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Old 05-01-2012   #21
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

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Originally Posted by rmartin65 View Post
Yaky called Mondek, the 6th rounder. I believe a couple guys were on the Brooks train, but the name coming to my mind the quickest is steelb.
That was GuerillaBlack who who called Brooks - my bad. Here's a link to his Mock


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Originally Posted by sbalderrama View Post
you'd think these guys would do a modicum of homework and at least vaguely understand a teams cap and free agent issues before commenting on why they draft like they did.
What for ? Its easier to just blow smoke.

The average fan doesnt know any better .... but we catch damn near every detail here on TT.
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Old 05-01-2012   #22
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

How do you Grade a draft? Does each pick count the Same, or should first rounders count more?

Personally I Love the Mercilus pick, am underwhelmed but intrigued by the WRs and love all of the other picks... All of this just based on potential and stuff you see and read on the internet.

But there is one thing I know for sure: I can't wait to see these guys on the field...
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Old 05-01-2012   #23
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

Thanks for the replies guys. Like I'd mentioned, I was probably wrong, and steelb is pretty damn close quite often on the draft. Hell, all of you guys are. Carolina could sure use you folks!
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Old 05-01-2012   #24
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

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Originally Posted by LikeMike View Post
How do you Grade a draft? Does each pick count the Same, or should first rounders count more?

Personally I Love the Mercilus pick, am underwhelmed but intrigued by the WRs and love all of the other picks... All of this just based on potential and stuff you see and read on the internet.

But there is one thing I know for sure: I can't wait to see these guys on the field...
For me , Im more excited by the WR picks than I am Mercilus .... then again , I had the opportunity to watch one of Posey's workouts and I came away thoroughly impressed. The guy throwing to him was instructed to throw everything .... off target at one point in the workout , nothing hit the ground (Posey was covered during this part of the drill).
He has all the skills (and size) to be a top flight NFL WR .... what it boils down to is whats between his ears.


Mercilus has his flaws .... He's not MW physically but .... his production has to be accounted for. 16 sacks and 9 forced fumbles .... thats serious business in pop warner much less NCAA D1. I didnt expect him to make it past the 18th pick FWIW.
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Old 05-01-2012   #25
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

Here are my grades for the reports they wrote:

Houston Chronicle (John McClain): B
Analysis: “GM Rick Smith took a chance by trading out of the second round before getting [DeVier] Posey, suspended for 10 games last season, and [Brandon] Brooks, who wasn’t invited to the combine. [Ben] Jones was ranked second at center. [Jared] Crick was an excellent pick. [Randy] Bullock is first kicker drafted in team history.”

I give this report a B. For "Bland". [Maybe] they could find a better journalist.

ESPN.com (Mel Kiper): B
Analysis: “I had Whitney Mercilus as a good fit at defensive end as high as No. 19 with the Bears, so he’s a pretty good value at No. 26. He isn’t Mario Williams, but the defense made a huge leap in 2011, and the Texans clearly want to make sure Wade Phillips has the tools he needs. He’s not a great value at No. 68 overall, but I’m intrigued by the DeVier Posey pick. He had to sit out so many games last year I don’t think scouts saw enough of him. He has really good hands, can create some matchup problems, and might be a little underrated in his ability to stretch the field. I also really like Keshawn Martin. He creates space and should stick with this team. Ben Jones and Brandon Brooks help the interior of that offensive line. I was surprised the Texans didn’t get a linebacker. At one time I saw Jared Crick as a second-rounder. If he regains form, that’s a good value in the fourth.”

He's not Mario Williams? Is that analysis? I give this report a C+ and pose the question of questions....With all variables included, just as they will be; who gets more sacks in the upcoming season? Mario Williams....or Whitney Mercilus? I'm going Mercilus because I think he's in a better situation, with better coaching. What, like it's so hard to believe? He did it last year...16 to 5.5 I believe.

NFL.com (Michael Lombardi): B
Analysis: “I always believe when you can strengthen a strength – and I think that’s the 49ers’ greatest testimony when they drafted Aldon Smith last year; it was a part of a strength – this year the Houston Texans can come off the edge. Whitney Mercilus can do that. I think that was outstanding. Brandon Brooks gives them another inside, strong player. I gave them a B. I like it.”

You liken them to a top team, agree with their strategy, the player and say you like it. And then you give it a B. Well I don't have a grade but I will say this review is soft on logic.

Sporting News (Vinnie Iyer): B
Analysis: “Key picks: OLB/DE Whitney Mercilus, WR DeVier Posey, DT Jared Crick. Following up the J.J. Watt-Brooks Reed combination, Wade Phillips should feel very good how his elite 3-4 just reloaded, again.”

