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View Poll Results: Realistically, will AJ get a yellow jacket based on his career to date
Yes 102 61.08%
No 65 38.92%
Voters: 167. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-09-2012   #41
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
Art Monk had THREE Super Bowl rings and was the All-Time leader in receptions when he retired in 1995 and it STILL took them until 2008 to vote him in. Monk should have been a lock. But they treat WRs just a little bit better than kickers when it comes to HoF voting. No one has ever given a satisfactory reason why that is.
My thoughts, as well. It was shocking every year to learn that Monk had been snubbed yet again. He played in an era where going across the middle of the field was a dangerous job and WRs did not have the rules of protection provided to today's receivers. And the HoF voters know this, but still dragged their feet to vote him in. I has never made sense to me as a fan.

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Moss will have to get in first - he has that 25 TD season on his resume and all those great years in Minn. OTOH, he'll have issues because of the time he goofed off in Oakland. And as many highlight catches and 100+ catch seasons that Harrison has on his resume' (not to mention he carried Peyton in the early years of his career) he'll probably have wait to get in because of the way his career ended (that gun thing).

Unless they start treating WRs better, A.J. is gonna have a tough time getting in. ESPECIALLY if there isn't a SB win or two (preferrably a SB MVP) for his supporters to point to.
The sad part is A.J.'s dedication to this team could ultimately cost him a ring or two and entry into the HoF. He's certainly gifted enough to make it, but spending his entire career on a floundering expansion team that took a decade to get into it's first playoff game will not be an exemption with the voters.
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Old 02-09-2012   #42
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

He'll make it in, but it will be a long, long, LONG time before he does.

At some point, the voters will look back at his talent, his dedication to the Texans (rather than whoring around like Randy Moss did), and his overall contribution to the game of football--He is a BEAST, period--and they will vote him into the HOF.

But it will take a long time, maybe 20+ years. Seriously. It will be in a year where there isn't much for the voters to choose from. It'll be a "meh" consensus, which is appropriate since the Texans were a "meh" team for those 8 or 9 years of his career here.

They'll feel sorry for him. There'll be stories about how unjust the voting system is, like there are for similar players who didn't have exceptional post-season careers but still contributed heavily to the NFL for many, many years regardless.
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Old 02-09-2012   #43
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by BullBlitz View Post
I think it's more like "HOF, no way."

We all like AJ here with good reason, but no, he has neither the playoff history nor the stats to be in a HOf discussion yet.

He is a good guy, and hopefully that will change. My sense is that playing his entire career in Houston isn't going to help though.
This team is now a superbowl contender for years to comes. We are set to go on a ten year run of division titles and playoff appearances.

I am going to call it. At least Superbowl titles in the next years.

Of course AJ may have only 4 more years left? Maybe?
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Old 02-09-2012   #44
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

I love me some AJ, but tbh he won't make it. Even if he produced 3-4 more GREAT seasons, I doubt he gets in, he would need to set all kinds of records for TD receptions to have a shot and in this offense, the one where we neglect to throw to him in the redzone, he just doesn't stand a chance. He will make the TEXANS HOF though and I am sure his number will be retired, but thats prolly it sadly.
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Old 02-09-2012   #45
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by TEXANRED View Post
This team is now a superbowl contender for years to comes. We are set to go on a ten year run of division titles and playoff appearances.
I need to see us do more than beat a weak Bengals wild card team in our own stadium before I develop such a view.

We are not "a superbowl contender for years to come" based on anything except wishful thinking.
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Old 02-09-2012   #46
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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I need to see us do more than beat a weak Bengals wild card team in our own stadium before I develop such a view.

We are not "a superbowl contender for years to come" based on anything except wishful thinking.
Texans are a Super Bowl contender entering 2012 and you're wrong if you think otherwise. This team is loaded on both sides of the ball. Just need a little luck staying healthy and a couple of improvements on special teams.
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Old 02-09-2012   #47
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by Bulls on Parade View Post
Texans are a Super Bowl contender entering 2012 and you're wrong if you think otherwise. This team is loaded on both sides of the ball. Just need a little luck staying healthy and a couple of improvements on special teams.
They always need a little luck. People said the same thing when they were so optimistic after the 9-7 season:

"Next season is going to be the one."
"Playoffs or bust".
"We've finally got a QB, a top WR, and a Rookie of the Year linebacker."

What happened? 6-10.

So, no, we aren't a Super Bowl contender based on what happened in 2011. Lots of teams are loaded; not that we are. We have plenty of glaring weaknesses that competitors can take advantage of.
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Old 02-09-2012   #48
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

It's a lot different compared to any past year. The Texans actually have a top-rated defense along with a highly ranked offense going into the off-season. Wade Phillips is a great defensive coordinator and not a total bonehead like the past defensive coordinators we've had over the years.

