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View Poll Results: Realistically, will AJ get a yellow jacket based on his career to date
Yes 102 61.08%
No 65 38.92%
Voters: 167. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 11-19-2013   #101
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

During recent games (for sure the last game), I've heard announcers lay the groundwork for it by saying things like "and now the future, no-doubt Hall of Famer Andre Johnson" or something like that.

I think they're laying the narrative. Andre is the best WR I've seen not named Jerry Rice. Maybe not in accomplishments or statistics, but ability. The dude is just...words can't describe how special he is as a player.
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Old 11-19-2013   #102
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

Whether or not Andre should go into the HOF based purely upon his resume (and I'm with most Texans' fans who think his resume more than qualifies him), he'll get in on politics as much as any reason because when he's eligible (atleast 5 years from now), the Texans will have been in league competition by then for atleast 15 years and still without a single member in the Hall.
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Old 11-19-2013   #103
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by IDEXAN View Post
Whether or not Andre should go into the HOF based purely upon his resume (and I'm with most Texans' fans who think his resume more than qualifies him), he'll get in on politics as much as any reason because when he's eligible (atleast 5 years from now), the Texans will have been in league competition by then for atleast 15 years and still without a single member in the Hall.
This.
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Old 11-19-2013   #104
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by Maddict5 View Post
We all love him and for a while there it seemed like he was destined for canton but when you see guys like carter and reed cant make it, does aj have a realistic shot at getting in esp with the way the league is getting pass happy and more wrs are putting up prolific numbers

carter: 1101 rec, 13,899 yds, 130 tds
aj: 706 rec, 9656 yds, 52 tds

tbh eventhough he should have a few good seasons left, i cant see him making it (as much as I want him to). imo his lack of tds will hurt him when its all time to make his case.....

I think he'll get in, but it's gonna take a good while for him to get in...sort of like it took for Art Monk.

But it's more than just his lack of TD's. Too many guys with the same impact & better career numbers have created a log jam at the position.

Tim Brown isn't in yet
Andre Reed still isn't in yet..
Issac Bruce isn't in yet
Randy Moss will be coming eligible soon
Terrell Owens will be coming elgible soon


& this isn't even counting guys in his generation...guys like Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Steve Smith & Larry Fitzgerald who all will be at least as deserving as well.

& If guy like Chris Carter didn't get in on the 1st ballot you know AJ's gonna have a hard time getting in.


Snacks..aka John McClain is gonna have his hands full trying to argue for AJ to get in amongst all these guys that will become elgible in the next 10 years.
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Old 11-19-2013   #105
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by Mr teX View Post
I think he'll get in, but it's gonna take a good while for him to get in...sort of like it took for Art Monk.

But it's more than just his lack of TD's. Too many guys with the same impact & better career numbers have created a log jam at the position.

Tim Brown isn't in yet
Andre Reed still isn't in yet..
Issac Bruce isn't in yet
Randy Moss will be coming eligible soon
Terrell Owens will be coming elgible soon


& this isn't even counting guys in his generation...guys like Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Steve Smith & Larry Fitzgerald who all will be at least as deserving as well.

& If guy like Chris Carter didn't get in on the 1st ballot you know AJ's gonna have a hard time getting in.


Snacks..aka John McClain is gonna have his hands full trying to argue for AJ to get in amongst all these guys that will become elgible in the next 10 years.
Chris Carter didn't get in right away because he's an ******* who pissed off too many people on his way up.

Part of Tim Brown's issue was the way he played three lousy seasons at the end of his career. (Same thing with Isaac Bruce & Andre Reed) Andre is on pace to crush all but Brown's TD numbers.

Isaac Bruce also has a dearth of All-Pro and Pro Bowl selections to contend with.

Andre Reed's total yds might be considered low for the seasons played when all is said & done as well.

Randy Moss makes it easy.
Marvin Harrison does as well.
Terrell Owens makes it, but maybe not on 1st go-round for attitude.

Andre's biggest fault will be lack of TDs. The best cure for that is a lot of late-career TDs so that the last years are fantastic in the voters minds. We can also hope they factor in the non-pass-happy offenses he's played in (Unlike Moss, Bruce and Harrison)
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Old 11-19-2013   #106
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by disaacks3 View Post
Chris Carter didn't get in right away because he's an ******* who pissed off too many people on his way up.

Part of Tim Brown's issue was the way he played three lousy seasons at the end of his career. (Same thing with Isaac Bruce & Andre Reed) Andre is on pace to crush all but Brown's TD numbers.

Isaac Bruce also has a dearth of All-Pro and Pro Bowl selections to contend with.

Andre Reed's total yds might be considered low for the seasons played when all is said & done as well.

