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Old 06-27-2013   #41
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
If not now, when? He's a FA at the end of the season. Then we're talking new contract.
I say never but Texans would want to wait a few games minimum to see if we can lose his $9m cap without pushing into future and bring in a younger cheaper guy. Also, Smith may want to test free agency as his last contract.
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Old 06-28-2013   #42
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

Cap space now for dead money later doesn't make ANY sense to me unless you think your window is closing in the next couple of seasons. That is like paying bills with a credit card. Great! You get to keep the power on this month, but next month when the bill is due you are going to have to steal from Peter to pay Paul.

Smith may understand that his best chance at getting a "final contract" may come in the form of a Texans extension, and force him to be reasonable. But he might opt to try the FA market at 33. Who knows.
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Old 06-28-2013   #43
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

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Smith may understand that his best chance at getting a "final contract" may come in the form of a Texans extension, and force him to be reasonable. But he might opt to try the FA market at 33. Who knows.
What's reasonable? That's what screws this whole conversation up. Antonio Smith just came off the two best seasons of his career. DL can play well into their thirties. Looking at Justin Smith we should be able to expect at least two more years from Antonio (I think).

Personally, if the Texans don't do something prior to the season starting (or shortly thereafter ala Schaub) that tells me the Texans do not have Antonio in their plans for the future. My way of thinking is that you don't let players you "need" hit free agency.

Of course if Antonio turns them down, that's another story.

So, this, "Don't sign anyone until we sign Cushing & Watt" thinking doesn't make sense to me. We're going to sign other players. As the Texans I would think they have a dollar figure at which they realize good value for Antonio Smith's services. Whatever that dollar figure is, they need to factor that into their future plans.
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Old 06-28-2013   #44
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

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What's reasonable? That's what screws this whole conversation up. Antonio Smith just came off the two best seasons of his career. DL can play well into their thirties. Looking at Justin Smith we should be able to expect at least two more years from Antonio (I think).

Personally, if the Texans don't do something prior to the season starting (or shortly thereafter ala Schaub) that tells me the Texans do not have Antonio in their plans for the future. My way of thinking is that you don't let players you "need" hit free agency.

Of course if Antonio turns them down, that's another story.

So, this, "Don't sign anyone until we sign Cushing & Watt" thinking doesn't make sense to me. We're going to sign other players. As the Texans I would think they have a dollar figure at which they realize good value for Antonio Smith's services. Whatever that dollar figure is, they need to factor that into their future plans.
Fun and interesting discussion! Is Smith a "need" player? Not so sure as Crick $ .668, Jamison $. 840 and even Browner $ .495 for 2014 may impact keeping Antonio after 2013.

Again, I like Smith but $9.5m cap goes a long way to signing Cushing & Watt. Ninja is a good player but not a great player.
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Old 06-28-2013   #45
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

I would not keep Smith anywhere near his current salary. He'd have to take a significant pay cut. Otherwise I'd let him test the market.
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Old 06-28-2013   #46
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

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Fun and interesting discussion! Is Smith a "need" player? Not so sure as Crick $ .668, Jamison $. 840 and even Browner $ .495 for 2014 may impact keeping Antonio after 2013.

Again, I like Smith but $9.5m cap goes a long way to signing Cushing & Watt. Ninja is a good player but not a great player.
If you're planning on extending Cushing or Watt this year, yes. If not, it has no bearing. Antonio Smith is a FA in 2014. If the Texans want to keep him past 2013 they need to sign him to an extension. I would prefer they do it this year if they are going to do it. That money could be used to sign the rookies & provide some buffer for this year.

If I thought Crick, Jamison or Browner can get me 5 sacks & all the hurries & pressures that goes with it, then yes that would change whether or not we "need" Smith.

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I would not keep Smith anywhere near his current salary. He'd have to take a significant pay cut. Otherwise I'd let him test the market.
His current salary is $6M. You don't think he is worth anywhere near $6M/yr? I think he's a $3-$5M per year player. I wouldn't have a problem if the Texans extended him for 4 years with a $10M signing bonus.

That would reduce his cap this year by $2-3M.

$3.5M (current prorated bonus) + $2.5M (new prorated bonus) + $800K (vet min) = 2013 cap hit

$2.5M + (vet min)= 2014 cap hit, 2015 cap hit, 2016 cap hit.

Or something like that.
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Old 06-28-2013   #47
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

To me, Smith saying he's interested in an extension is Smith saying that he doesn't want to test FA and that he's willing to sign for less. He wants to stay here.

