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View Poll Results: How do you grade the second selection of the third round?
A 22 28.57%
B 33 42.86%
C 14 18.18%
D 5 6.49%
F 3 3.90%
Voters: 77. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 04-30-2013   #41
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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Originally Posted by Seegara View Post
Absolutely. Trade him if possible, or cut him and spend the money elsewhere. If I remember right, Bruce Matthews was available when Cush was drafted. Cush had a college history of being injury prone, and has been sidelined by injuries time after time since then, culminating in the big one from which he'll never fully recover.
In the future, don't ignore injury history of prospects.
Lol at Bruce Matthews.....you mean his nephew right? and as far as ACL injuries...you did just see Adrian Peterson damn near break the single season rushing record last year right?
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Old 04-30-2013   #42
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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Absolutely. Trade him if possible, or cut him and spend the money elsewhere. If I remember right, Bruce Matthews was available when Cush was drafted. Cush had a college history of being injury prone, and has been sidelined by injuries time after time since then, culminating in the big one from which he'll never fully recover.
In the future, don't ignore injury history of prospects.





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Old 04-30-2013   #43
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

Speaking of taking plays off against lesser opponents, Hopkins was pretty good at that against Ball St. and Furman.

On plays that were called to the other side, he barely started his routes.
On run plays to the other side, or even up the middle, sometimes he just stood around.
I even noticed him not doing much of a job on a run play to his side.
The runner got tackled right into his feet. He could have gained a few more yards had Hopkins did his job with gusto.

All that changed the following week against Florida St., however, Hopkins worked hard in his blocking and route running even when the plays weren't to his side.

So yeah, I think a lot of guys don't get a thrill out of beating up on weaklings.
I don't need to ask them the question; I can see it on the field.
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Old 05-01-2013   #44
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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Originally Posted by Seegara View Post
Absolutely. Trade him if possible, or cut him and spend the money elsewhere. If I remember right, Clay Matthews was available when Cush was drafted. Cush had a college history of being injury prone, and has been sidelined by injuries time after time since then, culminating in the big one from which he'll never fully recover.
In the future, don't ignore injury history of prospects.
This has to be a fakepost. The logical end to this train of thought is that we no longer have Andre, Watt (elbow), Foster, Cushing, JoJo, Manning, Tate, or Schaub. We'd be like a healthy Cleveland Browns.
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Old 05-01-2013   #45
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
Speaking of taking plays off against lesser opponents, Hopkins was pretty good at that against Ball St. and Furman.

On plays that were called to the other side, he barely started his routes.
On run plays to the other side, or even up the middle, sometimes he just stood around.
I even noticed him not doing much of a job on a run play to his side.
The runner got tackled right into his feet. He could have gained a few more yards had Hopkins did his job with gusto.

All that changed the following week against Florida St., however, Hopkins worked hard in his blocking and route running even when the plays weren't to his side.

So yeah, I think a lot of guys don't get a thrill out of beating up on weaklings.
I don't need to ask them the question; I can see it on the field.
Not making an excuse, but I've played against cream puffs and it is hard to stay focused when you are absolutely destroying someone. And if that's when you take plays off, you'll probably never have that problem in an NFL game.
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Old 05-01-2013   #46
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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Gotta spread the rep
I got him.
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Old 05-01-2013   #47
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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Originally Posted by b0ng View Post
This has to be a fakepost. The logical end to this train of thought is that we no longer have Andre, Watt (elbow), Foster, Cushing, JoJo, Manning, Tate, or Schaub. We'd be like a healthy Cleveland Browns.
And the Vikes should have cut Adrian Peterson...
and the Broncos should have never signed Peyton...
and the Saints should have never taken a chance on Drew Brees
and MJD should be cut by the Jags
(hey, I'd kinda be good with that one...)
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Old 05-01-2013   #48
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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Originally Posted by BigBull17 View Post
Not making an excuse, but I've played against cream puffs and it is hard to stay focused when you are absolutely destroying someone. And if that's when you take plays off, you'll probably never have that problem in an NFL game.
My only concern is if he will take off plays when his team is getting destroyed. He never was in that situation at LSU, aside from maybe that championship game against Bama. Might be worth a look there to see if he's trying to help his team get back in the game, or is just giving up. In any case, motor/drive issues can be somewhat expected at the end of the 3rd round and beyond, if he didn't have questions like this about him, he would have gone in the 2nd or earlier.
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Old 05-01-2013   #49
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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My only concern is if he will take off plays when his team is getting destroyed. He never was in that situation at LSU, aside from maybe that championship game against Bama. Might be worth a look there to see if he's trying to help his team get back in the game, or is just giving up. In any case, motor/drive issues can be somewhat expected at the end of the 3rd round and beyond, if he didn't have questions like this about him, he would have gone in the 2nd or earlier.
He played hard throughout that BCS game.
It was a grind out game with only 52 defensive snaps for LSU (and 27 pass attempts for McCarron).