Again, speak highly of them and then throw down a B. B-


FOXSports.com (John Czarnecki): B-
Analysis: “Houston has consistently selected defensive players in the first round, and didn’t disappoint its fans with Illinois pass rusher Whitney Mercilus, who had 16 sacks last season. Some teams pegged Mercilus as a one-year wonder, but he suits what defensive coordinator Wade Phillips loves to do. … Nebraska defensive tackle Jared Crick was another gem with the 126th overall pick. … Apparently, the Texans want to cut Jacoby Jones loose based on taking two more receivers in Ohio State’s DeVier Posey and Michigan State’s Keshawn Martin, who’s not afraid to go over the middle. Martin has 4.46 speed and figures to be a plus in the return game as well.”

I mean what's an A? Everything he says is positive...except the negative sign. B- for you too sucka.


SportsIllustrated.com: C+
Analysis: “There was the good — Whitney Mercilus gives Houston another excellent pass-rusher after Mario Williams’ departure — and the very good — G Brandon Brooks (76) and DE/DT Jared Crick (126) could both be huge for the Texans. There was also a complete meltdown at wide receiver with red flag-heavy DeVier Posey (68) and inconsistent Keshawn Martin (121).”

Complete meltdown is a bit strong, eh? Really....Posey is a 3rd round pick, with a good deal of potential even....he's not even the highlight pick!!! Goodness...F. And a U.


Yahoo! (Jason Cole): C
Analysis: “There’s nothing wrong with the [Whitney] Mercilus pick, but I keep coming back to the idea that if the Texans needed a pass rusher, why didn’t they just spend the money and keep Mario Williams? That would have freed the team to use its first-round pick on another need or do something more creative. Williams was expensive, but there are times in the building of a team that you spend big to get big results. The Texans are finally at the point of making a big run and they made a move that screamed of remaining middle of the pack. [DeVier] Posey is an intriguing athlete with return ability and [Brandon] Brooks and [Ben] Jones could be starters in fairly short order if the team wants to push them.”

It really wouldn't have even taken much time to find the answer to his question. Big results? When did Mario Williams ever come up big? Signing up the best RB on the planet and the best Zone blocking OC in the league, letting the dead weight go and reloading with cheap talent screamed discipline and sound decision making. F. Three F's in a row FFF. See me after class.

CBS Sports (Rob Rang): dC
Analysis: “With a talentsed group of linebackers already in the fold, it was a surprise to some that the Texans elected to add another pass rusher in Illinois’ Whitney Mercilus in the first round but considering his production and upside, he may have been simply too good to ignore at No. 26. Some veteran talent evaluators thought he was limited to remaining as a 4-3 defensive end. Frankly, this wasn’t Houston’s only head-scratcher. There were better receivers still on the board for the Texans when they instead selected Devier Posey and Keshawn Martin in the second and fourth rounds, respectively. On the other hand, the Texans may wind up with steals in guard Brandon Brooks in the third and versatile, high-effort defensive lineman Jared Crick in the fourth.”

Whether I agree with him or not, he justifies a respectable opinion with sound reasoning. A+ Mr. Rang. Now here's to hoping you're wrong!!!
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Old 05-01-2012   #26
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

TimeKiller .... I give you a flying ****ing A.



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Old 05-01-2012   #27
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

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Originally Posted by TimeKiller View Post
Here are my grades for the reports they wrote:
Awesome!!! Repped.
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Old 05-01-2012   #28
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimeKiller View Post
Here are my grades for the reports they wrote:

Houston Chronicle (John McClain): B
Analysis: “GM Rick Smith took a chance by trading out of the second round before getting [DeVier] Posey, suspended for 10 games last season, and [Brandon] Brooks, who wasn’t invited to the combine. [Ben] Jones was ranked second at center. [Jared] Crick was an excellent pick. [Randy] Bullock is first kicker drafted in team history.”

I give this report a B. For "Bland". [Maybe] they could find a better journalist.

ESPN.com (Mel Kiper): B
Analysis: “I had Whitney Mercilus as a good fit at defensive end as high as No. 19 with the Bears, so he’s a pretty good value at No. 26. He isn’t Mario Williams, but the defense made a huge leap in 2011, and the Texans clearly want to make sure Wade Phillips has the tools he needs. He’s not a great value at No. 68 overall, but I’m intrigued by the DeVier Posey pick. He had to sit out so many games last year I don’t think scouts saw enough of him. He has really good hands, can create some matchup problems, and might be a little underrated in his ability to stretch the field. I also really like Keshawn Martin. He creates space and should stick with this team. Ben Jones and Brandon Brooks help the interior of that offensive line. I was surprised the Texans didn’t get a linebacker. At one time I saw Jared Crick as a second-rounder. If he regains form, that’s a good value in the fourth.”

He's not Mario Williams? Is that analysis? I give this report a C+ and pose the question of questions....With all variables included, just as they will be; who gets more sacks in the upcoming season? Mario Williams....or Whitney Mercilus? I'm going Mercilus because I think he's in a better situation, with better coaching. What, like it's so hard to believe? He did it last year...16 to 5.5 I believe.

