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Old 10-28-2013   #261
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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Originally Posted by GuerillaBlack View Post
Well Morey did lose his two top players once he got the job. He then compiled assets for three seasons, with the team never going below .500. If they were in the East, then they would have been a top six seed for those three years the Rockets missed the playoffs. In one year, he has added two top ten players to the team. Fans were getting pissed at all the movement, but now its finally paying off and there will be much more stability in the roster. Chemistry is important in basketball too. No doubt the Rockets are much more forward thinking than the Texans. The Astros are too.
I dont understand why fans get upset when players get traded. Moving all of those players over that 3 yr span set the Rockets up to have the cap room to sign 2 top 10 players and after making a trade have room to add a 3rd Aldridge/Love type player.

Those kinds of moves are the kinds of moves that teams with forward thinking GM's make. Morey makes Smith look like a kindergartener when it comes to being a GM. Of couse Morey is a MIT graduate. Did Rick graduate from Purdue?
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Old 10-28-2013   #262
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Well Morey did lose his two top players once he got the job. He then compiled assets for three seasons, with the team never going below .500. If they were in the East, then they would have been a top six seed for those three years the Rockets missed the playoffs. In one year, he has added two top ten players to the team. Fans were getting pissed at all the movement, but now its finally paying off and there will be much more stability in the roster. Chemistry is important in basketball too. No doubt the Rockets are much more forward thinking than the Texans. The Astros are too.
You just can't compare NFL to NBA. Not defending Smith at all but saying the Rockets are more forward thinking than the Texans is bogus. NBA players are shuffled around because of their contacts. Players are considered to be "great" commodities if they have expiring contacts. Draft picks aren't valuable past the top 5 or so. You only need 2-3 great players to be considered legit. There isn't a franchise player designation. If there was Miami wouldn't have Lebron and the Rockets probably don't have Howard. The goal in basketball is get those 2-3 star players and fill a roster around them. Other than qb there isn't a player in football that can compare in worth to any one player on a basketball team.

Smith deserves criticism. He may deserve to lose his job. Morey and his crazy player movement has nothing to do with it though.
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Old 10-28-2013   #263
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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I don't see a difference between Jjo & Matt Schaub. Both were good enough in their day, but I haven't seen Jjo play at a pro-bowl level in about as long as I've seen Schaub play at that level.

He's definitely not done anything in the last 2 seasons (yet, since this season is far from over) to make me want to take a $10M cap hit.
According to PFF out of 106 ranked CBs, Joseph is ranked #23. That's respectable. Cutting Joseph and the Texans secondary is only getting worse not better. I think the pass rush and run defense are bigger problems facing the defense. Currently the Texans Passing D is ranked #1, the Texans Rushing D is #27.
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Old 10-28-2013   #264
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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You just can't compare NFL to NBA. Not defending Smith at all but saying the Rockets are more forward thinking than the Texans is bogus. NBA players are shuffled around because of their contacts. Players are considered to be "great" commodities if they have expiring contacts. Draft picks aren't valuable past the top 5 or so. You only need 2-3 great players to be considered legit. There isn't a franchise player designation. If there was Miami wouldn't have Lebron and the Rockets probably don't have Howard. The goal in basketball is get those 2-3 star players and fill a roster around them. Other than qb there isn't a player in football that can compare in worth to any one player on a basketball team.

Smith deserves criticism. He may deserve to lose his job. Morey and his crazy player movement has nothing to do with it though.
Nah, the Rockets are easily more forward thinking, while the Texans are okay with the status quo. Just look at how both franchises operate, its obvious. Take things slow, be patient, etc. And draft picks are definitely valuable past the top five. Texans don't take big risks (Sam Montgomery isn't one), or they wait until it is too late (Schaub). If Kubiak coached the Rockets, he would have been fired like jvg was back in 2010.
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Old 10-28-2013   #265
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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According to PFF out of 106 ranked CBs, Joseph is ranked #23. That's respectable. Cutting Joseph and the Texans secondary is only getting worse not better. I think the pass rush and run defense are bigger problems facing the defense. Currently the Texans Passing D is ranked #1, the Texans Rushing D is #27.
Doubtful that we would have to cut Joseph... But, the threat of the cut encourages restructuring of the contract. Depending on any number of factors, having that $11 million salary available to cut without dead money being attached to it provides leverage and also freedom for the Texans should something happen (injury, another good CB surfaces at a bargain, etc..)

