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Old 02-07-2013   #1
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Default DT in 1st rd.

This is where my interest resides given the surplus of talent in this years draft which could enable Texans to still get a highly rated player who fills a need. I'm looking @ one tech-three tech-five tech combos who are both versatile, premium sized for position, low risk & solidify interior as well protect edges.

What do you guys feel about Johnathan Hankins, DT, Ohio State? Strong, bull rusher, collapse/compress pocket, requires double teams, adds depth @ razor thin position & allows Texans to move Cody island. He is a combo 1-3 tech.


Kawaan Short has more explosive compact body who could also is a 1-3 combo DL. He is probably the most plus pass rusher for nose, but decent in run support but not the space eater of Hankins or Jenkins.


Dante Jones, is a 5 tech but could kick inside once he fills in his frame. Fast riser who before Senior Bowl had a 2nd/3rd grade based on a disappointing season with UCLA. Once in mobile he show cased best power/strength combo I've seen in this class. Huge hands, explosive first step plays big. Would bookend Watt, provide excellent depth, high ceiling DL.
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Old 02-07-2013   #2
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.



John Jenkins, 6-3/359, Defensive Tackle. Georgia

John Jenkins Scouting Report by Charlie Campbell - more info at link

Strengths:
  • Overwhelming size and strength
  • Can't be moved off line of scrimmage
  • Tremendous run-defender
  • Surprising explosiveness
  • Extremely rare athlete
  • Good quickness
  • Quick feet
  • Good get off
  • Can collapse the pocket as a pass-rusher
  • Fabulous bull rush
  • Huge bulk
  • Constantly fills his gap
  • Very agile
  • Requires multiple blockers
  • Perfect fit as a zero-technique in a 3-4
  • Ready to play immediately in the NFL
  • Incredibly hard to move at line of scrimmage
  • Scheme versatility
Weaknesses:
  • Not much pass-rushing production
  • Conditioning
  • Will need to be rotated to stay fresh
  • Motor?
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Old 02-07-2013   #3
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Playoffs View Post


John Jenkins, 6-3/359, Defensive Tackle. Georgia

John Jenkins Scouting Report by Charlie Campbell - more info at link

Strengths:
  • Overwhelming size and strength
  • Can't be moved off line of scrimmage
  • Tremendous run-defender
  • Surprising explosiveness
  • Extremely rare athlete
  • Good quickness
  • Quick feet
  • Good get off
  • Can collapse the pocket as a pass-rusher
  • Fabulous bull rush
  • Huge bulk
  • Constantly fills his gap
  • Very agile
  • Requires multiple blockers
  • Perfect fit as a zero-technique in a 3-4
  • Ready to play immediately in the NFL
  • Incredibly hard to move at line of scrimmage
  • Scheme versatility
Weaknesses:
  • Not much pass-rushing production
  • Conditioning
  • Will need to be rotated to stay fresh
  • Motor?
I have yet to see Jenkins play a good game. In Senior Bowl he looked every pound of his weight. In my eval I wrote "fat, slow= no." Brandon Williams otoh looked quick and strong at 341lbs. I am down to three DTs: Short, B Williams and Sylvester Williams.
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Old 02-07-2013   #4
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

I think something like this will help Jj Watt be Jj Watt in 2013, & it's very important to this team that Jj Watt is Jj Watt in 2013.

Of the three you mentioned, I like the versatility of Jones, but a 1-3 tech would give us extra insurance in case Antonio Smith can't repeat his 2012 season.

