Texans - 2.4 Million Cap Carryover for 2013

[paycheck71]

Originally Posted by Vinny

it's credit card style cap management...borrowing Peter to pay Paul stuff. Dealing with your problems tomorrow instead of today.

Exactly what I said earlier. Some think it's OK to manage that way, but I don't. And to be honest I don't think the Texans do either.

[badboy]

I think the key to cap is establishing your roster in a way that incoming rookies with low dollar contracts & 2nd year guys replace the higher $ vets you can let go. We often focus on the high dollar guys rather than the low dollar guys such as Cushing, KJ, Newton, etc. especially when the vet is not doing well. The high $ players should be at the critical positions such as LT, WR1, QB and CB1. Exceptions like Foster who is top tier RB and a FA such as Manning exist.

After this off season, we should be grooming or drafting replacements for Schaub, AJ, OD, Manning, Antonio Smith and Joseph. IMO, replacements for Myers & Wade Smith
(Jones & Brooks)are on roster. Beginning in 2014, we should focus on top 3 rounds only and trade the other rounds.

[76Texan]

Originally Posted by badboy

I think the key to cap is establishing your roster in a way that incoming rookies with low dollar contracts & 2nd year guys replace the higher $ vets you can let go. We often focus on the high dollar guys rather than the low dollar guys such as Cushing, KJ, Newton, etc. especially when the vet is not doing well. The high $ players should be at the critical positions such as LT, WR1, QB and CB1. Exceptions like Foster who is top tier RB and a FA such as Manning exist.

After this off season, we should be grooming or drafting replacements for Schaub, AJ, OD, Manning, Antonio Smith and Joseph. IMO, replacements for Myers & Wade Smith
(Jones & Brooks)are on roster. Beginning in 2014, we should focus on top 3 rounds only and trade the other rounds.

It's kinda like rotating the purchase of your family vehicles while planning to upgrade to a newer or bigger house as the kids grow up, balancing with family vacations and all that stuffs; knowing that it's not a good idea to rely on future wage increase to make the decisions (and a possible lay-off).

[Dutchrudder]

Originally Posted by tru80texan

Now here is were I'm not quite sure why you believe it effects the next 3 years? If it's converted to a bonus that is spread out over years then my understanding is it only comes back to haunt you IF the player is eventually cut & then it becomes "dead money". Please correct me if I'm wrong, but if that is the case then that's were the GM must be careful on whom he restructures especially if it's a player w/ a lengthy contract or a player who wont make it past a year or 2 on the team. It seems players that are "core" players that you plan to build around would be the focus to ensure they stick around & the converted bonus won't come back to haunt them.

Well, by my spreadsheet of the cap, the Texans have 99.135 million in caphits due in 2014 from 23 players, so they will have 24 million to work with next year if nothing changes. However, there are 53 players on an active roster, so if they signed another 30 players at near minimum for 500k a piece average, they would use up 15 of that 24 million. Then you figure in performance escalators that might kick in, high round draft pick costs, IR players and their replacements, etc etc, and it gets gloomy. We simply don't have the future capspace to push 15 million (say 5 a year) to 2014/15/16. On top of that, if you want Cushing to make 8 million a year, then you have to start adding that to those caps too. If Quin costs 3m a year for 4 years, then you need to add that in. We simply don't have the wiggle room as it stands.

The problem is that if they start pushing more money to the future, they will have trouble re-signing players, or they won't be able to make cuts/trades as necessary to protect them from caphell, which is what you see happening to the Jets, Eagles, Cowboys, etc. As an example, let's look at PK's idea for JJo and see what his cap hit would be:

JJo next 3 year's caphits: 11,250,000 11,250,000 12,250,000
Restructure 2013 salary from $7,500,000 to $940k = 6,560,000/3 years = 2,186,666 per year change.
So his new caphits would become: 5,936,666 13,436,666 14,436,666.

With the restructure you are adding that 2.186m to each of 2014 and 2015's caps in order to save 4.373m this year. You are also risking more by giving him all of that 5.9m in restructure money as guaranteed money. If he has a career ending injury, it will be that much more costly to cut him. The bottom line is that if you are going to do this kind of caphit shell game, you better have a good reason to do it. Pushing all this money to the future ensures you won't be able to get free agents, and it ties the hands of the GM from making any significant moves.

Edit: Meant to add that with an aging player like AJ, you also have to be aware of retirement. If the player retires, I believe any guaranteed money gets accelerated to the current year and that hits the team's cap. That's a big issue with a guy like Tom Brady, who may not even play out his contract that is entirely guaranteed now. Converting more of AJ's money to signing bonus just means we have to keep him even longer if his skills go downhill. It's just more risk to consider.