The rush defense was never designed to be very good. The Phillips' scheme is set up to make plays against the run (but not consistently shut the attack down) and the pass. But, because it is an aggressive one gap scheme, if teams are able to run the ball 30 times a game, they are going to gash us sometimes. Also, Phillips' defense is poor recognizing and defending draws and screens- partly due to the aggressiveness and partly due to poor situational recognition by the coaches and subsequently the players.

All that being said, the Texans biggest issue on defense is the situational predictability in coverage and in blitzing. Playcallers can be relatively certain, in passing situations, that the Texans will be sending both OLBs, one ILB, along with the three downlinemen on 3rd and moderate-long... Also, they can be quite sure that the Texans will be in a straight man coverage scheme based on the offensive package and WR alignment. This is why the Texans struggle against good QBs with good coaches. Lesser QBs wilt under the pressure or struggle enough with consistency and accuracy that they can't make enough plays against the press man and pass rushing pressure. Good QBs see those predictable pressure packages as an opportunity... and they know that if the offense can execute, they will succeed on the play. For an offense to line up in those difficult situations (3rd and 6 or more) with that kind of confidence, well, that spells trouble.

Combine those defensive limitations with injuries to the two most versatile playmakers (Manning, Cushing) in the middle of the defense, and we are in a world of trouble against Indy, Denver, New England.

As a Kubiak and Schaub supporter, even I recognize our best hope to salvage this (once very promising season) is for Keenum to play and perhaps create/develop an offensive mentality that is more aggressive, unpredictable, and will hopefully create plays at opportune times in those games where we are over-matched.

I still think this is an 8 win team, even with the injuries and poor start. It needs to get to 10, though, and with the loss of Cushing, it will be one hell of an exciting and hope-invigurating ride if we get there. And, I can't imagine it happening without a set of peculiar variables: Keenum being one, and the surprising emergence of a couple other young players on defense being some others (safety and LB).
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Old 10-28-2013   #266
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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6

Nah, the Rockets are easily more forward thinking, while the Texans are okay with the status quo. Just look at how both franchises operate, its obvious. Take things slow, be patient, etc. And draft picks are definitely valuable past the top five. Texans don't take big risks (Sam Montgomery isn't one), or they wait until it is too late (Schaub). If Kubiak coached the Rockets, he would have been fired like jvg was back in 2010.
Yeah right - Morey is so good he was "forward thinking" to this 6 year plan huh? His roster churning appears to have finally paid off. After 6 years. Let that sink in. 6 years to get to where the Texans were 2 years ago after (wait for it) a complete roster turn over. Sounds like Smith did the same thing as Morey but had to flip 52 roster spots AND did it in 2 less years. The only difference is Morey landed 2 of the top players in back to back years. Smith didn't land Brady, Manning, Brees or some other top QB. He stuck with Schaub. I'm ready for a complete regime change but...if this team had a top 5 QB (maybe top 10) then Kubiak & Smith look like geniuses. They don't so they look like boobs.
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Old 10-28-2013   #267
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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I don't see a difference between Jjo & Matt Schaub. Both were good enough in their day, but I haven't seen Jjo play at a pro-bowl level in about as long as I've seen Schaub play at that level.

