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Old 04-09-2013   #21
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
The problem is that the offense is Kubiak. Clearly Shanahan saw a need to make changes when he got RG3 and he made changes. In other places with other people from that philosophical tree it has been adapted to fit talent and tweaked as the years have gone by. Here with Kubiak it's like the system that time forgot or something.
That's pretty funny...

It's going to be interesting to see how this team looks next year when they get into offensive funks.
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Old 04-09-2013   #22
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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Hope the above is meant as hyperbole but even if so ... for more realistic numbers:

Passing/running

2012 - 554/508 -
2011 - 467/548 - no Schaub for 6 games
2010 - 574/473 -
2009 - 593/425
Total snaps for the season don't truly capture Kubiak's conservative playcalling within a game...There are too many variables that have to be factored in looking at it this way.... Better insight into that would be to see his play breakdown based on down and distance for the first down.
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Old 04-09-2013   #23
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

I think it's funny how just 3 years ago, people were talking about the innovation of the Texans' offense. Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery. Yes, just a few years ago we would hear how other teams, NFL teams, were copying parts of our offense adding it to theirs.

But that same guy is now the most conservative in the league.

Something must have happened between then & now.
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Old 04-09-2013   #24
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

I don't consider this offense outdated, personally.
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Old 04-09-2013   #25
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
I don't consider this offense outdated, personally.
It's not as every offense has packages that are designed to counter certain aspects of what a defense is trying to do to them...

look at how expansive Kubiak's Denny's menu is....



Now look at what McDaniels/O'Brien have in their hands 9 out of 10 times for NE


Yet which team/coach shows more diversity in thier playcalling and personnel packages?
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Old 04-09-2013   #26
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

I do NOT understand why you guys are so hung up on that Denny's Menu thing.

Is Kubiak a conservative play-caller? Yeah. Do you really want him to call some more half-back passes? Really? Or would you prefer to keep winning games?

Most offensive coordinators who become head coaches either:
1) Can't get their team on track offensively (like Billick)
2) Get absolutely silly with their clock management and play choice (see Mike Martz, Jason Garrett)
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Old 04-09-2013   #27
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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Originally Posted by The Pencil Neck View Post
I do NOT understand why you guys are so hung up on that Denny's Menu thing.

Is Kubiak a conservative play-caller? Yeah. Do you really want him to call some more half-back passes? Really? Or would you prefer to keep winning games?

Most offensive coordinators who become head coaches either:
1) Can't get their team on track offensively (like Billick)
2) Get absolutely silly with their clock management and play choice (see Mike Martz, Jason Garrett)
The obsession with the denny's menu speaks to the variety of plays and packages he could use to do this.

It's not about calling specifically half back passes, and more about calling something different than what he normally calls when teams have settled in on what you want to do....All it takes is 1 or 2 of those plays to hit and the seed is planted.

if for nothing else to at least get the defense to think about it. At least make it look different.
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Old 04-09-2013   #28
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
I think it's funny how just 3 years ago, people were talking about the innovation of the Texans' offense. Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery. Yes, just a few years ago we would hear how other teams, NFL teams, were copying parts of our offense adding it to theirs.

But that same guy is now the most conservative in the league.

Something must have happened between then & now.
Ummmm...I don't recall ever reading that any team was taking offensive pointers from a 6-10 Texans team. Especially once you consider, they had just discovered the gem they had in Arian & were finally attempting to become a bit more balanced after being a pass heavy team w/ an ineffective run game in 2009. Seems a bit of a reach to say others were trying to imitate a team that didn't even have all its pieces & were trying to figure out its own identity. This offense is not being ran similar to what it was when Schaub was amongst the league leaders at QB & Chris Brown was the rb. I think that's safe to say.
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Old 04-09-2013   #29
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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The obsession with the denny's menu speaks to the variety of plays and packages he could use to do this.

It's not about calling specifically half back passes, and more about calling something different than what he normally calls when teams have settled in on what you want to do....All it takes is 1 or 2 of those plays to hit and the seed is planted.

if for nothing else to at least get the defense to think about it. At least make it look different.
lol

I feel really sorry for you guys if that's your issue.

The whole point of this offense is making it LOOK the same.

