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Old 10-12-2012   #1
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Default 2013 with trades

ILB and Nose are our glaring needs. SS & OLB if Quin and Barwin go, would then move up. I think Quin could re-sign but unlike you guys, I think Barwin is gone. Mercilus has shown nothing but it is still early.

If I could get a later first for Tate, I'd look for Teo, but I think a second and third more likely. I am more interested in quality than quantity in this draft so I prefer trade ups.

Tate for a 1st or second and third.
Trade a 3 (Tate) &5 & 6 for a second.

1. Williams (nose) in first (ours)
2. Minter (ILB) in second (Tate)
2b Dion Jordan (OLB) second (3&5&6)
2c. Ricky Wagner (OT/OG) second (ours)
3a Marcus Davis (WR) third (ours)
3b. Micah Hyde (FS/CB) third (comp Mario)
4. Andrew Jackson (ILB)
5. Silas Redd (RB) fifth (comp) http://espn.go.com/college-football/...340/silas-redd
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Old 10-12-2012   #2
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
ILB and Nose are our glaring needs. SS & OLB if Quin and Barwin go, would then move up. I think Quin could re-sign but unlike you guys, I think Barwin is gone. Mercilus has shown nothing but it is still early.

If I could get a later first for Tate, I'd look for Teo, but I think a second and third more likely. I am more interested in quality than quantity in this draft so I prefer trade ups.

Tate for a 1st or second and third.
Trade a 3 (Tate) &5 & 6 for a second.

1. Williams (nose) in first (ours)
2. Minter (ILB) in second (Tate)
2b Dion Jordan (OLB) second (3&5&6)
2c. Ricky Wagner (OT/OG) second (ours)
3a Marcus Davis (WR) third (ours)
3b. Micah Hyde (FS/CB) third (comp Mario)
4. Andrew Jackson (ILB)
5. Silas Redd (RB) fifth (comp) http://espn.go.com/college-football/...340/silas-redd
1) I know you are a huge fan of Williams, but I just dont see anything special in the guy. Dont get me wrong, I dont think he will be a bad player or a bust, but I dont think he will really upgrade the line. Picking 32 does limit our options though. I am fine with the pick.

2) Heck yeah on Minter. Kid could be a stud.

2) I am still not sold on Jordan, but apparently I am the only one who thinks so. He is athletically gifted, but his height worries me. At 6'6" or 7" he is going to have a hard time getting around that corner with leverage.

2) Sold on Wager. Should be a solid RT for years.

3) Davis is a project. All the athleticism in the world, but he still looks raw on the field. At this point, I want a more sure fire receiver. We have projects in Posey and Jean. If we are to invest in a receiver, I want to go top notch. However, it is the 3rd round. Cant get too picky, and Davis does have the size to contribute on special teams.

3) I like Hyde. Solid depth player and STer.

4) I am firmly on the Jackson bandwagon. However, I feel that I must continue to point out that Jackson is still just a Junior, and therefore is unlikely to declare for the draft if he is not considered a 2nd-3rd round pick. Its not impossible, just unlikely. Also, 2 ILBs in one draft? Plus a OLB? That seems a bit heavy.

5) Going RB is a good idea, especially if you are trading Tate (which I am 100% on board with).

If the draft broke down this way, I would be satisfied. I think the two ILBs is overkill though. I would probably switch out Jackson (who I think stays in school) for a blocking TE or SS. Maybe backup QB.
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Old 10-13-2012   #3
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

I like the players chosen but have to agree with RM65, it's a very LB heavy draft. Pick up another WR in the 4th since Davis is a project, or some OG depth, or blocking TE. I also wouldn't mind seeing one of those 2nd round picks spent on a quality CB. Other than that I'd be happy.
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Old 10-13-2012   #4
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

I really don't feel the Texans have any glaring needs. They believe in building through the draft on which we can agree. I personally think the Texans are in a position to let the draft come to them. This would include trades since they have what others need let teams come to them from position of strength. It's become lesser each year but injury's can expose a teams weakness, virtually impossible to be bullet proof in the NFL, you just never know who's going to fall next, so as they say next man up.