Montgomery got a sack and at least one (maybe 2 QB pressures).
He was in for two assists in the run game.
They had him mostly two-gapping to control the edge.

Bama had 331 yards in total offense, more than 100 under their average.
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Old 05-02-2013   #50
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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He played hard throughout that BCS game.
It was a grind out game with only 52 defensive snaps for LSU (and 27 pass attempts for McCarron).

Montgomery got a sack and at least one (maybe 2 QB pressures).
He was in for two assists in the run game.
They had him mostly two-gapping to control the edge.

Bama had 331 yards in total offense, more than 100 under their average.
Well that's good to hear, though I'm not surprised. Before the combine I saw several mocks that had him as a late 1st round pick. I just hope he can make the conversion to 34 OLB.
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Old 05-02-2013   #51
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

issue with Sam Montgomery is where does he fit? will he replace Reed LOLB then kick Brooks inside next to Cushing? I don't think so IMO. He certainly could back-up Brooks Reed. In case of injury he is valuable insurance. I think his best option is to get with strength coach, disprove his critics, lay on a few pounds in low 280's & swing inside to rotate with Antonio @ RDE. It's not his strength to be out in space or in coverage. He can fight with bigger dudes & win with his aggression, strength & excellent lateral quickness. Very similar in size to Connor Barwin just not as fast. Some of us wanted Wade to try & move Connor inside on rushing downs, with his hand on the ground like a true end. Montgomery is even better suited to pull this off. But you know the Texans, they will exhaust every avenue before they expose him game day & take their time developing him, molding him into position then when the moment of need arises insert him in the lineup. Far as 3-4 ends go he would be a quick one, in fact he had identical 10 yard split as JJ Watt @ the combine, gave up 30 lbs but you get my drift.
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Old 05-02-2013   #52
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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issue with Sam Montgomery is where does he fit? will he replace Reed LOLB then kick Brooks inside next to Cushing? I don't think so IMO. He certainly could back-up Brooks Reed. In case of injury he is valuable insurance. I think his best option is to get with strength coach, disprove his critics, lay on a few pounds in low 280's & swing inside to rotate with Antonio @ RDE. It's not his strength to be out in space or in coverage. He can fight with bigger dudes & win with his aggression, strength & excellent lateral quickness. Very similar in size to Connor Barwin just not as fast. Some of us wanted Wade to try & move Connor inside on rushing downs, with his hand on the ground like a true end. Montgomery is even better suited to pull this off. But you know the Texans, they will exhaust every avenue before they expose him game day & take their time developing him, molding him into position then when the moment of need arises insert him in the lineup. Far as 3-4 ends go he would be a quick one, in fact he had identical 10 yard split as JJ Watt @ the combine, gave up 30 lbs but you get my drift.
So... I was thinking about this, too.

Montgomery at SAM (or WILL) is asking him to work in space when he hasn't shown even the first inkling that he could (that I'm aware of.) OTOH, he could gain some weight and play DE to take over for the Ninja and get into the DE rotation. This makes a lot of sense if Jamison isn't going to be coming back soon and if they want to groom someone for Smith's possible departure next year... and if they don't think Crick is that guy.

I was watching Trevardo playing against NC State. My. God. He's scary fast coming off the edge. He completely embarrassed their LT on a couple of plays. He played with his hand up quite a bit although he was used entirely to rush from what I saw.

I feel infinitely more comfortable with Trevardo playing at the Will than I do with Montgomery at Sam or Will.

I need to go watch more Montgomery tape, I think.
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Old 05-02-2013   #53
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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Montgomery at SAM (or WILL) is asking him to work in space when he hasn't shown even the first inkling that he could (that I'm aware of.) OTOH, he could gain some weight and play DE to take over for the Ninja and get into the DE rotation.
I was listening to a radio interview earlier in the week with a reporter who covers LSU. He said that Montgomery had played at 245 lbs in 2011, and that he felt that Montgomery was qicker and better served if he lost the extra weight. I remember Wade asking Mario to drop some lbs in his move to OLB. I expect he will do the same with Montgomery.
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Old 05-02-2013   #54
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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I was listening to a radio interview earlier in the week with a reporter who covers LSU. He said that Montgomery had played at 245 lbs in 2011, and that he felt that Montgomery was qicker and better served if he lost the extra weight. I remember Wade asking Mario to drop some lbs in his move to OLB. I expect he will do the same with Montgomery.
Was about to post the same thing. I don't think Montgomery is an interior player.
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Old 05-02-2013   #55
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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issue with Sam Montgomery is where does he fit?
From an article comparing Montgomery to Mingo written in early February (apologies if this has been posted, but I haven't seen it anywhere on the site).

