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Old 06-11-2013   #361
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
The left side is your power side. Unless I'm totally wrong about Wade Smith, I can't wrap my head around putting Brooks anywhere but next to DBrown76. & with a lithe Ben Jones mopping up the second level.
From people who do charting, I've been told that from 2006-2011, the Texans were more of a right-handed running team. But that in 2012, the Texans ran more to the left.

I am guessing that is more due to personnel issues.
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Old 06-11-2013   #362
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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The left side is your power side. Unless I'm totally wrong about Wade Smith, I can't wrap my head around putting Brooks anywhere but next to DBrown76. & with a lithe Ben Jones mopping up the second level.
Where are you getting the left side being the "power" side? Most teams put their more athletic linemen on the left and the more move bodies type of guys on the right.

The guys on the left are generally facing more athletic defenders like the weak olb or weak side DE. And the guys on the right more often have the TE on their side which means they'll be facing the run stopping defenders.

Teams generally run more to the right which is the side the TE lines up on more often. Generally. There's always exceptions, but for the most part you will see the better run blockers on the right and the more athletic/better pass blockers on the left.
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Old 06-11-2013   #363
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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IMO it will look more like this: Brown, Quess, Myers, Brooks, Williams or Newton, with the loser of the RT job being the swing guy and Jones being the middle backup.
I think quess is going to win the RT job at some point. And IMO he's the best fit for that position. I don't think he's a guard at all. He has tackle written all over him.
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Old 06-11-2013   #364
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
5. Dark horse candidate: Quessenberry. When he works with backups, looks like he is too big to be with that group. Same sensation I got when I watched Eric Winston his rookie year. (Not the same player but long arms, named captain as a lineman, played through injuries). I'm going to watch Oline more carefully in minicamps given current issues.
First let me say thanks for your OTA coverage T_C, because for whatever reason it seemed that media access to that aspect of Texans' offseason training this year was more limited than usual and appreciate that you got out info about the sessions.
Now re Quessenberry, I'm still puzzled that he was not drafted until the 6th round because I watched the SenBowl TV coverage of him in practice from Mobile, and he was very impressive and got raves from many including Draft guru Mayoc. And the guy was a multi year LT starter in college, so he can pass-block and with his athleticism (another X-TE) should be a good fit for the Texans ZBS. Would have thought he would be more of a 3rd - 4th round
pick ?
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Old 06-11-2013   #365
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

It is way too early to analyze future Olines. Or even predict this year's.

The violent nature of the sport often dictates this sort of thing. It did last year. It may this year. The football gods can be brutal.
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Old 06-11-2013   #366
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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Where are you getting the left side being the "power" side? Most teams put their more athletic linemen on the left and the more move bodies type of guys on the right.

The guys on the left are generally facing more athletic defenders like the weak olb or weak side DE. And the guys on the right more often have the TE on their side which means they'll be facing the run stopping defenders.

Teams generally run more to the right which is the side the TE lines up on more often. Generally. There's always exceptions, but for the most part you will see the better run blockers on the right and the more athletic/better pass blockers on the left.
I've no doubt in my mind that Wade Smith (in 2010) was a better run blocker & pass blocker than Mike Briesel. No doubt in my mind that he was (in 2010) less athletic yet stronger.

Though we saw Wade Smith pull & wrap around the RT from time to time, Briesel was the more athletic of the two.

For all I know, that's what we ran with, because that's what Kubiak had. He may've been dreaming of two Wade Smith's this whole time. But I like the idea of having the versatility of having a guy like Briesel/Ben Jones on Myers' right side.
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Old 06-11-2013   #367
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

This would be a risky OL, but here's what I would do at the end of TC, if I saw Williams was healthy and playing well and Quessenberry could be an above avg backup.

Brown, Brooks, Myers, Jones, Williams

Quessenberry would be the main backup and with the $$$$$ saved from cutting W.Smith I would sign Casey Hampton. The risk is that the OL would be real young.
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Old 06-11-2013   #368
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

I'm with TC on not worrying about predicting the line at this point. With the injuries, young players that are still unknowns during their development it seems a rather large crap shoot.