I would like to see Texans add a stud WR to the mix & take some pressure off Andre Johnson. It's a good crop where Texans sit one of them is going to strike a pose on the podium 1st rd. w/Roger Goodell holding a Texan jersey.

Terrance Williams, Baylor
Aaron Dobson, Marshall
Justin Hunter, Tennessee
Keenan Allen, California
Robert Woods, Southern Cal
Cordarrelle Patterson, Tennessee
Marquess Wilson, Washington State

Best WR class in years, IMO. BL
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Old 10-13-2012   #5
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
I really don't feel the Texans have any glaring needs. They believe in building through the draft on which we can agree. I personally think the Texans are in a position to let the draft come to them. This would include trades since they have what others need let teams come to them from position of strength. It's become lesser each year but injury's can expose a teams weakness, virtually impossible to be bullet proof in the NFL, you just never know who's going to fall next, so as they say next man up.

I would like to see Texans add a stud WR to the mix & take some pressure off Andre Johnson. It's a good crop where Texans sit one of them is going to strike a pose on the podium 1st rd. w/Roger Goodell holding a Texan jersey.

Terrance Williams, Baylor
Aaron Dobson, Marshall
Justin Hunter, Tennessee
Keenan Allen, California
Robert Woods, Southern Cal
Cordarrelle Patterson, Tennessee
Marquess Wilson, Washington State

Best WR class in years, IMO. BL
You really thing it's a better class of WR than last year? Last year had great talent and depth. Hunter, Allen, and Woods will most likely be gone by the time we pick and I think Patterson stays in school. I'm not familiar with Dobson so if we take one in the 1st round we've got a good shot at Williams or Wilson. I also like Quinton Patton in the 2nd or 3rd and BB likes Marcus Davis so there's options.
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Old 10-13-2012   #6
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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Originally Posted by Wolf6151 View Post
You really thing it's a better class of WR than last year? Last year had great talent and depth. Hunter, Allen, and Woods will most likely be gone by the time we pick and I think Patterson stays in school. I'm not familiar with Dobson so if we take one in the 1st round we've got a good shot at Williams or Wilson. I also like Quinton Patton in the 2nd or 3rd and BB likes Marcus Davis so there's options.
last years class was heavily weighted by Blackmon & Floyd both out of Texan range so removing them our list (mocking for Texans) left only Wright as a legitimate option. On top of that guys like Hill who possessed the size & speed Texans like was raw needing a lot of polishing. The other big WR's Alshon Jeffery, Ruben Randall & Sanu Mohamed lacked first round speed. So as a group for first round consideration pick #26 once Wright was taken (#20) WR just wasn't as attractive as it will be this coming April.

San Francisco tried to force need taking WR, AJ Jenkins 30th overall who in my opinion is not as good as any of those WR's who will be available I mentioned above this year. Stephen Hill has flashed, but still struggles in route tree & is injury prone. Texans took a pair of 4th rd. grade WR's in last years draft Martin & Posey who are nice picks but need development.

This year they can add a true #1 WR prospect ready to contribute sooner than later & hopefully extend Andre Johnson's career. Even if the top guys are gone by the 30th-32nd pick a guy like Marquess Wilson would start day one. Very competitive go to guy who plays more physical than his weight suggests (strong) with excellent length 6'3 & long arms who has timing to get his large paws on the ball @ the apex of the throw, then the frame of mind to run after the catch. Plays smart, finds seams, polished technique can run entire route tree & these are my words not some internet site, so take it for what its worth. I've also seen him seal the edge & block his assignments so while not one of the marquee names out there he would be a solid addition to Texan roster, then hopefully rest of younger guys come around in support making this positional need a thing of the past even when Andre retires.
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Old 10-13-2012   #7
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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Originally Posted by rmartin65 View Post
1) I know you are a huge fan of Williams, but I just dont see anything special in the guy. Dont get me wrong, I dont think he will be a bad player or a bust, but I dont think he will really upgrade the line. Picking 32 does limit our options though. I am fine with the pick.

