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Old 11-12-2012   #41
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtexan02 View Post
Dobbits said outright he tried to hit Cutler up high because he was in the process of throwing and thought it would make him mess up. This proves a few things:

1. Dobbins hit Cutler as a passer, not a runner. Cutler's arm was cocked, too. Dobbins knew he was passing.

2. Dobbins purposefully hit him up high even though he could have hit him hip high instead. He even said he chose not to hit him hip high on purpose


Dobbins makes pretty clear contact with Cutler's head. Dirty or not makes no difference. I twas a pretty vicious hit, was definitely illegal, and Dobbins deserves both a penalty and a fine. I fthat had been Schaub, I'd call it dirty. Im as big of a homer as they come, but defending an obviously illegal hit after we've dealt with the same on other's boards is not something I'm going to do
Thanks for the heads up...I had only seen the replay a couple of time. Since Dobbins is basically saying he saw the QB as a passer I officially crawfish from my previous position.


Edited...Now Dobbins is saying he thought it was a running play...

I think I need the Elias Sports Bureau to figure this out for me.

Last edited by Señor Stan; 11-12-2012 at 02:10 PM.
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Old 11-12-2012   #42
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtexan02 View Post
Dobbits said outright he tried to hit Cutler up high because he was in the process of throwing and thought it would make him mess up. This proves a few things:

1. Dobbins hit Cutler as a passer, not a runner. Cutler's arm was cocked, too. Dobbins knew he was passing.

2. Dobbins purposefully hit him up high even though he could have hit him hip high instead. He even said he chose not to hit him hip high on purpose


Dobbins makes pretty clear contact with Cutler's head. Dirty or not makes no difference. I twas a pretty vicious hit, was definitely illegal, and Dobbins deserves both a penalty and a fine. I fthat had been Schaub, I'd call it dirty. Im as big of a homer as they come, but defending an obviously illegal hit after we've dealt with the same on other's boards is not something I'm going to do
That doesn't match what he said in this article - Link

Quote:
“I just felt like he was going to take off and run with the ball and I thought he was past the line.”
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Old 11-12-2012   #43
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
That doesn't match what he said in this article - Link
I actually got a giggle out of this one

Quote:
“I did not hit him in his head, and actually he ran into me,”
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Old 11-12-2012   #44
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by HOU-TEX View Post
I actually got a giggle out of this one
I did too. That was going a bit too far with the self-defense argument.
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Old 11-12-2012   #45
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by TexanSam View Post
He crossed the line as a passer, not a runner, and was defenseless. That's why it was a penalty.
Best argument yet.
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Old 11-12-2012   #46
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by HoustonFrog View Post
Come on. It was purely an illegal hit. Cutler is a dbag but it was illegal. He was still a QB...and I think also still behind the line..looking to throw. He hit him right in the head while running at him to tackle him. Under NFL rules now its easily an illegal hit.

Watch it again...it wasn't some incidental contact. I wouldn't call launching but he smacked him and left his feet.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-h...on-illegal-hit
What video are you watching cus he never left his feet. Cutler was over the line and a runner. You can't guard against stupid and Cutler had plenty of time to defend himself by sliding.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-wu6VwU6hI
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Old 11-12-2012   #47
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by infantrycak View Post
It really doesn't matter if he is considered a QB or a RB. Rule 12, Section 2, Article 7(a) defines defenseless player and states "(1) A player in the act of or just after throwing a pass." So the player's position doesn't matter. LT threw a bunch of TD passes. If he had been nailed high while passing he would have been a defenseless player.
And since Cutler was called for an "illegal forward pass," he empirically was identified as "a player in the act of or just after throwing a pass" which carries the definition of "defenseless player," who cannot be exposed to a helmet-to-helmet hit. The latter penalty was not called on the field, but technically should have been, and this will be acknowledge by a fine from the league against Dobbins.
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Old 11-12-2012   #48
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

Quote:
Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
And since Cutler was called for an "illegal forward pass," he empirically was identified as "a player in the act of or just after throwing a pass" which carries the definition of "defenseless player," who cannot be exposed to a helmet-to-helmet hit. The latter penalty was not called on the field, but technically should have been, and this will be acknowledge by a fine from the league against Dobbins.
The hit doesn't look helmet to helmet. Dobbins' head appears off to the side. The head jerk from Cutler is due to the sudden stop of the rest of his body.

You can't not hit a guy who is running at you. Should Dobbins have stepped aside and allowed Cutler to keep running?

Cutlers injury is his own stupid fault. I bet you he won't do that again.
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Old 11-12-2012   #49
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

I heard from a guy today that Dobbins said he wanted to knock him out is this true?
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Old 11-12-2012   #50
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TEXANRED View Post
The hit doesn't look helmet to helmet. Dobbins' head appears off to the side. The head jerk from Cutler is due to the sudden stop of the rest of his body.

You can't not hit a guy who is running at you. Should Dobbins have stepped aside and allowed Cutler to keep running?

Cutlers injury is his own stupid fault. I bet you he won't do that again.
Don't hit him above the shoulders...
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Old 11-12-2012   #51
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by TexanSam View Post
Don't hit him above the shoulders...
Don't run straight into the defender.
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Old 11-12-2012   #52
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TEXANRED View Post
The hit doesn't look helmet to helmet. Dobbins' head appears off to the side. The head jerk from Cutler is due to the sudden stop of the rest of his body.

