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Old 12-26-2013   #41
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Originally Posted by bhsman View Post
When McCarron is getting comparisons to a less-athletic Matt Cassel, things don't look great.
McCarron put together an impressive year, and I don't agree with quite a few talking points in an article that was written in September of last year. If we can target a starting RT in the third round, move Quiz to LG, and use Harris as our swing tackle we'll have a solid line to protect him and he will flourish.
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Old 12-26-2013   #42
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McCarron put together an impressive year, and I don't agree with quite a few talking points in an article that was written in September of last year. If we can target a starting RT in the third round, move Quiz to LG, and use Harris as our swing tackle we'll have a solid line to protect him and he will flourish.
It was written this year? Has any of these things significantly changed about his arm strength or how he's used in the offense since?

And AJ can flourish all he wants if can grab Alabama's schedules, too.
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Old 12-26-2013   #43
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It was written this year? Has any of these things significantly changed about his arm strength or how he's used in the offense since?

And AJ can flourish all he wants if can grab Alabama's schedules, too.
Virginia Tech 8-4 & bowl, Texas A&M rated #6 when Bama beat them now 8-4 & bowl, Colorado St 8-4 & bowl, Ole Miss #21 when Bama beat them and 7-5 & bowl, LSU rated #13 and now 9-3 #16 and bowl, Miss. St 6-6 but bowl, Auburn rated #4 now #2 12-1 & playing in BCS championship bowl & only team to beat Bama on a stupid play that was coach's fault.Seems lie a pretty tough schedule to me. The soft teams were trounced and that is what you want a team to do.
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Old 12-26-2013   #44
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Default Re: NastyNate's mock

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When McCarron is getting comparisons to a less-athletic Matt Cassel, things don't look great.
how about when he is compared to Brady?

"The college scouting director of an AFC club suggested just that possibility to NFL Media reporter Albert Breer, and compared the fifth-year senior's skill set to New England Patriots quarterback Tom Brady.

Week 14: Things we learned
From Jeremy Gallon helping to revive Michigan's offense vs. Ohio State to David Fales outdueling Derek Carr, here are the lessons we learned in Week 14 of college football. More ...
His assessment of the Crimson Tide senior:

"Good size, outstanding touch on all throws, can make all the throws but only has average arm strength. Average running ability but very good feet and movement in the pocket to avoid sacks. Outstanding progression-read quarterback, makes throws to his second and third reads consistently. Doesn't turn the ball over. Winner. Mentally tough. Has the moxie and cockiness most great QBs have. Very similar to Tom Brady in stature, athletic ability, arm strength, touch and the most important category -- wins."http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000291624/article/highlevel-nfl-scout-compares-aj-mccarron-to-tom-brady


I would say his arm is not a cannon but only one or two stand out to me Mettenberger and Mariota come to mind. However, AJ does everything else right. Why not instead of saying he is only a game manager, put him behind a better Oline that we have to build anyway?
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Old 12-26-2013   #45
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how about when he is compared to Brady?

Very similar to Tom Brady in stature, athletic ability, arm strength, touch and the most important category -- wins.
In stature, athletic ability, arm strength, touch Brady was considered very average and ordinary. His physical stature was considered not very athletic. Belichick liked him because he won and was exceptional in game winning drive situations.
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Old 12-26-2013   #46
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In stature, athletic ability, arm strength, touch Brady was considered very average and ordinary. His physical stature was considered not very athletic. Belichick liked him because he won and was exceptional in game winning drive situations.
"can make all the throws"
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Old 12-26-2013   #47
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Default Re: NastyNate's mock

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"can make all the throws"
What opinions do you have when it comes to comparing McCarron's movement skills/arm strength/read progressions/accuracy/poise under pressure and general moxie and Bridgewater who has been said to excel in these areas?
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Old 12-26-2013   #48
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Default Re: NastyNate's mock

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What opinions do you have when it comes to comparing McCarron's movement skills/arm strength/read progressions/accuracy/poise under pressure and general moxie and Bridgewater who has been said to excel in these areas?
I rate TB ahead of AJ BUT I have to add in where each are expected to be drafted. Combine that with TB + second round and then #1-1 other player + AJ, I have to go McCarron. It also should concern all how TB played in December.