2) Heck yeah on Minter. Kid could be a stud.

2) I am still not sold on Jordan, but apparently I am the only one who thinks so. He is athletically gifted, but his height worries me. At 6'6" or 7" he is going to have a hard time getting around that corner with leverage.

2) Sold on Wager. Should be a solid RT for years.

3) Davis is a project. All the athleticism in the world, but he still looks raw on the field. At this point, I want a more sure fire receiver. We have projects in Posey and Jean. If we are to invest in a receiver, I want to go top notch. However, it is the 3rd round. Cant get too picky, and Davis does have the size to contribute on special teams.

3) I like Hyde. Solid depth player and STer.

4) I am firmly on the Jackson bandwagon. However, I feel that I must continue to point out that Jackson is still just a Junior, and therefore is unlikely to declare for the draft if he is not considered a 2nd-3rd round pick. Its not impossible, just unlikely. Also, 2 ILBs in one draft? Plus a OLB? That seems a bit heavy.

5) Going RB is a good idea, especially if you are trading Tate (which I am 100% on board with).

If the draft broke down this way, I would be satisfied. I think the two ILBs is overkill though. I would probably switch out Jackson (who I think stays in school) for a blocking TE or SS. Maybe backup QB.
Thanks for input.

If draft goes as I think, Williams last of the best available. I see him and Sylvester W. top 10-12 in second round so Texans could trade down & get a Nose & another pick. In my projection, Cody will not be on roster and both Williams should be better than Mitchell. J.W. also plays O'line occasionally in Red Zone as he did today against Missouri (TD!)

Linebackers: If we lose Barwin (gain Jordan) cut Sharpton (gain Jackson) do not re-sign Bradie James (gain Minter) that is perfect! Cushing back calling plays and Minter should be no worse than James starting.

WR: Again if you want a more sure fire receiver you must go to second round minimum & remember where we are picking if no trade ups.
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Old 10-13-2012   #8
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

Quote:
Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
I really don't feel the Texans have any glaring needs. They believe in building through the draft on which we can agree. I personally think the Texans are in a position to let the draft come to them. This would include trades since they have what others need let teams come to them from position of strength. It's become lesser each year but injury's can expose a teams weakness, virtually impossible to be bullet proof in the NFL, you just never know who's going to fall next, so as they say next man up.

I would like to see Texans add a stud WR to the mix & take some pressure off Andre Johnson. It's a good crop where Texans sit one of them is going to strike a pose on the podium 1st rd. w/Roger Goodell holding a Texan jersey.

Terrance Williams, Baylor
Aaron Dobson, Marshall
Justin Hunter, Tennessee
Keenan Allen, California
Robert Woods, Southern Cal
Cordarrelle Patterson, Tennessee
Marquess Wilson, Washington State

Best WR class in years, IMO. BL
Hunter & Woods gone in first. Williams's stats compare to Marcus Davis. You'd have to give a first probably for Williams & Patterson. I like Wilson but like Davis upside better and not interested in Dobson. Allen gets total yardage but minimal avg. I'm not interested in him and have not watched.

So imo you use your first on Terrance Williams or your second on Patterson & I will not do that as of now.

If you compare 2012 to this years WRs at this time of year (not knowing how draft went) I take 2012 as better group.
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Old 10-13-2012   #9
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

Quote:
Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
last years class was heavily weighted by Blackmon & Floyd both out of Texan range so removing them our list (mocking for Texans) left only Wright as a legitimate option. On top of that guys like Hill who possessed the size & speed Texans like was raw needing a lot of polishing. The other big WR's Alshon Jeffery, Ruben Randall & Sanu Mohamed lacked first round speed. So as a group for first round consideration pick #26 once Wright was taken (#20) WR just wasn't as attractive as it will be this coming April.

