Penn State Child Molestation Case

[Honoring Earl 34]

Originally Posted by eriadoc

Likewise. I keep telling myself I'll turn off the news and not click this thread.



I'm trying not to come into this thread, much less post, but that was one of the first things that came to mind for me. If I were that 28 year old grad assistant and I walked in on that, there would be blood on the shower floor. I'd call the cops after and let them sort it out afterward, but there would have been some tossing around of a pedophile rapist.

Everyone involved in this case failed and is a disgustingly immoral human being that deserves to die a slow, painful, medieval death. That's about as nicely as I can put it.

[Vinny]

Originally Posted by Hervoyel

You're talking about this with emotion and I'm being reasonable. If you can find me 20 victims that Joe Paterno personally sodomized then I'm going to concede the point but Sandusky is the rapist pedophile and Paterno is the football coach who reported what he was told to his superior.

IF he was told that Sandusky was sodomizing a 10 year old in no uncertain terms then the only appropriate response was "Call the police right now".

If McQueary and his father beat around the bush and found a way to say just enough to clear their conscience (How you do that after you saw a kid being molested and did nothing I don't know) and left him with a "What are they talking about, I'm going to call the AD and get him to look into it" idea then maybe that was the appropriate response.

You don't know what he was or wasn't told. I don't either. All I'm saying is that before you crucify the guy (and he may have that coming to him) you might want to have an idea what he knew.

Suggesting that we take the time to find out all the facts before wiping this guy out is not the same thing as demanding that we get a ten year old out and sodomize him front of JoePa to see if he understands the specifics of the act. Take your moral outrage and your slowly forming straw-man argument (not inclined to wait around to be lumped in with the folks at Penn State thank you) somewhere else. I've been perfectly clear about this.

A graduate assistant testifies to a Grand Jury that he heard "rythmic slapping noises" in the shower and saw Sandusky with a 10 year old kid up against the wall in a manner that cops frisk perps and he was being raped. He immediately called his Father and THEY BOTH went to Paterno's house for a meeting. If you are to believe Paterno I'm not sure you are using logic. Let's say he just stopped their story short and told them "I don't want to hear the details, but I'll pass on your allegation to my boss". Logic states that Paterno is a man of deep integrity and is a cultural institution in a powerful University. Why would Paterno do this? He wouldn't. Paterno would ask a few questions if they beat around the bush. If they told him that there was a 10 year old kid in the shower with his Coach, you don't think that he'd want to know everything that happened? Paterno didn't get to be a great head coach by skipping over the main details of any problem to be solved.

It's a massive, gigantic leap of logic to think Paterno didn't know based on the testimony to a grand jury by all the parties. Paterno's ability to hide behind a loophole in a poorly written law that helps large corporations and institutions is another sad, sad issue in itself. I mean why is the law crafted so that anyone in any institution can just say, "I told my boss" and that exonerates him from his duty to protect ten year old children? What kind of crap law is this? All it does is help people pass the buck. I don't remember what the law is called but it needs to be renamed the "pass the buck" law. Its friggin' disturbing that so many stupid people write our laws and "protect" our children with yet more servings of corporate helper.

Last point, I think it is a stretch to believe that a man of deep integrity, a leader of Men, a man who has built a life on hard work and fairness would not wonder why nobody called the police after he reported this to his "boss". If you stretch your logic enough you can believe that Joe Paterno wasn't told the entire truth in that meeting at his house so many years ago.

If you haven't read this, you don't know anything. Not directing that at you herv...just to those who haven't read the Grand Jury's findings. Keep in mind, that was 11 months ago and Sandusky was on JoePa's campus as short a period as two weeks ago.

[Honoring Earl 34]

Originally Posted by Vinny

A graduate assistant testifies to a Grand Jury that he heard "rythmic slapping noises" in the shower and saw Sandusky with a 10 year old kid up against the wall in a manner that cops frisk perps and he was being raped. He immediately called his Father and THEY BOTH went to Paterno's house for a meeting. If you are to believe Paterno I'm not sure you are using logic. Let's say he just stopped their story short and told them "I don't want to hear the details, but I'll pass on your allegation to my boss". Logic states that Paterno is a man of deep integrity and is a cultural institution in a powerful University. Why would Paterno do this? He wouldn't. Paterno would ask a few questions if they beat around the bush. If they told him that there was a 10 year old kid in the shower with his Coach, you don't think that he'd want to know everything that happened? Paterno didn't get to be a great head coach by skipping over the main details of any problem to be solved.