NFL.com (Michael Lombardi): B
Analysis: “I always believe when you can strengthen a strength – and I think that’s the 49ers’ greatest testimony when they drafted Aldon Smith last year; it was a part of a strength – this year the Houston Texans can come off the edge. Whitney Mercilus can do that. I think that was outstanding. Brandon Brooks gives them another inside, strong player. I gave them a B. I like it.”

You liken them to a top team, agree with their strategy, the player and say you like it. And then you give it a B. Well I don't have a grade but I will say this review is soft on logic.

Sporting News (Vinnie Iyer): B
Analysis: “Key picks: OLB/DE Whitney Mercilus, WR DeVier Posey, DT Jared Crick. Following up the J.J. Watt-Brooks Reed combination, Wade Phillips should feel very good how his elite 3-4 just reloaded, again.”

Again, speak highly of them and then throw down a B. B-


FOXSports.com (John Czarnecki): B-
Analysis: “Houston has consistently selected defensive players in the first round, and didn’t disappoint its fans with Illinois pass rusher Whitney Mercilus, who had 16 sacks last season. Some teams pegged Mercilus as a one-year wonder, but he suits what defensive coordinator Wade Phillips loves to do. … Nebraska defensive tackle Jared Crick was another gem with the 126th overall pick. … Apparently, the Texans want to cut Jacoby Jones loose based on taking two more receivers in Ohio State’s DeVier Posey and Michigan State’s Keshawn Martin, who’s not afraid to go over the middle. Martin has 4.46 speed and figures to be a plus in the return game as well.”

I mean what's an A? Everything he says is positive...except the negative sign. B- for you too sucka.


SportsIllustrated.com: C+
Analysis: “There was the good — Whitney Mercilus gives Houston another excellent pass-rusher after Mario Williams’ departure — and the very good — G Brandon Brooks (76) and DE/DT Jared Crick (126) could both be huge for the Texans. There was also a complete meltdown at wide receiver with red flag-heavy DeVier Posey (68) and inconsistent Keshawn Martin (121).”

Complete meltdown is a bit strong, eh? Really....Posey is a 3rd round pick, with a good deal of potential even....he's not even the highlight pick!!! Goodness...F. And a U.


Yahoo! (Jason Cole): C
Analysis: “There’s nothing wrong with the [Whitney] Mercilus pick, but I keep coming back to the idea that if the Texans needed a pass rusher, why didn’t they just spend the money and keep Mario Williams? That would have freed the team to use its first-round pick on another need or do something more creative. Williams was expensive, but there are times in the building of a team that you spend big to get big results. The Texans are finally at the point of making a big run and they made a move that screamed of remaining middle of the pack. [DeVier] Posey is an intriguing athlete with return ability and [Brandon] Brooks and [Ben] Jones could be starters in fairly short order if the team wants to push them.”

It really wouldn't have even taken much time to find the answer to his question. Big results? When did Mario Williams ever come up big? Signing up the best RB on the planet and the best Zone blocking OC in the league, letting the dead weight go and reloading with cheap talent screamed discipline and sound decision making. F. Three F's in a row FFF. See me after class.

CBS Sports (Rob Rang): dC
Analysis: “With a talentsed group of linebackers already in the fold, it was a surprise to some that the Texans elected to add another pass rusher in Illinois’ Whitney Mercilus in the first round but considering his production and upside, he may have been simply too good to ignore at No. 26. Some veteran talent evaluators thought he was limited to remaining as a 4-3 defensive end. Frankly, this wasn’t Houston’s only head-scratcher. There were better receivers still on the board for the Texans when they instead selected Devier Posey and Keshawn Martin in the second and fourth rounds, respectively. On the other hand, the Texans may wind up with steals in guard Brandon Brooks in the third and versatile, high-effort defensive lineman Jared Crick in the fourth.”

Whether I agree with him or not, he justifies a respectable opinion with sound reasoning. A+ Mr. Rang. Now here's to hoping you're wrong!!!
Great analysis of the analysis.

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Old 05-01-2012   #29
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

I choose to "grade" this draft class, this time next year, or sometime during the season based on actual contributions. Right now, not one of these guys from this draft class has done a damn thang!!

There have been guys, in the past that I've either liked or not liked.... and sadly been proven wrong in both regards.
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Old 05-01-2012   #30
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

These "draft gurus" are biased and will base their grades according to THEIR boards and how THEY graded the players. They often fail to look at the bigger picture or beyond their own evaluations.
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Old 05-01-2012   #31
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

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Great analysis of the analysis.

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I had a good laugh!
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Old 05-01-2012   #32
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

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These "draft gurus" are biased and will base their grades according to THEIR boards and how THEY graded the players. They often fail to look at the bigger picture or beyond their own evaluations.
BINGO!!! That's why I think the talking heads are full of ****e...