San Francisco tried to force need taking WR, AJ Jenkins 30th overall who in my opinion is not as good as any of those WR's who will be available I mentioned above this year. Stephen Hill has flashed, but still struggles in route tree & is injury prone. Texans took a pair of 4th rd. grade WR's in last years draft Martin & Posey who are nice picks but need development.

This year they can add a true #1 WR prospect ready to contribute sooner than later & hopefully extend Andre Johnson's career. Even if the top guys are gone by the 30th-32nd pick a guy like Marquess Wilson would start day one. Very competitive go to guy who plays more physical than his weight suggests (strong) with excellent length 6'3 & long arms who has timing to get his large paws on the ball @ the apex of the throw, then the frame of mind to run after the catch. Plays smart, finds seams, polished technique can run entire route tree & these are my words not some internet site, so take it for what its worth. I've also seen him seal the edge & block his assignments so while not one of the marquee names out there he would be a solid addition to Texan roster, then hopefully rest of younger guys come around in support making this positional need a thing of the past even when Andre retires.
As stated I like Marquess but no way he beats out WR2 Walter. Our WRs and TEs take a beating as Martin is finding out. WIlson would have to beat out Martin & I would not spend a second let alone the first you indicate. You don't really have him rated that high?
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Old 10-13-2012   #10
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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Originally Posted by badboy View Post
Thanks for input.

If draft goes as I think, Williams last of the best available. I see him and Sylvester W. top 10-12 in second round so Texans could trade down & get a Nose & another pick. In my projection, Cody will not be on roster and both Williams should be better than Mitchell. J.W. also plays O'line occasionally in Red Zone as he did today against Missouri (TD!)

Linebackers: If we lose Barwin (gain Jordan) cut Sharpton (gain Jackson) do not re-sign Bradie James (gain Minter) that is perfect! Cushing back calling plays and Minter should be no worse than James starting.

WR: Again if you want a more sure fire receiver you must go to second round minimum & remember where we are picking if no trade ups.
The problem with Williams is that he does not fit the current D. I have written numerous posts on how Wade does not prefer big NTs or small NTs. He works with what he has. And I stand by that. I think that at this point, with the D clicking the way that it is, he will try to find a player similar to the players he has, just better. Thus, the big nasty run stuffers (like Williams) will not be high on his list. Just a gut feeling. Now, a guy you might be interested in is Missouri Southern State's Brandon Williams. I am still trying to find more tape on the guy, but in the limited viewings I have had he is the spitting image of BJ Raji. At this point I have him tentatively ranked where the Texans can grab him in the 4th, and indeed, in my MIP (mock in progress), we do grab him.

While I understand the rationale behind the plethora of LBs taken, I dont think the situation breaks down the way you have it. Barwin is rapidly lowering his value- I think he re-signs. He is important to the D in his versatility, he can do things that Reed/Braman/Mercilus/Jordan can not do. As for the two ILBs, maybe. You stated your case well.

I support picking a WR in the first or second. Da'Rick Rodgers is tearing it up against admittedly worse competition. He is in the mix in that late 1st/early 2nd range.
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Old 10-13-2012   #11
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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The problem with Williams is that he does not fit the current D. I have written numerous posts on how Wade does not prefer big NTs or small NTs. He works with what he has. And I stand by that. I think that at this point, with the D clicking the way that it is, he will try to find a player similar to the players he has, just better. Thus, the big nasty run stuffers (like Williams) will not be high on his list. Just a gut feeling. Now, a guy you might be interested in is Missouri Southern State's Brandon Williams. I am still trying to find more tape on the guy, but in the limited viewings I have had he is the spitting image of BJ Raji. At this point I have him tentatively ranked where the Texans can grab him in the 4th, and indeed, in my MIP (mock in progress), we do grab him.
PRETTY SOLID TAKE, BRO. Still looking for a Wade Phillips nose, although we thought Martin fit that bill last year & Texans passed.

