Connor Barwin and the 2013 draft

[otisbean]

Originally Posted by steelbtexan

Good news,

Dont know what OG/OT's are available in FA, but if they can sign an above avg OG and draft somebody like Long in the 2nd rd. The OL would look much better. Then get AJ some help on the outside and I think Schaub, despite his limitations would look much better.

Wade Smith made the pro bowl and will probably be looking to get paid. I've got alot of faith in Brooks taking over for Smith.

Agree with you about Barwin, but he put on weight this offseason and it hurt his quickness, if he gets back to last yrs playing weight he can become a double digit sack guy again. He's a hard worker so I wouldn't bet against him. Like you said it will all come down to the $$$$ with Barwin.

I know that the Texans could use a NT and a ILB and they should use later rd picks on those guys. Knott/A.J. Klein could be drafted later. But my philosophy is because teams play about 60% nickle defense now building the secondary should be a priority. Demps is a weakness and if he's re-signed for vet min to be a 4th S/ST's guy that would be OK.

The fastest way to upgrade the defense would be to re-sign Quin and to spend the 3rd rd comp pick on a S like Duke Williams, he can cover the slot WR/TE as well as play on the back end. This would also free up the Quin. I'm not advocating Williams although I like him alot. Just giving a philosophy on how to improve the Texans defense quickly.

I agree with everything you say here. I'd like us to target Andy Levitre from Buffalo or Brandon Moore from the Jets and I'd love to grab Long or another solid OT prospect in the 2nd. We also need some S depth as Dempsey and Keo are full of meh

[Goldensilence]

Originally Posted by Corrosion

Quin would be my top priority in this crop of FA's .... without a doubt. Especially considering that Demps and Keo are also FA's leaving only Manning at either S spot under contract.


Wade has used Barwin quite differently this year , especially late in the season , notice how often he's dropped back in coverage ?!
He's also been solid setting the edge against the run .... Just not a lot of numbers to show for his efforts.

I dont think keeping Bawrin is imperative .... I could see a case for keeping him or letting him walk and would be Ok either way. Bottom line it will boil down to $$$.

I've noticed too I've seen Barwin drop back more and haven't seen him set free really as often as last year. I have seen him seen him just miss on sacks this year too though. However, Merciless has been starting to get in on the rotation and I see him in him the backfield a lot just like Barwin last year. Now is he going to be a potential pro bowler? No clue, but clearly OLB was a concern going into last year with the loss of Mario and possibly in preparation of Barwin leaving via FA after a really solid job last year.

The question is going of course money. Physically he just doesn't look like the freak he did last year. Reed and Merciless are going to be steady at OLB at least, but the question is rotation and their respective ceilings.

I doubt we'll see it but I'd really like to see them invest something more substantial on the back end other than Keo and Demps, because I've seen them rotate in and they're vast drop offs from Manning and Quinn. I'm not saying we need pro bowlers but we need guys who have the speed to cover deep and keep better with slot WRs.

OL is going to be a question mark going into next season regardless of how the season ends. Jones ceiling to me seems closer to Brisiel than Hutchinson, but seems to be getting more PT than Caldwell, who is clearly on the way out now. I'd down down for someone like Levitre who would prolly be a good fit for what we're doing here and I was high on him coming out of the draft.

Not sure what to think of Wade Smith this year, but it kind of reminds me of Chester Pitts, when one of your guard spots is struggling you have to add extra help and shift responsibilities. Physically Brooks has what you want in a guard and I can only hope over this season he's learning something.

I dunno about you and I even doubt this is in the realm of possibility, but if I started to see Te'o drop a few spots to the lower top ten I'd be willing to give up some picks to have him and Cush man ILB. It'd make the the middle of this defense 10x better and free up whomever is going to start at OLB.

