCarron.

McCarron's vertical pass..... Even Bucky didn't like it
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2/3 of A.J. McCarron's passes in that drill were ugly

Last edited by Playoffs; 02-23-2014 at 11:15 AM.
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Old 02-23-2014   #170
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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By tomorrow the "experts" will have McCarron back in the 1st
Back?
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Old 02-23-2014   #171
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

Evaluation is a funny thing. 1 expert says he has proven himself and will be in the first. Another says 2/3 of his throws were ugly. How does that make any sense?
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Old 02-23-2014   #172
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Evaluation is a funny thing. 1 expert says he has proven himself and will be in the first. Another says 2/3 of his throws were ugly. How does that make any sense?
Maycock can really be off at times, growing tiresome on my nerves, he is not natural at player evaluation.
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Old 02-23-2014   #173
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

Mayock gets a lot of credit around these parts but he picks his favorites just like everyone else. He'll never say a bad word about the guys that he has a soft spot for but he will absolutely rip other guys apart.
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Old 02-23-2014   #174
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Mayock gets a lot of credit around these parts but he picks his favorites just like everyone else. He'll never say a bad word about the guys that he has a soft spot for but he will absolutely rip other guys apart.
Clowney must be on his bad side then....
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Old 02-23-2014   #175
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Maycock can really be off at times, growing tiresome on my nerves, he is not natural at player evaluation.
His evaluation skills are suffering from that NBC contract. Instead of evaluating college games all day he is preparing for and calling Notre Dame games.
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Old 02-23-2014   #176
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Originally Posted by kiwitexansfan View Post
Evaluation is a funny thing. 1 expert says he has proven himself and will be in the first.
30 year NFL scout.

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Originally Posted by kiwitexansfan View Post
Another says 2/3 of his throws were ugly. How does that make any sense?
2 of 3 throws in the long pass drill were poor today.

My knock on McCarron has been arm strength and long ball. It looks to me his passes hold speed for ~15 yards or so. Maybe more than that, though, I have trouble recalling "plus" plays/"wow" moments. 2nd round for WCO/Shanny -- Kubiak would love him, imo.


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A.J. McCarron has what I'd call a "box of excellence" that goes out to the numbers on either side, and about 30 yards upfield. Nothing more.
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Old 02-23-2014   #177
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

Hmm, most of what I've heard about McCarron throwing today was simply glowing.
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Old 02-23-2014   #178
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Hmm, most of what I've heard about McCarron throwing today was simply glowing.
I think he's helped himself from what I have seen and also heard. I don't know what it means for his overall draft grade though.
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Old 02-24-2014   #179
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

Aj McCarron's compares to:

Curtis Painter, Josh Booty, Brandon Weedon to name a few.
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Old 02-25-2014   #180
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Default Re: AJ McCarron

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Mayock gets a lot of credit around these parts but he picks his favorites just like everyone else. He'll never say a bad word about the guys that he has a soft spot for but he will absolutely rip other guys apart.
Mayock destroys about 99% of players, especially in the evaluation process.

The biggest difference on Thursday night Football and Monday night Football is Mayock hates and finds fault with every player that walks on the field and Gruden loves and finds great qualities with every player that walks on the field.
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