Quote:
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While I understand the rationale behind the plethora of LBs taken, I dont think the situation breaks down the way you have it. Barwin is rapidly lowering his value- I think he re-signs. He is important to the D in his versatility, he can do things that Reed/Braman/Mercilus/Jordan can not do. As for the two ILBs, maybe. You stated your case well.
ONCE AGAIN YOU NAILED IT. Barwin is a foundation piece for Wade Phillips, 3-4 strong side OLB. His production will come as QB's run away from SWATT.

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I support picking a WR in the first or second. Da'Rick Rodgers is tearing it up against admittedly worse competition. He is in the mix in that late 1st/early 2nd range.
Folks this usually goes on behind close doors but notice how agreement is reached by consensus. I did not include DaRick Rodgers because of off field issues, however he is a talent not to be denied. Question would Texans take chance on a guy with his track record? maybe 2nd then I'm on board he needs a little humility to bring his work ethic in line with this teams doctrine.

Excellent work as usual 65
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Old 10-13-2012   #12
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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As stated I like Marquess but no way he beats out WR2 Walter. Our WRs and TEs take a beating as Martin is finding out. WIlson would have to beat out Martin & I would not spend a second let alone the first you indicate. You don't really have him rated that high?
On Texans board, yes because he fits what they do. He would be very productive is already polished, has set every school record for WSU & is just a stand up team player, sound about right?
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Old 10-13-2012   #13
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

Banks is a stud CB for Mississippi State. Looks top 10 material. So great match-up w/Tennesse WR's.
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Old 10-14-2012   #14
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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Hunter & Woods gone in first. Williams's stats compare to Marcus Davis. You'd have to give a first probably for Williams & Patterson. I like Wilson but like Davis upside better and not interested in Dobson. Allen gets total yardage but minimal avg. I'm not interested in him and have not watched.

So imo you use your first on Terrance Williams or your second on Patterson & I will not do that as of now.

If you compare 2012 to this years WRs at this time of year (not knowing how draft went) I take 2012 as better group.
A couple other WR's you guys might want to look at are Cobi Hamilton and Quinton Patton. I also noticed that Conner Vernon from Duke has been slowly moving up the prospect charts as well.
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Old 10-14-2012   #15
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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PRETTY SOLID TAKE, BRO. Still looking for a Wade Phillips nose, although we thought Martin fit that bill last year & Texans passed.


ONCE AGAIN YOU NAILED IT. Barwin is a foundation piece for Wade Phillips, 3-4 strong side OLB. His production will come as QB's run away from SWATT.


Folks this usually goes on behind close doors but notice how agreement is reached by consensus. I did not include DaRick Rodgers because of off field issues, however he is a talent not to be denied. Question would Texans take chance on a guy with his track record? maybe 2nd then I'm on board he needs a little humility to bring his work ethic in line with this teams doctrine.

Excellent work as usual 65
Thanks! Rodgers is being dominant in the FCS. ~107 yards per game, 16.4 yards per reception... He is about 40% of his team's pass offense, and 1/3 of their receiving TDs.

I expect Rodgers to be met with by every team in the draft season. His talent is extraordinary, every team is going to meet with the guy to see if he has the goods upstairs.

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Banks is a stud CB for Mississippi State. Looks top 10 material. So great match-up w/Tennesse WR's.
Looks like Banks and Broomfield (who is really good in his own right) won that round. I did not watch the game though, so I cant say for sure.

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A couple other WR's you guys might want to look at are Cobi Hamilton and Quinton Patton. I also noticed that Conner Vernon from Duke has been slowly moving up the prospect charts as well.
I really like Patton, but he is also fairly raw. I still dont have a good read on Hamilton. He shows talent one week, then fades back a bit. I will have to take other people's opinions on him.