Randy Moss makes it easy.
Marvin Harrison does as well.
Terrell Owens makes it, but maybe not on 1st go-round for attitude.

Andre's biggest fault will be lack of TDs. The best cure for that is a lot of late-career TDs so that the last years are fantastic in the voters minds. We can also hope they factor in the non-pass-happy offenses he's played in (Unlike Moss, Bruce and Harrison)
The point is, most of those guys will be & should be in before him imo. & you know how the HOF is with WR's...he'll be waiting a long time.
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Old 11-19-2013   #107
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

The one thing no one ever mentions about whether guys get into the HOF has to do with their personality. It is, in fact, a personality contest as well as a look at ones productivity. EVERYONE LOVES AJ! He is like Jerry Rice in that way. Even people who are not Texans fans are AJ fans. It is kind of like Peyton Manning, it is hard not to like the guy except when he is playing you. For that reason, he will get in.

You look at guys like TO that are polarizing and mouthy, and there are plenty of guys that don't like them. They have a MUCH harder time getting the votes than someone like AJ who has borderline numbers but everyone likes because, lets face it, he is an awesome person, not just an awesome player.
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Old 11-19-2013   #108
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

Well, a great poster from the past called this a long time ago so I'm thinking that Andre Johnson will just have to make do without a HoF jacket. Shame really. Think what AJ could have done with Carr throwing to him if only his hands weren't limiting his physical ability.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibar_Harry View Post
I hope AJ and Carr become great as a duo, but I think AJ's hands are going to limit his great physical ability. I think you will find that Davis has very good hands along with Miller and Carr did dump a lot of passes in this senior year to people coming out of the back field.....
Texans Talk circa 2004
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Old 11-19-2013   #109
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

One of the issues today is the old-timers - the HoF players who vote - look at today's pass-happy game with a bit of disdain. The perceive QBs as having official-sanctioned "protection bubbles" around them. And they see receivers no longer scared to go across the middle and rule changes that clearly favor offensive players.

I think AJ should go in first ballot, but I'm not a voter. What the voters think is what matters, and there is no doubt that they think today's NFL is watered down and gaudy stats reflect those changes.

How often have we seen multiple 5000+ passing yards for QBs? How long did the record stand for 7 TDs in a game before TWO QBs have already tied it this season (one of them being some unknown dude at that?).

400 yards passing in a game is no longer special. Check this out:

Quote:
There was a time in the NFL when a quarterback who passed for 400 yards in a game had done something really special. That time has passed.

Consider this: In 2005, there were only two 400-yard passing games all season, both by Marc Bulger of the Rams. In 2013, that total has already been surpassed, and Week One isnít even over. Peyton Manning, Eli Manning and Colin Kaepernick all topped 400 yards this week.

NFL quarterbacks have picked up this season right where they left off in the last couple of seasons. Over the last 35 weeks of the regular season, stretching back to Week One of 2011, there have been 36 quarterbacks who threw for 400 yards in a game. Basically, in the NFL these days, we average a 400-yard passer a week.

And when you see something every week, it stops being special. In the 1970s, there were five 400-yard passing games for the entire decade.

Source
I'm not arguing against AJ in the HoF.

Rather, I am seeing a clear trend that will be taken into account by HoF voters. You simply cannot compare raw numbers of Art Monk to a modern receiver, because the game is drastically changing to favor offenses.

From the same article:

Quote:
Quarterbacks are protected from hits. Wide receivers are protected from hits. Pass interference, illegal contact and defensive holding are called much more stringently.

What has also changed is that young quarterbacks come into the league ready to command an NFL offense immediately. In the old days, it took years for quarterbacks to make the transition from the college game to the NFL. Now young quarterbacks can do it immediately. In NFL history, there have only been four 400-yard passing games by rookie quarterbacks, and all four of them happened in the last two years.
Just food for thought. Hopefully voters take into account AJ's career with an expansion team, the dignity that he has represented, and of course his consistently amazing talent that just got showcased the past couple of weeks with some spectacular TD catches.
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Old 11-19-2013   #110
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
400 yards passing in a game is no longer special. Check this out:
Been harping on that for a while re: Schaub. Wasn't especially impressed with Schaub's 4000 yard seasons and by extension, receivers collect a lot of that yardage. I personally value TDs over yardage. TDs and turnovers affect the final score way, way more than yardage. Yardage still matters, of course, but in the same way that 1000 yards is no longer impressive for a running back, the metric needs to be adjusted for inflation. The fact that AJ is one of only two or three receivers with three seasons of 1500 yards is impressive. So context matters.