I think it's the average fan, that feels good about some picks but not sure about others, solely based on their familiarity with said player. Simply put, it's because Lombardi or Mayock or any other draftnick geek (whether our in-house TexansTalk draft gurus) happens to say or grade draft picks, means little to me because at the end of the day, "it's all a crap shoot"... (that said Mayock is pretty good - but still has missed).

Again, I'll grade this draft class between sometime during next season and now, 2013
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Old 05-01-2012   #33
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

My draft grades rule, all the rest drool.

"My Texans 2012 draft grades + yours"

HA! I like the Southern Comfort grade the best myself.

Draft grades are dumb. Players haven't been on the field yet, and few national writers have a good feel for how specific players fit specific teams. Just too many teams to be good at doing that.

Much less injuries, opportunities. So many fluke injuries that could take what would otherwise a good pick and make it not so good. Or if a starter gets injured in front of a guy or not. Those things are not predictable.
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Old 05-01-2012   #34
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

Quote:
Originally Posted by TimeKiller View Post
Here are my grades for the reports they wrote:

CBS Sports (Rob Rang): dC
Analysis: “With a talentsed group of linebackers already in the fold, it was a surprise to some that the Texans elected to add another pass rusher in Illinois’ Whitney Mercilus in the first round but considering his production and upside, he may have been simply too good to ignore at No. 26. Some veteran talent evaluators thought he was limited to remaining as a 4-3 defensive end. Frankly, this wasn’t Houston’s only head-scratcher. There were better receivers still on the board for the Texans when they instead selected Devier Posey and Keshawn Martin in the second and fourth rounds, respectively. On the other hand, the Texans may wind up with steals in guard Brandon Brooks in the third and versatile, high-effort defensive lineman Jared Crick in the fourth.”

Whether I agree with him or not, he justifies a respectable opinion with sound reasoning. A+ Mr. Rang. Now here's to hoping you're wrong!!!
Ummmmm. Mr Rang. Excuse me. Devier Posey was selected in the third round. Did you not get the memo? Uh. No. You may not have your credibility back. thank you.
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Old 05-01-2012   #35
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texans_Chick View Post
My draft grades rule, all the rest drool.

"My Texans 2012 draft grades + yours"

HA! I like the Southern Comfort grade the best myself.

Draft grades are dumb. Players haven't been on the field yet, and few national writers have a good feel for how specific players fit specific teams. Just too many teams to be good at doing that.

Much less injuries, opportunities. So many fluke injuries that could take what would otherwise a good pick and make it not so good. Or if a starter gets injured in front of a guy or not. Those things are not predictable.
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Old 05-01-2012   #36
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

I don't care for draft grades. It just shows how dumb writers/experts are (Jason Cole/SI/Rob Rang)

We did need an OLB. Obviously we have Connor Barwin and Brooks Reed, but who do we have after that, that are proven players? And no Jason, we couldn't bring back Mario because there wasn't any salary space to do so. I'm guessing he's new to the NFL, or he thought Houston had plenty of salary space.

And how exactly, was DeVier Posey, a "red flag-heavy" prospect? Last I checked, be broke the NCAA rules, not laws. All he did was sold his stuff, so he can have some money, and got tattoos for free. Where exactly, are the heavy red flags?

Keshawn Martin, however might be inconsistent, but we didn't draft him to be just a WR. We drafted him so he can PR/KR.

I'm not saying there wasn't better WRs available at the time, but Gary knows his offense better than anyone and he got who he wanted.
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Old 05-02-2012   #37
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

I like post draft grades because it is an instant feedback on the newly drafted players to your squad. It shows the initial gut reactions to each players prospect profile and the supposed value they bring to the team. Nobody is fully right or wrong really and it gives us interesting reading material in the future.
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Old 05-03-2012   #38
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

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Originally Posted by drs23 View Post
Question...

Every "draft grader", as well as the knowledgeable draft followers here are saying what a great pick Brandon Brooks in the third was. I'm probably wrong but I don't recall having seen his name mentioned in all the pre-draft threads here, or really anywhere for that matter.

My question being since he's being lauded as such a great pick, and apparently that's the consensus, why wasn't he even invited to the combine.

Inquiring minds and all that...
Texans generally dont take 340+ pound maulers like Brooks so there was little reason for people to mock a player like that to us. But if the Texans think they can get a 340+ pound lineman who runs the 40 in under 5 seconds to work in our scheme, then that makes people pretty excited.

Not sure why he wasnt invited to the combine. I guess they already filled up the guest list before his stellar East West performance.
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Old 05-03-2012   #39
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Default Re: Talking Heads Grade Texans Draft

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He's not Mario Williams?


LoL breaking news! Mercilus is not Mario Williams!
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