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Old 01-07-2014   #1021
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
I understand trashcanning the staff responsible for a 2-14 season. That's to be expected. My question is why? Because he didn't think any of them could do the job?
Fair enough.
But if O'Brien fired them all so he can bring in his own set of buddies (like Kubiak did) without looking around the league, or in the college ranks, to see who might be BETTER than his buddies at each position, well, this sounds eeriely like the way things unfolded with Kubiak and with Capers before him...

....we just left that movie didn't we? I thought this was supposed to be different.

I got "excited" with Kubiak before all the results were in. Not doing that with O'Brien.

Like you say, we'll all find out together.
When a team hires an NFL coach, they are getting said coaches buddy list along with the ride. Capers did the same things really when he came in, and I'm pretty sure the 6 or 7 other new HC's next year are also going to do that as well.

Basically you have to believe that the people O'Brien wants to bring in are the people who can coach this team up into a winner and perennial playoff appearance if you think this regime will succeed.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1022
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
I understand trashcanning the staff responsible for a 2-14 season. That's to be expected. My question is why? Because he didn't think any of them could do the job?
Fair enough.
But if O'Brien fired them all so he can bring in his own set of buddies (like Kubiak did) without looking around the league, or in the college ranks, to see who might be BETTER than his buddies at each position, well, this sounds eeriely like the way things unfolded with Kubiak and with Capers before him...

....we just left that movie didn't we? I thought this was supposed to be different.

I got "excited" with Kubiak before all the results were in. Not doing that with O'Brien.

Like you say, we'll all find out together.
The way I see it, I would be very surprised if he didn't bring in his buddies, especially position coaches.

It would be interesting to note everytime a new head coach is hired how many of his buddies he brings.

I believe it's a way to bring in your philosophy quickly because those coaches already know it and have bought into it.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1023
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
I, for one, can't get "excited" until there's something to get excited about. This new dude - and I mean O'Brien - hasn't done anything of note as yet. I do know this. I have much higher expectations from him than I did from Kubiak when he got here.
- He is inheriting a much, much better cast of characters than Kubiak inherited when he got here.
- He's not saddled with the owner's damaged "fair-haired boy" at QB and actually gets to pick his own guy.
- If Foster heals properly he'll have a stud at RB (and speaking of which, what are the odds of that Doc??).
- He'll have a stud at LT, a solid guy at center, and some decent prospects at the other O-line spots; something it took the previous regime three drafts to find and another year or two to fully develop.
- He has an all-time great at WR plus some potential studs at the other WR spots as well at TE.

All the offensive pieces - except QB - are here for this "offensive genius" to make work. And he gets to pick his own guy at QB.

I wanna see what he does with this loaded toy box before I get "excited".

Or will he throw it all away and start over like he did the whole coaching staff??
You think that Kubiak and O'Brien are the only ones that do this? You are wrong. This is business as usual for new regimes when they come in.

It's mind boggling that people actually get upset or get frustrated because old coaches get fired from a regime that just lost 14 games in a row. Why this is even a discussion is weird on many levels.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1024
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

As long as he doesn't bring in Sanduski to "mentor" prepubescent/teenaged boys or any of Bele-cheat's "videographers" to help him cheat I'm good.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1025
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

I'd lose a little respect for O'Brien if he came in and kept any part of status quo.

New head coaches hire "their guys" for a number of reasons. I'd imagine the primary reason is to get a staff that can implement the head coach's schemes on both sides of the ball.

And there is the matter of trust, especially during crucial situations in games. Coordinators get a bit of autonomy, so there has to be a foundation of trust in the way an assistant coach is going to adjust to what the other team is doing and how that assistant is going to react when the pressure of the moment is on and the game is on the line.

And just basic stuff like compatibility in the daily grind is important when they spend so much time together. Chemistry starts at the top, with the coaches, and we've see the oil and water mix in Houston before. Having two warring factions within a team is never good for business.

I'm a little curious why Rick Smith, the general manager, did not fire the previous staff. It seems like making the new guy do all the dirty work, but then again, maybe that is the established power structure on Kirby. They want a strong head coach.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1026
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
I'd lose a little respect for O'Brien if he came in and kept any part of status quo.
Well, they did keep Kollar (I'm guessing at the behest of JJ).
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Old 01-07-2014   #1027
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
I understand trashcanning the staff responsible for a 2-14 season. That's to be expected. My question is why? Because he didn't think any of them could do the job?...
Because he doesn't want to have to teach/train his coaches along with his players -- he's got enough on his plate as it is and a shorter leash in the NFL...

And because he wants guys who coach with a lot of enthusiasm. So he retained Bill Kollar.