He's definitely not done anything in the last 2 seasons (yet, since this season is far from over) to make me want to take a $10M cap hit.
The corner backs are being put in a very difficult position. I think they are both playing very well. However, they are left playing straight man defense too often. They are very good at it. However, because it is so predictable, teams can have such confidence of that island that QBs do not have to hestitate or worry about misreading the coverage. And, because safeties are not rolling into the coverage and zone is seldom mixed in, KJ and JJ are not being given opportunities to aggressively attack the ball on short routes... Therefore, it is almost irresponsible of them to attempt to make a play on the ball when it is 3rd and 7 and the WR runs a seven yard out.
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Old 10-28-2013   #268
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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So your suggesting that the Ravens should not have re-signed Flacco, let him walk, become a FA. Silly. Your post have become unreasonable. You are arguing for the sake of arguing. That is waste of my time and I don't do that. I hope you will understand if I don't or just stop responding to your comments.
Dripping with Irony.

I never suggested the Ravens should not have re-signed Flacco. I simply refuted your argument that Schaub's contract is comparatively restrictive to the cap as Flacco's.

Did the Ravens overpay Flacco in my estimation? Yes. Does that mean it was a mistake? not necessarily. I'm sure they attempted to get the best deal they could. They were not willing to gamble on a young, talented Superbowl QB hitting the free agent market. I get that. And, because of their difficult cap situation after the season, they could not franchise tag him or even threaten to. ... Which brings me back to my point for those worried about the Texans' cap as it pertains to JJWatt. The reason why Cushing and DBrown were signed and taken care of, and the reason the Texans decided to make calculated decisions and let guys like Barwin, Quin, Casey go is because they have a long term look at the cap, at keeping it healthy... with an effort to be talented and capable of championship runs for a long time.

So, the Texans are positioning themselves each off-season to not have core players becoming free agents or being in a situation where they are having to scramble to get a deal done and a guy they want to keep under the cap. So, when Watt's 4year deal is up, the Texans will pick up their option on year 5 (using it as leverage for a relatively reasonable long term deal before they pick the meager option up). If he decides to play out the option instead of re-signing, the Texans will have room under the cap and have the franchise tag as leverage. If he doesn't sign, they franchise him. The next season, the same thing. If then, he still won't sign, they cut him loose after 7 years of service as he hits his 30th birthday.
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Old 10-28-2013   #269
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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Dripping with Irony.

I never suggested the Ravens should not have re-signed Flacco. I simply refuted your argument that Schaub's contract is comparatively restrictive to the cap as Flacco's.

Did the Ravens overpay Flacco in my estimation? Yes. Does that mean it was a mistake? not necessarily. I'm sure they attempted to get the best deal they could. They were not willing to gamble on a young, talented Superbowl QB hitting the free agent market. I get that. And, because of their difficult cap situation after the season, they could not franchise tag him or even threaten to. ... Which brings me back to my point for those worried about the Texans' cap as it pertains to JJWatt. The reason why Cushing and DBrown were signed and taken care of, and the reason the Texans decided to make calculated decisions and let guys like Barwin, Quin, Casey go is because they have a long term look at the cap, at keeping it healthy... with an effort to be talented and capable of championship runs for a long time.

So, the Texans are positioning themselves each off-season to not have core players becoming free agents or being in a situation where they are having to scramble to get a deal done and a guy they want to keep under the cap. So, when Watt's 4year deal is up, the Texans will pick up their option on year 5 (using it as leverage for a relatively reasonable long term deal before they pick the meager option up). If he decides to play out the option instead of re-signing, the Texans will have room under the cap and have the franchise tag as leverage. If he doesn't sign, they franchise him. The next season, the same thing. If then, he still won't sign, they cut him loose after 7 years of service as he hits his 30th birthday.
First I've heard of Watt having an option year. 2015 is UFA IIRC. Can you provide link? That would be huge if there exist a team option as with KJ.
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Old 10-28-2013   #270
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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Yeah right - Morey is so good he was "forward thinking" to this 6 year plan huh? His roster churning appears to have finally paid off. After 6 years. Let that sink in. 6 years to get to where the Texans were 2 years ago after (wait for it) a complete roster turn over. Sounds like Smith did the same thing as Morey but had to flip 52 roster spots AND did it in 2 less years. The only difference is Morey landed 2 of the top players in back to back years. Smith didn't land Brady, Manning, Brees or some other top QB. He stuck with Schaub. I'm ready for a complete regime change but...if this team had a top 5 QB (maybe top 10) then Kubiak & Smith look like geniuses. They don't so they look like boobs.
It did not take him six years. What are you talking about?
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Old 10-28-2013   #271
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It did not take him six years. What are you talking about?
Morey's been GM since 2007. 2013-2007=6. Math.
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Old 10-28-2013   #272
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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First I've heard of Watt having an option year. 2015 is UFA IIRC. Can you provide link? That would be huge if there exist a team option as with KJ.
It is not expressly written into Watt's contract but is a universal rule collectively bargained under the new deal in 2011. Here is the applicable part followed by the link:

First-round picks get four-year deals in which the club holds a fifth-year option. There are slotted four-year deals from Rounds 2 through 7. Here's the discount. Cam Newton, the first pick in this year's draft, would be eligible for a four-year, $22.03 million contract. If the Panthers keep him for a fifth year, his salary would be at the average of the top 10 salaries of other quarterbacks. One unique part about the new system is it should prevent long holdouts. At some point in August, unsigned draft choices lose their leverage if they aren't signed. There is another clause that prevents draft picks from holding out after they sign. If he holds out during the deal, he is prohibited from renegotiating his contract. There is a limit to the amount of money given to rookies. The max total in 2011 is $874 million.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/67...football-terms
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Old 10-28-2013   #273
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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According to PFF out of 106 ranked CBs, Joseph is ranked #23. That's respectable. Cutting Joseph and the Texans secondary is only getting worse not better. I think the pass rush and run defense are bigger problems facing the defense. Currently the Texans Passing D is ranked #1, the Texans Rushing D is #27.
If the pass rush gets fixed, we don't need Jjo to play so well. McCain would even look better.

For a $10M cap hit we need him to look as good on the field as he does on paper. Especially knowing there are 22 corners playing better.

If we don't cut him, it would be in our best interest to renegotiate, kick some of that money down the line bringing his cap hit down to the $3M-$5M range, again providing cap relief while aligning his expected performance with his cap number.
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Old 10-28-2013   #274
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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Morey's been GM since 2007. 2013-2007=6. Math.
Are you aware that the Rockets last won a playoff series was in 2009? That was with one superstar already injured with the other getting injured during the second round. That was further than the Texans had been. Then they make the playoffs last season. Your math may be right, but youre using it for the wrong stuff and it doesn't make sense.

Let this sink in, the injury to two of his superstars four years ago caused him to have to shuffle the roster for three seasons toto land Harden last year. Morey had the assets and cap space thing down and now other tens are poaching the Rockets front office. tell me, who from the Texans front office gets pulled to other teams? Morey lost like three assistants over the off-season.
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Old 10-28-2013   #275
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Are you aware that the Rockets last won a playoff series was in 2009? That was with one superstar already injured with the other getting injured during the second round. That was further than the Texans had been. Then they make the playoffs last season. Your math may be right, but youre using it for the wrong stuff and it doesn't make sense.

Let this sink in, the injury to two of his superstars four years ago caused him to have to shuffle the roster for three seasons toto land Harden last year. Morey had the assets and cap space thing down and now other tens are poaching the Rockets front office. tell me, who from the Texans front office gets pulled to other teams? Morey lost like three assistants over the off-season.
This thread has devolved too much. This is my last reply to this take. Morey has not fielded a team that anyone considered reasonable favorites to get to or win a championship until this season. 6 years. Smith has done it for the past 3 - this year included.

I'm NOT defending Smith. People just seem to throw Morey out as an example of "how it should be done". He wanted Howard last year. He wanted Gasol. If he gets either he doesn't get Harden. If Howard does well in the Lakers system, he may stay in LA. He's smart but he got lucky too.
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Old 10-28-2013   #276
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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This thread has devolved too much. This is my last reply to this take. Morey has not fielded a team that anyone considered reasonable favorites to get to or win a championship until this season. 6 years. Smith has done it for the past 3 - this year included.

