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Old 11-12-2013   #301
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by Corrosion View Post
I'm not against taking a QB - don't get me wrong .... I just don't see any real franchise QB's in this draft. Every one of them is a huge gamble tho some greater than others.


I do want to see Keenum finish the season before we make the decision we have to draft a QB .... he's played pretty damn well so far despite unfavorable conditions - no running game and a sh!t OL.

Also filling those holes at LG & RT via FA .... will cost premium $$$$.


Lets at least get to the end of the season before we finalize our evaluations of the QB spot - its a near complete unknown , those other spots (LG , RT , ILB , NT) aren't.



Tough question .... one I wouldn't want to make just yet.
I would put off drafting a QB until 2015, fill as many holes as the new regime can and find out if Keenum can be the QB of the future by giving him the rest of this season and all of 2014. If Keenum isn't the man for the job, then trade up and pick Hogan in the 2015 draft. I'm biased, my 2 favorite QB's are McCarron and Hogan.
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Old 11-12-2013   #302
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
If we get the #3 pick, I think I'd take clowney and stick him at olb.
What would you do with Mercilus? If you don't mind my asking.
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Old 11-12-2013   #303
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by Blake View Post
I agree you dont just play the odds. All the QB's you mention were selected because teams evaluated them and judged their value in the top 10 of their draft class. Gabbert, Carr and Harrington werent the only QBs left on the board. They were judged to be top signal callers and worthy of a top 10 pick.

Obviously if you dont feel that the QB prospect is a top signal caller and have another position player rated higher you can go with that. But with a top 5 pick (and Bridgewater, Mariota, Hundley potentially coming out) we would virtually be a lock for a highly rated signal caller. And it wouldnt be out of the question to move up a couple of spots to land your guy.
We obviously evaluate this group of QB's differently .... at this point in time.


Of those you listed , Bridgewater is the only one I take with a first round pick (this year).
Mariota looks to me to be a system QB and probably the best athlete on the field in any given game - that doesn't make him a good QB.

Hundley is probably two years away from being close to NFL ready. He's a project.

I'd rather go with Murray in the second or McCarron in the 3rd than either Mariota or Hundley , might even take Boyd and Manziel over them as well.
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Old 11-12-2013   #304
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by WolverineFan View Post
What would you do with Mercilus? If you don't mind my asking.
Ever since the Mercilus pick was announced i was down on it. I did not see the actual ability that his one year of great production. He plays stiff to me and I don't see a real football player when I look at how he moves.

I'm not a fan of his or reeds.

So really I don't care what they do with him.

But practically speaking I'd have an open competition for his spot.

If you're asking if Mercilus could play opposite clowney, my answer is yes. But again, I'd open the competition and if he didn't win the spot I'd bench him.
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Old 11-12-2013   #305
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
Ever since the Mercilus pick was announced i was down on it. I did not see the actual ability that his one year of great production. He plays stiff to me and I don't see a real football player when I look at how he moves.

I'm not a fan of his or reeds.

So really I don't care what they do with him.

But practically speaking I'd have an open competition for his spot.

If you're asking if Mercilus could play opposite clowney, my answer is yes. But again, I'd open the competition and if he didn't win the spot I'd bench him.
Mercilus was definitely an "all potential" pick. He was pretty raw and only had the one year of production like you said. I think it's obvious he always relied too much on his athletic ability and hasn't really developed. It is pretty frustrating that the defense is basically built for him to succeed and he only has 4.5 sacks.

As for my original question, I only ask because I see Clowney as Ninja's replacement at DE. The problem is I question his ability with double teams so my 2nd position for him would be WLB. Mercilus doesn't really have another position in the defense though so he'd be a wasted pick if you move Clowney there. He did play well in spot duty last year at the 7' technique, but it was mostly on passing downs. I question his ability to two-gap and cover TE/RB's.
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Old 11-12-2013   #306
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by WolverineFan View Post
Mercilus was definitely an "all potential" pick. He was pretty raw and only had the one year of production like you said. I think it's obvious he always relied too much on his athletic ability and hasn't really developed. It is pretty frustrating that the defense is basically built for him to succeed and he only has 4.5 sacks.

As for my original question, I only ask because I see Clowney as Ninja's replacement at DE. The problem is I question his ability with double teams so my 2nd position for him would be WLB. Mercilus doesn't really have another position in the defense though so he'd be a wasted pick if you move Clowney there. He did play well in spot duty last year at the 7' technique, but it was mostly on passing downs. I question his ability to two-gap and cover TE/RB's.

I'd play clowney exactly how we played Mario.

Right now I'm assuming that the coaching staff will be back. Who knows. We could go to a 43.

Personally, I wouldn't put him at 34 DE though. I think he would be a beast on the edge where he could better use his athleticism.

I know most disagree, but I'd move Cushing outside to be the solb opposite clowney.

I can almost guaranteed we'd get more pressure on qb's from the edges.
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Old 11-12-2013   #307
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
I'd play clowney exactly how we played Mario.

Right now I'm assuming that the coaching staff will be back. Who knows. We could go to a 43.

Personally, I wouldn't put him at 34 DE though. I think he would be a beast on the edge where he could better use his athleticism.

I know most disagree, but I'd move Cushing outside to be the solb opposite clowney.

I can almost guaranteed we'd get more pressure on qb's from the edges.
It's certainly not a bad idea. Right now Mercilus basically plays a wide 9 and his only responsibilities are leverage to his side and rushing the passer. I don't think it's a stretch to say that Clowney would be more successful, if not much more successful. Also, Clowney tends to get lazy in the run game so it's not a bad idea to put him in a position to focus mainly on rushing the passer.

