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Old 11-23-2012   #1
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Default The House that Gary/Rex Built.

So what do you think?

In 2009, Rex Ryan inherited the 9-7 NYJets that failed to make the play-offs & turned them into a 9-7 team that backed into the play-offs. They went on a magical run that culminated with a close loss in the AFC Championship.

They followed that up with an 11-5 season & another loss in the AFC Championship game.

In 2009, Kubiak's fourth season with the Texans. Considered by some to have underachieved in the previous three seasons (6-10, 8-8, 8-8) finally managed a winning season (9-7), but no play-off appearance.

2010, the Texans field one of the worst pass defenses in the history of the league & finish the season 6-10.

===================================

2011, rumblings from inside the Jets locker room become public. They finish the season 8-8

Meanwhile the Texans finish with a franchise best 10-6 season despite missing many key players throughout the season (Foster, Schaub, & Andre played less than 50 snaps together or something like that)... They host a play-off game as winners of the AFC South, they win that game against the Bengals & lose in Baltimore due to a rookie QB, and sub-par special teams play.

2012, The Jets have got to win out just to finish 9-7. The Texans can lose the rest of the way & finish 10-6. The Texans have been favored to win almost every game this season & are generally considered the favorites to represent the AFC in the Super Bowl.

=====================================


If you were told that you could be the head coach of either of these teams, but you've got to win in 2013, winning will be defined as simply a winning season. Nothing about division champs, nothing about play-offs, all you have to do is have a winning season in 2013.....

which team would you pick? Imagine you can name your price for a wining season & you're permanently banned from any NFL activity in the future if you're 8-8 or worse.

Which HC/GM did a better job of building a team?
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Old 11-23-2012   #2
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

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Originally Posted by Fiddler View Post
which team would you pick? Imagine you can name your price for a wining season & you're permanently banned from any NFL activity in the future if you're 8-8 or worse.
That's a bit extreme isn't it?
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Old 11-23-2012   #3
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiddler View Post
So what do you think?

In 2009, Rex Ryan inherited the 9-7 NYJets that failed to make the play-offs & turned them into a 9-7 team that backed into the play-offs. They went on a magical run that culminated with a close loss in the AFC Championship.

They followed that up with an 11-5 season & another loss in the AFC Championship game.

In 2009, Kubiak's fourth season with the Texans. Considered by some to have underachieved in the previous three seasons (6-10, 8-8, 8-8) finally managed a winning season (9-7), but no play-off appearance.

2010, the Texans field one of the worst pass defenses in the history of the league & finish the season 6-10.

===================================

2011, rumblings from inside the Jets locker room become public. They finish the season 8-8

Meanwhile the Texans finish with a franchise best 10-6 season despite missing many key players throughout the season (Foster, Schaub, & Andre played less than 50 snaps together or something like that)... They host a play-off game as winners of the AFC South, they win that game against the Bengals & lose in Baltimore due to a rookie QB, and sub-par special teams play.

2012, The Jets have got to win out just to finish 9-7. The Texans can lose the rest of the way & finish 10-6. The Texans have been favored to win almost every game this season & are generally considered the favorites to represent the AFC in the Super Bowl.

=====================================


If you were told that you could be the head coach of either of these teams, but you've got to win in 2013, winning will be defined as simply a winning season. Nothing about division champs, nothing about play-offs, all you have to do is have a winning season in 2013.....

which team would you pick? Imagine you can name your price for a wining season & you're permanently banned from any NFL activity in the future if you're 8-8 or worse.

Which HC/GM did a better job of building a team?
Both of these questions are "no brainers" to me at least. The Texans are in better shape now (personnel wise) than the Jets, which only proves the 2nd question of which HC/GM did a better job of building a team. Right now, I'd say the Jets are in shambles, especially with their butt kicking loss last night to NE. Don't think ole Rex is gonna have a job there much longer. Not sure about the GM and don't know who he is, but I gotta think he's on the "hot seat" too.

The Texans are being built for the long haul, which is what McNair wants. A team, like the Steelers, who win consistently year in and year out and compete for, and win, multiple Super Bowls.
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Old 11-23-2012   #4
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

The Jets signed Tim Tebow this offseason. Is this really even debatable?
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Old 11-23-2012   #5
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Insideop View Post
Right now, I'd say the Jets are in shambles, especially with their butt kicking loss last night to NE.

The Texans are being built for the long haul...
That's pretty much what I'm getting at. In 2009, in 2010, some here was using Rex's success to highlight Gary's failure. Even then, there were those who said there's a right way & a wrong way to build a team. I'm not a Kubiak fan, though I've always wanted him to succeed, since he is from Houston & I've always been impressed with his command of the locker room.

