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Old 01-26-2012   #1
dinkatoid
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Default Best Tackling Safetys

From PFF:

Quote:
The Texans made Danieal Manning one of their biggest free agency priorities to help out a leaky secondary, and though Jonathan Joseph got all of the press with Houstonís improved play this year, Manningís reliability as a tackler helped in a major way as well. Manning missed only two tackles this season (neither in coverage) to finish second on the list with a miss every 26 attempts. Houstonís third-year safety, Troy Nolan was neck-and-neck with Manning in rating, missing only one tackle against the run, and keeping a clean slate against the pass (where most of his work on the season was done). Nolan missed a tackle once every 24 attempts this season.
Read the full article here:
http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog...-the-safeties/
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Old 01-26-2012   #2
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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Originally Posted by dinkatoid View Post
From PFF:



Read the full article here:
http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog...-the-safeties/
not surprised. We all know Manning is good, and i have always liked Nolan. I think he has what it takes to be a Starter in the NFL.
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Old 01-26-2012   #3
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

But Nolan takes bad angles and is not a good tackler
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Old 01-26-2012   #4
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
But Nolan takes bad angles and is not a good tackler
haha hmmm i always thought he did a pretty good job while he was in. Sure he has a lot to learn still but i see the skill set needed.
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Old 01-26-2012   #5
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
But Nolan takes bad angles and is not a good tackler
He does...
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Old 01-26-2012   #6
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
But Nolan takes bad angles and is not a good tackler
I thought the general opinion of Nolan was that he was a run stopper safety but not much in coverage, despite always being around tipped balls.
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Old 01-26-2012   #7
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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Originally Posted by Mr teX View Post
He does...
That doesn't sound like the criticism someone that knows a lot about football would make IMHO.

Don't want to really go into it, but that sounds ridiculous.
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Old 01-26-2012   #8
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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I thought the general opinion of Nolan was that he was a run stopper safety but not much in coverage, despite always being around tipped balls.
Actually, I think Nolan was thought to be a ball Hawk with suspect tackling. The guy had a lot of INT's coming out of college.

And there is a segment on here that always claims that he takes bad angles and is not a good tackler. That could be true, but I find it hard to believe that they'd be able to make that observation even if they watched all the games at Reliant.
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Old 01-27-2012   #9
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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Originally Posted by Mr teX View Post
He does...
Name one play? Coverage he plays lights out. Very quick pursuit to the ball and solid form tackling. I can't agree with this at all. Our safety play was excellent this year. Who's defense led the league in 20+ yard plays allowed? I swore we were leading the league for most of the year. Curious where we finished.
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Old 01-27-2012   #10
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
Actually, I think Nolan was thought to be a ball Hawk with suspect tackling. The guy had a lot of INT's coming out of college.

And there is a segment on here that always claims that he takes bad angles and is not a good tackler. That could be true, but I find it hard to believe that they'd be able to make that observation even if they watched all the games at Reliant.
So which is it?!? lol....

I mean, despite limited playing time he's got a few here too....but like I said, it's all off of tipped balls, not like he cut off a route or anything.

I'll say this much, he damn sure takes better angles than Keo.
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Old 01-27-2012   #11
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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I'll say this much, he damn sure takes better angles than Keo.
A circle has better angles than Keo.
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Old 01-27-2012   #12
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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Originally Posted by NastyNate View Post
A circle has better angles than Keo.


Nicely done!
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Old 01-27-2012   #13
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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Originally Posted by Rey View Post
That doesn't sound like the criticism someone that knows a lot about football would make IMHO.

Don't want to really go into it, but that sounds ridiculous.
C'mon Rey you know stats can be made to show anything...These stats are mainly a function of snaps taken & nothing more. Lesser snaps taken = less times to miss tackles & screw up; minimum qualifying number of course.


So with him he's 1 of the top tackling safties mainly b/c he took the least amount of snaps across the board amongst those who qualified....that's pretty much it.