[Dutchrudder]

Originally Posted by paycheck71

The guy is from NJ, I seriously doubt he's a Titans fan even though he covered them for a few years. Other than that, I agree with you completely. He just didn't do enough research for his article, and there is no way I'm restructuring that many guys at once.

According to his bio, he covered the Titans for 12 years before taking this job at ESPN. I'm pretty sure he's stated it several times that he's a Titans fan. Honestly, I don't really read the guy, his best stuff for Texans fans is in the form of links to other people's work, like Steph or Alan Burge.

[paycheck71]

Originally Posted by badboy

I think the key to cap is establishing your roster in a way that incoming rookies with low dollar contracts & 2nd year guys replace the higher $ vets you can let go. We often focus on the high dollar guys rather than the low dollar guys such as Cushing, KJ, Newton, etc. especially when the vet is not doing well. The high $ players should be at the critical positions such as LT, WR1, QB and CB1. Exceptions like Foster who is top tier RB and a FA such as Manning exist.

After this off season, we should be grooming or drafting replacements for Schaub, AJ, OD, Manning, Antonio Smith and Joseph. IMO, replacements for Myers & Wade Smith
(Jones & Brooks)are on roster. Beginning in 2014, we should focus on top 3 rounds only and trade the other rounds.

I entirely agree that good drafting is key to successful cap management. You HAVE to let some of your higher priced veterans go and replace them with rookies. If you have too many draft misses, you can't do that anymore and the quality of your team suffers (see Cowboys, there are probably many others, but I follow DAL a little closer than most other teams).

[paycheck71]

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder

According to his bio, he covered the Titans for 12 years before taking this job at ESPN. I'm pretty sure he's stated it several times that he's a Titans fan. Honestly, I don't really read the guy, his best stuff for Texans fans is in the form of links to other people's work, like Steph or Alan Burge.

Not that this particular point really matters to me, but I've only seen him deny being a fan of any team when being accused directly of being a Titans fan, multiple times. Just seems odd that he'd move to Nashville from NJ and become a fan of a crappy Oilers team.

[TexanBacker93]

Originally Posted by steelbtexan

Schaub' contract will be the cap killer if he continues to regress like a certain Doc has predicted.

I dont know how the Texans do business, but other teams like the Pats/Eagles etc... seem to be able to keep their core players and add atleast 1 high profile FA every yr.

Rick/Olsen seem to be in over their heads when it comes to cap management.

The Pats are usually very quiet on the high profile FA front. The only real big one they signed in the past years was Adalius Thomas and that didn't work out for them.

The Eagles are also normally very reserved but jumped in with both feet 2 years ago with Nnamdi, Jenkins, and Babin. Babin had one good year with them before imploding.

The teams that are continually successful don't pick up the high paid FAs. The Patriots always find guys that are perfect fits for their system that nobody else seems to want, get them on the cheap, and turn them into superstars. Think Welker.

The Cowboys have won less playoff games in the last 10 years than the Texans. I don't think following their model is going to be an avenue to success. The Redskins are the team that are usually associated with trying to buy a ring and they're consistently one of the worst teams year in and year out. They might have a little resurgence with RGIII, but I'm not convinced it will continue as long as Snyder is there.

Draft well to make sure you have guys that can take over for your overpriced players, and find some cheap vets to fill in depth and maybe a starter here and there and you can continue to be one of the better teams. Well, provided you have a very good QB.

[GP]

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder

According to his bio, he covered the Titans for 12 years before taking this job at ESPN. I'm pretty sure he's stated it several times that he's a Titans fan. Honestly, I don't really read the guy, his best stuff for Texans fans is in the form of links to other people's work, like Steph or Alan Burge.

PK is 100% Titans homer all the way, and then his next favorite team: Colts.

I used to value his blog, but really he's like the other NFL Divisional Bloggers...all they do, as you stated, is re-post links to articles that other people created. It's a DrudgeReport.com for NFL news.

And when he chooses to offer something he made himself, he's snarky to fans and generally condescends whenever he gets a chance. Pretty big ******* in my book.

[Dutchrudder]

Originally Posted by GP

PK is 100% Titans homer all the way, and then his next favorite team: Colts.

I used to value his blog, but really he's like the other NFL Divisional Bloggers...all they do, as you stated, is re-post links to articles that other people created. It's a DrudgeReport.com for NFL news.