We have a good offense. We have a productive offense. In the end, that's what matters.
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Old 04-09-2013   #30
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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Originally Posted by tru80texan View Post
Ummmm...I don't recall ever reading that any team was taking offensive pointers from a 6-10 Texans team. Especially once you consider, they had just discovered the gem they had in Arian & were finally attempting to become a bit more balanced after being a pass heavy team w/ an ineffective run game in 2009. Seems a bit of a reach to say others were trying to imitate a team that didn't even have all its pieces & were trying to figure out its own identity. This offense is not being ran similar to what it was when Schaub was amongst the league leaders at QB & Chris Brown was the rb. I think that's safe to say.
There have been several coaches (including the Ravens and Bengals) who've said they study the Texans offense in the off-season. When Leach went to the Ravens, they had him give them pointers in how to block the ZBS the way we do.
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Old 04-09-2013   #31
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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lol

I feel really sorry for you guys if that's your issue.

The whole point of this offense is making it LOOK the same.

We have a good offense. We have a productive offense. In the end, that's what matters.
"When it matters" (prime-time games, playoffs) is exactly when it doesn't matter and when the the offense isn't as productive as it needs to be.
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Old 04-09-2013   #32
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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Now look at what McDaniels/O'Brien have in their hands 9 out of 10 times for NE


Yet which team/coach shows more diversity in thier playcalling and personnel packages?
I look forward to seeing how NE fares without a HoF QB behind center. It makes all the difference in the world.
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Old 04-09-2013   #33
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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"When it matters" (prime-time games, playoffs) is exactly when it doesn't matter and when the the offense isn't as productive as it needs to be.
And you think that's because of the size of Kubiak's play sheet? Really?
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Old 04-09-2013   #34
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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I look forward to seeing how NE fares without a HoF QB behind center. It makes all the difference in the world.
not dismissing that aspect of it at all, but Brady doesn't have control over the personnel packages Bellichick/McDaniels run out there for him to use.
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Old 04-09-2013   #35
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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I think it's funny how just 3 years ago, people were talking about the innovation of the Texans' offense. Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery. Yes, just a few years ago we would hear how other teams, NFL teams, were copying parts of our offense adding it to theirs.

But that same guy is now the most conservative in the league.

Something must have happened between then & now.
Gary, like most anybody else, has become someone who relies on what's comfortable and what worked well in the past.

Everything about the guy screams "play it safe."

Oh, we only picked up 1 or 2 yards on 1st down? Well ****, let's be safe and not commit a turnover here. After all, the defense will get it back for us. This game is about field position after all. (Which works well against lesser opponents who always shoot themselves in the foot...not so wonderful against very competent offenses such as GB and NE and now apparently Indy, again!)

Our QB is the definition of reliably safe. So much so that he began throwing the ball away even when he had a meager amount of pressure on him at the end of the season last year. We've all seen THAT before, it's the sign that something is wrong. Isn't it? Be it physical, mental, or both...something is wrong there.

Keeps inferior coaches on staff. Joe Marciano: Nuff said. Right? Oh wait, the outlawing of "the wedge" is what killed Joe's mojo. I forgot. Always an excuse for how Gary can keep inferior coaches and players around.

The mystique has worn off of Gary Kubiak because he himself has become predictable and beatable by any team who isn't named Cleveland Browns, Jacksonville Jaguars, or any other weak sister team out there that breaks down in the midst of a game against us. We won the two OT games vs. Lions and Jags because frankly they quit before we did. Against GB and NE (twice) it was the Texans who mailed it in at the first sign of trouble.

This team is a reflection of its head coach. Stable, productive offense...loyalty amongst them all, which makes them feel like a team (and probably gets them through many games they'd otherwise lose to weak sister teams)....but an inability to dig deep into the suitcase of courage and pull out the starched underwear and buckle down for a hard day's work.

We don't have to play nice about this, guys and gals. It is what it is. I don't expect a leap this year, there's nothing here that has happened the previous several seasons that should fill anybody with a trustworthy springboard to jump upon and dive into a Kool Aid-filled 2013 season. We're going to beat the teams we should, and we'll lose to the teams we should lose to. And along the way, Gary's old habits will undo him and this team when crunch time arrives.

