LZ: The offense is very much broken and Kubiak can’t rely on ‘the system’ he has to f

[DX-TEX]

Originally Posted by Corrosion

Its already been refuted .... Just put on your and wait a decade or so.


Point blank , Bob Allen gave bad information. Just the media being the media trying to make a mountian out of a molehill .... Do you really believe Pey-Me-A-Ton would leave $10m on the table ?! (thats the difference between Schaub and Manning this year roughly.)


Never waste a controversy.

What I read was from a Denver Broncose beat writer, I just cant remember who but it wasnt Allen. I trust no Houston media types.

[Corrosion]

Originally Posted by DX-TEX

What I read was from a Denver Broncose beat writer, I just cant remember who but it wasnt Allen. I trust no Houston media types.

Hearsay.


Unadmissible.


If it didnt come from the Texans brass ... or Pey-Me-A-Ton .... its worthless.

[76Texan]

Originally Posted by DX-TEX

There was talk that Peyton would have taken less from Houston. It was the only spot he REALLY wanted to go to so he could stick it to Irsay twice a year. After we rejected him he moved on and the bidding commenced. None of this will ever be confirmed until after he retires Im sure.

Originally Posted by Corrosion

Its already been refuted .... Just put on your and wait a decade or so.


Point blank , Bob Allen gave bad information. Just the media being the media trying to make a mountian out of a molehill .... Do you really believe Pey-Me-A-Ton would leave $10m on the table ?! (thats the difference between Schaub and Manning this year roughly.)


Never waste a controversy.

Originally Posted by DX-TEX

What I read was from a Denver Broncose beat writer, I just cant remember who but it wasnt Allen. I trust no Houston media types.

So Payless got rejected by the Texans even though he offered himself for cheap.
He then sign with the Broncos for beaucoup money; then he goes on and spill it all to a Broncos beat writer. You know, the Texans could have me for less. I didn't entertain a single offer. I was saving my cherry just for them, but they sent Schaub to chase me away. Next thing I know I'm in Denver with a big check in my hand. You know I don't care for it; the Texans could have had me for less.

Yeah, that sounds about right!
I know I can trust that beat writer better than Bob Allen; I don't even need to know who he is, as long as he's not affiliated with anybody from the Houston media.

[Corrosion]

Originally Posted by 76Texan

So Payless got rejected by the Texans even though he offered himself for cheap.
He then sign with the Broncos for beaucoup money; then he goes on and spill it all to a Broncos beat writer. You know, the Texans could have me for less. I didn't entertain a single offer. I was saving my cherry just for them, but they sent Schaub to chase me away. Next thing I know I'm in Denver with a big check in my hand. You know I don't care for it; the Texans could have had me for less.

Yeah, that sounds about right!
I know I can trust that beat writer better than Bob Allen; I don't even need to know who he is, as long as he's not affiliated with anybody from the Houston media.

One of these days , you'll all know the absolute truth.


I need some absolute vodka in the mean time. Man I hate Vodka and Russians about as much as Reagan did.

[TejasTom]

Originally Posted by dalemurphy

Kubiak is not the quickest to change and adapt...

Snails slowing down for speed bumps pass him.

[Textan]

Originally Posted by dalemurphy

Kubiak is not the quickest to change and adapt. He does, though. I think we are looking at a painful lesson this year and a quick exit from the playoffs. I believe Kubiak will assess the season and realize he failed to adjust after the Cushing injury and redirect the offense to an aggressive and attacking offense that used the pass to set up the run (2008, 2009 and 2010). Moving forward, he won't make that mistake again. Unfortunately, that doesn't help us this year. Fortunately, though, the team is set up for continued success and some of the pain we experienced this year will be addressed with personnel additions... We should have 11 or 12 draft picks and very little dead money eating away at our cap.

Though our head coach and QB are not elite, they are good and they are committed. Furthermore, we have a very good coaching staff and wealth of young talent, high character and committed players, an owner who wants to win, lots of draft picks, JJ Watt, Cushing, Joseph, ASmith, Quin, KJackson, DBrown, Foster, Tate, AJ, OD, Myers... We will have a good shot again next year. We are now one of the elite organizations and we are experiencing what they all experience most seasons. New England has gone how many years since they won a Superbowl?... with Tom Brady and Belichek in place. McNair's philosophy and willingness to stick with Kubiak and Smith after 2010 has paid off. We can expect to win double-digits again next year and playoff success will ultimately come down to variables like health, playoff matchups, and whether the team is peaking at the right time.

This season is not going to end well, but the team is positioned well and one disappointing finish should not be over-analyzed. Remember, the same head coach won the division and a playoff game with a 3rd string, rookie QB last season and threatened advancing to the AFC Championship game. It is not as though he has not shown the ability to win big games or get a lot out of limited talent in high pressure situations.

