kipers new mock

[Insideop]

Originally Posted by Doppelganger

I think Briesel is much more likely to leave than Myers. He could play in a power or zone scheme. Myers is 293 lbs soaking wet. He is too light in anything but a ZBS.

Brisiel is listed at 300 lbs. Not exactly what I would call your everyday power OG.

[mussop]

Originally Posted by beerlover

You should, might help!

Doubt it!

Originally Posted by beerlover

Coples has great size but will need to improve technique, hence emphasis on his work ethic/consistency. His value should project to 15-20 not top 10.

Coples is considered the best pass rushing prospect in the draft. He dominated the senior bowl workouts. All the negatives you point out about him were the same things people were saying about Mario Williams when he was coming out. He easily could go top ten.

This guy seems to disagree with you Bl Top 32 he has him ranked #7 of the top 32 players in the draft.

Originally Posted by beerlover

Mark Barron is not a first round pick.

You are right that he probably wont go in the first round but not because of a lack of talent. He will miss the combine because of a double-hernia surgery that held him out of the Senior Bowl. Still barring injury he was widely considered the best safety prospect in the draft and he graded out as a first round pick by many scouts.

Originally Posted by beerlover

Kirkpatrick will need to play FS doesn't have fluid hips to play corner plus not overly fast. Again both reaches.

Depends on the system. There are many that he could fit right into and he is most likely gone top twenty @ CB! Want more proof he is a top twenty prospect? I know you are a big fan of this guy and read his stuff. LINK

Originally Posted by beerlover

Reiff should not be a top 10 pick, RT's should not go this high.

Have you ever watched an actual draft? Maybe you should it might help! If you are talented enough (and Reiff is) and you play a position of need for a high picking team it doesn't matter the position is. People used to say that C's never go in the first round. They used to say G's don't go in the first round. Yet year after year they do.

On top of that he is rated top ten by most talent evaluators if you need proof look Bl Top 32This guy has him ranked eight overall.

Originally Posted by beerlover

Those are just a sampling of nitpicks the Patriot picks are downright horrible as is the Texans pick.

The patriots are known for taking players that fit their system even though others think they are reaching. As far as the Texans pick goes, again this guy Bl Top 32 thinks Worthy is #28 of the top 32 players in the draft.

Originally Posted by beerlover

Stay thirsty, my friend

Always my friend, always.

[mussop]

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder

Vinny Curry would be an OLB in our system, and I said he should be considered, not taken. It depends on how other things shake out in free agency. If we keep Myers, Brisiel and Foster, WR and OLB would be our top two positions of need. However, I expect Blackmon, Floyd and Wright to be off the board by 26, so I would rather spend that pick on a good OLB. That's all, it's just a bunch of IF statements

I'm sorry I meant OLB. I'm just used to calling Mario a DE. I understand all the IF statements and agree with all of them except that we should use our first pick on depth at OLB. We defiantly need to address it but not necessarily taht early IMO.

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder

As I said, each of those picks is dependent on free agency. If Myers leaves, we must take Konz to keep the o-line in tact. I belive Konz can easily come into our system and start week 1. Same with Decastro. If we lost both Myers and Brisiel, I would have a hard time picking between the two of those guys, but I think Decastro will be gone before Konz. Either way, I hope the Texans aren't forced to pick one of those two due to losses.

Agree 1000000%

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder

I agree with that, but consider all the conditions here. If we keep Myers, Brisiel, Foster (I think that's reasonable) and lose Mario, wouldn't OLB be one of our top needs? We don't have much behind Barwin and Reed, and we need depth there. I think it would come down to OLB and WR, but given the free agency class, I would expect the Texans to pick up a WR more so than an OLB. There is a lot of talent at WR free agency and I would prefer filling that need through free agency. Good WRs are easier to find in this second round than OLBs too, so if that's the case, I would prefer going with Curry at 26 and seeing who falls to 58. Rueben Randel, Dwight Jones, Alshon Jeffery, Tommy Streeter, Sanu, etc etc, any of them could be there.