[TimeKiller]

I think we should do like the Seahawks, grab the craziest pass rusher available: Margus Hunt, DE in the first. I bet he doesn't even last that long. That guy is twice the freak Barwin is and his production would push Antonio Smith's bloated contract out the door at the same time. Mercilus gets a real shot to fulfill his potential, Reed resumes his normal duties at SAM, Money is better spent on keeping Quin around, players know they have to produce to get paid. All wins.

After that you target OL, maybe another RB and filling in depth up the middle of the defense that will also improve the special teams.

[otisbean]

Originally Posted by Goldensilence

I've noticed too I've seen Barwin drop back more and haven't seen him set free really as often as last year. I have seen him seen him just miss on sacks this year too though. However, Merciless has been starting to get in on the rotation and I see him in him the backfield a lot just like Barwin last year. Now is he going to be a potential pro bowler? No clue, but clearly OLB was a concern going into last year with the loss of Mario and possibly in preparation of Barwin leaving via FA after a really solid job last year.

The question is going of course money. Physically he just doesn't look like the freak he did last year. Reed and Merciless are going to be steady at OLB at least, but the question is rotation and their respective ceilings.

I doubt we'll see it but I'd really like to see them invest something more substantial on the back end other than Keo and Demps, because I've seen them rotate in and they're vast drop offs from Manning and Quinn. I'm not saying we need pro bowlers but we need guys who have the speed to cover deep and keep better with slot WRs.

OL is going to be a question mark going into next season regardless of how the season ends. Jones ceiling to me seems closer to Brisiel than Hutchinson, but seems to be getting more PT than Caldwell, who is clearly on the way out now. I'd down down for someone like Levitre who would prolly be a good fit for what we're doing here and I was high on him coming out of the draft.

Not sure what to think of Wade Smith this year, but it kind of reminds me of Chester Pitts, when one of your guard spots is struggling you have to add extra help and shift responsibilities. Physically Brooks has what you want in a guard and I can only hope over this season he's learning something.

I dunno about you and I even doubt this is in the realm of possibility, but if I started to see Te'o drop a few spots to the lower top ten I'd be willing to give up some picks to have him and Cush man ILB. It'd make the the middle of this defense 10x better and free up whomever is going to start at OLB.

As a 20+ year ND fan, I'd literally do a back flip if we landed Teo. I know people talk about the Wr position quite a bit and I agree that it should be upgraded, but we HAVE to address the OL and LBs this off season if we want to be a legit SB contenders

[Rey]

Originally Posted by otisbean

I'd like to get some thoughts regarding Barwin. I really like the guy and would like to see him remain a Texan, BUT I'm not happy with his performance this season at OLB. The WOLB is supposed to get sacks, and I believe at this point Barwin has 3.... I'm wondering how Barwin would do at ILB next to Cushing. He's athletic enough to play in space, remember he started as a TE and he was a college basketball player, in fact his combine numbers are very similar to Cush's

Barwin
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings...009&genpos=OLB

Cush
http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings...009&genpos=olb

The reason I have this in the draft section is simple, we've had less than stellar play from our LBs this year and I believe this must addressed early in the draft or through FA (which is typically expensive).
The 2 areas I'd love to improve on the Texans are the OL and the pass rush. I feel like our DL is quite good, though I would like an upgrade at NT like most here. I'd like to grab a pass rusher early (Ansah perhaps) and move Barwin inside. Ansah, Barwin, Cush, and Reed with Merciless in the mix along with Watt and Smith would be quite scary in terms of pressure on opposing QBs. Barwin and Cush coming on inside blitzes would be awesome. I'm also very intrigued by Ansah and would love to see him in a Texans uniform as a WOLB

If we resign Barwin and keep him outside then I'd like to look at either Olgetree
or Minter as an ILB upgrade. I like Dobbins as depth and I'd let James walk

For OL, I think I'd like to sign some veteran help, we have a bunch on young guys that have some talent so adding more youth may not be the answer. Signing a vet or 2 and letting the young guys learn a grow a bit would work well in my opinion. Just some thoughts

Not a fan of ansah or merciless as pass rushers and I think having both of them would do very little to help the pass rush. I can't see ansah as a wolb here because that's where merciless plays. And I don't know if I want to see merciless playing on the strong side over te's.