I appreciate your opinion, so please don't be offended by some of my counter-arguments.
Coaches and players study film. They do it excessively, hours on end. To me a coach who can't see the writing on the wall after one game, maybe two at the most, is living in a state of denial I'd hate to witness, but I guess I am while watching these games. If this is indeed the case "Kubiak" failed the team and the fans.
I'm sure you know the definition of insanity, well Kubiak's coaching this year is a perfect example.
Sure, I can see why he'd try the same scheme maybe a game or two, but this is freaking ridiculous.
To me Kubiak's ability to lead a team Captained by a 3rd string QB as far as he did last year, and this monumental collapse this year "barring some incredible heroics these coming weeks" tells me he's digressed as a coach, not learned or moved forward.
Seriously, how stubborn do you have to be?
And, I'm a conservative for the most part, but Kubiak's giving that ideology a bad name lately.
Schaub, Schaub is decent when no pressure threatens his comfort zone. I was once comfortable saying that, but seeing him under-throw, or just plain miss wide open receivers lately has me questioning even his ability to do that.
He can't scramble, improvise, or just basically run at greater than a Sloth's pace.
I see this team going nowhere anytime soon with Schaub at the helm. Again, unless some unforeseen Schaub rears his head these coming weeks, he will have been outplayed by a 3rd string QB with zilch experience.
How can you over-analyze something so horribly wrong as this teams monumental collapse?

[TheMatrix31]

lol @ people acting like we gave Schaub an extension just because of one game.

Yeah, I'm really sure they drew up that deal in the 15 minutes from the end of the game to when it was announced, bro. And I'm REALLY sure it was just because of that one game. Yeah, okay.

Jiminy Christmas.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by dalemurphy

Kubiak is not the quickest to change and adapt. He does, though. I think we are looking at a painful lesson this year and a quick exit from the playoffs. I believe Kubiak will assess the season and realize he failed to adjust after the Cushing injury and redirect the offense to an aggressive and attacking offense that used the pass to set up the run (2008, 2009 and 2010).

I think we would like to pin Kubiak into a corner where being "aggressive" is the only answer. But I don't think he looks at it as being aggressive/conservative. He puts his best plays in the game & it's up to his players to execute.

You know that every play has multiple receivers, usually there's a deep, intermediate, short/checkdown. If Matt is going to his check down, or continually checking to a run play, we look at that & call it "conservative" & blame Kubiak. When it may be a Matt Schaub "confidence" issue.

Kubiak didn't call a 4 yard dump off to Andre on 3rd & a mile.

Even the third & long draws... Kubiak straight up said that one in particular a play was called to get Casey wide open, but Schaub didn't like what he saw & checked to a run. He said he tried to get that play in 3 times, we only saw it once. The other two times, Schaub checked out.

[GuerillaBlack]

Originally Posted by TheMatrix31

lol @ people acting like we gave Schaub an extension just because of one game.

Yeah, I'm really sure they drew up that deal in the 15 minutes from the end of the game to when it was announced, bro. And I'm REALLY sure it was just because of that one game. Yeah, okay.

Jiminy Christmas.

Well obviously it wasn't written in 15 minutes. Everyone knows that. The problem is the Texans giving him the deal after one game, as if one good game was all they needed to see in order to give him the deal. His injury (and past injuries) be damned. Schaub is an elite QB after this one game. We don't need to see him string together a couple of performances first.

[Mr teX]

Originally Posted by GuerillaBlack

Well obviously it wasn't written in 15 minutes. Everyone knows that. The problem is the Texans giving him the deal after one game, as if one good game was all they needed to see in order to give him the deal. His injury (and past injuries) be damned. Schaub is an elite QB after this one game. We don't need to see him string together a couple of performances first.

Then the 1 game had zero effect...In all likelihood is that the contract was being drawn up before he even played that 1 game everyone is talking about...meaning it was going to happen regardless.

[TexanSam]

Originally Posted by GP

Yep. Immediately after the game it was tweeted by various Houston sports media yayhoos that Rick and Bob gave Matt a new deal.

I mean, talk about premature ejaculation of cash and contract terms!

Sheesh, what a frigging dumb thing to do. It's as if they did that to quash the whole Peyton Manning situation whereby Kubiak told Matt (jokingly) to go get Manning at the airport. Yeah, he has a great game in Game 1 of a 16-game season and by gawd! let's get this awesome QB locked up.

"Look! LOOK! We got us a great QB too! We're juuuuust fine here in Houston!"

Reeks of P.R. move, to me. But hell, we were so high on our own fumes that we couldn't see it for that. Look back on it now, though.