But I like the idea of a 1-3 tech as opposed to getting a guy to replace Cody.... get someone who'll stay on the field more often & contribute.
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Old 02-07-2013   #5
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

So busy, not much time around here lately but most intriguing aspect of this years Superbowl were the physical match-ups across both sides of each team. It was a battle in those trenches, both sides not giving an inch, fists, elbows, knees, feet you name it. To me that is what defines playoff/Super Bowl combatants. Texans just wore down 3/4 through season, not enough depth & JJ amazing as he is had to be running on fumes & desire. The DL is a source of possible immediate improvement given strength of position in this years draft. IMO.
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Old 02-07-2013   #6
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
So busy, not much time around here lately but most intriguing aspect of this years Superbowl were the physical match-ups across both sides of each team. It was a battle in those trenches, both sides not giving an inch, fists, elbows, knees, feet you name it. To me that is what defines playoff/Super Bowl combatants. Texans just wore down 3/4 through season, not enough depth & JJ amazing as he is had to be running on fumes & desire. The DL is a source of possible immediate improvement given strength of position in this years draft. IMO.
Give me Jones

He can help provide pressure that the Texans are sorely lacking. Watt/Jones = pass rush. He would be my pick if he were there at 27. (Doubtful)

Even though I'm an all offense guy in the 1st three rds. Jones is the exception to this rule for me.
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Old 02-07-2013   #7
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by badboy View Post
I have yet to see Jenkins play a good game. In Senior Bowl he looked every pound of his weight. In my eval I wrote "fat, slow= no." Brandon Williams otoh looked quick and strong at 341lbs. I am down to three DTs: Short, B Williams and Sylvester Williams.
The guys at Walter Football saw it differently:
Quote:
"Jenkins had a phenomenal week of practice at the Senior Bowl. He wasn't known as a pass-rusher for Georgia, but he showed nice pass-rushing potential in Mobile as he dominated the one-on-one sessions. The guards and centers were virtually incapable of keeping him out of the backfield. The massive tackle was destroying linemen with his bull rushes.

Jenkins also displayed surprising explosion. He has a good get-off and fires into blockers to often gain leverage. There were plays when Jenkins drove linemen straight back before shoving them to the ground. He was excellent all week."
And they're even saying he's on the Texan's radar, "I've been told that John Jenkins is a strong option for the Texans at No. 27 if they can't land one of the two SEC linebackers... "
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Old 02-07-2013   #8
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

JMO:

Star Lotulelei, OMG I see why this guy is so highly rated. I haven't really watched tape on him until recently because he was out of our range, but he'd be a guy that if he fell out of the top 15 for some reason I'd trade up to get him.

Johnathan Hankins, I haven't looked at him much and don't know much about him, I always considered him out of our range at #27.

Kawann Short, this has been my guy for us at NT since TC began. He's got the base/foundation (hips, butt, and legs) and strength to anchor well and hold up to the double teams while also having good straight line speed to pursue the QB, and enough lateral agility to play the run. In our 1 gap system he's perfect. I think Short would also free us up to use Mitchell in the DE rotation and some special D-line lineups thus bringing more size to the D-line when needed.

Datone Jones, IMO is to small for 3-4 DE duties. At 274 lbs. he's more of a 4-3 DE or if he loses 15 lbs. and can gain some speed maybe he's a 3-4 OLB. He'd have to add 20 lbs. to play 3-4 DE and I wonder what that kind of added weight would do to his speed and athleticism. Plus he'd only be depth at DE behind Antonio and we need some size added to our D-line at NT.

Jesse Williams, could also be a serious candidate for the Texans. Jesse is probably the strongest NT candidate and a more traditional NT that handles double teams and plays the run while collapsing the middle of the QB pocket. He's got great strength and good straight line speed, but I think he lacks some of the lateral agility/athleticism that Short or Sylvester Williams has.

Sylvester Williams, is more of a speed rusher with good moves, a penetrating NT candidate, or 4-3 DT as well. He lacks the strength of Jesse Williams or Short but has better athleticism/agility and quickness than they do. He could be good for the Texans but I think a good S&C program would help him alot and there'd be a big difference in his 2nd season.

John Jenkins, I read the same thing that Playoffs just posted. I can see him in our system but I think the Texans would have him drop at least 20-25 lbs. and an NFL level strength and conditioning program plus the southeast Texas summer heat would probably melt that weight off quickly with the right nutrition. I think he's got the strength and size to be a very good traditional NT.