You either trust the guy to make his own decisions... or you don't hire him.
  • His pressers will suck like Belichick's.
  • He'll take ultimate responsibility because failure is his responsibility.
  • He's a QB coach because the NFL more than ever is a QB league.
  • He won't throw his players under the bus because leaders with integrity don't do that.
  • He'll call his own plays because he's smart enough to do so, until he finds another guy he trusts to do same... which he will.

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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
And more than that, I want to see who he picks as his defensive coordinator...But if it ends up being another of his buds.....
DC will be Crennel, who is another one of his "buds", unless something screwy is going on.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1028
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

It seems like I'm in bizarro world where new NFL head coaches are expected to keep the assistant coaches from the previous failed regime.
What the hell are people thinking?
Keeping coaches from the previous staff is the exception, not the rule.
Virtually 100% of new HCs bring in 100% new coaching staffs. They don't keep the old coaches in almost every instance.
They also don't hire people that they are not familiar with, and/or have not worked with before. Some of y'all have a completely inaccurate idea of what happens when HCs are fired in the NFL. It's like you haven't been watching the game at all.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1029
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
I'm a little curious why Rick Smith, the general manager, did not fire the previous staff. It seems like making the new guy do all the dirty work, but then again, maybe that is the established power structure on Kirby. They want a strong head coach.
Yep. You answered your own question: they didn't fire the coaching staff because they wanted the new head coach to do it. That, in turn, sends a signal that the new coach means business.

This is more than a coaching change; this is a culture change. McNair is not playing around (even his attitude seems different) and wants to send a strong signal. You do that by hiring a head coach that's not afraid to roll in and clean house.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1030
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Originally Posted by michaelm View Post
It seems like I'm in bizarro world where new NFL head coaches are expected to keep the assistant coaches from the previous failed regime.
What the hell are people thinking?
Keeping coaches from the previous staff is the exception, not the rule.
Virtually 100% of new HCs bring in 100% new coaching staffs. They don't keep the old coaches in almost every instance.
They also don't hire people that they are not familiar with, and/or have not worked with before. Some of y'all have a completely inaccurate idea of what happens when HCs are fired in the NFL. It's like you haven't been watching the game at all.
I'm guessing that people saw that Kubiak kept one or two of Capers' assistants - Marciano and Harris, I think - and assumed that that is how it's done. It's the "nice guy" way of doing things, in a lot of people's minds.

But, the truth is, O'Brien was well within reason to clean house and not get input from the current coaches. Had we gone, say, 8-8, then maybe I could see considering keeping a few more people.

But, 2-14? And losing 14 in a row?

Hell no.

Everybody and their mamma should have been fired.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1031
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
Soooo we should be okay with O'Brien showing signs of the same behavior Kubiak did.
- Offensive-minded head coach who also calls the plays... Check.
- Head coach who's supposed to be a "QB Guru"... Check.
- Was a coordinator, with no NFL HC-ing experience, on a Super Bowl winner... Check.
- Some flavor of "It's on me" at pressers... Check.
- Hiring his buds instead of doing a thorough search for better candidates... Check.

Same behaviour as the last guy but we should expect a different result...??

What's the word for that again...??
Not the one you are going for but - duplicitous. What this experience should teach is all those criticisms were made up BS in the first place. Easy allegations without any substance.

Lose a game and we will start hearing about the Ihop menu.

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Old 01-07-2014   #1032
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Not the one you are going for but - duplicitous. What this experience should teach is all those criticisms were made up BS in the first place. Easy allegations without any substance.

Lose a game and we will start hearing about the Ihop menu.

Very true. As much as I wanted Kubiak gone, I tried to be fair about it, and not judge him based on nonsense like not looking at field goals, his colorful playbook (which damn-near every coach has) and his boring press conferences.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1033
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Originally Posted by houstonspartan View Post
Very true. As much as I wanted Kubiak gone, I tried to be fair about it, and not judge him based on nonsense like not looking at field goals, his colorful playbook (which damn-near every coach has) and his boring press conferences.
Those were three things that a lot of people bitched about that made absolutely no sense to me.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1034
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

Friedgen on O'Brien relating to players

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Houston Texans coach Bill O'Brien has had several coaching mentors throughout his career. One of them is Ralph Friedgen, the former Maryland coach who first presided over O'Brien when both were at Georgia Tech...
Friedgen hired O'Brien as a running backs coach and then tried to hire him as his offensive coordinator at Maryland.
...
"I think he’s blatantly honest with them," Friedgen said. "...We’re a lot alike in that way. I’m an emotional guy, he’s an emotional guy. He’ll tell you how he feels. You’ll see him get very angry, you’ll also see him get quiet. I think what happens is people can trust him. I think it wasn’t an easy decision for him to leave now. I think he could have done it last year. But because of the commitment the players made there and the commitment he made to the players (he stayed)."
...
He also noted, as others have, that O'Brien's strength is working with quarterbacks.