There seems to be a strong foundation on both sides of the ball for the first time in franchise history. A great mix of veterans and talented young players. If only Andre Johnson had a team as loaded as this earlier in his career, he'd be that much closer to knocking on the doors of the Pro Football Hall of Fame.

I don't even think this team has a lot of glaring weaknesses right now. At least nothing that isn't easily fixable with one more good draft and free agent signing. I just don't want to end the season and go to battle in the playoffs with an unproven third-string rookie at quarterback. That's about the only gripe I had with this past season. But that was just some unfortunate luck. Schaub getting hurt by Albert Haynesworth on a quarterback sneak backed up on our own goal line. What are the odds of that happening? Just the playcalling on that particular play was insane to begin with (cough, cough, Kubiak!!!!).
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Old 02-10-2012   #49
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by amazing80 View Post
I love me some AJ, but tbh he won't make it. Even if he produced 3-4 more GREAT seasons, I doubt he gets in, he would need to set all kinds of records for TD receptions to have a shot and in this offense, the one where we neglect to throw to him in the redzone, he just doesn't stand a chance. He will make the TEXANS HOF though and I am sure his number will be retired, but thats prolly it sadly.
AJ has been the dominant wr of the last half decade. Art Monk couldn't carry Andre's jock and he is a HOF'er. He only went to 3 Pro Bowls and was pretty much only a possession wr. All he did was be pretty good for a long time (has some longevity records)...he wasn't ever "dominant" and didn't make defenses change their schemes for his game like teams HAVE to defend Andre Johnson. If AJ stays healthy he is a no brainer HOF player.
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Old 02-10-2012   #50
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
AJ has been the dominant wr of the last half decade. Art Monk couldn't carry Andre's jock and he is a HOF'er. He only went to 3 Pro Bowls and was pretty much only a possession wr. All he did was be pretty good for a long time (has some longevity records)...he wasn't ever "dominant" and didn't make defenses change their schemes for his game like teams HAVE to defend Andre Johnson. If AJ stays healthy he is a no brainer HOF player.
Do you think HoF voters will agree with you? They just dissed Chris Carter, and according to some NFL analysts, this will be a trend that continues for awhile against receivers.
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Old 02-10-2012   #51
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
Do you think HoF voters will agree with you? They just dissed Chris Carter, and according to some NFL analysts, this will be a trend that continues for awhile against receivers.
He was more one-dimensional compared to Andre Johnson who can do everything but he caught more TD passes. I think if Andre stays healthy and keeps his production high he'll be considered one of the top 2-3 wide outs of his era. I think Carter is more of a HOF guy than Art Monk was fwiw.
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Old 02-10-2012   #52
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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He was more one-dimensional compared to Andre Johnson who can do everything but he caught more TD passes. I think if Andre stays healthy and keeps his production high he'll be considered one of the top 2-3 wide outs of his era. I think Carter is more of a HOF guy than Art Monk was fwiw.
I agree with you completely about AJ. I just hope the HoF voters share our perspective when the time comes. Hopefully that's a decade away (or longer).
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Old 02-10-2012   #53
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
AJ has been the dominant wr of the last half decade. Art Monk couldn't carry Andre's jock and he is a HOF'er. He only went to 3 Pro Bowls and was pretty much only a possession wr. All he did was be pretty good for a long time (has some longevity records)...he wasn't ever "dominant" and didn't make defenses change their schemes for his game like teams HAVE to defend Andre Johnson. If AJ stays healthy he is a no brainer HOF player.
eventhough it was less than 5 yrs ago, imo monk would have a slim chance of getting into the hall today. much more prolific wrs than aj (td wise) and probably comparable yardage wise (when its said and done) are being kept out

the 'dominant receivers' at various points of the last decade were probably: holt, TO, moss, AJ, welker, fitz, wayne & harrison, chad johnson, steve smith... not to mention guys like megatron, aj green, nicks etc who've started out real strong and you're looking at a potential greater bottleneck than we have now at wr in the hof

aj had about 2 yrs where he was considered the best... but most of those guys will have pretty comparable cases or stronger to him

its by no means a no brainer. i think most realistic ppl would agree with that. heres hoping he can string together a few more 1500 yd, 10+ td seasons to help himself out
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Old 02-10-2012   #54
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

Ummmmmm!

Ya think so doctor???

YESSSSS!!!

Dude did more, with a lot less!!!!
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Old 02-10-2012   #55
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by Double Barrel View Post
Do you think HoF voters will agree with you? They just dissed Chris Carter, and according to some NFL analysts, this will be a trend that continues for awhile against receivers.
This is THE crucial question. As Texans fans we have to remember that most of the HoF voters won't have Battle Red KoolAid running thru their veins. They won't care what A.J. has meant to us. They'll look at the numbers - five 1000-yd seasons, four 85+ catch seasons, only 54 TDs in nine years - and say "maybe".