Brandon Williams, another guy that I don't know alot about. The limited film I've seen of him, he looks slow but holds up to double teams well and plays the run well, but lacks the athleticism/agility. The Senior Bowl writeups were fantastic. I worry about the step up from D-2 ball to the NFL.



I think it all depends on what type of NT you want for the Texans. Luckily Wade seems to be able to adapt his defense to the type of players we have and not the other way around. I also think that with the structured and disciplined team we've got almost any player we pick will fall in line and learn to be a Texan through hard work. Lets face it any NT we pick is going to have JJ on one side of him, the Ninja on the other side, and a berserk Cushing behind him, he'd be to afraid not to give 100% effort.

Last edited by Wolf6151; 02-08-2013 at 01:48 AM.
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Old 02-07-2013   #9
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf6151 View Post
JMO:

Johnathan Hankins, I haven't looked at him much and don't know much about him, I always considered him out of our range at #27.

Kawann Short, this has been my guy for us at NT since TC began. He's got the base/foundation (hips, butt, and legs) and strength to anchor well and hold up to the double teams while also having good straight line speed to pursue the QB, and enough lateral agility to play the run. In our 1 gap system he's perfect.

Datone Jones, IMO is to small for 3-4 DE duties. At 274 lbs. he's more of a 4-3 DE. He'd have to add 20 lbs. to play 3-4 DE and I wonder what that kind of added weight would do to his speed and athleticism. Plus he'd only be depth at DE behind Antonio and we need some size added to our D-line at NT.

Jesse Williams, could also be a serious candidate for the Texans. Jesse is probably the strongest NT candidate and a more traditional NT that handles double teams and plays the run while collapsing the middle of the QB pocket. He's got great strength and good straight line speed, but I think he lacks some of the lateral agility/athleticism that Short of Sylvester Williams has.

Sylvester Williams, is more of a speed rusher with good moves, a penetrating NT candidate, or 4-3 DT as well. He lacks the strength of Jesse Williams or Short but has better athleticism/agility than they do.

John Jenkins, I read the same thing that Playoffs just posted. I can see him in our system but I think the Texans would have him drop at least 20-25 lbs. and an NFL level strength and conditioning program plus the southeast Texas summer heat would probably melt that weight off quickly with the right nutrition. I think he's got the strength and size to be a very good traditional NT.

Brandon Williams, another guy that I don't know alot about. The limited film I've seen of him, he looks slow but holds up to double teams well and plays the run well, but lacks the athleticism/agility. The Senior Bowl writeups were fantastic. I worry about the step up from D-2 ball to the NFL.



I think it all depends on what type of NT you want for the Texans. Luckily Wade seems to be able to adapt his defense to the type of players we have and not the other way around. I also think that with the structured and disciplined team we've got almost any player we pick will fall in line and learn to be a Texan through hard work.

This falls right in with my line of thinking. I just started watching Hankins fopr the same reason. So far he looks good. Don't see the lack of effort I have read in a couple of places. The only knock I have so far is that he tends to lean forward too much at times and lose his balance. Needs to learn better technique to stay low to keep his center of gravity.

Dude moves really well for his size. It's actually pretty impressive. Still I would rather have Short as of now. His penetrating ability is what I like for this defense. IMO having 3 DL that can get penatration is key to taking this defense to the next level. Thats just my preference. I won't be upset if Wades preference leans towards a Hankins. I can't wait for the combine.
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Old 02-10-2013   #10
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolf6151 View Post
JMO:

Brandon Williams, another guy that I don't know alot about. The limited film I've seen of him, he looks slow but holds up to double teams well and plays the run well, but lacks the athleticism/agility. The Senior Bowl writeups were fantastic. I worry about the step up from D-2 ball to the NFL.