And when he chooses to offer something he made himself, he's snarky to fans and generally condescends whenever he gets a chance. Pretty big ******* in my book.

That's the impression I have gotten from him, which is why I don't really follow him. I'm not a fan of his work, and that article posted upthread is just another example of why I don't care what he says. He's clearly not privy to the Texans' situation, and I don't think he could care less.

[badboy]

Originally Posted by 76Texan

It's kinda like rotating the purchase of your family vehicles while planning to upgrade to a newer or bigger house as the kids grow up, balancing with family vacations and all that stuffs; knowing that it's not a good idea to rely on future wage increase to make the decisions (and a possible lay-off).

While my personal income may suffer due to a lay off, NFL teams will continue to get paid even if amount is basically same (cap) annually. I recently moved from a 2008 to 2012 auto and kept same payment for twice the car. Due to high mileage (work) that I no longer have, I am now investing in an auto I can keep for many years. Did the same with my son's car and lowered his payment & insurance costs. So if investments are wise, Texans can replace older, higher dollars with cheaper, younger contracts. This is why I look at our cap situation differently than some.

[badboy]

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder

Well, by my spreadsheet of the cap, the Texans have 99.135 million in caphits due in 2014 from 23 players, so they will have 24 million to work with next year if nothing changes. However, there are 53 players on an active roster, so if they signed another 30 players at near minimum for 500k a piece average, they would use up 15 of that 24 million. Then you figure in performance escalators that might kick in, high round draft pick costs, IR players and their replacements, etc etc, and it gets gloomy. We simply don't have the future capspace to push 15 million (say 5 a year) to 2014/15/16. On top of that, if you want Cushing to make 8 million a year, then you have to start adding that to those caps too. If Quin costs 3m a year for 4 years, then you need to add that in. We simply don't have the wiggle room as it stands.

The problem is that if they start pushing more money to the future, they will have trouble re-signing players, or they won't be able to make cuts/trades as necessary to protect them from caphell, which is what you see happening to the Jets, Eagles, Cowboys, etc. As an example, let's look at PK's idea for JJo and see what his cap hit would be:

JJo next 3 year's caphits: 11,250,000 11,250,000 12,250,000
Restructure 2013 salary from $7,500,000 to $940k = 6,560,000/3 years = 2,186,666 per year change.
So his new caphits would become: 5,936,666 13,436,666 14,436,666.

With the restructure you are adding that 2.186m to each of 2014 and 2015's caps in order to save 4.373m this year. You are also risking more by giving him all of that 5.9m in restructure money as guaranteed money. If he has a career ending injury, it will be that much more costly to cut him. The bottom line is that if you are going to do this kind of caphit shell game, you better have a good reason to do it. Pushing all this money to the future ensures you won't be able to get free agents, and it ties the hands of the GM from making any significant moves.

Edit: Meant to add that with an aging player like AJ, you also have to be aware of retirement. If the player retires, I believe any guaranteed money gets accelerated to the current year and that hits the team's cap. That's a big issue with a guy like Tom Brady, who may not even play out his contract that is entirely guaranteed now. Converting more of AJ's money to signing bonus just means we have to keep him even longer if his skills go downhill. It's just more risk to consider.

If nothing changes is the key. There are still players in '14 to rework. Also, why should Cushing get $8 m if Brown only gets 6 Foster 5.75 and AJ 6.5? Joseph does get $7.5 but I think that was an exceptional offer.

I do agree that you are playing with fire but you do not necessarily have to get burned. Rather than rework Joseph for example to extend Cushing, rework Brown and Foster, young guys who should be around & not cause dead money in fulfilling entire contract.

[Dutchrudder]

Originally Posted by badboy

If nothing changes is the key. There are still players in '14 to rework.

Haha, yes there are plenty of players to rework in 2014, so we can send their cap hits to 15/16/17 I guess. When you look at what the Patriots have done over the last 10 years to stay competitive and make the playoffs nearly every year, do you see them pushing money to future years? Do you see them restructuring contracts and pushing money into future years? I don't, and I think that's the way to to do it. Pay your guys fairly each year, and draft to fill holes as needed. Pick up free agents for cheap and hope you get lucky every once in a while.

Also, why should Cushing get $8 m if Brown only gets 6 Foster 5.75 and AJ 6.5? Joseph does get $7.5 but I think that was an exceptional offer.