Minter is a decent player, but tbh, outside of Teo none of the ilb prospects I've seen do anything for me. And I don't even think Teo is all world. Weak year for ilb IMO. Maybe we can go after Shaun Phillips and play him inside some or Rey mauluga.

On OL I think this is a good year to grab a guy high. There are quite a few guys that seem like they'd fit well here.

[Mr teX]

Barwin...needs to be let go period..the guy hasn't done anything over his career to warrant bringing back..

[badboy]

The position Barwin plays for Phillips does not call for a player that makes 44 tackles & 3 sacks. Watt's productivity should allow Barwin to get free and dominate the QB. He is not being double teamed.

Quin playing behind our corners is in a prime position. An article in Houston paper today by David Barron asks if Joseph can cover Bengals' AJ Green. He quotes former NFL all pro safety Darren Sharper "JJ is not good when he's on an island."
http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans...nts-on-parade/

If Barwin leaves we do have two starters in Reed and Mercilus. If Quin leaves we are in wee bit of consternation with no one behind him.

[IDEXAN]

Barwin has only 3 sacks this year playing primarily from Wade Phillip's primary pass-rushing position at the weakside OLB/DE position. He did get 11.5 sacks last year, but 5 came in one game vs the Jags and the leagues worst QB, so arguable that "double-sack" total is misleading. But the thing is he had a very
underachieving 2012 season, which was his "contract year", so it's highly unlikely that the Texans bid higher for Barwin's sevices this upcoming offseason than EVERY other team in the NFL. Besides the Texans have an even higher investment in first-round pick Murciless who they expect to start and develope in the near future, and there isn't room for both to start.

[Playoffs]

Does Wade's scheme this year make it harder to judge Barwin? It seems like everything up front was schemed to free up Watt. 76T?

[otisbean]

Originally Posted by Rey

Not a fan of ansah or merciless as pass rushers and I think having both of them would do very little to help the pass rush. I can't see ansah as a wolb here because that's where merciless plays. And I don't know if I want to see merciless playing on the strong side over te's.

Minter is a decent player, but tbh, outside of Teo none of the ilb prospects I've seen do anything for me. And I don't even think Teo is all world. Weak year for ilb IMO. Maybe we can go after Shaun Phillips and play him inside some or Rey mauluga.

On OL I think this is a good year to grab a guy high. There are quite a few guys that seem like they'd fit well here.

For the record, in my first post I was talking about possibly keeping Barwin and playing him at ILB, as I agree with you in that this may not be the best ILB class. There are some interesting guys, Teo, Ogletree, maybe Skov or Thomas but I think Barwin has the athleticism to play there and could give us some diversity in our LB group.

The main reason I picked Ansah, is he played well against ND so he's been stuck in my mind. Truth be told Im for any one that can rush the QB as outside of Watt we haven't had much

We also definitely need to upgrade the OL, and I wouldn't be opposed to taking one high. I do think our young guys have talent they just need to mature. Im hoping we add some FAs to the OL this year. Hell for the first time in our existence we are a choice destination IMHO.

[mussop]

Originally Posted by IDEXAN

Barwin has only 3 sacks this year playing primarily from Wade Phillip's primary pass-rushing position at the weakside OLB/DE position. He did get 11.5 sacks last year, but 5 came in one game vs the Jags and the leagues worst QB, so arguable that "double-sack" total is misleading. But the thing is he had a very
underachieving 2012 season, which was his "contract year", so it's highly unlikely that the Texans bid higher for Barwin's sevices this upcoming offseason than EVERY other team in the NFL. Besides the Texans have an even higher investment in first-round pick Murciless who they expect to start and develope in the near future, and there isn't room for both to start.

After Reed got hurt Barwin switched to his position.