But in regards to the power side of the line, Rey is correct. It is generally universal that the right side is your strong side of the line. One, defenses line up their stronger run defenders on that side and those tend to be their strongest, biggest as well. Two, running backs have a comfort level going to their right (right handed ones at least). Three, the left side is generally more athletic due to the fact they will usually face the best pass rushers from the opposition.

Not sure, Thunder, why you thought Brisiel was more athletic than Smith. In categories they were tested Smith beat out Brisiel's numbers in all of them. Meaning 40, 20 yard shuttle, 3 cone, broad jump, vertical, etc. He's the more athletic of the two. And in 2010 Brisiel graded to be a better run blocker than Smith and we ran it +17 times at the RG compared to LG.

This is why Jones struggled. His strength is not developed yet to face the stronger DT's on that side. On the left you would face the quicker, 3-tech guys and have to be quick/athletic enough to deal with that and the stunts defensive coaches like to do with those type of players. Right side not as much.
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Old 06-11-2013   #369
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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Originally Posted by steelbtexan View Post
Brown, Brooks, Myers, Jones, Williams
Risky for sure, because we have no idea how the gimpy Williams will play. But if he does earn that spot over Newton, that's great.

I think we focused too much on the right side of the line last year. The rotations & young players was a big part of that. But I think it took too much attention away from what was happening on the left side. Duane had a really good year, but we didn't see any of the dominating performances he spoiled us with in 2010 & 2011.

I don't think anyway. I don't think it's a cause for much concern, just mentioning, that's all.

Wade Smith, though he played better in 2012 than he did in 2011 I think he was far, far away from what we should expect on this line. He's declining. Specifically in the run game, still a fine pass blocker, but in the run game, we need to get better.

I didn't see Brandon Brooks play better in 2012, but I did see damn fine play & the foundation to be a better player in 2013.

I saw a starter in Ben Jones. A starter at RG. But most of us are looking at our line as if we only need to figure out RG & RT.

I agree with you steelb, we need to figure out LG, RG, & RT
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Old 06-11-2013   #370
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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we have no idea how the gimpy Williams will play.
Isn't this the same guy who just came off of his last season in the last 6 - 10 months in college missing a significant part of the season because of injury ?
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Old 06-11-2013   #371
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

If Brennan Williams is the RT this year, back up QB will be a whole lot more important because Schaub would get killed.

Not sure what you guys are talking about...But RG is pretty much sewn up. That's Brandon Brooks spot.

The positions in Question are RT for this season and LG for future seasons.
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Old 06-11-2013   #372
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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If Brennan Williams is the RT this year, back up QB will be a whole lot more important because Schaub would get killed.

Not sure what you guys are talking about...But RG is pretty much sewn up. That's Brandon Brooks spot.

The positions in Question are RT for this season and LG for future seasons.
I think that THIS is what Kubiak is hoping, at least for the future:

Brown - Quessenberry - Myers - Brooks - Newton/Williams

Quess may or may not beat out Smith this year but I think he's the future at the LG spot... unless he does a great job at RT because Newton/Williams/Harris can't stay healthy. If that happens, then he could be hard to get out of that RT spot.

From what I've seen from Quess, I think he'd make a great RT but early on at the OTAs, they had him at LG.
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Old 06-11-2013   #373
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
If Brennan Williams is the RT this year, back up QB will be a whole lot more important because Schaub would get killed.

Not sure what you guys are talking about...But RG is pretty much sewn up. That's Brandon Brooks spot.

The positions in Question are RT for this season and LG for future seasons.
Imo, we're in trouble at RT no matter what. Newton's not healthy and was below average when he was healthy. Quess is a rookie from a small school that has a lot of upside. Williams is a rookie who has only been on the field a couple hours since he's been here. To me, going into camp, RT is Harris' job to lose. And, unless he's vastly improved, it makes me cringe

*BTW, I was just piggy-backin your post. I agree with your comments
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Old 06-11-2013   #374
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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I think that THIS is what Kubiak is hoping, at least for the future:

Brown - Quessenberry - Myers - Brooks - Newton/Williams

Quess may or may not beat out Smith this year but I think he's the future at the LG spot... unless he does a great job at RT because Newton/Williams/Harris can't stay healthy. If that happens, then he could be hard to get out of that RT spot.

