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Old 01-21-2013   #21
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Default Re: Mock off-season

So I gather that those xtra 3s, 5s, & 6s are comp pics for Mario, Briesel, & Dreessen ? How confidant are we that we are actually going to be awarded those pics ?
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Old 01-21-2013   #22
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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The routes our guys run and the routes welker runs in NE are completely different.

Our offense is completely different as well. We run two TE sets a bunch which means only two wr's. Welker would not NE able to just line up in the slot most of the time. He'd have to line up out wide and be counted on to block players bigger than him. I don't think welker is nearly as effective if he's lining up out wide most of the time.
There's a reason why David Anderson hung around here so long in my opinion. Kubiak wants a guy like that but just hasn't found one he likes. While we do love 2 TE sets I don't think its far fetched at all that we'd adjust our offense to fit a guy like that. If Martin was more consistent I think we would have done that this year.
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Old 01-21-2013   #23
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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You could be right, and I'm not a cap guru like some others on the board so I get my info from them and I've seen plenty of them say how we'll be strapped in the offseason. So thats a convo I really can't have due to ignorance on the subject, but I'd take any of those guys. Just don't want Walter as our number 2 again.
If you allow the guys I propose to walk, you get 12.528 million back. If you cut Walter thats another 3.5 bringing it up to 16.028. Here is what is interesting though.

The genius of Rick Smith is actually in his cap ability. He is actually better than you think. Foster and Brown, Joseph, Myers, Smith and Manning increase about 3.5 million ALL TOGETHER next season. But Schaub actually goes down about 1 million. Meaning for all those guys, we only increase the salary roughly 2 M.

The problem is Andre, Antonio and Owen increase pay SUBSTANTIALLY. I would honestly expect them to re-do their deals or be cut/traded (except Andre, not sure he can do anything with his deal). If they re-do Smith and OD we will be in GREAT shape to add a piece or 2, nothing crazy, but something to help the team and still have money for draft picks. I would expect something big to happen this off-season as we prepare to sign Cushing, Watt and Kareem Jackson.
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Old 01-21-2013   #24
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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So I gather that those xtra 3s, 5s, & 6s are comp pics for Mario, Briesel, & Dreessen ? How confidant are we that we are actually going to be awarded those pics ?
Its rumored on numerous sites we will get those, I just rolled with it
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Old 01-21-2013   #25
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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If you allow the guys I propose to walk, you get 12.528 million back. If you cut Walter thats another 3.5 bringing it up to 16.028. Here is what is interesting though.

The genius of Rick Smith is actually in his cap ability. He is actually better than you think. Foster and Brown, Joseph, Myers, Smith and Manning increase about 3.5 million ALL TOGETHER next season. But Schaub actually goes down about 1 million. Meaning for all those guys, we only increase the salary roughly 2 M.

The problem is Andre, Antonio and Owen increase pay SUBSTANTIALLY. I would honestly expect them to re-do their deals or be cut/traded (except Andre, not sure he can do anything with his deal). If they re-do Smith and OD we will be in GREAT shape to add a piece or 2, nothing crazy, but something to help the team and still have money for draft picks. I would expect something big to happen this off-season as we prepare to sign Cushing, Watt and Kareem Jackson.
Sounds good...... I'll trust you on that because I honestly have no clue. I evaluate talent well I believe but refuse to take the time to learn about the cap. So i'll defer to you on this one.
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Old 01-21-2013   #26
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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There's a reason why David Anderson hung around here so long in my opinion. Kubiak wants a guy like that but just hasn't found one he likes. While we do love 2 TE sets I don't think its far fetched at all that we'd adjust our offense to fit a guy like that. If Martin was more consistent I think we would have done that this year.
Anderson hung around, on the bench mostly, because we kept investing in our defense and other positions (while signing old washed up street free agents).

Gary invested in 2 wide outs since he has been here, Jones (3rd round) and Anderson(7th round), its time we take a play maker and quit relying on late round players to help this team. Posey showed promise, until he got hurt, and Martin was fast, but still a lot of work to be done to his route running. I would like to draft a big time player, as we prepare to move on from Aj within 3-5 seasons but in the meantime a stud wr will help us make a deep run and compete with high powered offenses. We have to be able to score points sometimes and having another big play maker in the redzone will help.