You can't not hit a guy who is running at you. Should Dobbins have stepped aside and allowed Cutler to keep running?

Cutlers injury is his own stupid fault. I bet you he won't do that again.
Even if he didn't hit him helmet to helmet:

Quote:
(b)􀀃 Prohibited contact against a player who is in a defenseless posture is:

(1)􀀃 Forcibly hitting the defenseless player’s head or neck area with the helmet, facemask, forearm, or shoulder, regardless of whether the defensive player also uses his arms to tackle the defenseless
player by encircling or grasping him; and
NFL RULES
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Old 11-12-2012   #53
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
Even if he didn't hit him helmet to helmet:

NFL RULES
I hear you about the rules but I don't think these rules apply to this situation, or shouldnt anyway. Cutler was a runner and was past the line of scrimmage. Cutler ran straight at a defender and chose not to defend himself instead pulled off a boneheaded play that got him hurt. He was not a receiver going up for the catch nor was he in the pocket throwing the football. He was a runner.

If you run your car into the brick wall is it the brick wall's fault that you ran into it?
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Old 11-12-2012   #54
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TEXANRED View Post
I hear you about the rules but I don't think these rules apply to this situation, or shouldnt anyway. Cutler was a runner and was past the line of scrimmage. Cutler ran straight at a defender and chose not to defend himself instead pulled off a boneheaded play that got him hurt. He was not a receiver going up for the catch nor was he in the pocket throwing the football. He was a runner.

If you run your car into the brick wall is it the brick wall's fault that you ran into it?
LMAO Goodnight all!!
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Old 11-12-2012   #55
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by Big Lou View Post
Cutler became a RB the minute he "crossed" (Or when the Refs thought he crossed if you believe he didn't) the LOS. He therefore loses the protections of being a QB.

In all honesty the rule should probably be ammended because a QB doesn't run the ball the way a RB does. There should be some kind of defenseless QB rule when running. The QB is vunarable until he is way past the LOS.

I was screaming at the TV, although glad for the illegal forward pass, but pissed, because that was kind of having it both ways. I always wonder if the coaches yell some of the same things fans do when there are those strange calls.
Does the QB run the differently when Cam Newton runs or RGIII runs an option play? If the rule is changed to protect a defenseless QB when running rule, then a QB should not be allow to run for positive yardage. As soon as the QB reaches the LOS, the play is whistled dead for no gain. The worst abuser of the Qb running treatment was Steve Young. When a defender closed on him, he would lean his chest back and jut his knees out like he was starting to slide. If the defender backed off, he would shift to the side and run for another 6 or 10 yards. If the defender didn't back off, he did the slide for the penalty.

We did get the best of the off setting penalties because the big play was wiped out. I still say the calls were inconsistent. Unless if it is 4th and 4, and Arian Foster is about to get drilled for a 2 yard gain he could throw the ball forward and get a do over on off setting penalties.
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Old 11-12-2012   #56
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

I tried to argue it was a good hit. Old school & all, that's the way you stop a QB from wanting to run the ball.

But the truth of the matter is.... Cutler didn't have the ball when Dobbins hit him.

That throws out all "legalities" that might exist.

It doesn't matter that he was a QB, doesn't matter what side of the LOS he was on.... he didn't have the ball in his hands when he got hit.
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Old 11-12-2012   #57
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

When I first saw the play in full speed. I thought he was way over the line (replay proved he was at the line) I did think it was a bang bang play at first glance.

I don't know. When you see QBs (running) juke defenders for big yardage because the defenders held up. Everyone says what a play by the QB!! But when a defender levels them , it is "how can ye hit them?"
Guess as a defender you roll with the hits
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Old 11-12-2012   #58
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by Fiddler View Post
I tried to argue it was a good hit. Old school & all, that's the way you stop a QB from wanting to run the ball.

But the truth of the matter is.... Cutler didn't have the ball when Dobbins hit him.

That throws out all "legalities" that might exist.

It doesn't matter that he was a QB, doesn't matter what side of the LOS he was on.... he didn't have the ball in his hands when he got hit.
So if a running back who is about to only get a one yard gain pulls up and throws the ball and gets leveled, does that mean he would get the 15 yard roughing the passer penalty?
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Old 11-12-2012   #59
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by TEXANRED View Post
So if a running back who is about to only get a one yard gain pulls up and throws the ball and gets leveled, does that mean he would get the 15 yard roughing the passer penalty?
Yes, then the RB gets cut for being a punk
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Old 11-12-2012   #60
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Default Re: Hit on Cutler...

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Originally Posted by TEXANRED View Post
So if a running back who is about to only get a one yard gain pulls up and throws the ball and gets leveled, does that mean he would get the 15 yard roughing the passer penalty?
The NFL may need to clarify (although they probably will not unless someone tries to abuse the current setup) but as the rules read yes there should be offsetting penalties just as here. It doesn't matter who the passer is "in the act of throwing or immediately after" they are considered a defenseless player.
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