It's a massive, gigantic leap of logic to think Paterno didn't know based on the testimony to a grand jury by all the parties. Paterno's ability to hide behind a loophole in a poorly written law that helps large corporations and institutions is another sad, sad issue in itself. I mean why is the law crafted so that anyone in any institution can just say, "I told my boss" and that exonerates him from his duty to protect ten year old children? What kind of crap law is this? All it does is help people pass the buck. I don't remember what the law is called but it needs to be renamed the "pass the buck" law. Its friggin' disturbing that so many stupid people write our laws and "protect" our children with yet more servings of corporate helper.

Last point, I think it is a stretch to believe that a man of deep integrity, a leader of Men, a man who has built a life on hard work and fairness would not wonder why nobody called the police after he reported this to his "boss". If you stretch your logic enough you can believe that Joe Paterno wasn't told the entire truth in that meeting at his house so many years ago.

If you haven't read this, you don't know anything. Not directing that at you herv...just to those who haven't read the Grand Jury's findings. Keep in mind, that was 11 months ago and Sandusky was on JoePa's campus as short a period as two weeks ago.

The scary part is what was Sandusky's leverage to come and go after all that ?

[eriadoc]

Originally Posted by Vinny

A graduate assistant testifies to a Grand Jury that he heard "rythmic slapping noises" in the shower and saw Sandusky with a 10 year old kid up against the wall in a manner that cops frisk perps and he was being raped. He immediately called his Father and THEY BOTH went to Paterno's house for a meeting. If you are to believe Paterno I'm not sure you are using logic. Let's say he just stopped their story short and told them "I don't want to hear the details, but I'll pass on your allegation to my boss". Logic states that Paterno is a man of deep integrity and is a cultural institution in a powerful University. Why would Paterno do this? He wouldn't. Paterno would ask a few questions if they beat around the bush. If they told him that there was a 10 year old kid in the shower with his Coach, you don't think that he'd want to know everything that happened? Paterno didn't get to be a great head coach by skipping over the main details of any problem to be solved.

It's a massive, gigantic leap of logic to think Paterno didn't know based on the testimony to a grand jury by all the parties. Paterno's ability to hide behind a loophole in a poorly written law that helps large corporations and institutions is another sad, sad issue in itself. I mean why is the law crafted so that anyone in any institution can just say, "I told my boss" and that exonerates him from his duty to protect ten year old children? What kind of crap law is this? All it does is help people pass the buck. I don't remember what the law is called but it needs to be renamed the "pass the buck" law. Its friggin' disturbing that so many stupid people write our laws and "protect" our children with yet more servings of corporate helper.

Last point, I think it is a stretch to believe that a man of deep integrity, a leader of Men, a man who has built a life on hard work and fairness would not wonder why nobody called the police after he reported this to his "boss". If you stretch your logic enough you can believe that Joe Paterno wasn't told the entire truth in that meeting at his house so many years ago.

If you haven't read this, you don't know anything. Not directing that at you herv...just to those who haven't read the Grand Jury's findings. Keep in mind, that was 11 months ago and Sandusky was on JoePa's campus as short a period as two weeks ago.

Like I said above, Paterno either knew or he did his damn dead level best to avoid knowing. Either way, it's willful negligence and he enabled Sandusky. As you noted, the grand jury presentment was almost a year ago, yet Sandusky was still hanging around.

[The1ApplePie]

I wonder who plays Joe Pa when Law and Order "rips this from the headlines."

With the twist that he originally raped the Sundusky character of course

[Hardcore Texan]

Originally Posted by TimeKiller

Legality. Ha. We all break laws moron. Nobody is calling for my head for speeding to get home earlier. Some words on a piece of paper somewhere is what you and Pappy Slappy can hide behind. The MONSTER he tried to hide will ALWAYS be visible.

You hear something? What is it. Oh, it's a guy raping a kid. What on the face of the planet would stop you from a) kicking the **** outta that guy b) calling the police and my goodness c) disassociate with the monster who raped children in YOUR house?

Legally Joe Paterno might be in the clear. Morally he's got a thousand pound weight strapped to his back. Socially, he's ****ed.

The bolded!

How do you not intervene and put an immediate stop to something like that. And if you are too much of a wuss to protect the child then call the damn cops. It's pretty simple!

Same thing applies if you are out shopping and see someone strike a kid. Don't know about you, but I am stepping in. I'll let the cops sort out who goes to jail, but not on my watch buddy. No. Excuse. Period.

And if I get my ass whooped then so be it, at least it's not the kid getting abused!

[JCTexan]

Originally Posted by gary

The statement just given by Joe makes me sad, God bless him he gave his heart and soul for that school but the director should go to hell and burn. Joe did not follow the morals of the majority so he is now evil. Look at those who showed up at his home last night to support him good for them.

Originally Posted by gary

He is old and I have personally seen where older folks in the work place just there doing their thing in the background without knowing what is going on from within. I would not doubt that at all in this case. Joe has been leagally cleared here and yet people just want to rag on him I almost want to send him a letter of support myself. What we have here is the public becoming morally tied to the victims and not looking at this story as an outsider.