As a comparison, let's look at two HoF WRs vs CC and AJ.

Lynn Swann:
336 receptions, 51 TDs, 5462 yds, FOUR rings.

Michael Irvin:
750 receptions, 11,904 yds, 65 TDs, three rings.

Cris Carter:
1101 receptions, 13,899 yds (including a stretch where he had 8 straight 1000+ yd seasons), 130 TDs, zero rings.

A.J.:
706 receptions, 9656 yds, 52 TDs, no rings.

See a pattern in the HoF voters thinking? It's the SB rings that get you in over your stats... and they get you in sooner rather than later.

We better get AJ into a couple of Super Bowls and let him shine for him to have a shot at a yellow jacket.
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Old 02-10-2012   #56
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by ObsiWan View Post
This is THE crucial question. As Texans fans we have to remember that most of the HoF voters won't have Battle Red KoolAid running thru their veins. They won't care what A.J. has meant to us. They'll look at the numbers - five 1000-yd seasons, four 85+ catch seasons, only 54 TDs in nine years - and say "maybe".

As a comparison, let's look at two HoF WRs vs CC and AJ.

Lynn Swann:
336 receptions, 51 TDs, 5462 yds, FOUR rings.

Michael Irvin:
750 receptions, 11,904 yds, 65 TDs, three rings.

Cris Carter:
1101 receptions, 13,899 yds (including a stretch where he had 8 straight 1000+ yd seasons), 130 TDs, zero rings.

A.J.:
706 receptions, 9656 yds, 52 TDs, no rings.

See a pattern in the HoF voters thinking? It's the SB rings that get you in over your stats... and they get you in sooner rather than later.

We better get AJ into a couple of Super Bowls and let him shine for him to have a shot at a yellow jacket.
its almost impossible to compare stats from the 70's. You could mug a wr all over the field...literally knock their blocks off at any time - today, every stat or new rule has gone on to enhance the stats of the offensive players in this newer era. In the greater picture, football is a sport very much unlike the stat-driven game of baseball (as an example of making HOF cases on pure stats alone). I think you have to look past raw data to see the impact of a football player. Sometimes you get a lot of catches because the defense is really doubling Ricky Sanders (Art Monk, cough, cough). AJ is a dominant blocker, an elite route runner, makes teams gameplan totally around his skill-set, and has been on some really bad teams. I think the voters will see that and there are tons of things players do to dominate games that don't end up on stat sheets. Stats are for baseball and fantasy leagues.
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Old 02-10-2012   #57
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

AJ is a lot more revered here than nationally. If we don't get to some playoff games where he can do something, the HOF will be a long shot.
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Old 02-10-2012   #58
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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its almost impossible to compare stats from the 70's. You could mug a wr all over the field...literally knock their blocks off at any time - today, every stat or new rule has gone on to enhance the stats of the offensive players in this newer era. In the greater picture, football is a sport very much unlike the stat-driven game of baseball (as an example of making HOF cases on pure stats alone). I think you have to look past raw data to see the impact of a football player. Sometimes you get a lot of catches because the defense is really doubling Ricky Sanders (Art Monk, cough, cough). AJ is a dominant blocker, an elite route runner, makes teams gameplan totally around his skill-set, and has been on some really bad teams. I think the voters will see that and there are tons of things players do to dominate games that don't end up on stat sheets. Stats are for baseball and fantasy leagues.
I recognize and agree with most of that statement. A.J. was the one stud on a sucky team. But now the offense goes thru Foster. Defenses don't fear A.J. like they fear Foster. What's more likely to happen... an opposing defense doubling A.J. with a CB and safety or them putting that safety in the box to stop Foster??

The part I disagree with is that you're giving the HoF voters more credit than they're due. They won't care that A.J. is a great downfield blocker or a great route runner. There's no evidence that they are that smart. Carter and Harrison are two of the best route runners this side of Jerry Rice. Carter still isn't in and it will be interesting to see if Harrison gets in when eligible (I think he's still 2-3 years away).

I'm telling you A.J. needs a ring or two to cement his chances.
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Old 02-11-2012   #59
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

I'll say that he does go to the HOF, but I won't be surprised if he doesn't get it in either.

I think that the voters will remember and realize how dominant he was and how feared he was around the league, and will understand that he played on a bad team for a long time.
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Old 02-11-2012   #60
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Default Re: Realistically, is AJ going to the hall of fame??

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Originally Posted by TEXANRED View Post
No. AJ is not in the top 25 in receptions. Also if Tim Brown (14th) and Cris Carter (3rd) are not in the hall of fame then you have to figure you are going to have to be better than those guys to make it in or have some rings like Michael Irving.
This, if the Texans win two of the next three & Andre is MVP in at least one of them, he gets in.

But I voted no.
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