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Old 09-21-2013   #41
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
I never even implied the state of the cap overall was not a consideration.



Or they didn't reach at all and the draftniks were just wrong aka Duane Brown. JJ Watt and Cushing certainly were not reaches and neither was KJ. Even bust Okoye wasn't a reach - the draftniks had him rated that high. Mario wasn't even a reach and arguably QB and RB were higher needs. Seems like you are example shy on your position.
The ONLY BPA in your list of names is JJ Watt. The others were high positions of need and some were reaches regardless of what you have been led to believe. If you take off the Rose colored glasses it is clear to see that the Texans are clearly Reactive and not Proactive. It's called Coach Think vs GM Think!
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Old 09-21-2013   #42
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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The ONLY BPA in your list of names is JJ Watt. The others were high positions of need and some were reaches regardless of what you have been led to believe. If you take off the Rose colored glasses it is clear to see that the Texans are clearly Reactive and not Proactive. It's called Coach Think vs GM Think!
Total BS. Being a position of need does not preclude someone from also being BPA such as Cushing. And there is no led to believe. Picking the worst result, Okoye was all over the place listed as value at our pick with a significant number of people ranking him to go before us.

Spare the silly false comparison. EVERY single GM in the league considers both BPA and need.
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Old 09-21-2013   #43
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
Total BS. Being a position of need does not preclude someone from also being BPA such as Cushing. And there is no led to believe. Picking the worst result, Okoye was all over the place listed as value at our pick with a significant number of people ranking him to go before us.

Spare the silly false comparison. EVERY single GM in the league considers both BPA and need.
Things are sweet when BPA=Need.

I wanted Clay Matthews over Cushing as BPA when he was drafted. Pass rusher over MLB. Plus Matthews gene lines showed he was more likely to stay healthy. Even after Cushing was drafted I wanted Rick to trade back into the 1st rd and pick Matthews. Of course Rick waited and took Barwin in the 2nd. (I was high on Barwin too) and we see how that turned out. The Texans are still looking for a high end pass rusher today.

Who did you want Cushing or Matthews?
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Old 09-21-2013   #44
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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Things are sweet when BPA=Need.

I wanted Clay Matthews over Cushing as BPA when he was drafted. Pass rusher over MLB. Plus Matthews gene lines showed he was more likely to stay healthy. Even after Cushing was drafted I wanted Rick to trade back into the 1st rd and pick Matthews. Of course Rick waited and took Barwin in the 2nd. (I was high on Barwin too) and we see how that turned out. The Texans are still looking for a high end pass rusher today.

Who did you want Cushing or Matthews?
Just like I thought during that draft, it was and is a toss up. I certainly would have cheered a move to get both.

Cushing was not drafted to be MLB. He played OLB his 1st two seasons including going to the pro-bowl and being named defensive rookie of the year at OLB over Matthews.
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Old 09-21-2013   #45
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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Just like I thought during that draft, it was and is a toss up. I certainly would have cheered a move to get both.

Cushing was not drafted to be MLB. He played OLB his 1st two seasons including going to the pro-bowl and being named defensive rookie of the year at OLB over Matthews.
You couldn't go wrong with either one of them.

The bold move to make would've been to move up and get both of them. Like the Packers did with Raji and Matthews.

Not crossing threads, but I'm worried that Grigson will make these bold moves and the Rick wont. If this happens it wont be long before the Texans pass the Texans in the standings again.
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Old 09-21-2013   #46
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
Total BS.
Says who? Your responses make perfect sense by someone whose thought process is clouded by their own optimism and a belief that the Texans can do no wrong. That's perfectly understandable but it doesn't make it TOTAL BS.

Okoye's own college coach passed on him. If there ever was a consensus of who was the best player it was Patrick Willis. In fact Okoye's college accomplishments were not much better than average and ordinary. His Combine was better. In fact Okoye was a draft pick based on pure potential. 19 yrs old, 300 lbs and strong. He was suppose to get bigger, stronger and faster because was 19 but he didn't. What's the old saying Drafting based on potential will get you fired. Potential certainly doesn't = BPA.

Brown was drafted by Gibbs because of his run blocking and athletic ability to make back side blocks needed in the ZBS. Brown was drafted for Gibbs running game. A LOT is usually drafted for pass pro abilities. Brown's first 3 years in pass pro were atrocious, some of the worst in the league, his last 2 have been very good, this year hasn't looked so good.

Frank Bush made the decision to draft Cushing early in that season. In 2009 the Texans were in desperate need of another pass rusher. Clay Matthews was clearly the better pass rusher and athlete. You just can't ignore his 1.49 10 yd split or multi generation DNA. Cushing at USC was often on the sideline during passing downs, replaced Kaluka Maiava. For many, (including me) Matthews was clearly the BPA.

Kareem Jackson was a David Gibbs (now out of coaching) and Rick Smith pick. Jackson prep school (because of poor grades) transfer was deemed by a few scouts as the most ready for the NFL in a very weak CB class. That came mainly from being a Saban DB and Saban being a former NFL DB coach under Belichick. Evaluators have learned that is not so much the case today. Jackson stats and performances were for the most part middle of the pack in the SEC. Athletically Jackson was slightly above average. Jackson's first (3) years were woeful. Last year Jackson played well against passes under 20 yards but was still having problems with passes over 20+ yds. There were at least a half dozen players who were considered BPA over Jackson.

