Stupor Bowl Ring Not withstanding Joe Flacco STILL aint that great

[Dread-Head]

He has a Superbowl ring and in his mind this makes him worth the $20million a year he THINKS he's worth, but let's be honest. If you gave David Carr Antoine Bolden he'd look like a probowl QB. The Raven's D and some blind refs gave them a Championship it still doesn't change the fact that Flacco doesn't warrant being mentioned in the same breath with Manning, Brady, Rogers, Roethlisburger, Brees or some of the elites to have played the position. For what it's worth hell David Carr has a stupor bowl ring too...doesn't make HIM a better QB.

[Luv_ya_blue]

I know you did NOT mention David C***!


Just said it before someone else does.
I agree fwiw.

[Dread-Head]

Originally Posted by Luv_ya_blue

I know you did NOT mention David C***!


Just said it before someone else does.
I agree fwiw.

I would have said "Bubby Brister 2.0" or "Flacco 1.0" but some wouldn't have known what I meant.

[Vinny]

Originally Posted by Dread-Head

He has a Superbowl ring and in his mind this makes him worth the $20million a year he THINKS he's worth, but let's be honest. If you gave David Carr Antoine Bolden he'd look like a probowl QB. The Raven's D and some blind refs gave them a Championship it still doesn't change the fact that Flacco doesn't warrant being mentioned in the same breath with Manning, Brady, Rogers, Roethlisburger, Brees or some of the elites to have played the position. For what it's worth hell David Carr has a stupor bowl ring too...doesn't make HIM a better QB.

I find it hard to believe that people watching the playoffs can come to the conclusion that Joe Flacco isn't that good. Bolden is past his prime and cannot create separation and Flacco made some UNREAL passes to him in tight coverages. Flacco escaping the rush was just awesome yesterday...Shaub would have been killed or at least those balls were in the cheap seats but Flacco made completions out of them. Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.

You can continue to stay married to your 2010 take on Flacco....I'll stick to what my eyes tell me in 2013

[Rey]

Originally Posted by Vinny

I find it hard to believe that people watching the playoffs can come to the conclusion that Joe Flacco isn't that good. Bolden is past his prime and cannot create separation and Flacco made some UNREAL passes to him in tight coverages. Flacco escaping the rush was just awesome yesterday...Shaub would have been killed or at least those balls were in the cheap seats but Flacco made completions out of them. Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.

You can continue to stay married to your 2010 take on Flacco....I'll stick to what my eyes tell me in 2013

Must spread....

I do not know what people look at sometimes...

Carr had Andre Johnson, but now if he gets Boldin he's winning superbowls??

[Luv_ya_blue]

Originally Posted by Dread-Head

I would have said "Bubby Brister 2.0" or "Flacco 1.0" but some wouldn't have known what I meant.

I don't have the anti-Carr venom that some do `round these parts.

I see Flacco as being the role player WITH the tools that are needed to take the team where they need to go. Let's be honest, if not for J@**** Freakin' J@*** and his TWO TDs, there's really not a game at all. But Flacco managed to hit him for one of those TDs and if the 49ers defender doesn't do some stupid hurdling move instead of touching the player--it may be a 3 point drive rather than ending up 7. Take the KR for TD off the board and the 49ers win this one convincingly.

But that's all pie-in-the-sky because it didn't end up that way. In any event, I don't know that you need a superstar/elite QB to win a championship. I mean for Pete's sake, the Ravens have shown that to be true with 1st Dilfer and now Flacco! But if the coaches choose to make him (and his weaknesses) the core of the scheme because they choose to try and constantly outthink the room, rather than just DO WHAT WORKS, it's on them.

[Luv_ya_blue]

Originally Posted by Vinny

I find it hard to believe that people watching the playoffs can come to the conclusion that Joe Flacco isn't that good. Bolden is past his prime and cannot create separation and Flacco made some UNREAL passes to him in tight coverages. Flacco escaping the rush was just awesome yesterday...Shaub would have been killed or at least those balls were in the cheap seats but Flacco made completions out of them. Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.

You can continue to stay married to your 2010 take on Flacco....I'll stick to what my eyes tell me in 2013

He absolutely made some great passes.
I just don't see Flacco nearly as much elite as he is, fortunate to fit into the system.

I could be wrong.

[TexanSam]

David Carr had Andre Johnson. Joe Flacco may not be elite during the regular season, but this is two years in a row where he's been excellent in the post-season. He's great when it counts.

[GP]

Is He or Is He Not Elite Joe Flacco, I Fumble Everything Jacoby Jones, Old Man Boldin, Old Man Lewis, Old Man Leach, Penalty Fanatic Pollard, a new o-coordinator halfway through the reg season, they just pretty much told everybody to STFU. IMO.

But yeah, let's try to rationalize why they just lucked into a SB ring.

Some people will do anything to minimize the pain of being a Texans fan.

By the way, they came back and beat the Broncos (tried like hell to help us out by giving us one half of the equation for Home Field in a potential Houston-hosted AFCC game, by the way). Then they freaking DRUBBED the Patriots and made them look like maroons.

Pretty bad thread decision, DreadHead. Take a mulligan.

[Vinny]

Originally Posted by Luv_ya_blue

He absolutely made some great passes.
I just don't see Flacco nearly as much elite as he is, fortunate to fit into the system.

I could be wrong.

Did Joe Flacco just have the best playoffs of any quarterback we've ever seen?

Not joking. This is a conversation that absolutely needs to be had. The Flacchise has numbers that place him into that discussion, and if anything, the numbers might underrate how good he's been during these playoffs.