You don't really believe that they just magically worked out a $24 million contract after one game, do you?

[76Texan]

Originally Posted by GuerillaBlack

Well obviously it wasn't written in 15 minutes. Everyone knows that. The problem is the Texans giving him the deal after one game, as if one good game was all they needed to see in order to give him the deal. His injury (and past injuries) be damned. Schaub is an elite QB after this one game. We don't need to see him string together a couple of performances first.

Would it make you feel better if they had waited for two games, three games, or four games. It would have been the same anyway.

If I remember correctly, the Texans don't talk contract during the season.
Seems perfectly clear to me that they were just wrapping things up there with Schaub's agent.

[playa465]

Originally Posted by GuerillaBlack

Well obviously it wasn't written in 15 minutes. Everyone knows that. The problem is the Texans giving him the deal after one game, as if one good game was all they needed to see in order to give him the deal. His injury (and past injuries) be damned. Schaub is an elite QB after this one game. We don't need to see him string together a couple of performances first.

I think he means that the contract workings had been going on a while prior to the game. The media put that idea out there that the Texans would probably wait til after the season possibly due to the injury. I'm sure Matt was identified as part of the core group the Texans wanted to build around so they got it done. He was compensated based on what he had proven to the organization and what they think he could do in the future. The fact that it took place after the first game means what? That the Texans wanted to see him post injury? I think they took care of that by only guaranteeing 2yrs of the contact and the signing bonus. I know he's been playing like poo, but let's see how he does in his first playoffs.

[dalemurphy]

Originally Posted by Textan

I appreciate your opinion, so please don't be offended by some of my counter-arguments.
Coaches and players study film. They do it excessively, hours on end. To me a coach who can't see the writing on the wall after one game, maybe two at the most, is living in a state of denial I'd hate to witness, but I guess I am while watching these games. If this is indeed the case "Kubiak" failed the team and the fans.
I'm sure you know the definition of insanity, well Kubiak's coaching this year is a perfect example.
Sure, I can see why he'd try the same scheme maybe a game or two, but this is freaking ridiculous.
To me Kubiak's ability to lead a team Captained by a 3rd string QB as far as he did last year, and this monumental collapse this year "barring some incredible heroics these coming weeks" tells me he's digressed as a coach, not learned or moved forward.
Seriously, how stubborn do you have to be?
And, I'm a conservative for the most part, but Kubiak's giving that ideology a bad name lately.
Schaub, Schaub is decent when no pressure threatens his comfort zone. I was once comfortable saying that, but seeing him under-throw, or just plain miss wide open receivers lately has me questioning even his ability to do that.
He can't scramble, improvise, or just basically run at greater than a Sloth's pace.
I see this team going nowhere anytime soon with Schaub at the helm. Again, unless some unforeseen Schaub rears his head these coming weeks, he will have been outplayed by a 3rd string QB with zilch experience.
How can you over-analyze something so horribly wrong as this teams monumental collapse?

I would argue that the overanalysis would be that the team's struggles in December this year means that Kubiak and Schaub are overall failures. I disagree. Kubiak was very successful last year during this time of the year. You think he's regressed. I simply think a set of variables arrived that he struggled to respond to well this winter. Last year, he handled more difficult situations much better. Next year, I think it is likely this late season failure won't repeat.

[ObsiWan]

Originally Posted by GuerillaBlack

And Kubiak was pretty damn pissed after that one. Face red and was most likely cussing up a storm. I can only imagine what he was saying. Schaub set his feet and launched that. With the way he threw it, I felt that we were about to get a big reception for a TD. Instead, it was an INT.

I was wondering if I was the only one who saw that. And he was like that during the Vikings game too. He ain't happy with what he's been getting out of Schaub.

We know that Kubiak won't throw his guys under the bus in public and in the press but you have to know the post-game review between he and Schaub was ..."testy".

A lot of you have said he and Schaub are "joined at the hip"; and that is definitely true. But I'm beginning to wonder if some sort of separation surgery is on the horizon. Not this year obviously, but I will be watching the draft and free agency with great interest to see who, if anyone, gets brought in to challenge Schaub for his job in 2014. If the S.S. Schaub is sinking - meaning he continues to slump in this upcoming playoff game - I'd bet good money that Kubiak won't go down with that ship in the coming seasons.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by 76Texan

Would it make you feel better if they had waited for two games, three games, or four games. It would have been the same anyway.

I originally thought all this Schaub bashing was knee-jerk. But it continues today. Schaub's been having an excellent year, throwing for 4000 yards even though we led in most of our games.

The guy's not perfect. He's got flaws & we've talked about these flaws before. Last year, at this time, we were wishing we had a healthy Matt Schaub.