Good, entertaining football...until the heat gets too hot, and then we fold up and head home. Same ****, different season. But better than being a cellar dweller, I might add.
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Old 04-09-2013   #36
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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And you think that's because of the size of Kubiak's play sheet? Really?
Dude don't be dense...clearly the size of his play sheet with it written on the front and back indicates that there are more plays and options for different looks and personnel packages than the small percentage of them he seems to revolve around yearly. It's like he gets info overload and gets stuck in 1 area of his play sheet when he calls plays in the games at times.

Arian Foster's targets in the passing game have steadily declined over the last 3 years...from 60+ recs in the last few years down to just 40 rec this past year....and thats with him missing 2 games in 2011. What the hell happened? You could say that teams started accounting for him more.........but then there's that pesky "targets" stat which shows that his targets were down as well. Now when you consider Foster is one of our best playmakers why would you bring down his targets in the passing game? Why not try to get creative with how you get him the ball? What happened to that throw back play he scored on running a wheel route out of the backfield last year in TB? This is the kind of creativity that he needs to embrace more.

making every play look the same has its benefits only if you put enough options out there in a variety of different ways to make teams think....and pay for it if they're not respecting certain aspects of your offense. If you don't do that, it just makes it easier for defenses to defend you...
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Old 04-09-2013   #37
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

I think it's encouraging to know that we feel this offense can be (& should have been) more prolific than what it was in 2012.
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Old 04-09-2013   #38
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

sigh...........


this is what i dont understand about kubiak, the texans have great design plays but the problem is kubiak is horrible at picking which plays to run. He would choose a great reverse to keyshawn that gains 10 yards and you never ever see it again!!! The offfense would dial up a great play for casey that nets them positive yards then you never see that play again!!!! Everybody talks about the vast dennys menu yet it seems like we run the same plays over and over again and we only see creative plays every now and again. Kubiak outsmarts himself far too many times and over thinks plays. Its like he has a set of normal plays he runs then has another set of other great plays that he runs every now and then. I wish he would run all of them. Kubiak doesnt use his entire denny's menu's arsenal.


Great coaches like belichick and someone like jeff fisher, if a play works, they come back to it. They run it over and over again until its stopped. Even if its stopped they come back to it because its been known to be successful.

We had a unique, athletic full back in casey yet he barely touched the ball. There was that road game in new orleans where they dialed up great plays for casey that got us huge chunk of yards and we never came back to it. We should be targeting casey multiple times every game to take advantage of his unique athleticism and skill set yet kubiak rarely went to him.
Arian foster catching the ball was also another weapon that was severely under used. RB screens should have been a staple for our offense with our inconsistent right o line yet kubiak didnt call it enough. Ben tate was another weapon that was grossly underused even before his injury.

We have great plays, great players, but kubiak because of his conservative, rigid, one dimensional, play not to lose approach, a lot of our weapons got under utilized.Kubiak's incompetence is why people still think matt schaub is the answer and as a schaub hater i sometimes think of that. Is it schaub or is it kubiak's coaching that is hindering him like not being able to audible at the line of scrimmage or using a no huddle offense.

It doesnt help kubiak either because of matt's glaring weaknesses which in turn ask the question is kubiak really a bad coach or is it schaub?

That's why ive always wanted to move on from either both or one of them so we can definitively say yes that's the problem lets upgrade that. The fact that we are staying with both guys, for better or for worse, it will muddy the water forever for the fanbase and the front office.
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Old 04-09-2013   #39
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

It's simple really. Kubiak either incorporates more uptempo plays in his offense or the offense will suffer like it did towards the end of last year. It's clear that other teams have figured out how to attack our offense and the Texans have to find ways to keep defenses off balance. The way you do that is to be more proactive like run plays faster, give multiple looks, quick slant routes and let the receivers do their job, etc. Schaub's immobility is a limitation, but not an excuse to not run a faster offense instead of the lumbering, slow moving, it takes 10 plays to set up 1 big play offense.
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Old 04-09-2013   #40
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Default Re: [Grantland] Hey, Don't F*$% This Up: The Houston Texans' Outdated Offense

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Originally Posted by Mr teX View Post
Total snaps for the season don't truly capture Kubiak's conservative playcalling within a game...There are too many variables that have to be factored in looking at it this way.... Better insight into that would be to see his play breakdown based on down and distance for the first down.
Every NFL Head Coach is "conservative" on third and long... Some more than others, but they all are. It's not College football. If they weren't, they would be Jerry Glanville's definition of NFL........ Not For Long.
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