I still would like a proven vet as a 3rd option, because Posey and Martin still have a lot of room to grow and we don't have all the time to wait for them. This team is built to win now.
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Old 01-21-2013   #27
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There's a reason why David Anderson hung around here so long in my opinion
Not having anyone better probably has something to do with it. Kubiak's extreme loyalty to his guys is also a factor.

Whats the reason Walter has hung around as a starter for so long?

Because he wants a guy like welker starting there instead?
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Old 01-21-2013   #28
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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Not having anyone better probably has something to do with it. Kubiak's extreme loyalty to his guys is also a factor.

Whats the reason Walter has hung around as a starter for so long?

Because he wants a guy like welker starting there instead?
That's an answer I'm sure most of us would love to know. I understand what you're saying, but I don't agree that our route combos are that much different than what Welker runs now.
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Old 01-21-2013   #29
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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Not having anyone better probably has something to do with it. Kubiak's extreme loyalty to his guys is also a factor.

Whats the reason Walter has hung around as a starter for so long?

Because he wants a guy like welker starting there instead?
Just because he is loyal, doesn't mean he is smart. Neither one has warranted a position on this team. Walter has been declining since he got here and to say his blocking skills are superb is stupid. Last I checked blocking is only a small skill on a large scale. Its time we stop living in the 90s pretending like running teams with pass blocking wrs are the way to win. Hell even the Niners and Ravens (who have superb defenses) have legit weapons for their qb. Its time we invest in GOOD players at the skill positions instead of just being loyal to "good boys".
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Old 01-21-2013   #30
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Default Re: Mock off-season

Hell even walter was a 7th round pick, its like Gary values wide outs like he does corners or offensive linemen, just pick a low skill player who blocks and we should be good....his ego is disgusting when it comes to certain players and his eye for talent is sorely lacking. Guess what, 2 of the better players on this team in those positions (Brown and Jackson) were FIRST ROUND PICKS, after numerous failed attempts in lower round picks. Its time we do the same for wide out.
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Old 01-21-2013   #31
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That's an answer I'm sure most of us would love to know. I understand what you're saying, but I don't agree that our route combos are that much different than what Welker runs now.
Our routes are vastly different.

Patriots run a lot of short quick developing routes.

Our routes usually take longer to develop. Despite the complaints of Matt throwing short, we run a bunch of long routes. Deep crosses.

And I still believe that we just aren't built for a slot guy to be the number two receiver. Kubiak loves his fb a te's. Wes works better in an offense where they spread it out. Kubiak would have to make some significant changes to his offense to accommodate one player.

There are other players like welker. Not great outside receivers, but good slot guys. Keyshawn Martin isn't that kind of player, despite his size.

Kw would be a good slot receiver for us. Can block, would not need to be on the field all the time, and a nice big target for matt to hit in traffic.
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Old 01-21-2013   #32
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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Our routes are vastly different.

Patriots run a lot of short quick developing routes.

Our routes usually take longer to develop. Despite the complaints of Matt throwing short, we run a bunch of long routes. Deep crosses.

And I still believe that we just aren't built for a slot guy to be the number two receiver. Kubiak loves his fb a te's. Wes works better in an offense where they spread it out. Kubiak would have to make some significant changes to his offense to accommodate one player.

There are other players like welker. Not great outside receivers, but good slot guys. Keyshawn Martin isn't that kind of player, despite his size.

Kw would be a good slot receiver for us. Can block, would not need to be on the field all the time, and a nice big target for matt to hit in traffic.
We must be watching a different offense then if you think we don't throw a lot of short, quick developing routes. I respect your football knowledge, but I don't agree with you on this one.
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Old 01-21-2013   #33
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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We must be watching a different offense then if you think we don't throw a lot of short, quick developing routes. I respect your football knowledge, but I don't agree with you on this one.
I agree, I can't agree after watching this team over the years to think Welker wouldn't fit this offense perfectly. We run 3 wide sets quite often and to me Welker would be a number 3 more than he would a number 2. I would and did draft a play maker at wr to take over number 2 duties.

And to say he doesn't work the deep part of the field is a joke. In 2011 he was top 10 in 20 and 40 plus yard catches and this season is was top 20.