Furthermore, the stat only takes into account when tackles are attempted, everything that happened before that is ignored. So it wouldn't take into account his bad angles...all it cares about is when he goes for a tackle does he get the guy down or not. So in theory he could've been in the trail position (due to taking bad angles) every time he made a tackle in coverage & still been high on this list.

there's a reason the guy hasn't been able to get into a starting slot & why we went out & got manning in the 1st place. I've seen him play enough to know that he's nothing special back there. The coaching staff obviously don't think as highly of him as you do.......for whatever reason. Its the Morlon Greenwood effect at work here. Yeah, you're up there & leading the team/league in tackles......................but most of your tackles are taking place 5-8 yds down the field; that's not really impressive & doesn't make you a good at your position.
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Old 01-27-2012   #14
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

Quote:
Originally Posted by dinkatoid View Post
From PFF:



Read the full article here:
http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog...-the-safeties/
Wow! Impressive just doesn't describe it.
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Old 01-28-2012   #15
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

Well from what I saw, when Manning went down Nolan stepped up and the D hardly missed a beat.

I wonder if a lot of the bad rep he's getting on here is due to the fact that he was a 7th round developmental player who has taken time to develop. ie; he was poor at some aspects when he first came here, but this last season, like most of the guys on D, he's looked pretty good to me.

One thing I couldn't help but wonder towards the end of this season, was regarding Bernard Pollard, the guy, similar to his first season with us, was put in position to succeed in Balt, and looked really good again. I couldn't help but wonder if we'd have kept him on a cheap contract, could he have subbed in on 3rd downs where Quin was coming closer to the line, leaving Quin at safety?
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Old 01-31-2012   #16
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

Quote:
Originally Posted by dinkatoid View Post
From PFF:

Houstonís third-year safety, Troy Nolan was neck-and-neck with Manning in rating, missing only one tackle against the run, and keeping a clean slate against the pass (where most of his work on the season was done). Nolan missed a tackle once every 24 attempts this season.

Read the full article here:
http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog...-the-safeties/
Somehow this one nagged me (and stayed in the back of my mind) for the last couple of days.

Nolan had 26 solo tackles and 6 assists; how does he miss a tackle every 24 attempts?

Secondly, I was glossing over the Saints game and noticed that Nolan missed two tackles already in the first half.

2nd qtr

3-4-HST 30 (8:30) D.Sproles right end for 30 yards, TOUCHDOWN.

3rd qtr

3-17-HST 32 (1:27) (Shotgun) D.Brees pass short middle to D.Sproles to HST 17 for 15 yards (G.Quin). Pass -4, YAC 19
Timeout #2 by NO at 00:38.

Nolan was still inconsistent to me, but he did make progress over the previous year, something that seems to be a given for all the defensive players under Wade.
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Old 01-31-2012   #17
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

I have seen our Safeties out of position in pass coverage a lot this season that caused big gains for the opposing teams and we need a big time upgrade opposite D. Manning and Glover Quinn is just horrible in pass coverage we need to cut him loose and bring in new help via the draft.
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Old 02-01-2012   #18
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Default Re: Best Tackling Safetys

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I have seen our Safeties out of position in pass coverage a lot this season that caused big gains for the opposing teams and we need a big time upgrade opposite D. Manning and Glover Quinn is just horrible in pass coverage we need to cut him loose and bring in new help via the draft.
I really don't get this point of view at all, its an opinion and you're entitled to it so i'm not having a go at you, but I've seen a few people say this now and I just did not see it at all myself.

Ask yourself this though, would you take Troy Polamalu? Because, and I know they are in a different class, but Troy cheats all the time and gets caught out very often if you actually watch him, yet is a future HOF player.

For the safety position, coverage isn't everything.

Also, for now, Quin is very cheap, still playing his rookie contract, so why you'd cut him loose I don't know, you could say bring in some competition and it might sound a little more rational.

But, for me, we have a good group back there at safety, and as bad as Keo looked who knows what another training camp could do for him.
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