Hindsight, we can see the Jets were built on nothing but fluff. They were a talentless team then, they are a talentless team now. They sold out for the wins, but imo they wasted the last 4 years.

The Texans could have won more games in that time period acquiring other free agents, trading draft picks, ignoring faults, playing aggresive & care free. But we'd be a different team today. Wins would be the end-all-be-all instead of character & integrity.

A coach going to the Jets have nothing to work with. Absolutely nothing but bad contracts & aging players. A coach coming to the Texans will have a young talented team & an organization behind him that knows how to win.

Now, just because Rex is a failure with the NYJ doesn't mean that the way we did it is the only way to do it. You can look at San Francisco, which appear to be the real deal, but the difference there is that Harbough took over a talented team with a solid organization (who had been accumulating talent) behind him. Detroit appears to have followed the same path as the NYJ. Except they've been doing a better job of accumulating talent. If that's the organization (which I believe it is) they'll be a force in the near future.

In fact, Detroit looks just like us, only 2 years back. They're a young team in a mature division. Greenbay appears to be their Colts. Chicago their Jags & Minnesota their Titans. Greenbay is probably going to own that division for the next couple of years, the Bears are going to challenge, & the Vikings are going to swing from really good to really bad, but the Lions are going to have to battle that every year until Rogers has a neck issue & get released from the division.
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Old 11-23-2012   #6
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

Why the "H" would I chose to play Tom Brady twice, an up-and-coming Miami team twice, and Buffalo twice when I can get 5 - 6 almost for sure wins by staying in the AFC South??
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Old 11-23-2012   #7
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
Why the "H" would I chose to play Tom Brady twice, an up-and-coming Miami team twice, and Buffalo twice when I can get 5 - 6 almost for sure wins by staying in the AFC South??
Because it's still the AFC, and everybody knows that in the AFC even average teams can go 10-1!
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Old 11-23-2012   #8
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
Why the "H" would I chose to play Tom Brady twice, an up-and-coming Miami team twice, and Buffalo twice when I can get 5 - 6 almost for sure wins by staying in the AFC South??
Yep, the main reason the Texans should dominate the AFC South for the next 3 yrs or so, is everybody else has young QB's and young teams. They are where the Texans were pre-Wade.

Fiddler, winning should be a be all end all. If you can also have integrity also that's a plus. It's why they keep score. BoB's directive was to build this team so that corporations would fill the seats, winning be damned. He did a good job.
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Old 11-23-2012   #9
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
Why the "H" would I chose to play Tom Brady twice, an up-and-coming Miami team twice, and Buffalo twice when I can get 5 - 6 almost for sure wins by staying in the AFC South??
Division games are never a gimmie .... Just look at the Jax game this year and the Dolts last season.
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Old 11-23-2012   #10
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

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Originally Posted by Hookem Horns View Post
The Jets signed Tim Tebow this offseason. Is this really even debatable?
the cowboys are americas team "cough cough" AND NOW the jets are gods team.
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Old 11-23-2012   #11
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
Why the "H" would I chose to play Tom Brady twice, an up-and-coming Miami team twice, and Buffalo twice when I can get 5 - 6 almost for sure wins by staying in the AFC South??
As much as I agree with this (as a NYJ vs. Hou debate), you have to realize you are trading a first place team with a team currently in last place. In that sense a NE-Hou debate would seem more fair.

Outside of either New England and Houston who is the best team in either division? I would say with Andrew Luck looking good, the future of the Indianapolis Colts is brighter than any of the other teams.
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Old 11-23-2012   #12
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

I wouldn't even take the Jets at any point during their "success" run.

Only got in because other teams laid down in one year, then in the next year they literally won like 6 games off of luck/BS.

No Rex Ryan Jets team has ever been as good as their media exposure indicated.
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Old 11-24-2012   #13
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

They have destroyed their roster. ManGenius built a great roster and Rex's "magic" is dwindling as his roster turnover increases.

If Rex gets fired they better clean house of the GM as well.
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Old 11-24-2012   #14
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhouston View Post
Rex, like Wade, is one of the best DC's in the league but has never been the best head coach, or really even in the discussion. They both are much better when they concentrate on defense.
But he's firey, animated, & watches field goals. What else could you want in a Head Coach?
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Old 11-24-2012   #15
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

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Originally Posted by Fiddler View Post
But he's firey, animated, & watches field goals. What else could you want in a Head Coach?
Someone who does nothing but pass deep when up 20 in the 4th quarter?

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Old 12-18-2012   #16
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

For the guys that watched the Jets@Titans last night. Even a part of it.

Did it ever get that bad for us? I know we had a 2-14 season, but did we ever look that inept against a team that bad?

My memory isn't what it should be. I remember some bad games, but I don't remember the details. Do you ever remember our team being on the losing end of a game that bad?