I am still hoping Mariota declares and then if not I would hope Hundley declares. If all are available, as of now I rank Mariota 1-1, Hundley 2-1 then McCarron in second.
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Old 12-26-2013   #49
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Default Re: NastyNate's mock

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What opinions do you have when it comes to comparing McCarron's movement skills/arm strength/read progressions/accuracy/poise under pressure and general moxie and Bridgewater who has been said to excel in these areas?
To be fair, Bridgewater has been under pressure far more than McCarron so he has been easier to scout in this area, and has more practice in it.

Bridgewater is clearly the superior athlete. He is also more elusive in the pocket, dodging rushers but keeping his feet under him and his eyes down the field. But again, McCarron has not been in this situation very often.

Arm strength appears equal but McCarron throws a better deep ball. Bridgewater sometimes tries to put too much touch on his and lets too much air get under it.

They appear somewhat equal in read progression but Bridgewater has to make his decisions quicker. McCarron may be capable of making his reads more quickly but he hasn't had a reason to. He is almost always very well protected.

They are both very poised under pressure. This is one of Bridgewater's best qualities but McCarron is right there with him on this one.

They both appear to possess top notch leadership skills and poise. McCarron hasn't been asked to win games so he's harder to read. Bridgewater definitely has the clutch gene.
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Old 12-26-2013   #50
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Default Re: NastyNate's mock

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To be fair, Bridgewater has been under pressure far more than McCarron so he has been easier to scout in this area, and has more practice in it.

Bridgewater is clearly the superior athlete. He is also more elusive in the pocket, dodging rushers but keeping his feet under him and his eyes down the field. But again, McCarron has not been in this situation very often.

Arm strength appears equal but McCarron throws a better deep ball. Bridgewater sometimes tries to put too much touch on his and lets too much air get under it.

They appear somewhat equal in read progression but Bridgewater has to make his decisions quicker. McCarron may be capable of making his reads more quickly but he hasn't had a reason to. He is almost always very well protected.

They are both very poised under pressure. This is one of Bridgewater's best qualities but McCarron is right there with him on this one.

They both appear to possess top notch leadership skills and poise. McCarron hasn't been asked to win games so he's harder to read. Bridgewater definitely has the clutch gene.
Wow! Exactly what I would have said but too tired to put together, a very good evaluation. If we had a trade down and got TB I'd be more willing.
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Old 12-26-2013   #51
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Default Re: NastyNate's mock

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To be fair, Bridgewater has been under pressure far more than McCarron so he has been easier to scout in this area, and has more practice in it.

Bridgewater is clearly the superior athlete. He is also more elusive in the pocket, dodging rushers but keeping his feet under him and his eyes down the field. But again, McCarron has not been in this situation very often.

Arm strength appears equal but McCarron throws a better deep ball. Bridgewater sometimes tries to put too much touch on his and lets too much air get under it.

They appear somewhat equal in read progression but Bridgewater has to make his decisions quicker. McCarron may be capable of making his reads more quickly but he hasn't had a reason to. He is almost always very well protected.

They are both very poised under pressure. This is one of Bridgewater's best qualities but McCarron is right there with him on this one.

They both appear to possess top notch leadership skills and poise. McCarron hasn't been asked to win games so he's harder to read. Bridgewater definitely has the clutch gene.
This evaluation is in line with mine. We are seeing the same things.

Although I will say I thought McCarron played well under intense pressure during the Auburn game.
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Old 12-27-2013   #52
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Default Re: NastyNate's mock

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Originally Posted by bah007 View Post
To be fair, Bridgewater has been under pressure far more than McCarron so he has been easier to scout in this area, and has more practice in it.

Bridgewater is clearly the superior athlete. He is also more elusive in the pocket, dodging rushers but keeping his feet under him and his eyes down the field. But again, McCarron has not been in this situation very often.

Arm strength appears equal but McCarron throws a better deep ball. Bridgewater sometimes tries to put too much touch on his and lets too much air get under it.

They appear somewhat equal in read progression but Bridgewater has to make his decisions quicker. McCarron may be capable of making his reads more quickly but he hasn't had a reason to. He is almost always very well protected.

They are both very poised under pressure. This is one of Bridgewater's best qualities but McCarron is right there with him on this one.

They both appear to possess top notch leadership skills and poise. McCarron hasn't been asked to win games so he's harder to read. Bridgewater definitely has the clutch gene.
So in your opinion is TB getting overrated or McCarron being underrated??
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Old 12-27-2013   #53
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Default Re: NastyNate's mock

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So in your opinion is TB getting overrated or McCarron being underrated??
McCarron is clearly being underrated and the Heisman ceremony provides a glimpse into why. His numbers up against the other qb prospects in that ceremony looked below average and made it seem like he didn't even belong there. Hell, the fact that he's never thrown for even 3000 yards in a season makes it seem proposterous that he was considered at the outset of the season to begin with.