I'd vote him in just because he makes plays that other WRs can't make, even those with better numbers at times.
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Old 11-19-2013   #111
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by eriadoc View Post
Been harping on that for a while re: Schaub. Wasn't especially impressed with Schaub's 4000 yard seasons and by extension, receivers collect a lot of that yardage. I personally value TDs over yardage. TDs and turnovers affect the final score way, way more than yardage. Yardage still matters, of course, but in the same way that 1000 yards is no longer impressive for a running back, the metric needs to be adjusted for inflation. The fact that AJ is one of only two or three receivers with three seasons of 1500 yards is impressive. So context matters.

I'd vote him in just because he makes plays that other WRs can't make, even those with better numbers at times.
I agree with you.

I think 'cak's argument is a good one, as well, because it's relative to the times (like you said, context). AJ has been an elite receiver his entire career and he has led the league in stats for individual seasons. It's not like the HoF is going to completely blacklist all WRs, so in that regard, AJ has a body of work, a reputation as non-showboating workhorse, and I also think his loyalty to the franchise should be considered in voting, as well.

I'm just hoping he retires a Texan many years from now and the next regime uses him effectively to win games (i.e. score TDs!).
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Old 11-19-2013   #112
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

Does anyone else think that the fact he would be the first Texans player to make it, actually makes it easier to get in?
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Old 11-19-2013   #113
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by kiwitexansfan View Post
Does anyone else think that the fact he would be the first Texans player to make it, actually makes it easier to get in?
Ehh, maybe, but do the Jags have a HOFer yet? How about the Panthers?
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Old 11-19-2013   #114
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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I'm just hoping he retires a Texan many years from now and the next regime uses him effectively to win games (i.e. score TDs!).
I see what you did there.
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Old 11-19-2013   #115
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by eriadoc View Post
Ehh, maybe, but do the Jags have a HOFer yet? How about the Panthers?
The answer is no, but who have they had who was arguable should be?

Julius Peppers and Steve Smith will eventually be considered.
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Old 11-19-2013   #116
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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The answer is no, but who have they had who was arguable should be?
I think if you're going with the premise of slackened requirements for an expansion franchise's first ever, a case could be made for Jimmy Smith from the Jags. The Panthers, I have no idea.
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Old 11-19-2013   #117
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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I think if you're going with the premise of slackened requirements for an expansion franchise's first ever, a case could be made for Jimmy Smith from the Jags. The Panthers, I have no idea.
We're talking a feather on the scales, not a brick.
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Old 11-19-2013   #118
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by TheMatrix31 View Post
During recent games (for sure the last game), I've heard announcers lay the groundwork for it by saying things like "and now the future, no-doubt Hall of Famer Andre Johnson" or something like that.

I think they're laying the narrative. Andre is the best WR I've seen not named Jerry Rice. Maybe not in accomplishments or statistics, but ability. The dude is just...words can't describe how special he is as a player.
not seen many Detroit lions games eh? not a slight at aj who is great but megatron is on pace to be an all-timer.. think most objective Texans fans would agree with that
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Old 11-19-2013   #119
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by Mr teX View Post
I think he'll get in, but it's gonna take a good while for him to get in...sort of like it took for Art Monk.

But it's more than just his lack of TD's. Too many guys with the same impact & better career numbers have created a log jam at the position.

Tim Brown isn't in yet
Andre Reed still isn't in yet..
Issac Bruce isn't in yet
Randy Moss will be coming eligible soon
Terrell Owens will be coming elgible soon


& this isn't even counting guys in his generation...guys like Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Steve Smith & Larry Fitzgerald who all will be at least as deserving as well.

& If guy like Chris Carter didn't get in on the 1st ballot you know AJ's gonna have a hard time getting in.


Snacks..aka John McClain is gonna have his hands full trying to argue for AJ to get in amongst all these guys that will become elgible in the next 10 years.
Tim Brown and Andre Reed are not in the same conversation with Andre Johnson.

Johnson has finished top two in receiving yards per game five different times in his career.
Brown did this once.
Reed only finished in the top 10 three times, never higher than number 5.

Brown and Reed are accumulators. They played a long time and accumulated a lot of stats. They were never the greatest in the game like Andre.

Yards per game and where you finished amongst your peers is the on ly fair way to look at it. It takes out the difference in offenses you may see over different eras.

Heck Randy Moss only finished top two once.

Jerry Rice and Calvin Johnson are the only two guys in the last 40 years with a career as impressive as Andre's.
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Old 11-19-2013   #120
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
Well, a great poster from the past called this a long time ago so I'm thinking that Andre Johnson will just have to make do without a HoF jacket. Shame really. Think what AJ could have done with Carr throwing to him if only his hands weren't limiting his physical ability.



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NICE FIND! I completely forgot about ibar harry. I used to love reading his posts for comic relief.
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