Cowher on the Texans

[thunderkyss]

I don't know what you guys think of Bill Cowher's opinion, but he had some good things to say about the Texans, Matt Schaub, & Gary Kubiak. Here's a link to his visit with J&R..

Give it a listen, then let's discuss.

[Thorn]

He sounded reasonable. He was higher on Kubiak than I am, he was straight about Schaub. Until Schaub actually does something in the playoffs, there will always be doubt about him, and rightly so. He also said something we've all be saying around here, we need another good WR before the offense can take the next step. He said you have to have two good wide outs to be effective, and that's the truth. We have one. A damn good one, but he's still just one.

I liked the interview. And I wouldn't put nothing on the fact he said he could win the Super Bowl with the Texans. It was more of an off the cuff remark than something real definate.

[Hagar]

Cowher's analysis is spot on. I think he was right about Schuab and Cushing. If our defense is going to work, Cushing has got to be healthy run all over the place making plays.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Hagar

Cowher's analysis is spot on. I think he was right about Schuab and Cushing. If our defense is going to work, Cushing has got to be healthy run all over the place making plays.

Loosing Cushing was big, but Cowher also hit on another thing. Injuries to that position. Dobbins got hurt, James got hurt, Sharpton got hurt... Barrett Ruud probably didn't expect to play as much when he signed on.

I don't think continuity is as important for the position as it is for your offensive line, but if you look, it was one week after another. It was rare that we started the same two ILBs in back to back weeks after Cushing went down & it was just as rare that the two guys that started the game were the same two guys that ended the game.

Then we caught an injury bug at the safety position for a little bit as well.

I don't like to blame injuries, & we managed to win quite a few of those games regardless. But I think our situation was unusual & our coaches handled it about as well as could be expected.

He also mentioned a little bit of luck helping Baltimore get to the dance. Team of destiny he said.

[bckey]

Originally Posted by Hagar

Cowher's analysis is spot on. I think he was right about Schuab and Cushing. If our defense is going to work, Cushing has got to be healthy run all over the place making plays.

Agreed. I think the loss of Cushing was huge. And Schaub has to step up his game and prove he can take this team to the sb. I would also throw in the fact that RS sent the right side of the ol packing in the offseason. Drafting project wrs didn't help either.

Thanks for the link TK!

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by bckey

I would also throw in the fact that RS sent the right side of the ol packing in the offseason. Drafting project wrs didn't help either.

It sucks when you take "educated" chances like that & they don't work out. Surely we expected some drop off going from Winston & Briesel to Butler & Gump... surely they could "hold the fort" until the future was ready to play..... but nooooooo. They both get hurt early, Butler before the season started.

Now... WR. He's only been working on this for 6 seasons & we've got nothing to show for it. From day one, we were in no position to field 3 WRs...... that's a fail imo. Coaching staff & Smith (scouting department) we've brought plenty of WRs in over that time & haven't found one to stick, then get yourself in a situation where you're overpaying not one, but two #3 WRs... fail.

Originally Posted by bckey

Thanks for the link TK!

De nada

[mussop]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

It sucks when you take "educated" chances like that & they don't work out. Surely we expected some drop off going from Winston & Briesel to Butler & Gump... surely they could "hold the fort" until the future was ready to play..... but nooooooo. They both get hurt early, Butler before the season started.

Now... WR. He's only been working on this for 6 seasons & we've got nothing to show for it. From day one, we were in no position to field 3 WRs...... that's a fail imo. Coaching staff & Smith (scouting department) we've brought plenty of WRs in over that time & haven't found one to stick, then get yourself in a situation where you're overpaying not one, but two #3 WRs... fail.



De nada

Not saying we shouldn't still try and upgrade the position but posey was on his way to becoming #2 before he got hurt. he was really starting to look like he was becoming legit. I still think Martin has the skill set to become a solid slot WR. He had a rough freshman year i know but most WR's make a big jump in their second year.

[JPPT1974]

Well he does seem higher on Kubiak. But it is about trying to get past the Divisional Title Games that could the team, take it to the next level. Just get past that! But they are on a huge start. Just took time to get the chemistry going with Kubiak and the team!

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by mussop

Not saying we shouldn't still try and upgrade the position but posey was on his way to becoming #2 before he got hurt. he was really starting to look like he was becoming legit. I still think Martin has the skill set to become a solid slot WR. He had a rough freshman year i know but most WR's make a big jump in their second year.

I like the three of them. Posey, Martin, & LeStar.

My gripe, is that we didn't have a third receiver. I remember discussing this before the season started. "We" said we should be able to get a rookie fresh off the draft to produce Walter/Jacoby type of numbers, a productive #3.

But I'm not blaming the kids, I'm blaming the leadership, the F.O. the scouts, the coaches. We got nothing out of Dorin Dickerson, or Andre Davis... I'm missing David freak'n Anderson right now, that's how bad this is.

But hey...... they can't all be homeruns right?