I think it all depends on what type of NT you want for the Texans. Luckily Wade seems to be able to adapt his defense to the type of players we have and not the other way around. I also think that with the structured and disciplined team we've got almost any player we pick will fall in line and learn to be a Texan through hard work. Lets face it any NT we pick is going to have JJ on one side of him, the Ninja on the other side, and a berserk Cushing behind him, he'd be to afraid not to give 100% effort.
This one has more than a chance to be the "sleeper" of the DT Draft.....for sure if he makes it into the 2nd round. He's far from slow and has the motor, the work ethic and mean streak we need to "enforce."


Quote:
2013 NFL Draft: Missouri Southern Defensive Tackle Brandon Williams
By
Scott Bischoff
(Featured Columnist) on November 28, 2012

Brandon Williams is a gigantic man who plays defensive line for Division II Missouri Southern State University in the Mid-America Intercollegiate Athletic Association. Williams is 6’3", 325 pounds and was recently named MIAA defensive player of the year.

Williams had an incredible senior season. He had 68 total tackles, 16.5 tackles for loss, 8.5 sacks, two pass breakups, eight quarterback hurries, five forced fumbles and a safety. Williams plays as a nose tackle, but is versatile enough to play any position from a 0-technique (lined up directly over the center), to a 5-technique (lined up on the outside shoulder of the offensive tackle).

During his senior season, Williams broke the Missouri Southern sack record, and he finished with 27 sacks during his career at school. To make it clear, Williams is not just a sack artist, but a complete football player who can stop the run and get to the quarterback.

I got the chance to talk to Williams after his senior season ended. He is a charming, engaging, vibrant young man who left me with a very positive impression of who he is, both as a football player and as a person. I imagine that teams are going to fall in love with him during the pre-draft process where they get to meet with him.

The first question I asked was what position he played in college.

“I would be a nose guard”.

I asked him what position he projected himself to play in the NFL.

“I can play in either scheme, a 3-4 or 4-3 because in college I played the whole D-line and then, and when we went to our 3-3 stuff, I was the outside 5-tech as well as over the center. I played in any and every position, so I am comfortable playing in any scheme.”



I asked him what his strength did for him playing along the interior of the defensive line. I wondered if he liked throwing offensive linemen around, so I asked if he liked to stack and shed, or get rid of double-teams.

“It’s all of the above. Playing run stop, playing pass, breaking down double-teams, that was really great. Also, it gives me great pleasure getting off of the ball, the first couple of steps, getting into the offensive linemen and pushing him back two or three yards, it puts pressure on the quarterback as well as giving the running back a hard time to pick a hole.”

We talked about the number of sacks that he has, and how he could get that much pressure on the quarterback from the middle of the defensive line. I asked him how he felt about putting up the number of sacks that he has.

“It feels good. It gives me opportunities to get into different positions and not stay in one position and it gives me a better advantage to use my talents more in a wider range. Playing defensive end, working the 5-technique on the tackle, I can play the run and play between the guard and the center, or I can play between the tackle and the guard.”

He explained that teams were triple-teaming him in the middle at the end of the season and his coaches put him outside to give him a better chance at making plays.


Quote:
We talked about the process that is going to lead up to the 2013 NFL draft. He was adamant in saying that he just wanted to get picked to have an opportunity to prove himself.

I asked what he wanted to show teams during the process.

“I want to show them just because I'm a small-school guy doesn't mean [I can’t play]. I'm a small-school guy, but I can hang with the best of them. You know, I'm the kind of guy who doesn't take no for an answer. If you tell me I can’t do something, I am going to prove you wrong. I’m going to show them that no matter who the competition is, I’m the guy for it.”

Williams told me that he thinks he can run a 40-yard dash time below the 5.0 second mark and that he “expects his 40 time to be around 4.9’s.” It would be reminiscent of what Kansas City Chiefs nose tackle Dontari Poe did at the 2012 NFL combine, and it would shoot his draft stock soaring as he can play football and he is not just a workout wonder.

I asked Williams what an NFL team would be getting if they were to draft him.

“They would be getting a hard-working player, you know? A player that says what he does and does what he says. I think of myself as a stand-up guy. I think that I am a well-rounded player, you know, on and off the field.”

