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Old 12-28-2013   #241
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Belichick, Carroll, Kubiak (had), Shanahan for strarters.
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Should we start with Kubiak? How about Carroll? Johnson? Parcels? Belichick? Fisher? Spurrier?
Exaggerating a bit. Kubiak, yes. Main reasoning though is he had an owner uneducated in how the league plays and who had meetings with Kubiak and Smith as he learned his way. Easy to say at this point McNair is no longer uneducated in that department.

Belichik did not have full authority. In fact, some of the more bigger moves he got approval from Art Modell before hand. His first coaching was with the Browns after all. He had say but not some mystical full authority. All coaches have some say in personnel unless under a GM with an iron hand which is more rare than often.

Carroll also did not have full authority. His first coaching job was with the Patriots. His experiences with the Patriots and the power issues there is what caused him requesting more in Seattle.

Shanny did not have full authority either. It was one of the issues. His first job was with the Raiders. He and Al Davis butted heads often and frequently hence his short time period there.

Previous you named Spurrier who also didn't have full authority and even got overridden by Snyder. Fisher didn't either as that wasn't a case that happened with a Bud Adams team.

Coaches generally have input on personnel and that won't change. Only the most heavy handed GM's and owners would make it their sole responsibility and that is rare in this league. So no, the common stance is coaches have strong input on personnel and they choose their own staff.

Also I believe a point was brought McNair would be cheap in regards to staff (though again staff is chosen by the head coach 9 times out of 10). The Texans are one of the top teams in money spent. McNair is hardly cheap. Last time the listing came out we were 7th in this area.
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Old 12-28-2013   #242
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Exaggerating a bit. Kubiak, yes. Main reasoning though is he had an owner uneducated in how the league plays and who had meetings with Kubiak and Smith as he learned his way. Easy to say at this point McNair is no longer uneducated in that department.

Belichik did not have full authority. In fact, some of the more bigger moves he got approval from Art Modell before hand. His first coaching was with the Browns after all. He had say but not some mystical full authority. All coaches have some say in personnel unless under a GM with an iron hand which is more rare than often.

Carroll also did not have full authority. His first coaching job was with the Patriots. His experiences with the Patriots and the power issues there is what caused him requesting more in Seattle.

Shanny did not have full authority either. It was one of the issues. His first job was with the Raiders. He and Al Davis butted heads often and frequently hence his short time period there.

Previous you named Spurrier who also didn't have full authority and even got overridden by Snyder. Fisher didn't either as that wasn't a case that happened with a Bud Adams team.

Coaches generally have input on personnel and that won't change. Only the most heavy handed GM's and owners would make it their sole responsibility and that is rare in this league. So no, the common stance is coaches have strong input on personnel and they choose their own staff.

Also I believe a point was brought McNair would be cheap in regards to staff (though again staff is chosen by the head coach 9 times out of 10). The Texans are one of the top teams in money spent. McNair is hardly cheap. Last time the listing came out we were 7th in this area.
Tell us who did have control then.
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Old 12-28-2013   #243
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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There's nothing to indicate Shaw can negotiate a $7M/yr salary. Even if he were, there's nothing to indicate Bob won't pay it. There is also nothing to indicate that Shaw wants complete control of personnel, or that Bob is unwilling to give it up.

& we have no idea what Rick Smith's role will be in the future.



Rick Smith can whine all he wants. He's not calling the shots here, never has & most likely never will. Just because Rick is unhappy doesn't mean he will get more control.
Please tell us what head coach asked for less money, less control, accountability and responsibility. So if Rick Smith is to remain a nobody are you saying that Bob McNair is going Jerry Jones? Who was last owner prior to McNair to fire a head coach in season?
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Old 12-28-2013   #244
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Uh...... You consider Sherman to be a top notch OC/OL coach?

Did you see the Dolphins offense last Sunday. Sherman fit the Friends of Gary description.
Well, your exact comment was Bob has never paid for a top notch assistant, and the point was clearly that he's too cheap, as it followed your guarantee he would go cheap on assistants. I would say that given his demand and resume at the time, Sherman clearly contradicts your comment. So did Alex Gibbs and Ray Rhodes for that matter.