Pair him with Andre and a young play maker, we'd be dangerous.
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Old 01-21-2013   #34
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Welker isn't coming here to be a number three receiver.
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Old 01-21-2013   #35
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Default Re: Mock off-season

I feel like if Bradie James is still here in September we haven't improved enough on defense.

I would resign Donnie Jones -- ProFootballFocus had him as their top rated overall punter. We can't afford to get even worse on special teams.

I don't see Wes Welker as a fit in this offense. I think anyone who signs him won't get near the production you see w/NE.
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Old 01-21-2013   #36
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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Welker isn't coming here to be a number three receiver.
Yea, I doubt many super bowl contenders will offer him a contract, so why not come here to at least compete, its not like he is young and dominant. He was a no body prior to New England, so why wouldn't he come here and contribute while competing for another ring?


Even so I would be ok with Brian Hartline who I think we COULD sign for a good price and who WOULD want to come here.
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Old 01-21-2013   #37
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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I feel like if Bradie James is still here in September we haven't improved enough on defense.

I would resign Donnie Jones -- ProFootballFocus had him as their top rated overall punter. We can't afford to get even worse on special teams.

I don't see Wes Welker as a fit in this offense. I think anyone who signs him won't get near the production you see w/NE.
For me, with all those comp picks, I would prefer to draft a younger, cheaper punter with a big leg, some good ones this season. Ryan Allen for instance is a BEAST. the only 2 time Ray Guy award winner and had a beastly net punt average. He would be a long term solution and could cut the salary in half, its all about the money at this point IMO, not to mention p's and k's are getting better and better coming out of college, its not like before when you couldn't trust a young kicker. Times are changing.
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Old 01-21-2013   #38
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Default Re: Mock off-season

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If you allow the guys I propose to walk, you get 12.528 million back. If you cut Walter thats another 3.5 bringing it up to 16.028. Here is what is interesting though.

The genius of Rick Smith is actually in his cap ability. He is actually better than you think. Foster and Brown, Joseph, Myers, Smith and Manning increase about 3.5 million ALL TOGETHER next season. But Schaub actually goes down about 1 million. Meaning for all those guys, we only increase the salary roughly 2 M.

The problem is Andre, Antonio and Owen increase pay SUBSTANTIALLY. I would honestly expect them to re-do their deals or be cut/traded (except Andre, not sure he can do anything with his deal). If they re-do Smith and OD we will be in GREAT shape to add a piece or 2, nothing crazy, but something to help the team and still have money for draft picks. I would expect something big to happen this off-season as we prepare to sign Cushing, Watt and Kareem Jackson.
Actually I made a mistake, Smith and Daniels salary only goes up about 500k EACH, so a million total.

So if you take all the "big" increases you have 5.4 (Aj) and 4.5 (for everyone except Schaub) and -1 (schaub)

So you have ROUGHLY 9 million of the 16 (assuming you cut Walter) leaving you with 7 million left. I would still like to see something done with Dre, but I doubt we can do anything since he re-did his contract numerous times.

If it is similar to last season we would have about 1.5 cap hit in the first round and a drop from there. Lets just round it, because I don't have time to go through all 10 other picks. 500k for each pick meaning 2.5 million plus the 1.5 for the first rounder.

We would have 3 million left over. The guys we would "plan" on re-signing come out to be 5.3 M (not including Alexander and Gardner, because they don't actually come off being ERFA and RFA). That is 8.3 million plus tates 760k brings it up to about 9 million.

Now we need to sign Ball, Barwin, Quin, James, Forsett and Harris still. Can we sign all of them and have room to sign someone else, IDK.
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Old 01-21-2013   #39
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Default Re: Mock off-season

I don't think Welker would come here for the simple fact he is terrified of the Reliant turf. He hates the turf at Reliant ever since he blew his knee out.

I think Antonio is going to be a cap casualty this offseason...Sucks but I think they were impressed enough with Crick to replace Smith...

as for the mock, holy crap Amazing, bring on the offseason already!

and you are correct, if this was anybody else, mainly one particular poster who likes to write boring, uninteresting articles because he/she is a wannabe journalist, I move on. BUT it's you and a mock sooo...

Read on young scholars...
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Old 01-21-2013   #40
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Default Re: Mock off-season

The good news is in 2 weeks everyone is back on the same playing field again. Dead period, then combine... Then free agency and the draft countdown begins.

Despite everything, we have alot to look forward to next year... AGAIN!!
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