& for a guy who played in so many big games in the SEC and BCS bowls, he didn't really have that many moments &/or "wow" plays that scouts & draftniks like to see. I contend that he did, they were just overshadowed by 1 of the following:

-how good his overall team was & how dominant they were....
-by how a player on his own team was making an opponent look...
-by how a player on another team was making his team look.....

And unless your talent & potential is off the charts, Draft "experts" have this thing where they tend to shy away from qb's who put up video game numbers in smaller conferences..but endlessly hype qbs in bigger conferences who do the same thing. Guys like McCarron who fall between these 2 extremes are usually treated as the former.....Stupid i know, but that's why you get guys like Rodgers, Russell Wilson & Kaepernick falling through the cracks. In McCarron's case, anyone who's objectively looking at him can clearly see the potential is there, but b/c Saban was so clearly dominant in terms of the leadership of the team, McCarron doesn't get his just due as being the co-captain of that juggernaut.

Last edited by Mr teX; 12-27-2013 at 08:52 AM.
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Old 12-27-2013   #54
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"can make all the throws"
Again, this is a matter of opinion. In the 5 games I have watched Bridgewater, IMHO, Teddy doesn't make all the throws. My biggest concern is his deep ball, Bridgewater needs a high trajectory, a lot of air underneath in order to get the distance he needs. For me, I saw several of these type passes that would likely be INTs in the NFL. I have also noticed that while Bridgewater is accurate, his ball placement is suspect, which could also be more of a problem in the NFL.
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Old 12-27-2013   #55
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Again, this is a matter of opinion. In the 5 games I have watched Bridgewater, IMHO, Teddy doesn't make all the throws. My biggest concern is his deep ball, Bridgewater needs a high trajectory, a lot of air underneath in order to get the distance he needs. For me, I saw several of these type passes that would likely be INTs in the NFL. I have also noticed that while Bridgewater is accurate, his ball placement is suspect, which could also be more of a problem in the NFL.
Serious question. To you, how does ball placement differ from accuracy? I figured ball placement is part of what makes a QB accurate.
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Old 12-27-2013   #56
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Serious question. To you, how does ball placement differ from accuracy? I figured ball placement is part of what makes a QB accurate.
IMHO regarding QB ball placement, does the QB put the ball in the best position possible for the receiver to make the catch. A completion says accurate but doesn't necessarily mean good ball placement. As you are aware and have watched many times you have seen WRs make good catches on passes that were to high, to low, behind the receiver, leads the WR to much, to little, under throws the receivers yet these types of passes can also be completions. To me, Bridgewater has a high percentage of these type passes.
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Old 12-27-2013   #57
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Serious question. To you, how does ball placement differ from accuracy? I figured ball placement is part of what makes a QB accurate.
This is a good place for the distinction between accurate and precise.



Without precision even accurate throwers can't get into ball placement as much more than luck.
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Old 12-27-2013   #58
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This is a good place for the distinction between accurate and precise.



Without precision even accurate throwers can't get into ball placement as much more than luck.
We're talking about QB ball placement and not firearm target practice. Once again your left field comparisons does absolutely nothing to answer the question. It only confuses the issue, you now have folks wondering does a QB have to be a good shot to be a good QB. If a QB is proficient at shooting skeet is he even a better QB? Typical stuff you can expect from Cak's alternative universe.
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Old 12-27-2013   #59
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Default Re: NastyNate's mock

I guess I just dont consider a QB who doesnt have good ball placement as having good accuracy. I would never say "that dude is so accurate except he puts the ball behind the receiver."

Calling a QB accurate when he has poor ball placement doesnt make sense to me. Either you are accurate and place the ball correctly, or you dont.
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Old 12-27-2013   #60
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Default Re: NastyNate's mock

Bridgewater has tremendous timing & rhythm. He throws a very catchable football that when you talk about accuracy, one: is in receivers optimum window that leads to two: precision in stride & out of hitting (dangerzone) intersection so receiver can focus on making catch first instead of hearing footsteps & third: combination of two enhances chance to turn small gain into something much bigger (run after catch), more TD's & higher numbers in general.
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