Let's start with the numbers, though, because they're staggering. Flacco finished the postseason having gone 73-of-126 (57.9 percent) for 1,140 passing yards with 11 touchdowns and zero interceptions. Eleven to zero. Only one other player since the merger has produced a touchdown-to-interception ratio equal to or better than that in the playoffs, and it's a guy who has a pretty sterling postseason reputation: Joe Montana.

Montana's 1989 season pretty clearly stands out to me as the greatest postseason run since 1970, but I've gone ahead and listed some other notable Super Bowl–winning postseasons that might put Flacco's big January into context:

Player Year Team GP Cmp Att Cmp% Yds Y/Att TD INT Rating Yds/Gm
Joe Montana 1989 49ers 3 65 83 78.3% 800 9.6 11 0 146.4 266.7
Troy Aikman 1992 Cowboys 3 61 89 68.5% 795 8.9 8 0 126.4 265.0
Steve Young 1994 49ers 3 53 87 60.9% 623 7.2 9 0 117.2 207.7
Joe Flacco 2012 Ravens 4 73 126 57.9% 1140 9.0 11 0 117.2 285.0
Drew Brees 2009 Saints 3 72 102 70.6% 732 7.2 8 0 117.0 244.0
Joe Montana 1988 49ers 3 56 90 62.2% 823 9.1 8 1 117.0 274.3
Joe Theismann 1982 Redskins 4 58 85 68.2% 716 8.4 8 3 110.7 179.0
Aaron Rodgers 2010 Packers 4 90 132 68.2% 1094 8.3 9 2 109.8 273.5
Terry Bradshaw 1978 Steelers 3 44 78 56.4% 790 10.1 8 4 104.1 263.3
Eli Manning 2011 Giants 4 106 163 65.0% 1219 7.5 9 1 103.3 304.8


It's admittedly going to be hard to top Montana, who basically played perfect football for three consecutive weeks. Flacco arguably had to shoulder a heavier portion of the workload than Montana did with his 49ers, but that's partly due to a shift in league trends; note that Aaron Rodgers (2010) and Eli Manning (2011) each threw more passes than Flacco and the rest of the group. Based on the numbers, Flacco probably belongs in a group just behind Montana, alongside Troy Aikman (1992) and Rodgers's 2010 campaign.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/...in-perspective

[Playoffs]

Joe Flacco is better than he's been allowed to be under Cam Cameron.

He was the best QB in these playoffs with a 117 QB rating.

Gotta give the man his due -- he took the chances & they paid off.

[Thorn]

It doesn't matter how good Flacid is. He won this years Super Bowl so he'll be a big topic all off season.

[eriadoc]

Originally Posted by Dread-Head

If you gave David Carr Antoine Bolden he'd look like a probowl QB.

Dread, regardless what anyone thinks about Flacco, this is clearly one of the most ... off ... things you've ever written.

[toronto]

I was already on board with Flacco being damn good, but his post season elevated him to another level. Dread you took on the wrong QB here. This guys stock is google-sequence and deservedly so.

I would take him over almost any QB now. Smart, young, great deep ball and calm under pressure. And now, at its purest form, winner.

[dtran04]

He deserves the payday that is upcoming. Although he should send a few million towards Rahim Moore.

Probably will make an extra $20 million because of the playoffs.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Vinny

Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.

What's worse, is that he did the same thing in last year's play-offs. Had this been the first time he put on a show like that, yeah I can see how some would attribute it to luck, or whatever. But a second time?

Surely you've got to at least acknowledge that maybe there's something there.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by dtran04

Although he should send a few million towards Rahim Moore.

Preparation meet opportunity.

[Lucky]

I don't know if Joe "Hardy" Flacco didn't made a Faustian deal. And I don't know if he will be an elite QB next season. But in these playoffs, he was elite. And I'm sure his agent will remind the Ravens.

[Texecutioner]

Originally Posted by Vinny

I find it hard to believe that people watching the playoffs can come to the conclusion that Joe Flacco isn't that good. Bolden is past his prime and cannot create separation and Flacco made some UNREAL passes to him in tight coverages. Flacco escaping the rush was just awesome yesterday...Shaub would have been killed or at least those balls were in the cheap seats but Flacco made completions out of them. Kudos to Bolden for beasting up and making strong-man catches, but it continues to amaze me when people debate if a guy is good or not right after he plays a great series of games.

You can continue to stay married to your 2010 take on Flacco....I'll stick to what my eyes tell me in 2013

No question he has looked very good in the post season. But all of this elite talk has been pretty over the top and way to quick. Flacco has had a very nice run, and played pretty well in the post season last year, but he has to show that he carry his team from this point on and put the fear into defenses year after year. Guys like Rodgers, Brady, and Manning have been doing this for years at the highest level. That is why they are called elite in the first place. For years people have considered the QB position one of the weakest positions on the Ravens team with Flacco out there. Many of them even said at one point that the only reason why the Steelers had more SB rings then they did was because the Steelers had Ben and they had Flacco. People are forgetting that QB's and teams make big runs every year. Flacco has a lot further to go as far as getting into that conversation. This post season run that he helped to lead his team on was a giant leap for Flacco. Let's see if he can maintain that consistency in the season for 16 games without his fans and his team questioning him as the guy. Ravens fans have had just as much controversy with Flacco as the QB as Schaub has recently had here.

[Dutchrudder]

I think it's pretty obvious that the issue with the Ravens offense the past few years was Cam Cameron. Flacco looked like a different QB once Cam was gone, and the playbook was adjusted to work to Flacco's strengths, adjust the offensive line protections, and better scheme against the pass rush. I wouldn't call Flacco elite, but he's certainly moved in to the tier 2 discussion.