[SAMURAITEXAN]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I like the three of them. Posey, Martin, & LeStar.

My gripe, is that we didn't have a third receiver. I remember discussing this before the season started. "We" said we should be able to get a rookie fresh off the draft to produce Walter/Jacoby type of numbers, a productive #3.

But I'm not blaming the kids, I'm blaming the leadership, the F.O. the scouts, the coaches. We got nothing out of Dorin Dickerson, or Andre Davis... I'm missing David freak'n Anderson right now, that's how bad this is.

But hey...... they can't all be homeruns right?

We ain't drafting WR high for last several years I think highest is 3rd. Higher than 3rd would be 2002 2nd rd Gaffney and 2003 1st rd Dre and that is all. We may need to draft higher to find that may stick. I am not saying Mid to Late rds or UDFA won't cut it but I think we may have better chance to find more promising prospects in earlier rds IMO. However, I don't know if this is the year for WR to go early rounds.

[DX-TEX]

[Lucky]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I like the three of them. Posey, Martin, & LeStar.

The problem was that Gary and Rick liked them too much. After a combined 22 catches for 2 TDs, how do they like them now? I realize that the Texans could not afford to go after a legit FA WR last year. But who put then in that position? All of these contracts belong to this brain trust.

If the offense's problems are going to be laid on the inexperience of the 3rd WRs and the right side of the O-line, that's on Smithiak's overconfidence in their scouting/coaching abilities. I don't think that was is entirely true, but what are the plans to solve these issues? Hope the young guys get better? Draft more young guys to protect and produce for QB who is a year older and slower? I'm not going to criticize moves that haven't been made. But these guys need to come up with a better plan than last season.

[76Texan]

Originally Posted by Lucky

The problem was that Gary and Rick liked them too much. After a combined 22 catches for 2 TDs, how do they like them now? I realize that the Texans could not afford to go after a legit FA WR last year. But who put then in that position? All of these contracts belong to this brain trust.

If the offense's problems are going to be laid on the inexperience of the 3rd WRs and the right side of the O-line, that's on Smithiak's overconfidence in their scouting/coaching abilities. I don't think that was is entirely true, but what are the plans to solve these issues? Hope the young guys get better? Draft more young guys to protect and produce for QB who is a year older and slower? I'm not going to criticize moves that haven't been made. But these guys need to come up with a better plan than last season.

They can evaluate the players correctly, but when those guys don't perform to their capacity, it's tough.

Jean is a guy who made his mark in college with over the head catches, but he dropped a few big ones last year.

Martin dropped but maybe once or twice his entire senior year and never slipped on a route; but he dropped 4 or 5 balls in very few passes thrown his way, and slipped on another. His drop rate is supposed to be less than 2%; instead, it became 20% percent or so; that was just ridiculous.

[bckey]

Originally Posted by Lucky

But these guys need to come up with a better plan than last season.

You got that right.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Lucky

The problem was that Gary and Rick liked them too much. After a combined 22 catches for 2 TDs, how do they like them now? I realize that the Texans could not afford to go after a legit FA WR last year. But who put then in that position? All of these contracts belong to this brain trust.

Yeah... that's what I said. That's exactly what I said.

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I like the three of them. Posey, Martin, & LeStar.

But I'm not blaming the kids, I'm blaming the leadership, the F.O. the scouts, the coaches. We got nothing out of Dorin Dickerson, or Andre Davis... I'm missing David freak'n Anderson right now, that's how bad this is.

Originally Posted by Lucky

If the offense's problems are going to be laid on the inexperience of the 3rd WRs and the right side of the O-line, that's on Smithiak's overconfidence in their scouting/coaching abilities. I don't think that was is entirely true, but what are the plans to solve these issues? Hope the young guys get better? Draft more young guys to protect and produce for QB who is a year older and slower? I'm not going to criticize moves that haven't been made. But these guys need to come up with a better plan than last season.

I know people are calling for Joe Marciano's head. But at least he's had some success in the time that he's been here. The guy I think we should be looking at is Larry Kirksey. He's been here since 2007 & we haven't developed 1 WR. We've had plenty come through here & his best "job" to date is Jacoby Jones.

That's the guy who's stealing money.

As far as the right side of the OL goes, I think Benton & Rico are doing their job. The drop off we saw "shouldn't" have been so bad if Butler & Caldwell were in fact the starters. But they both got hurt & we got Newton/Harris, Jones/Brooks. still they did an admirable job when you consider Matt was one of the least sacked QBs, he threw for 4000 yards, Andre grabed 100+ catches for 1500 yards & Foster ran for 1400.... the problem was not being able to do it when we needed to. But overall, I think they made good out of a bad situation.

[Lucky]

Originally Posted by 76Texan

They can evaluate the players correctly, but when those guys don't perform to their capacity, it's tough.

Jean is a guy who made his mark in college with over the head catches, but he dropped a few big ones last year.