I think Cushing gets about 8 million a year because that's a good deal for a 34 ILB. It's actually a bit lower than the top 5 ILBs though (top AAV is 10 a year), and it would make him the 9th highest paid ILB in the league. He might get 9 a year from the Texans, but whatever, for the point PK was making it's dumb to push 15 million into 14/15/16 just to sign a guy for 8m a year when they are already cash strapped. Unless of course you want to say 2013 is our year, and it's literally Super Bowl or bust, because doing all this cap maneuvering will cause this team to fall apart in 2014 or 2015.

As for the other guys, you're looking at 2013 salaries, which is not indicative of their actual compensation.

Duane Brown's AAV is 8.9 million (10th for LTs)
Foster 8.7(4th for RBs)
AJ is 9.68(7th for WRs)
Joseph is 9.75(7th for CBs)

All of these guys are well paid and in the top 10 at their position with regard to compensation. I think Cushing will get an extension worth about 8-9m average, and that will put him in the top 10 of ILBs, which is just about the same as all the other guys listed above.

I do agree that you are playing with fire but you do not necessarily have to get burned. Rather than rework Joseph for example to extend Cushing, rework Brown and Foster, young guys who should be around & not cause dead money in fulfilling entire contract.

Extending Cushing likely doesn't help the cap this year. He counts 4.6m against the cap this year and he is coming back from injury. An extension will only make that number go up in 2013. Now if you want to reduce future cap hits, they could extend him this year and include the signing bonus in 2013. That's what they did with Duane Brown, and it should help out in the future. That is wise cap management IMO, reducing costs over time, while not putting off paying your players.

[thunderkyss]

I thought this article concerning the Ravens salary cap was interesting & lends some perspective on our own situation.

Under the rule of 51 that governs the offseason accounting for the salary cap, the Ravens are currently $7.207 million under the NFL salary-cap limit of $123 million.

This is already after losing Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Paul Kruegar, Anquan Boldin, Bernard Pollard, Billy Cundiff, Matt Birk, & Boobie Williams.

The top 10 salary-cap figures on the roster are: 1. Outside linebacker Terrell Suggs ($13.02 million), 2. defensive tackle Haloti Ngata ($11.5 million), 3. Offensive guard Marshal Yanda ($7.45 million), 4. Quarterback Joe Flacco ($6.8 million), 5. Running back Ray Rice ($5.75 million), 6. Cornerback Lardarius Webb ($5.385 million), 7. Offensive tackle Michael Oher ($4.955 million), 8. Wide receiver Jacoby Jones ($4.9 million), 9. Fullback Vonta Leach ($4.33 million) and 10. Inside linebacker Jameel McClain ($4.2 million).

I know the money they've spent got them a Super Bowl Championship, but the point here, is that this is just business as usual in the NFL. We aren't necessarily in a bad spot, just need to spend wisely.

[badboy]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I thought this article concerning the Ravens salary cap was interesting & lends some perspective on our own situation.
This is already after losing Ray Lewis, Ed Reed, Paul Kruegar, Anquan Boldin, Bernard Pollard, Billy Cundiff, Matt Birk, & Boobie Williams.
I know the money they've spent got them a Super Bowl Championship, but the point here, is that this is just business as usual in the NFL. We aren't necessarily in a bad spot, just need to spend wisely.

What I've been saying for months & totally agree. I think Smith and Olsen have done remarkably well. Having AJ available to restructure and possibly Antonio Smith....

[76Texan]

The Ed Reed signing is facilitated by the extra money from the Ryans' trade.
Hopefully, it pays off.

[The Pencil Neck]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I know the money they've spent got them a Super Bowl Championship, but the point here, is that this is just business as usual in the NFL. We aren't necessarily in a bad spot, just need to spend wisely.

I think the people who've been saying that we're in "cap hell" don't really understand how bad some teams have it. Like you said, we're not that bad off. There are teams with a lot more room to maneuver and we're not in the greatest position, but we're not in a bad position.

[badboy]

Not seen this reported anywhere on MB but Spotrac has 2013 cap hits for Reed $3.33m, McCain $1.35 and Lechler $1.34 = approx $6m

Total: smidgeon over $120 over the cap site http://www.overthecap.com/teamcap.ph...xans&Year=2013

Edit: Spotrac $118m http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/houston-texans/cap-hit/

[76Texan]

Originally Posted by badboy

Not seen this reported anywhere on MB but Spotrac has 2013 cap hits for Reed $3.33m, McCain $1.35 and Lechler $1.34 = approx $6m

Total: smidgeon over $120

It's been here, there, but it was never stressed.

[76Texan]

Like I mentioned on a post above; we cleared some cap space by trading Ryans, to the tune of $9M. Look at what it has bought us so far; and it is still giving
.