Seriously? The AD should burn in hell but you give Paterno your support when he was the one who notified the athletic director of what was happening?

[Runner]

Originally Posted by Vinny

A graduate assistant testifies to a Grand Jury that he heard "rythmic slapping noises" in the shower and saw Sandusky with a 10 year old kid up against the wall in a manner that cops frisk perps and he was being raped. He immediately called his Father and THEY BOTH went to Paterno's house for a meeting. If you are to believe Paterno I'm not sure you are using logic. Let's say he just stopped their story short and told them "I don't want to hear the details, but I'll pass on your allegation to my boss". Logic states that Paterno is a man of deep integrity and is a cultural institution in a powerful University. Why would Paterno do this? He wouldn't. Paterno would ask a few questions if they beat around the bush. If they told him that there was a 10 year old kid in the shower with his Coach, you don't think that he'd want to know everything that happened? Paterno didn't get to be a great head coach by skipping over the main details of any problem to be solved.

It's a massive, gigantic leap of logic to think Paterno didn't know based on the testimony to a grand jury by all the parties. Paterno's ability to hide behind a loophole in a poorly written law that helps large corporations and institutions is another sad, sad issue in itself. I mean why is the law crafted so that anyone in any institution can just say, "I told my boss" and that exonerates him from his duty to protect ten year old children? What kind of crap law is this? All it does is help people pass the buck. I don't remember what the law is called but it needs to be renamed the "pass the buck" law. Its friggin' disturbing that so many stupid people write our laws and "protect" our children with yet more servings of corporate helper.

Last point, I think it is a stretch to believe that a man of deep integrity, a leader of Men, a man who has built a life on hard work and fairness would not wonder why nobody called the police after he reported this to his "boss". If you stretch your logic enough you can believe that Joe Paterno wasn't told the entire truth in that meeting at his house so many years ago.

If you haven't read this, you don't know anything. Not directing that at you herv...just to those who haven't read the Grand Jury's findings. Keep in mind, that was 11 months ago and Sandusky was on JoePa's campus as short a period as two weeks ago.

All right. I've been wavering on the idea that Paterno could have been kept in the dark. This convinces me he had to know unless he deliberately avoided knowing. The in-person visit by witness and father was something I wasn't aware of. I've been reading summaries and didn't see that detail.

The more data I see, the more confounded I am that this could happen. It's pathetic.

[Double Barrel]

Originally Posted by eriadoc

Like I said above, Paterno either knew or he did his damn dead level best to avoid knowing. Either way, it's willful negligence and he enabled Sandusky. As you noted, the grand jury presentment was almost a year ago, yet Sandusky was still hanging around.

According to the report posted by Vinny:

"Paterno testified that the graduate assistant was very upset. Paterno called Tim Curley ("Curley"), Penn State Athletic Director and Paterno's immediate superior, to his home the very next day, a Sunday, and report to him that the graduate assistant had seen Jerry Sandusky in the Lasch Building showers fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a young boy."

That's about as black and white as it gets.

Paterno, like the graduate assistant and his father, along with all the others involved, are freakin' pieces of ****.

And for any ***** that claims that I am posting out of emotion, YOU'RE DAMN RIGHT I AM!! This story angers me at such a basic, fundamental level that I'd volunteer to be on a firing squad to exterminate this wretched filth from humanity. Every damn single one of them.

[HealingBullets]

Originally Posted by Grams

I have been reading about this and listening to various media opinions.

It just comes down to the facts: they knew what was going on in 1998 - when he "retired".

This is the true bottom line in this deal...Sandusky was a known molester back in 1998 .....He was "retired" by Penn State because of these issues...The claim that this came out of left field in 2002 when Sandusky continues to molest kids is absolute hogwash. The truth is that what happened in 2002 is obviously a continuation of the cover up that began years earlier.

[PsychoLove]

The NCAA should official change the schools name to "State Penn".

[toronto]

I don't care about the Seniors getting screwed out of senior day. This game on Saturday, especially with Paterno likely still there, needs to be cancelled.

Otherwise you will have 106,000 gathered for a support Joe Paterno pep rally, and the kids that went through this hell will go through it all over again.

Paterno resigns or is fired today, different story maybe.

But there is NOT a single person at PSU standing up to the football program right now. Paterno if frigging calling the shots, even around all of this mayhem. Its like he's basically the defacto university president and no one there has the power or balls to get him the hell out of there.

Someone, ANYONE with power, hell get the frigging NCAA President or Big Ten President (has he uttered a word either????) involved and stop this before we're all subjected to one of the worst displays you will ever see on TV in our lifetime.