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While I am confident that Montgomery could be a productive outside linebacker in a 34 scheme because he would be outstanding against the run and a solid pass rusher, his best position would be as a base 43 defensive end who can shut down the run to his side of the field and will get pressure on the QB through effort, technique and strength despite lacking elite athletic traits. Mingo is likely to be drafted higher, but if I were making the selection I would choose Montgomery as I feel he is a more complete all-around player who should be able to challenge for a starting job as a rookie. Mingo reminds me a little of former Titans' pass rusher Jevon Kearse and current Bengals' pass rusher Aaron Maybin, while Montgomery is more like the Ravens Paul Kruger.
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/...ersion-10.html

It's far and away positive, and while he does indicate he feels Montgomery would be better in a 4-3, he also draws the comparison to Paul Kruger who's spent his entire career (up until now) playing in a 3-4. Seems like it's one of those things where you look to Wade and let him figure out how to maximize the skill set Montgomery brings to the table.
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Old 05-02-2013   #56
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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So... I was thinking about this, too.

Montgomery at SAM (or WILL) is asking him to work in space when he hasn't shown even the first inkling that he could (that I'm aware of.) OTOH, he could gain some weight and play DE to take over for the Ninja and get into the DE rotation. This makes a lot of sense if Jamison isn't going to be coming back soon and if they want to groom someone for Smith's possible departure next year... and if they don't think Crick is that guy.

I was watching Trevardo playing against NC State. My. God. He's scary fast coming off the edge. He completely embarrassed their LT on a couple of plays. He played with his hand up quite a bit although he was used entirely to rush from what I saw.

I feel infinitely more comfortable with Trevardo playing at the Will than I do with Montgomery at Sam or Will.

I need to go watch more Montgomery tape, I think.
No I think you nailed it. He is going to have trouble in space. He is very good at the poa though, and could probably get away with putting 10 lbs on and playing at 275 since he is so stout against the run. Watch the Alabama tape he did a great job stumping thier nfl talent offensive line.
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Old 05-02-2013   #57
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All the concerns I've seen in this thread are so similar to concerns we had a few years ago, that you could literally replace Montgomery's name with Mario Williams name.
Montgomery will probably be WOLB, and in Wade's system, that position is very much like a "rush" DE. Didn't Wade say Mario was going to rush the passer something like 95% of the time, and drop in zone only occasionally?
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Old 05-02-2013   #58
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

NOLA Com on Sam Montgomery

I loved this...
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I admit. I lold.
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Old 05-02-2013   #59
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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All the concerns I've seen in this thread are so similar to concerns we had a few years ago, that you could literally replace Montgomery's name with Mario Williams name.
Montgomery will probably be WOLB, and in Wade's system, that position is very much like a "rush" DE. Didn't Wade say Mario was going to rush the passer something like 95% of the time, and drop in zone only occasionally?
But for entirely different reasons.

Mario had questions about his motor because he disappeared from games and on tape.

Montgomery has questions because he said he didn't try as hard against weaker opponents because it was hard to get as excited but that he didn't expect that in the NFL. BUT... on tape and in games, Montgomery was a high-motor player. He does NOT disappear from games. He had at least one sack in almost every game he played in.

But the Mario comparison is interesting to me.

Physically, the guys aren't comparable, really. Mario is just so much bigger. Mario is just a freak.

But to my eye, at least, the way Montgomery moves reminds me of Mario.

Since Wade thought he could make a Will out of Mario and since Mario seemed to be thriving in his defense, I'll go along with the move of Montgomery to OLB. I don't think he'll be able to go SAM, though, if he has any coverage responsibilities. I think he'll be a monster if they let him run downhill.
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Old 05-02-2013   #60
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Default Re: Draft Grade - Round 3/2 Sam Montgomery

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Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
issue with Sam Montgomery is where does he fit? will he replace Reed LOLB then kick Brooks inside next to Cushing? I don't think so IMO. He certainly could back-up Brooks Reed. In case of injury he is valuable insurance. I think his best option is to get with strength coach, disprove his critics, lay on a few pounds in low 280's & swing inside to rotate with Antonio @ RDE. It's not his strength to be out in space or in coverage. He can fight with bigger dudes & win with his aggression, strength & excellent lateral quickness. Very similar in size to Connor Barwin just not as fast. Some of us wanted Wade to try & move Connor inside on rushing downs, with his hand on the ground like a true end. Montgomery is even better suited to pull this off. But you know the Texans, they will exhaust every avenue before they expose him game day & take their time developing him, molding him into position then when the moment of need arises insert him in the lineup. Far as 3-4 ends go he would be a quick one, in fact he had identical 10 yard split as JJ Watt @ the combine, gave up 30 lbs but you get my drift.

This is exactly right. No idea why everyone keeps talking about the OLB pozish? To me this move is to spell the aging A. smith this year and groom him to be his long term replacement.
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