Once again your eagerness to hate has squashed your ability to intelligently evaluate.
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Old 12-28-2013   #245
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Exaggerating a bit. Kubiak, yes. Main reasoning though is he had an owner uneducated in how the league plays and who had meetings with Kubiak and Smith as he learned his way. Easy to say at this point McNair is no longer uneducated in that department.
Kubiak was unusual also in that McNair was relying heavily on Dan Reeves in how to restart the team.
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Old 12-28-2013   #246
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Well, your exact comment was Bob has never paid for a top notch assistant, and the point was clearly that he's too cheap, as it followed your guarantee he would go cheap on assistants. I would say that given his demand and resume at the time, Sherman clearly contradicts your comment. So did Alex Gibbs and Ray Rhodes for that matter.

Once again your eagerness to hate has squashed your ability to intelligently evaluate.
Gibbs was well paid and rightfully so, tell me was Sherman highly paid? I dont think so.

Was Rhodes highly paid? Probably not.
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Old 12-28-2013   #247
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

I don't think it's fair to call McNair cheap. Has he trusted the wrong people or made bad decisions? Yes. But I don't think cheap is a fair criticism.
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Old 12-28-2013   #248
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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As I was researching O'brien's bio, I was suddenly deflated as I cam across this name (a RB he coached at Georgia Tech): Tony Hollings.... One of the names, long since forgotten, that belongs in the Texan Hall of Shame along with (Boselli, Carr, Weaver, Buchanan, Ryan Young, Joppru, Charles Spencer, J.Mathis, Ahman Green, Eric Moulds, Seth Wand, Amobi Okoye, Petey Faggins)- nothing against some of those guys, but it is a list that tells a story of woe, that's for sure, and Hollings name had slipped from my memory until 15 minutes ago. Thanks Bill O'Brien!
Why would you care? Tony Hollings produced for Georgia Tech. Maybe if he'd had a coach like O'Brien here in Houston he wouldn't have been such a footnote and warning to others here
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Old 12-28-2013   #249
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

You may ask yourself, well, how did I get here?
Letting the days go by, let the water hold me down
Letting the days go by, water flowing underground....

Same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was
Same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was


Full song here by Talking Heads:
http://www.lyricsfreak.com/t/talking..._20135070.html
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Old 12-28-2013   #250
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
You may ask yourself, well, how did I get here?
Letting the days go by, let the water hold me down
Letting the days go by, water flowing underground....

Same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was
Same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was, same as it ever was


Full song here by Talking Heads:
http://www.lyricsfreak.com/t/talking..._20135070.html
love Talking Heads....
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Old 12-28-2013   #251
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Why would you care? Tony Hollings produced for Georgia Tech. Maybe if he'd had a coach like O'Brien here in Houston he wouldn't have been such a footnote and warning to others here
.
I'm not holding it against O'Brien-- It was just another reminder of horrible decisions that crippled the organization... I thought it was funny, as I was looking to get a sense of O'Brien's influences to run into Tony Hollings in his bio.
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Old 12-28-2013   #252
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Gibbs was well paid and rightfully so, tell me was Sherman highly paid? I dont think so.

Was Rhodes highly paid? Probably not.
Well, it least we've already blown your "BoB has never paid for a top notch Asst coach, until Wade" assertion out of the water.

It must be nice to make such negative assumptions about folks simply because of what you wanted to think was true. If you've got any evidence (or even a logical line of reasoning) supporting why you think what you do, I'd love to hear it.

The fact of the matter is there's not going to be anything concrete that says what he was paid, but Sherman was coming off a 6 year stint as HC of the Packers that included 5 winning seasons, four trips to the playoffs, three NFC North divisional titles in a row, and a 57-43 regular season record. That sounds like someone who would have had some options, and that usually translates to dollars.