I haven't made it a secret on this board but I have a certain disdain for the way Clowney has played this year. His pursuit effort has been pitiful this year and he seems to only care about two things 1) sacks and 2) not getting hurt. I acknowledge his ridiculous talent, but I question his work ethic and seeing a guy with that kind of talent not give 100% effort really pisses me off.
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Old 11-12-2013   #308
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

The fact that people in this thread alone disagree on which QB is rated the highest should mean that there's no sure-fire franchise QB in this class.

Sounds to me like rolling the dice if one wants to go all-in for a QB.
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Old 11-12-2013   #309
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
The fact that people in this thread alone disagree on which QB is rated the highest should mean that there's no sure-fire franchise QB in this class.

Sounds to me like rolling the dice if one wants to go all-in for a QB.
Manning and Leaf were widely debated on who should be rated the highest. Doesnt mean there wasnt a sure-fire franchise QB there.
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Old 11-12-2013   #310
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
The fact that people in this thread alone disagree on which QB is rated the highest should mean that there's no sure-fire franchise QB in this class.

Sounds to me like rolling the dice if one wants to go all-in for a QB
.
Because of that , doesn't it make sense to take the highest risk / reward guy if you are in fact going to take the gamble ?
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Old 11-12-2013   #311
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by htownfan32 View Post
I'm not sure what you see in what is basically an inferior version of Johnny Manziel.
To each his own. I see a guy who is a dual threat QB with blazing speed, and height to see over the o-line. I see a guy who is taking care of the football and making good decisions. Resembles Kaepernick to an extent.
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Old 11-12-2013   #312
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

Most college QBs if they don't have 30 college starts under their belt will return to school. The general rule of thumb is the NFL will downgrade their their perspective draft position because of a lack of experience. NFL Conventional Wisdom is those college QBs with 30 or more college starts tend to be the rookie QBs who have better and earlier success in the NFL.
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Old 11-12-2013   #313
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by Corrosion View Post
Because of that , doesn't it make sense to take the highest risk / reward guy if you are in fact going to take the gamble ?
That guy would be Clowney.
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Old 11-12-2013   #314
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
That guy would be Clowney.
Or Manziel (strictly speaking on the QB position).


I think they are both boom or bust ...
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Old 11-12-2013   #315
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by Blake View Post
To each his own. I see a guy who is a dual threat QB with blazing speed, and height to see over the o-line. I see a guy who is taking care of the football and making good decisions. Resembles Kaepernick to an extent.
I can see where many would be enamored with Mariota. I'm not really one of them. He is in my mind like Manziel, too difficult to project at a pro level in a pro offense.

I think he'd kill it if Philly picked him up, though.
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Old 11-12-2013   #316
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by htownfan32 View Post
I can see where many would be enamored with Mariota. I'm not really one of them. He is in my mind like Manziel, too difficult to project at a pro level in a pro offense.

I think he'd kill it if Philly picked him up, though.
I don't see how he is anything like Manziel. They both can run and are in odd spread schemes, that's about it.
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Old 11-12-2013   #317
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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I can see where many would be enamored with Mariota. I'm not really one of them. He is in my mind like Manziel, too difficult to project at a pro level in a pro offense.

I think he'd kill it if Philly picked him up, though.
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I don't see how he is anything like Manziel. They both can run and are in odd spread schemes, that's about it.
The difference in Manziel and Mariota is Manziel is Must See TV. Manziel sees the field better than any other college QB today and Manziel is better at improvisation.
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Old 11-12-2013   #318
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
The fact that people in this thread alone disagree on which QB is rated the highest should mean that there's no sure-fire franchise QB in this class.

Sounds to me like rolling the dice if one wants to go all-in for a QB.
Pretty much, just like last draft a lot of great college QBs that may not have what it takes in the NFL.

Personally, I think the safe and smart bet would be to trade the Texans first round pick for another team's that might be lower plus more 1st or 2nd round picks. As nice as this QB class is looking, we all know big name guys in College football right now will fall a round or two based off slip ups in the combine and just the normal GMs trying to outsmart themselves.

Personally, I'd grab someone that can take the place of one of the departing starters like Wade Smith or maybe Antonio Smith (who I hope we retain) and then pick up one of the fallen QBs later in the round or in the second.

The fact is the best QBs right now are all undersized, might as well get legit needs handled first so that if we can have our new QB surrounded with talent that can help him succeed sooner rather then later.
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Old 11-13-2013   #319
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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If we get the #3 pick, I think I'd take clowney and stick him at olb.
if your going to stay with 3-4 surely you go Barr over clowney. both a incredible playmakers and barr is having the better season this year
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Old 11-13-2013   #320
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Default Re: Where to spend the 2014 1st round pick?

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Foster wouldn't net us a 6th right now I don't think .... big contract & injuries.


BUT pending we end up with a top 5 pick , there is the possibility of getting both a tackle (doubtful its Erving) and Mosley .... depending upon what compensation you get by trading back ~5-7 picks.
If you get a 2nd as compensation , you could easily package that along with your own #2 to get back up in the middle of the first round giving you two selections from ~10-12 and ~12-15.
You might even be able to keep one of those second rounder's and give up a 2nd & 3rd instead , picking somewhere around ~18.


Maybe you end up with Mosley & Antonio Richardson of Tennessee who is very comparable to Erving.
yeah i like that idea. Mosley is just to much of a playmaker for me to pass on. in terms of defence its him barr and clowney has your elite talents in the draft imo. Also if you could keep that 2nd round pick. taking ebron would be icing on the cake…but i think I'm asking for a bit to much

you really think thats all we would get for foster?
I agree that his health is a concern but his contract is favourable considering when healthy is an elite RB in the league. when i see richardson going for a 1st surely foster is worth at minimum the same amount
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