"If they draft a quarterback, I think they will, he’ll get excellent guidance," he said. "He’s not the coordinator, he’s the head coach but he’ll have an impact on that. He’ll hire somebody that’s going to be thinking the same way he does. ... You’ve gotta have a quarterback or you won’t win."

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Interesting note. Both Bill O'Brien and @BuffaloBills coach Doug Marone were on same Georgia Tech staff in late 90s: http://bit.ly/1gC6m05
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Old 01-07-2014   #1035
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Those were three things that a lot of people bitched about that made absolutely no sense to me.
Exactly - I have a hard time believing people really believe some of what's said.

Team Owner/GM : I see you want to hire <fill in the blank> as your newest assistant coach.
Head Coach : Yes - I think he'll do a fine job as our <fill in the blank> coach.
TO/GM : Is this someone you're personally familiar with?
HC : Yes he is.
TO/GM : Have you worked with him before?
HC : Yes I have. I've seen him work first hand, and based on that, I believe he can help this team succeed.
TO/GM : Is this someone you've actually hired before when you were putting together another coaching staff?
HC : Yes, I thought enough of him to hire him before, and based on that experience, I'm willing to stake some of my success on my previous experience.
TO/GM : Then I'm sorry I can't approve the hire. Please go out and find someone you've never worked with or met, and then come back and talk to me.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1036
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Exactly - I have a hard time believing people really believe some of what's said.

Team Owner/GM : I see you want to hire as your newest assistant coach.
Head Coach : Yes - I think he'll do a fine job as our coach.
TO/GM : Is this someone you're personally familiar with?
HC : Yes he is.
TO/GM : Have you worked with him before?
HC : Yes I have. I've seen him work first hand, and based on that, I believe he can help this team succeed.
TO/GM : Is this someone you've actually hired before when you were putting together another coaching staff?
HC : Yes, I thought enough of him to hire him before, and based on that experience, I'm willing to stake some of my success on my previous experience.
TO/GM : Then I'm sorry I can't approve the hire. Please go out and find someone you've never worked with or met, and then come back and talk to me.

Lmao!!!!


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Old 01-07-2014   #1037
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Very true. As much as I wanted Kubiak gone, I tried to be fair about it, and not judge him based on nonsense like not looking at field goals, his colorful playbook (which damn-near every coach has) and his boring press conferences.
If you've ever been in a relationship that is well past it's prime, even the little innocuous things tend to get on your nerves.

I think these Kubiak tendencies were those little things that people would focus on because they did not like the head coach.

I'm not defending it as much as I'm trying to explain it.

I found the whole Denny's menu thing to be more humor than any real legitimate criticism. Sometimes, though, my perception was that it seemed like a bit of a crutch, sort of a way to bury his face in it instead of ruling the sidelines like other head coaches. Kubiak sometimes stared a hole through it like the answers to a particular problem would magically jump out at him (and I think this tendency is from years of being an offensive coordinator where their minds are buried in the playbook for entire games).

I could not care less about boring press conferences, although I do like those coaches that break down plays and strategies after games. Mainly to be educated about the game and schemes for my own enjoyment. But I do not criticize a coach for being mundane with the press.

The field goal thing was just a weird little quirk. I never understood it, but I never felt like it reflected on him as a coach. Some would argue it's a nervous thing. As long as he's not closing his eyes when he shoots a weapon.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1038
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

Boring press conferences?? You'd better hope they remain boring, else they end up on Youtube, and not shown in a positive light.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1039
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Boring press conferences?? You'd better hope they remain boring, else they end up on Youtube, and not shown in a positive light.
Yeah, we've all seen a few of those with three of 'em just about tied for first place.
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Old 01-07-2014   #1040
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Default Re: Texans hire Bill O'Brien as HC

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Boring press conferences?? You'd better hope they remain boring, else they end up on Youtube, and not shown in a positive light.
Unless the coach wins championships. Then they become legendary, like the way Bill Parcells or Mike Ditka would deal with the media.

Personally, I get a kick out of the droll attitude that Belichick takes with the media, especially after seeing his "A Football Life" and his personality away from the press. He plays mind games with those media people.

But yeah, in general, you probably do not want your HC to be known for his meltdowns more than whatever he accomplishes as HC.

As a football fan, I do love to see head coaches on other teams have those moments!
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