Rhodes had 5 years experience as an NFL HC- two of those years resulted in playoff teams, and one of them resulted in a trip to the NFC divisional title game. His last job prior to joining the Texans was as the DC for the Seahawks. His final two full seasons there, they'd been divisional winners, and had top 10 defenses (measured by yardage one year, and points allowed the other). He left Seattle because of health reasons. Again, no solid proof, but that strikes me as someone who would have had more than one team interested at the time he decided he was ready to return to NFL coaching.

At the time they were hired by the Texans, both guys had resumes and backgrounds that should have been desirable to more than a few NFL teams.
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Old 12-28-2013   #253
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Well, it least we've already blown your "BoB has never paid for a top notch Asst coach, until Wade" assertion out of the water.

It must be nice to make such negative assumptions about folks simply because of what you wanted to think was true. If you've got any evidence (or even a logical line of reasoning) supporting why you think what you do, I'd love to hear it.

The fact of the matter is there's not going to be anything concrete that says what he was paid, but Sherman was coming off a 6 year stint as HC of the Packers that included 5 winning seasons, four trips to the playoffs, three NFC North divisional titles in a row, and a 57-43 regular season record. That sounds like someone who would have had some options, and that usually translates to dollars.

Rhodes had 5 years experience as an NFL HC- two of those years resulted in playoff teams, and one of them resulted in a trip to the NFC divisional title game. His last job prior to joining the Texans was as the DC for the Seahawks. His final two full seasons there, they'd been divisional winners, and had top 10 defenses (measured by yardage one year, and points allowed the other). He left Seattle because of health reasons. Again, no solid proof, but that strikes me as someone who would have had more than one team interested at the time he decided he was ready to return to NFL coaching.

At the time they were hired by the Texans, both guys had resumes and backgrounds that should have been desirable to more than a few NFL teams.
And both of them were out of work for more than 1 season before Gary hired them. More FoG if you ask me. I wish I knew a site that you could see what AC's have been paid throughout the yrs and the correlation between paying AC's vs winning teams.

Can you tell me what Sherman/Rhodes were paid PER yr while they were here? If not I think we are both jumping to conclusions. The fact that Sherman/Rhodes were out of work for multiple yrs before signing on with Gary leads me to believe they came on the cheap.
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Old 12-28-2013   #254
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Just reporting on espn that he's a big favorite to be new HC with both sides negotiating to make a deal happen

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Old 12-28-2013   #255
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Bill O'Brien & Texans intensify talks they hope will make him next coach in Houston, per sources. ESPN link soon from myself & @AdamSchefter
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Old 12-28-2013   #256
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

Ho Yeah! Peggy Hill!

And this should be appropriate...

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Old 12-28-2013   #257
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Bill O'Brien has emerged as the overwhelming favorite to become the next coach of the Houston Texans, and the two sides are working to get a deal in place within the next week, league sources told ESPN.

O'Brien met with the Texans this week after Christmas at his home in Cape Cod, resulting in intensified discussions they hope will culminate with a finalized contract, the sources said.
http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10...ans-head-coach
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Old 12-28-2013   #258
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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And both of them were out of work for more than 1 season before Gary hired them. More FoG if you ask me. I wish I knew a site that you could see what AC's have been paid throughout the yrs and the correlation between paying AC's vs winning teams.

Can you tell me what Sherman/Rhodes were paid PER yr while they were here? If not I think we are both jumping to conclusions. The fact that Sherman/Rhodes were out of work for multiple yrs before signing on with Gary leads me to believe they came on the cheap.
Mike Sherman was fired by Green Bay on Jan. 2, 2006. He was hired by the Texans Feb. 15, 2006. There was no out of work for even one season.

The reason for Ray Rhodes missing the 2007 season (he started the 2006 season but that ended with an emergency landing of the team plane midway through the season) is obvious - health.
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Old 12-28-2013   #259
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Default Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

If it ends up working out between both parties I will be pretty happy, as it means that McNair did not take the safe route.
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Old 12-28-2013   #260
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Question Re: Texans interested in Bill O'Brien

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Ho Yeah! Peggy Hill!

And this should be appropriate...

Huge!
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