As for Vernon, I like him a lot. He caught my eye when I was watching Duke to scout their QB, and now I think he is a better prospect than Renfree. That said, I have my doubts that he can be a true number 1 receiver. He has sticky hands and knows how to get open (look at his catching streak, its ridiculous), but he lacks that extra gear to make him a threat to take the ball to the house on every play.
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Old 10-16-2012   #16
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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The problem with Williams is that he does not fit the current D. I have written numerous posts on how Wade does not prefer big NTs or small NTs. He works with what he has. And I stand by that. I think that at this point, with the D clicking the way that it is, he will try to find a player similar to the players he has, just better. Thus, the big nasty run stuffers (like Williams) will not be high on his list. Just a gut feeling. Now, a guy you might be interested in is Missouri Southern State's Brandon Williams. I am still trying to find more tape on the guy, but in the limited viewings I have had he is the spitting image of BJ Raji. At this point I have him tentatively ranked where the Texans can grab him in the 4th, and indeed, in my MIP (mock in progress), we do grab him.

While I understand the rationale behind the plethora of LBs taken, I dont think the situation breaks down the way you have it. Barwin is rapidly lowering his value- I think he re-signs. He is important to the D in his versatility, he can do things that Reed/Braman/Mercilus/Jordan can not do. As for the two ILBs, maybe. You stated your case well.

I support picking a WR in the first or second. Da'Rick Rodgers is tearing it up against admittedly worse competition. He is in the mix in that late 1st/early 2nd range.
Ok 65 now you are just messing with me, lol. Brandon Williams is 325 & Raji 337 & my guy Jesse Williams is 320. You say Phillips will not draft my big nasty but will draft your bigger nasty?

Here is my POV if Cody is gone, we have to have a starter. I don't see one better than Mitchell after Jesse or Sylvester Williams. BL has a guy as you know but I need convincing. Now it is possible we can trade down from 30s to top 12 and still get one of the Williams + a draft pick. Done deal for me. I could see going for a late developing Nose if we had Teo in first round but don't see him falling.
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Old 10-16-2012   #17
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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A couple other WR's you guys might want to look at are Cobi Hamilton and Quinton Patton. I also noticed that Conner Vernon from Duke has been slowly moving up the prospect charts as well.
Not interested in Hamilton. Watched him a lot but gut tells me no.
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Old 10-16-2012   #18
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I watched Patton for the 1st time against A&M and he was very impressive.

Can y'all give me your opinions of him?
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Old 10-16-2012   #19
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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Ok 65 now you are just messing with me, lol. Brandon Williams is 325 & Raji 337 & my guy Jesse Williams is 320. You say Phillips will not draft my big nasty but will draft your bigger nasty?
I see how it looks that way, but here is my rationale- it is about explosion. Jesse Williams does didly squat behind the LOS. Yeah he holds down the fort, but that it. Brandon Williams, on the other land, lives in the backfield. 4.5 sacks and 9.5 TFLs already this season.
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Old 10-16-2012   #20
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Default Re: 2013 with trades

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I watched Patton for the 1st time against A&M and he was very impressive.

Can y'all give me your opinions of him?
I like what I see in Quinton Patton which is a guy with good size at 6'02" and 195 lbs. who catches with his hands, has very good foot work and speed (I think it's better than the 4.58 that's listed on him), athleticism/body control, not afraid to go over the middle, good routes, good cuts, and good yards after the catch. He's currently listed by CBS/NFLDraftscout as a 3rd round pick and by Walterfootball as a 5-6 round pick. He's having a good productive year so far and I think he'll move up the prospect charts considerably after the season and before the draft. If he's there in the 3rd round I'd take him and be happy but it wouldn't surprise me to someone take him in the 2nd round.
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