Martin dropped but maybe once or twice his entire senior year and never slipped on a route; but he dropped 4 or 5 balls in very few passes thrown his way, and slipped on another. His drop rate is supposed to be less than 2%; instead, it became 20% percent or so; that was just ridiculous.

Lestar Jean was a UDFA. Keshawn Martin was a raw receiver who made most of his plays at Michigan State as a returner or catching bubble screens. Expecting these guys to step into a key role in a NFL offense is not evaluating players correctly.

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

The guy I think we should be looking at is Larry Kirksey. He's been here since 2007 & we haven't developed 1 WR. We've had plenty come through here & his best "job" to date is Jacoby Jones.

That's the guy who's stealing money.

I'm not into passing the buck to the assistants. If Kirksey hasn't been getting the job done, Kubiak should have looked elsewhere long ago. To be fair to Kirksey, he's been given one HOF talent and little else. He's not shopping for the groceries, as far as we know.

[76Texan]

Originally Posted by Lucky

Lestar Jean was a UDFA. Keshawn Martin was a raw receiver who made most of his plays at Michigan State as a returner or catching bubble screens. Expecting these guys to step into a key role in a NFL offense is not evaluating players correctly.


I'm not into passing the buck to the assistants. If Kirksey hasn't been getting the job done, Kubiak should have looked elsewhere long ago. To be fair to Kirksey, he's been given one HOF talent and little else. He's not shopping for the groceries, as far as we know.

Jean was an UDFA, yes, but they also saw something there when he beat a couple of CBs who were drafted (what's his name from UT? - was one).

They didn't expect him to be up to par right away; he was a project, and that was true.
But we all saw some good plays from him that we hope is worth the wait (for cheap).

Martin wasn't just a guy who takes bubble screen at Mich. St.
He ran plenty of routes from the slot and also from the wide out spots.
That's why the Texans "fast-tracked" him (a little too soon for my taste.)

I would rather have him in return duties and then work him in as a receiver slowly.

There's nothing wrong with that when he's a mid round pick.

I was hoping that Posey can get up to par sooner.
You can see that he was showing the sign of being a better option than the other two when given the chance.

Nobody expected them to play a big role, but I definitely didn't expect Jean and Martin to drop that many passes and/or running poor routes as they did.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by JPPT1974

Well he does seem higher on Kubiak. But it is about trying to get past the Divisional Title Games that could the team, take it to the next level. Just get past that! But they are on a huge start. Just took time to get the chemistry going with Kubiak and the team!

He seemed genuine to me. He sounded as if he truly believes Kubiak is a "great" HC. But I'm sure he was hamming it up a little bit. What I thought was interesting was that he said Kubiak "will get better"

I personally think that should be true for all coaches, head coaches, coordinators, position coaches... once you stop getting better, it's time to move on. Because, as you know, the game is constantly changing. You've got defensive guys out scheming offensive guys, offensive guys out scheming defensive guys. You've got 6'6" TEs that can run like deer & 2nd year DL playing like 24 year veterans.

But I wonder how much of himself does Cowher sees in Kubiak. How many times did Cowher think his team was good enough, only to fall short? I remember a couple of years before he won the SuperBowl the talking heads had him on the hot-seat. So I would think he also knows that "lucky I have a job" feeling.

[Lucky]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

But I wonder how much of himself does Cowher sees in Kubiak. How many times did Cowher think his team was good enough, only to fall short?

I think what Cowher learned was the value of the QB position. He had the Steelers playing great defense with a strong running attack for years, but continued to fall short. And he went through 3 QBs (O'Donnell, Stewart, and Maddux) before finding one that could take the team all the way.

Matt Schaub may be Kubiak's Neil O'Donnell. Hopefully, we don't get Kordell Stewart and Tommy Maddux before seeing Kubiak's Ben Roethlisberger.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Lucky

I think what Cowher learned was the value of the QB position.

I'm pretty sure everyone involved with the NFL understands the value of the QB position. The guy touches the ball on practically every offensive snap.

Unlike Cowher, Kubiak comes from an organization that had that QB everyone knew could get it done (ala Peyton Manning) but still failed to win the Lombardy more times than not. After Elway Kubiak & Shanahan got close one time. So I'm sure he knows the value of the position.

The thing we all need to learn, is not only do you have to have the right QB, but you've got to have the right team behind them. Jim Kelly is a good example. You can't tell me he wasn't good enough. Warren Moon, Dan Marino, I'll even throw in Cunningham. They were all good enough, imo, but QBs don't win Super Bowls. They don't win championships. They can win games but it takes a team to win Championships.

Tom Brady & Ben Roethlisbergers weren't very good QBs when they won their first Super Bowl. Both were better QBs when they won their second. Brady much better when he won his third. They are both way much better QBs now than they were then & it's been awhile since they've won a championship. But you take Vinatieri of those Patriots teams, how many Super Bowls does Belichick have?