I already responded to this in the first paragraph but will add, depth is depth. We don't really have very good depth on the interior OL, S, CB, ILB if we loose Dobbins, and we could stand to improve depth at DT and DE. Give me best player available at any of those positions for depth in this draft and we are improving our team. If we can find some young talent that is versatile enough to play more than one position that is a bonus.

[beerlover]

Originally Posted by mussop

Have you ever watched an actual draft? Maybe you should it might help! If you are talented enough (and Reiff is) and you play a position of need for a high picking team it doesn't matter the position is. People used to say that C's never go in the first round. They used to say G's don't go in the first round. Yet year after year they do.

Now I know how McShay feels when Kiper goes postal & uses his own words to eat him

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by mussop

This guy seems to disagree with you Bl Top 32 he has him ranked #7 of the top 32 players in the draft.

That's cold blooded.

[SteveSlaton20]

Not going to read all of the posts, but where is he supposed to play if we draft him? NT?

[Mr teX]

Hate Kiper...he's annoying as hell....This is the deepest draft at WR i can remember since we took AJ. We can't lose if we get 1 of the top 5 guys at the position imo. So if we don't take a WR in the 1st im going to be

[TimeKiller]

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder

I agree with that, but consider all the conditions here. If we keep Myers, Brisiel, Foster (I think that's reasonable) and lose Mario, wouldn't OLB be one of our top needs? We don't have much behind Barwin and Reed, and we need depth there. I think it would come down to OLB and WR, but given the free agency class, I would expect the Texans to pick up a WR more so than an OLB. There is a lot of talent at WR free agency and I would prefer filling that need through free agency. Good WRs are easier to find in this second round than OLBs too, so if that's the case, I would prefer going with Curry at 26 and seeing who falls to 58. Rueben Randel, Dwight Jones, Alshon Jeffery, Tommy Streeter, Sanu, etc etc, any of them could be there.

And we don't have ANYTHING beyond Brisiel or Myers. Antoine Caldwell? Not on the same level as Barwin/Reed. I definitely can see them going pass rusher DE or OLB at some point in the draft (maybe both) but this #1 pick is getting real tricky. Just in a bad spot.



Anyone given any thought to grabbing Mark Barron? Or hell, if Kirkpatrick fell and they thought of him to be a FS? Or are we too scared of Alabama DB's to try it again? Since it's such an ugly area...would it be a terrible idea to grab the best safety on most boards even if it's a small reach?

[mussop]

Originally Posted by TimeKiller

And we don't have ANYTHING beyond Brisiel or Myers. Antoine Caldwell? Not on the same level as Barwin/Reed. I definitely can see them going pass rusher DE or OLB at some point in the draft (maybe both) but this #1 pick is getting real tricky. Just in a bad spot.



Anyone given any thought to grabbing Mark Barron? Or hell, if Kirkpatrick fell and they thought of him to be a FS? Or are we too scared of Alabama DB's to try it again? Since it's such an ugly area...would it be a terrible idea to grab the best safety on most boards even if it's a small reach?

Barron would be an upgrade over Quin IMO. I wouldn't hate it if we picked him. With the pressure we put on QB's you would think Quin would of picked at least one pass off last year.

[TimeKiller]

Originally Posted by mussop

Barron would be an upgrade over Quin IMO. I wouldn't hate it if we picked him. With the pressure we put on QB's you would think Quin would of picked at least one pass off last year.

Meh, INT's are pretty random. Especially on the backend I think you're looking for tipped passes as much as trying to jump a route. Not everybody has that instinct to jump passes like Ed Reed, that's what makes him special. Besides, Quin was never a high INT guy, pretty sure he got all 3 against Rusty Smith his first year. Quin's coverage was an obvious improvement over Wilson/Pollard though and he brought a pretty good pile of wood to the position as well.