I asked Williams what an NFL team would be getting if they were to draft him.

“They would be getting a hard-working player, you know? A player that says what he does and does what he says. I think of myself as a stand-up guy. I think that I am a well-rounded player, you know, on and off the field.”
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Old 02-10-2013   #11
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

From what I've seen Brandon does have a high motor. He uses leverage to his advantage with strong lower body & bubble butt. Seems to have about three pretty good pass rush moves, spin, good rip/chop & bull rush. sort of a thrashing buzz saw on steroids. Given level of play against inferior competition I think teams will tread lightly not to over price his draft grade based off Poe last season. I do like his potential, long term with that work ethic he could be a solid pick in the 2nd. More physical, explosive, yet similar version to Earl Mitchell who Texans drafted in the 3rd.

I'll tell you the real sleeper is for DT class but he shouldn't be because he played @ Penn State & that is Jordan Hill. 6' 1" 1/2 294. Very quick & could also solidify DE with Crick. That is four solid DE's with a couple who can also kick inside, nullifying the need to draft a pure 1 gap NT.

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Old 02-11-2013   #12
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

I like a lot of the nt prospects,but looking at the guys availible in free agency , id rather go get one of those guys. Terrance Knighton and sammy lee hill are 2 guys who will be fairly cheap. The beauty is both are 26 yrs old. Texans could probably offer 5 yrs 17m with 6m guarantee.
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Old 02-11-2013   #13
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The texans have missed twice with previous defensive tackles in first round, so I'm a little nervous on picking that position in first. But it would be nice having someone disruptive next to Watt. It just seems DT 's have a higher bust factor than other positions.
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Old 02-11-2013   #14
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Playoffs View Post
The guys at Walter Football saw it differently:
And they're even saying he's on the Texan's radar, "I've been told that John Jenkins is a strong option for the Texans at No. 27 if they can't land one of the two SEC linebackers... "
He may have had a good practise week but if they think he had a good game....
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Old 02-11-2013   #15
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
He ay have had a good practise week but if they think he had a good game....
I was impressed with Jenkins, multiple games while @ Georgia against SEC competition. Even mocked him to the Texans couple months ago but that was before he got stupid (guessing he contacted an agent) besides just stopping taking classes, all the while saying he was returning to Georgia. Once busted he was ruled ineligible for bowl game, hence early declaration for the draft. Red flag for me, I can't see how he could still be on the Texans draft board, character is too important despite physical attributes. He is nothing more than a run plugger anyway, nose tackle only doesn't bring multiplicity.
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Old 02-11-2013   #16
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

Yep, remember our discussions. I think there are better options at Nose. Your other info should pretty much rule him out.
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Old 02-11-2013   #17
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
This one has more than a chance to be the "sleeper" of the DT Draft.....for sure if he makes it into the 2nd round. He's far from slow and has the motor, the work ethic and mean streak we need to "enforce."






link

I have moved him up to 4th on my DT's list.
Star
Short
Hankins
B Williams
I can see him going in the first round.
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Last edited by mussop; 02-11-2013 at 12:49 PM.
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Old 02-20-2013   #18
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

as per walterfootball's website

"I've been told that John Jenkins is a strong option for the Texans at No. 27 if they can't land one of the two SEC linebackers".
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Old 02-21-2013   #19
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

What are your guys thoughts on Sharrif Floyd and Sheldon Richardson?
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Old 02-21-2013   #20
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Default Re: DT in 1st rd.

Quote:
Originally Posted by b0ng View Post
What are your guys thoughts on Sharrif Floyd and Sheldon Richardson?

I'd run to the podium if Sheldon Richardson were available to us at #27, but it ain't happening. He and Watt on the same D-line would almost be illegal. He'd be a stud at 3-4 DE, we could release Antonio, and might be a JJ clone.

I think Floyd is more of a 4-3 UT and will make some team very happy, just not right for our system.
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