No offense to anyone who didn't watch that game, but if you didn't see it, its difficult to really grasp how bad both teams were & how bad the Jets had to be to lose it... give it away.
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Old 12-18-2012   #17
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

we havent been that totally inept during kubiak's tenure, though i'm sure there were a few times with capers and carr that come close. the reggie bush bowl against the 49'ers comes to mind as a game that both teams appeared to do whatever possible to keep from winning in a laughably sad game. we've had some real stinkers since then, but what team hasnt?

i've never liked rex as a head coach, though i did find him pretty amusing for a while. coaches that outlandish just dont last long because they cant maintain the locker room once things inevitably turn south. he's only lasted this long because of dumb luck and teams rolling over for them, and the talent level has severely plummeted during his tenure. part of that is he has zero feel for the other side of the ball, no offensive awareness at all which is also weakening where his focus should be - building and maintaining the defense. rex may be a decent coordinator, but he wasnt nor ever will be a good head coach.

kubiak on the other hand has shown those positive qualities. win or lose, good or bad, the players wont quit on him. with a few choice words he's able to motivate without the long term negative side effects that often come with rah rah coaches. unlike rex, kubiak has atleast some feel for the defense. obviously his choice of coaching has been flawed, but we saw what wade was able to do with essentially the defense kubiak assembled, and kubiak never lost his grip over his specialty on offense. as for the talent level, well we've improved every year outside of a blip in 2010, and are currently 12-2 talking about the world ending if we dont win the superbowl.
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Old 12-18-2012   #18
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

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Originally Posted by Scooter View Post
we havent been that totally inept during kubiak's tenure, though i'm sure there were a few times with capers and carr that come close. the reggie bush bowl against the 49'ers comes to mind as a game that both teams appeared to do whatever possible to keep from winning in a laughably sad game. we've had some real stinkers since then, but what team hasnt?

i've never liked rex as a head coach, though i did find him pretty amusing for a while. coaches that outlandish just dont last long because they cant maintain the locker room once things inevitably turn south. he's only lasted this long because of dumb luck and teams rolling over for them, and the talent level has severely plummeted during his tenure. part of that is he has zero feel for the other side of the ball, no offensive awareness at all which is also weakening where his focus should be - building and maintaining the defense. rex may be a decent coordinator, but he wasnt nor ever will be a good head coach.

kubiak on the other hand has shown those positive qualities. win or lose, good or bad, the players wont quit on him. with a few choice words he's able to motivate without the long term negative side effects that often come with rah rah coaches. unlike rex, kubiak has atleast some feel for the defense. obviously his choice of coaching has been flawed, but we saw what wade was able to do with essentially the defense kubiak assembled, and kubiak never lost his grip over his specialty on offense. as for the talent level, well we've improved every year outside of a blip in 2010, and are currently 12-2 talking about the world ending if we dont win the superbowl.
I always laughed at the Rex Ryan hoopla. He took a 9 and 7 team, 9 and 7, and everyone gushed. They backed in to the playoffs that year. As soon as he got there they started trading picks away, and this is what they ended up with.

Build through the draft, thats how its done.

Will be interesting to see if he lands on his feet at the end of the season, I know his wife will.......
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Old 12-18-2012   #19
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooter View Post
we havent been that totally inept during kubiak's tenure, though i'm sure there were a few times with capers and carr that come close. the reggie bush bowl against the 49'ers comes to mind as a game that both teams appeared to do whatever possible to keep from winning in a laughably sad game. we've had some real stinkers since then, but what team hasnt?

i've never liked rex as a head coach, though i did find him pretty amusing for a while. coaches that outlandish just dont last long because they cant maintain the locker room once things inevitably turn south. he's only lasted this long because of dumb luck and teams rolling over for them, and the talent level has severely plummeted during his tenure. part of that is he has zero feel for the other side of the ball, no offensive awareness at all which is also weakening where his focus should be - building and maintaining the defense. rex may be a decent coordinator, but he wasnt nor ever will be a good head coach.

kubiak on the other hand has shown those positive qualities. win or lose, good or bad, the players wont quit on him. with a few choice words he's able to motivate without the long term negative side effects that often come with rah rah coaches. unlike rex, kubiak has atleast some feel for the defense. obviously his choice of coaching has been flawed, but we saw what wade was able to do with essentially the defense kubiak assembled, and kubiak never lost his grip over his specialty on offense. as for the talent level, well we've improved every year outside of a blip in 2010, and are currently 12-2 talking about the world ending if we dont win the superbowl.
Yep,


isn't nearly as humiliating as

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Old 12-18-2012   #20
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Default Re: The House that Gary/Rex Built.

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Originally Posted by ChampionTexan View Post
Yep,


isn't nearly as humiliating as

LOL
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