I wouldn't oppose Barron, he's big, he's fast, he's a good tackler and has a nose for playmaking when the ball is in the air. He and Manning would be awesome and Quin could play CB or backup S or nickel/slot cover guy.

People want to say, Wade and Barwin/Reed/Watt improved the pass rush and it did, no doubt....but Confucious knows: Improved coverage::Improved pass rush. The 2ndary is still a few players away, they might be Harris or Carmichael but Barron would be a helluva choice, especially since it seems like there are about 20 no doubter 1st rounders and more than a few guys who will be considered a reach when they get picked at the end of the 1st.

[amazing80]

Originally Posted by mussop

Barron would be an upgrade over Quin IMO. I wouldn't hate it if we picked him. With the pressure we put on QB's you would think Quin would of picked at least one pass off last year.

Ya grabbing Barron and allowing Quin to play corner improves our secondary. I would be fine with this.....

[bah007]

So EVERYBODY wanted Quin to move over to FS last year. And now we want to move him back to CB?

[beerlover]

Originally Posted by bah007

So EVERYBODY wanted Quin to move over to FS last year. And now we want to move him back to CB?

Yeah, I really don't understand this either? Quin is the consummate teammate, moved to a new position & started every game for a defense that did a complete turnaround all for much less than a first round pick would cost (still playing on his rookie four-year, $2.240 million contract). Freaking genius'es around here

[amazing80]

Originally Posted by beerlover

Yeah, I really don't understand this either? Quin is the consummate teammate, moved to a new position & started every game for a defense that did a complete turnaround all for much less than a first round pick would cost (still playing on his rookie four-year, $2.240 million contract). Freaking genius'es around here

Well lets be honest what other good options were there last season at SS? If we can grab a potential star like Barron at SS wouldn't you consider it? Then if you do that Quin is still good enough to start, so you move him to corner....

[WolverineFan]

Originally Posted by bah007

So EVERYBODY wanted Quin to move over to FS last year. And now we want to move him back to CB?

But, but, but.....interceptions!!!!!

[Mr teX]

Originally Posted by amazing80

Well lets be honest what other good options were there last season at SS? If we can grab a potential star like Barron at SS wouldn't you consider it? Then if you do that Quin is still good enough to start, so you move him to corner....

CB & Safety are 2 different positions & besides that, You just don't do that to a player. How's he supposed to show improvement at a spot if you keep changing his position? Aside from that, We still don't know what we have in Brandon Harris & Roc Carmicheal...you know, 2 cbs we drafted just last year.

[beerlover]

Originally Posted by amazing80

Well lets be honest what other good options were there last season at SS? If we can grab a potential star like Barron at SS wouldn't you consider it? Then if you do that Quin is still good enough to start, so you move him to corner....

yeah, lets be honest, hell no. Quin is the Texans starting Srong Safety going forward & Wade loves the guy. CB yes, DL, OL yes, LB sure.

[Dutchrudder]

Originally Posted by bah007

So EVERYBODY wanted Quin to move over to FS last year. And now we want to move him back to CB?

I don't get it either. Quin is a fine safety, he's nowhere near contending for All-pro or even second team. He's solid safety, but not spectacular. That's fine with me. You can't have pro-bowlers at every spot on a roster.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder

I don't get it either. Quin is a fine safety, he's nowhere near contending for All-pro or even second team. He's solid safety, but not spectacular. That's fine with me. You can't have pro-bowlers at every spot on a roster.

I thought he looked pretty good at corner.

I think he looks pretty good at safety. Damn good considering it was his first year.

I'd like to see him after a full off-season. With better play from the #2 corner & our Free safety & Glover himself, I think we'll all be pleasantly surprised from the group as a whole.

[Lucky]

If Barron were an amazing Polamalu type talent, then he would be a consideration. But, he's not. So this pick makes little sense. Taking a Tackle, RB, or QB makes little sense. I would include TE, but I don't know if Dreessen is a certain re-sign. Pretty much everything else should be on the table, with WR getting the edge if the talent is equal.