I understand optimism and do no wrong thinking to a point. In 2009 after firing Richard Smith (who had no experience as DC) and with several accomplished successful DC available, Gary Kubiak does NOT do (1) interview before hiring Frank Bush (who had no experience as DC), told me Kubiak's commitment to his friends exceeded any commitment to excellence. That's when I lost my optimism and thinking the Texans did no wrong.

Last edited by Texian; 09-21-2013 at 10:26 PM.
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Old 09-21-2013   #47
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

I really don't see the point in arguing about past drafts. They happened, for better or worse. Honestly, aside from Okoye, all the players being discussed have turned out quite well for the Texans. I'm pretty comfortable with the talent our team has acquired through the draft, and while yes, not all picks were home runs, that's simply the nature of the NFL Draft. Remember when Aaron Curry went 4th overall and was the clear cut best LB in the class with Cushing and Matthews? Didn't work out so well, did it? No such thing as a can't miss prospect, and even we as fans can be quite wrong with regards to the players we champion during the draft process.

All we can really do is say who we'd like and who we think they will take...after all they don't take our opinions into account on draft day, do they?
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Old 09-21-2013   #48
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
He played OLB his 1st two seasons including going to the pro-bowl and being named defensive rookie of the year at OLB over Matthews.
When he was juiced. (which was also a very strong rumor prior to the draft) That Performance dropped noticeably after his suspension.

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You couldn't go wrong with either one of them.

The bold move to make would've been to move up and get both of them. Like the Packers did with Raji and Matthews.

Not crossing threads, but I'm worried that Grigson will make these bold moves and the Rick wont. If this happens it wont be long before the Texans pass the Texans in the standings again.
Quite a few wanted Matthews because Texans were in desperate need of pass rusher opposite of Mario. This is an illustration in some of logic of Texans drafting. They draft Cushing who played primarily SLB/MILB at USC to play OLB. What's the first thing Wade does when he comes in, moves Cush to LILB where he had his best success while at USC.

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Old 09-21-2013   #49
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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When he was juiced. (which was also a very strong rumor prior to the draft) Performance dropped after his suspension.



Quite a few wanted Matthews because Texans were in desperate need of pass rusher opposite of Mario. This is an illustration in some of logic of Texans drafting. They draft Cushing who played primarily MILB at USC to play OLB. What's the first thing Wade does when he comes in, moves Cush to MILB where he was so successful at USC.
I could have sworn Rey Maualuga was the MLB for the Trojans while he, Cushing and Matthews were there...and don't forget we were still running a 4-3 at the time.
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Old 09-21-2013   #50
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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I really don't see the point in arguing about past drafts.
You know me when someone makes a blanket comment like, "Total BS" without any reason I am going to respond. Unlike others I do try to give reasoning, to my thinking.

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I could have sworn Rey Maualuga was the MLB for the Trojans while he, Cushing and Matthews were there...and don't forget we were still running a 4-3 at the time.
Maualuga did play ILB, Cush played inside and out RILB/SLB. USC played some 4-3 & 3-4. Maualuga, Cushing, Matthews and Maiava all were drafted. USC also would bring in Maiava for Cush in some passing situations. While Matthews was on the field for most all passing downs.

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Old 09-21-2013   #51
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

The Trojans did line up with 3 DLs some, but on very few snaps.
I watched nearly 20 of their games the two years prior to 'em LB entering the draft.

Cushing played a vast majority on the outside.
I'm not even sure if he ever lined up in the middle at the second level.
My memory might be faulty; there's always a chance of that, but I think that probability is quite low.
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Old 09-21-2013   #52
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

If you google Pete Carroll 43 under defense, a ton of results will come up; that what he was known for.
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Old 09-21-2013   #53
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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The Trojans did line up with 3 DLs some, but on very few snaps.
I watched nearly 20 of their games the two years prior to 'em LB entering the draft.

Cushing played a vast majority on the outside.
I'm not even sure if he ever lined up in the middle at the second level.
My memory might be faulty; there's always a chance of that, but I think that probability is quite low.
You're right. Cushing played SLB primarily. In 2007 USC created the Elephant (hybrid) position in order to get Matthews on the field because he was that good as he was backing up Keith Rivers at the time (Rivers a Top 10 draft pick). Because of the success they stayed with it in 2008. In the 4-3 Matthews played DE and in the 3-4 he played ROLB. When USC was in a 4-3 in some passing situations Kaluka Maiava would come in for Cushing. The Trojans when in a 3-4, LBs would line up, Maiava-Cushing-Maualaga-Matthews. Actually to be more technically correct Carroll used a 5-2 much like Wade's D with Matthews on the End standing up and Cushing and Maualaga were the 2. Much like the way Carroll is using Bruce Irvin in Seattle. The 2008 USC Defense is considered one of the best defenses of all time.