If this goes through, I will never support NCAA athletics again. Not a single ****ing dime.

[Honoring Earl 34]

Originally Posted by Double Barrel

According to the report posted by Vinny:

"Paterno testified that the graduate assistant was very upset. Paterno called Tim Curley ("Curley"), Penn State Athletic Director and Paterno's immediate superior, to his home the very next day, a Sunday, and report to him that the graduate assistant had seen Jerry Sandusky in the Lasch Building showers fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a young boy."

That's about as black and white as it gets.

Paterno, like the graduate assistant and his father, along with all the others involved, are freakin' pieces of ****.

And for any ***** that claims that I am posting out of emotion, YOU'RE DAMN RIGHT I AM!! This story angers me at such a basic, fundamental level that I'd volunteer to be on a firing squad to exterminate this wretched filth from humanity. Every damn single one of them.

I think it's just a paternal instinct to want to protect kids .

[NitroGSXR]

Originally Posted by Honoring Earl 34

The scary part is what was Sandusky's leverage to come and go after all that ?

Bingo. A world of depravity is tucked within the Nittany Lions. Sandusky's testimony in exchange for a reduced sentence?

When I say reduced, I mean 5 oz less gasoline.

[Hervoyel]

Originally Posted by Runner

All right. I've been wavering on the idea that Paterno could have been kept in the dark. This convinces me he had to know unless he deliberately avoided knowing. The in-person visit by witness and father was something I wasn't aware of. I've been reading summaries and didn't see that detail.

The more data I see, the more confounded I am that this could happen. It's pathetic.

Likewise. I finally read this thing and it wasn't easy. I am convinced as well.

Immensely disturbing stuff going on here. It looks more like a cabal of powerful people doing everything they can to keep the university looking good. The story around Paterno rings more of people providing a "legend" with plausible deniability than anything else (and doing a poor job of it at that).

I'm firmly in the "Knew or didn't know intentionally" camp.

[ArlingtonTexan]

Originally Posted by HealingBullets

This is the true bottom line in this deal...Sandusky was a known molester back in 1998 .....He was "retired" by Penn State because of these issues...The claim that this came out of left field in 2002 when Sandusky continues to molest kids is absolute hogwash. The truth is that what happened in 2002 is obviously a continuation of the cover up that began years earlier.

It would seem so. I mean Sandusky was in his mid 50s and while not "young" by coaching circles, he was not yet old. I mean with his reputation as a coach, no other major program would come and try to money whip him out of "retirement." My guess is that his troubles were not only known by Penn State, but within the college coaching community. (I am just speculating of course)

[Double Barrel]

Originally Posted by Hervoyel

Likewise. I finally read this thing and it wasn't easy. I am convinced as well.

Immensely disturbing stuff going on here. It looks more like a cabal of powerful people doing everything they can to keep the university looking good. The story around Paterno rings more of people providing a "legend" with plausible deniability than anything else (and doing a poor job of it at that).

I'm firmly in the "Knew or didn't know intentionally" camp.

I have no doubt that he knew.

Paterno himself testified that he told Curley "that the graduate assistant had seen Jerry Sandusky in the Lasch Building showers fondling or doing something of a sexual nature to a young boy."

Those are his words.

He might not have known specific details, but he damn sure knew that a young boy was being molested by Sandusky in the shower. His own testimony confirms his guilt.

In light of this, I cannot believe the school will trot that old bastard out there at a football game and hundreds of moronic students continue to pep rally for him. It's a sad, sad world.

[The1ApplePie]

Originally Posted by toronto

I don't care about the Seniors getting screwed out of senior day. This game on Saturday, especially with Paterno likely still there, needs to be cancelled.

Otherwise you will have 106,000 gathered for a support Joe Paterno pep rally, and the kids that went through this hell will go through it all over again.

Paterno resigns or is fired today, different story maybe.

But there is NOT a single person at PSU standing up to the football program right now. Paterno if frigging calling the shots, even around all of this mayhem. Its like he's basically the defacto university president and no one there has the power or balls to get him the hell out of there.

Someone, ANYONE with power, hell get the frigging NCAA President or Big Ten President (has he uttered a word either????) involved and stop this before we're all subjected to one of the worst displays you will ever see on TV in our lifetime.

If this goes through, I will never support NCAA athletics again. Not a single ****ing dime.

The pep rally on Joe's lawn this morning was pretty ****ed up as it is.

[Vinny]

Paterno has just been fired after the Board of Trustees met in University Park. Tom Bradley now interim coach.

[Runner]

Originally Posted by Vinny

Paterno has just been fired after the Board of Trustees met in University Park. Tom Bradley now interim coach.

Wow. That is a very fast fall for a man of such (former) stature. Or slow, if you look at it as twelve years too late.