I'm NOT defending Smith. People just seem to throw Morey out as an example of "how it should be done". He wanted Howard last year. He wanted Gasol. If he gets either he doesn't get Harden. If Howard does well in the Lakers system, he may stay in LA. He's smart but he got lucky too.
No, the Rockets were thought of as contenders in 08-09 with the addition of Artest. The year before as well until Yao for hurt. Sometimes you make your own luck. Morey made his. we are still waiting on Smith and his bad handling of the cap/drafting replacements.
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Old 10-28-2013   #277
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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No, the Rockets were thought of as contenders in 08-09 with the addition of Artest. The year before as well until Yao for hurt. Sometimes you make your own luck. Morey made his. we are still waiting on Smith and his bad handling of the cap/drafting replacements.
Why on earth are we talking about the ridiculous NBA? And, are you kidding me? what have the Rockets accomplished that the Texans have not since 2007? I thought you guys were concerned about championships. I don't follow the NBA- it's almost as scripted as pro wrestling. Still, I don't recall seeing the Rockets accomplishing much in the playoffs.
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Old 10-28-2013   #278
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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Riiiiiiggghhhtttt. Bad cap management started affecting us in December. So do bad draft picks start hurting teams in the Superbowl?

I've wasted too much time in this thread. You have a twisted reason for every statement you make and your analytical skills are severely lacking.

It is OK for a very talented team to be up against the cap. This is a very talented team. Your favorite team, Indy apparently, is under the cap because they are a young team with onegreat player and several above aaverage players that are all very young.

And in case you have forgotten, your favorite team had the best qb of all time for over a decade and only has one ring to show for it. Think about that for a minute. You think in 3 years that Luck's contract isn'tgoing to put indy in a world of hurt? Their owner was just lamenting the fact that they only won one ring with Manning. The colts are a 3 or 4 win team without Luck. The Texans will win more games than that with a QB that is half as good as luck and then they will have the chance to draft a franchise QB.

Other than luck which players do the colts have that you would take over the Texans hands down? If that list is more than three or four players we know the problem, it is your knowledge.

Mike
Wait a minute, back it up... Beep Beep Beep

The "very talented" texans are 2-5 and 2-6 is very much a reality. Hell, I think 2-7 might happen because winning @ARI is no easy feat.

I think we can stop the delusion that the Texan's roster is "very talented".
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Old 10-28-2013   #279
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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Wait a minute, back it up... Beep Beep Beep

The "very talented" texans are 2-5 and 2-6 is very much a reality. Hell, I think 2-7 might happen because winning @ARI is no easy feat.

I think we can stop the delusion that the Texan's roster is "very talented".
Make your argument. It can't simply be, "the record proves it". Talented teams have had bad stretches. Teams with little talent have had winning streaks... Do you think the jets have more talent than the texans? Explain.

Maybe you are right. But, break it down... You must love Kubiak as a coach to get so much out of an untalented team the past two years.
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Old 10-28-2013   #280
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Default Re: Rick Smith's poor job of managing the cap has closed our window for the time bein

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Are you aware that the Rockets last won a playoff series was in 2009? That was with one superstar already injured with the other getting injured during the second round. That was further than the Texans had been. Then they make the playoffs last season. Your math may be right, but youre using it for the wrong stuff and it doesn't make sense.

Let this sink in, the injury to two of his superstars four years ago caused him to have to shuffle the roster for three seasons toto land Harden last year. Morey had the assets and cap space thing down and now other tens are poaching the Rockets front office. tell me, who from the Texans front office gets pulled to other teams? Morey lost like three assistants over the off-season.
comparing morey and smith as GMs is one of the stupidest things ive seen on this thread.

COMPLETELY DIFFERENT SPORT. morey has 12 roster positions, football has 53. much more parity in football, and MUCH easier to turn a program around.

in basketball, you NEED 1 top 10 player to be relevant, 2 to compete realistically. AND, take into consideration that morey inherited the yao-tmac injury mess. the fact that he turned it around without tanking (which, isnt garaunteed) is unbelievable. even if it took, gasp, 6 years.
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