I know the "popular" opinion is to say he's not the same after his injury, but I'm not seeing it. He's the same guy he's always been & who he's always been was a guy that could get us deep into the play-offs.

He's not underthrowing guys because of his foot. After he underthrew Casey, he overthrew everyone else, including Andre, in the same game.

Some people are panicking, because they lost faith. I get that. However, I've never been a "Schaub guy" so I can say with complete honesty. If you ever thought Matt Schaub could get us to the Super Bowl..... nothing should have changed.

He underthrew Casey... he usually doesn't hit guys in stride. Big Whup. He never has, yet he usually finds a way to get his team into the red zone & they usually walk away with a TD.

He's lost some of his mojo. I don't know why. But I think these high character guys they built this team around, these professionals will find a way to get it done.

We're not going to be one & done & an AFC Championship game is the low bar.

[Mr teX]

Originally Posted by dalemurphy

I would argue that the overanalysis would be that the team's struggles in December this year means that Kubiak and Schaub are overall failures. I disagree. Kubiak was very successful last year during this time of the year. You think he's regressed. I simply think a set of variables arrived that he struggled to respond to well this winter. Last year, he handled more difficult situations much better. Next year, I think it is likely this late season failure won't repeat.

Don't count on it Dale...short of drastic changes in the way that he calls plays or talent, he doesn't seem to really adjust until it's too late. We've seen the same issues scheme wise since 2009 when the Cowboys and Giants came to town and thoroughly dominated us in much the same fashion we have been dominated in these last 4 games.

From game to game, he simply refuses to abandon the run or go away from it enough on a temporary basis when it's not working....until it's too late that is...By then, the defense knows that you need to pass to get back in the game & they either go into dime/nickel packages to make it more difficult for you to pass...or they pin their ears back & get after you. Sometimes, you have to step out of your comfort zone to break tendencies.....Kubiak does it, but he does it too late and we almost never come out on top b/c of it...This season more than any other has shown me this.

[ObsiWan]

Originally Posted by Fiddler

I think we would like to pin Kubiak into a corner where being "aggressive" is the only answer. But I don't think he looks at it as being aggressive/conservative. He puts his best plays in the game & it's up to his players to execute.

It's like we hear in all those NFL films shots on the Patriots sidelines where Belichick is yelling at his players...
DO.
YOUR.
JOB!!

Originally Posted by Fiddler

You know that every play has multiple receivers, usually there's a deep, intermediate, short/checkdown. If Matt is going to his check down, or continually checking to a run play, we look at that & call it "conservative" & blame Kubiak. When it may be a Matt Schaub "confidence" issue.

Kubiak didn't call a 4 yard dump off to Andre on 3rd & a mile.

Even the third & long draws... Kubiak straight up said that one in particular a play was called to get Casey wide open, but Schaub didn't like what he saw & checked to a run. He said he tried to get that play in 3 times, we only saw it once. The other two times, Schaub checked out.

So it's Schaub that's over conservative, more so than Kubiak. Makes one wonder, just how much leeway to change the play Schaub really DOES have but doesn't have the confidence to go all out and take the higher risk/higher reward option.

If this keeps up, a Kubiak/Schaub divorce could be in the future.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by ObsiWan

So it's Schaub that's over conservative, more so than Kubiak. Makes one wonder, just how much leeway to change the play Schaub really DOES have but doesn't have the confidence to go all out and take the higher risk/higher reward option.

If this keeps up, a Kubiak/Schaub divorce could be in the future.

I think it's a matter of Matt being able to turn it on & off at will.

I think about a guy like Jake Plummer. That guy was a gunslinger & Kubiak/Shanahan had to put chains on him to real him in. But he could turn it on naturally, because that was truly his nature.

I think Schaub is 10x smarter (cautious) than Jake. But it isn't his personality to push. Jake would throw first then think about it. Matt thinks, then throws...... looks slower & I think that's what has hurt us more than anything.

He needs to learn to trust what he sees & stop thinking so much, but being he's a 10 year vet, it probably isn't going to happen.

But there isn't going to be a divorce of any kind. Kubiak is happy with what he's got. We've won a lot of games with Schaub.. including a game against New England, a game against GreenBay..... we didn't beat them this year & people are just over reacting.

[CloakNNNdagger]

Originally Posted by Fiddler

He's not underthrowing guys because of his foot. After he underthrew Casey, he overthrew everyone else, including Andre, in the same game.

Not so fast. Anyone who has ever played or coached QBs would tell you, not having a "healthy" back foot goes to overall ACCURACY...........BOTH as pertains to the tendency to underthrow AS WELL as to overthrow, due to the variability of the pressure/stress he is able or willing to apply to that back foot.