If he's willing to be reasonable with his money requests, I'm willing to extend him.
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Old 06-28-2013   #48
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
If you're planning on extending Cushing or Watt this year, yes. If not, it has no bearing. Antonio Smith is a FA in 2014. If the Texans want to keep him past 2013 they need to sign him to an extension. I would prefer they do it this year if they are going to do it. That money could be used to sign the rookies & provide some buffer for this year.

If I thought Crick, Jamison or Browner can get me 5 sacks & all the hurries & pressures that goes with it, then yes that would change whether or not we "need" Smith.



His current salary is $6M. You don't think he is worth anywhere near $6M/yr? I think he's a $3-$5M per year player. I wouldn't have a problem if the Texans extended him for 4 years with a $10M signing bonus.

That would reduce his cap this year by $2-3M.

$3.5M (current prorated bonus) + $2.5M (new prorated bonus) + $800K (vet min) = 2013 cap hit

$2.5M + (vet min)= 2014 cap hit, 2015 cap hit, 2016 cap hit.

Or something like that.

2-3 mil. Max.

We have a lot of young guys in the stable that I think are capable. Considering the guys will will have to pay I would not place a high priority on Smith.

If he wants to play for half his current salary or less then yeah...why not...
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Old 06-28-2013   #49
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

Most very good teams try to maintain continuity by keeping some seasoned productive vets while transitioning to currently promising but definitely unproven substitutions. If negotiations allow for us squeezing in the deal, I say go for it. With so much of our lbs and secondary coming back from injuries/surgeries, at least try to keep the productive (and protective) part of the front line intact (I'm personally not sold on the Earl Mitchell love).
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Old 06-28-2013   #50
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

I think there will be teams willing to pay Smith with his stats what he is earning this year $6m and offer a three year deal. If I were him I would not agree to a $3m (or less) extension. In addition, he will be playing for a new deal somewhere and if he does well or gets a ring, why not seek greener money er pastures?
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Old 06-28-2013   #51
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
To me, Smith saying he's interested in an extension is Smith saying that he doesn't want to test FA and that he's willing to sign for less. He wants to stay here.

If he's willing to be reasonable with his money requests, I'm willing to extend him.
Let's say we rework him and he gets a $3m base + $1m prorated bonus or cap hit of $4m. That would be very reasonable although I doubt he would take it. You have reduced his cap hit by almost half from $9.5 to 4. While $4.5 savings is good, it does not do as much as having a full $9m to utilize. If we are considering allowing his contract to play out, we need to make sure we have a replacement for his absence in 2014. While we might surmise, it would be best to allow at least half of 2013 season to pass; no reason to do anything at this time.
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Old 06-29-2013   #52
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
Fun and interesting discussion! Is Smith a "need" player? Not so sure as Crick $ .668, Jamison $. 840 and even Browner $ .495 for 2014 may impact keeping Antonio after 2013.

Again, I like Smith but $9.5m cap goes a long way to signing Cushing & Watt. Ninja is a good player but not a great player.
Do you really think Cushing will be as effective with Jamison or Crick or Browner at the other DE spot as he's been with Ninja in that spot. Would Wade be able to play the move-Watt-around games he plays if Jamison/Crick/Browner in Ninja's spot.

It's not just a money thing; it's will we fundamentally weaken our defensive front by letting a very effective DE (22 sacks in the 4 yrs he's been here) walk out the door...? Keeping a solid defense for the next 2-4 years - while A.J. is still the monster he's been on offense - is worth a 3-5 mil/yr investment. I simply don't see Jamison sufficiently filling the void that Ninja would leave. And Browner and Crick are pretty much unknown quantities.
I don't care for the idea of monkeying with Wade's toys like that to save a few bucks when there are games that can be played to keep the cap hit sensible.

And, BTW, what's wrong with Cushing giving a "hometown discount"? Yeah, he's a terror when healthy but he's missed 16 games in the four years he's been here.... Ninja has missed NONE.
Just my

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Old 06-29-2013   #53
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Default Re: Reports: Mutual Interest in Antonio Smith Extension

I agree. Had Crick or Jamison shown they were ready to take Antonio's spot this would be a differnet conversation. The smart move now is to extend smith & try to trade Crick or Jamison if they can increase their perceived value.
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Old 06-29-2013   #54
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Not sure who is coming out next year or what the field looks like but I don't see him being around that much longer.
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