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Old 09-21-2013   #54
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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Frank Bush made the decision to draft Cushing early in that season.
Ah, I see. You are one of those people who thinks they have a magic 8-ball that shows them the inner workings of every Texans' decision.

PS - my opinions have nothing to do with optimism. Your slinging that around toward those who disagree with you is just a poor attempt at a bullying rhetorical device.
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Old 09-22-2013   #55
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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Ah, I see. You are one of those people who thinks they have a magic 8-ball that shows them the inner workings of every Texans' decision.

PS - my opinions have nothing to do with optimism. Your slinging that around toward those who disagree with you is just a poor attempt at a bullying rhetorical device.
NO! I have already linked a video of Frank Bush saying he knew early in the season that he wanted Cushing and he would be the pick if Cush was available. There was no magic 8 ball. You're the one that resorts to name calling and outlandish comments (total BS) without any logic, reasoning or explanation whatsoever to support your excuses or argument.

Those with tunnel vision never see the other side of logic. They see truth, logic and deductive reasoning as bullying rhetorical devices and their own excuses are never backed up with any reasonable explanations. The fact that you don't see yourself as overly optimistic or that your attitude towards the Texans is they can do no wrong is similar to a greedy or spoiled person not thinking they're are greedy or spoiled. You may not see yourself as such but you definitely talk the talk and walk the walk of a Die Hard, Overly Optimistic, Texans can do no wrong fan. And there is nothing wrong with that.

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Old 09-22-2013   #56
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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You're right. Cushing played SLB primarily. In 2007 USC created the Elephant (hybrid) position in order to get Matthews on the field because he was that good as he was backing up Keith Rivers at the time (Rivers a Top 10 draft pick). Because of the success they stayed with it in 2008. In the 4-3 Matthews played DE and in the 3-4 he played ROLB. When USC was in a 4-3 in some passing situations Kaluka Maiava would come in for Cushing. The Trojans when in a 3-4, LBs would line up, Maiava-Cushing-Maualaga-Matthews. Actually to be more technically correct Carroll used a 5-2 much like Wade's D with Matthews on the End standing up and Cushing and Maualaga were the 2. Much like the way Carroll is using Bruce Irvin in Seattle. The 2008 USC Defense is considered one of the best defenses of all time.
This is accurate from what I watched too, never considered USC defense one of best ever, but certainly had the tools & in mix for best in country that year.
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Old 09-22-2013   #57
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

OT unless Williams shows something for next year. We need something behind Duane and Newton is getting shredded.
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Old 09-27-2013   #58
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

Cush played multiple positions through out his tenure at USC
He was their best defender plain and simple

Which shows till this day

He played Weak and Strongside
He could play middle but didn't need too
He played OLB/DE
Elephant hybrid role.

he is a true defender plug and play

I wanted him from the get go and pleased we got him
He is better than Matthews then and now
That year it was Cushing or Matthews
Couldn't go wrong really but I preferred Cushing and glad we got him and I would make the same pick till this day
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Old 09-27-2013   #59
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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Cush played multiple positions through out his tenure at USC
He was their best defender plain and simple

Which shows till this day

He played Weak and Strongside
He could play middle but didn't need too
He played OLB/DE
Elephant hybrid role.

he is a true defender plug and play

I wanted him from the get go and pleased we got him
He is better than Matthews then and now
That year it was Cushing or Matthews
Couldn't go wrong really but I preferred Cushing and glad we got him and I would make the same pick till this day
Give me an ILB that can cover in late 2nd or third to watch. I have UCONN's Yawin Smallwood in 2nd round now. Hope to watch him against Buffalo tomorrow afternoon.
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Old 09-27-2013   #60
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Default Re: Texans draft 2014

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Give me an ILB that can cover in late 2nd or third to watch. I have UCONN's Yawin Smallwood in 2nd round now. Hope to watch him against Buffalo tomorrow afternoon.
Why the 2nd RD? I'm all in on CJ Mosley from Bama he will be a pro bowler I was all in last year but he returned surprisingly as a top 15 pick.
Defenders are abundant in this years draft and a few backers will drop

A few others I really like AJ Johnson from Tenn and Christian Jones from FSU.
Both Johnson&Jones are ranked in the 2nd RD currently. Another name is Andrew Jackson from Westren Kentucky is another impressive inside back but unlike the other 3 I mentioned he can not cover he is a thick, down hill, wrecking ball. Strictly a 1st&2nd down inside backer but A backer of value and skill that will be desirable because what he does even though limited he does so well.

Mosley is the leader of the best defense and is pro ready and pro coached and is a do it all inside out and multiple formations
Basically it doesn't matter what scheme what formation anything... Mosley will play and play well and lead on all downs.
Johnson&Jones are similar I prefer Johnson both are hustle guys and are sideline too sideline backers and both can handle the middle weather attacking the line and filling the gaps or disguising and back pelting out and covering
Both are very athletic and dynamic

Mosley is the cream of the crop though but Johnson&Jones can get the job done. I don't know how they will fair in a 3-4 scheme though jones is a little on the small side with height and weight I prefer for my 34IlB same with Johnson but I think Johnson can handle it he is a little nasty and kind of badger like
I think Johnson would find a way too get the job done and both can add weight and get bigger
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