From what I've seen from Quess, I think he'd make a great RT but early on at the OTAs, they had him at LG.
I think Quess has a good chance of winning the RT spot this year. I don't know how Mondek or the other guy have progressed though, so I can't really say.

What I do know though is that Newton and Williams are both hurt and Williams had quite a few awful moments in pass protection in college.

I don't think Kubiak has any expectations like that. I think he drafts guys he likes and lets things sort themselves out. I think he had mentioned Brandon Brooks as a tackle at one point last year. Ben Jones got a lot og Reps at RG last year.

I believe he tries guys in different spots to see where they fit well. I don't think he's really set on any one thing unless he just believes a guy flat out can't do something.
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Old 06-11-2013   #375
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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Originally Posted by HOU-TEX View Post
Imo, we're in trouble at RT no matter what. Newton's not healthy and was below average when he was healthy. Quess is a rookie from a small school that has a lot of upside. Williams is a rookie who has only been on the field a couple hours since he's been here. To me, going into camp, RT is Harris' job to lose. And, unless he's vastly improved, it makes me cringe

*BTW, I was just piggy-backin your post. I agree with your comments
I agree with that. I don't know how much it's going to adversely affect us, but right now RT is definitely the weak link. Not that we know Brooks is going to be a beast at RG, but just the nature of the position and the fact that Brooks played well at the end of last year makes me feel a little better about him at RG than ???? at RT.
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Old 06-11-2013   #376
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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I agree with that. I don't know how much it's going to adversely affect us, but right now RT is definitely the weak link. Not that we know Brooks is going to be a beast at RG, but just the nature of the position and the fact that Brooks played well at the end of last year makes me feel a little better about him at RG than ???? at RT.
Agreed! And if it weren't for a few MAs he would've been really good. I think he's going to take a huge step this season and be the full time starter. I can't stand it when Kubiak has a rotation going with an oline position. Especially running the ZBS where the oline works as one.

No more rotations, please! Choose your RT in camp and go with him
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Old 06-11-2013   #377
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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Agreed! And if it weren't for a few MAs he would've been really good. I think he's going to take a huge step this season and be the full time starter. I can't stand it when Kubiak has a rotation going with an oline position. Especially running the ZBS where the oline works as one.

No more rotations, please! Choose your RT in camp and go with him
We started last season with Caldwell at RG & Butler at RT. When they both got hurt, our depth suddenly dissipated. Ben Jones surprised everyone & started early. However, like all young players struggled to maintain focus & perform at his best down after down, series after series.

The rotation had nothing to do with not being able to decide on who he wanted his RG or RT to be. It was about maintaining a level of consistency of play.

To me, it doesn't make sense to "waste" a year (2012) on getting one player ready. We know there's going to be a drop off when we bring a new player into the line, unless we get a blue chip player, which isn't going to happen [for one, we'll never select in the top 10 again, :fingers crossed:] then waste another (2013) year to bring someone in at LG. Get them both up to speed in 2012 & kick some doors in in 2013.

I think Ben Jones will be our RG, he did a good job at that position for a rookie. Brandon Brooks will be our LG.
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Old 06-11-2013   #378
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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I think Ben Jones will be our RG, he did a good job at that position for a rookie. Brandon Brooks will be our LG.
I didn't try to find the quote but Kubiak said during OTAs that Brandon Brooks was the starting RG. When did that change? I haven't heard nor read about it.
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Old 06-11-2013   #379
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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I didn't try to find the quote but Kubiak said during OTAs that Brandon Brooks was the starting RG. When did that change? I haven't heard nor read about it.
At the time, I'm sure that was true. No Ben Jones, someone has to play RG. Reporters are going to ask stupid questions, he answers the most economic way possible.

We'll see who the starting RG is come week one.

PreSeason may not tell us a lot either. Remember before 2010, Wade Smith played with the second group as much as the first. We didn't know he was our starting LG until Game 1.
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Old 06-11-2013   #380
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Default Re: Texans OTAs thread (5/20-21, 23, 28-30, 6/3-6).

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
At the time, I'm sure that was true. No Ben Jones, someone has to play RG. Reporters are going to ask stupid questions, he answers the most economic way possible.
Not sure what you're talking about - I'm pretty certain Ben Jones fully participated in all OTA's
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