Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk > Texans Talk Archive
Home Forums Register FAQDonate Automatic Monthly Contribution Members List Mark Forums Read


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-16-2011   #341
thunderkyss 
& so it begins
 
thunderkyss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Texas
Age: 41
Posts: 32,284
Rep Power: 153118 thunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respected
Send a message via Yahoo to thunderkyss
Default Re: Rookie CB a quick comparison - KJ vs Patrick Peterson and others

Quote:
Originally Posted by amazing80 View Post
O I agree with this 100% and I do trust in him, but all I'm saying is, maybe corner should be a top priority yet again next off-season. He did inherit the worst secondary EVER.
Maybe, but we've got 11 games to figure that out.
__________________
thunderkyss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #342
hot pickle
السلام عليكم
 
hot pickle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Winnipeg, Canada
Age: 25
Posts: 2,466
Rep Power: 2074 hot pickle is a quality contributor and well respectedhot pickle is a quality contributor and well respectedhot pickle is a quality contributor and well respectedhot pickle is a quality contributor and well respectedhot pickle is a quality contributor and well respectedhot pickle is a quality contributor and well respectedhot pickle is a quality contributor and well respectedhot pickle is a quality contributor and well respectedhot pickle is a quality contributor and well respectedhot pickle is a quality contributor and well respectedhot pickle is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

kareem jackson sucks! I was defending him all pre season and so far all season, but enough is enough already! why the hell does he play 10-15 yards off his WR every play and joseph is right up there bumping.... is that just wades defense or kareem just suck?
hot pickle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #343
thunderkyss 
& so it begins
 
thunderkyss's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Texas
Age: 41
Posts: 32,284
Rep Power: 153118 thunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respectedthunderkyss is a quality contributor and well respected
Send a message via Yahoo to thunderkyss
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hot pickle View Post
kareem jackson sucks! I was defending him all pre season and so far all season, but enough is enough already! why the hell does he play 10-15 yards off his WR every play and joseph is right up there bumping.... is that just wades defense or kareem just suck?
Wow.... I was scared Kj was going to get burned quite a bit. He was playing bump & run a lot this game.
__________________
thunderkyss is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #344
Rey
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 14,475
Rep Power: 0 Rey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderkyss View Post
Wow.... I was scared Kj was going to get burned quite a bit. He was playing bump & run a lot this game.
So Kareem exceeded your expectations today?
Rey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #345
EllisUnit
Homerism Champ
 
EllisUnit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: San Antonio
Section: 2" from the TV, Screaming.
Age: 29
Posts: 5,589
Rep Power: 44018 EllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

Allen has had some big downs this season BUT he has also had 2 good picks. After all that and i didnt see him play one defensive snap all game. Kubiak needs to get over it and let the best of the 2 bad CBs play. haha
__________________
"Oh, yes, and one more thing, dear Lord about our enemies? Ignore their heathen prayers and help us blow those little bastards straight to hell. Amen again."
EllisUnit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #346
76Texan
Hall of Fame
 
76Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,033
Rep Power: 57325 76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.





Flip these diagrams to correspond with the screen shots.
It looks to me that the Texans were in cover 4 (rather than cover 8 or man).
Cover 4 is the top diagram, cover 8 is the second.





Notice that Boldin was the only receiver on Joseph and Quin's side.
76Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #347
76Texan
Hall of Fame
 
76Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,033
Rep Power: 57325 76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

It makes very little sense to have those two double teaming on Boldin and to leave man coverage on the other side against the bunch formation.

If it was man coverage, it makes more sense with Quin as he middle deep safety.

You can see here that the FS Quin was on the double team with the WCB Joseph.
Quin played over the top (1/2), Joseph trailed (1/4)

The SAM and both ILBS dropped according to the diagram.
There was no blitz, Rey!







The whole sequence is here:

http://s1217.photobucket.com/albums/...20to%20TSmith/
76Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #348
Rey
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 14,475
Rep Power: 0 Rey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

You are writing your own narrative instead of seeing what actually happened. Boldin is their best receiver and it makes no sense to double him?

Seriously, why do you try to explain away anything bad Kareem does? Its hard to take your analysis serious. All you do is post stuff to highlight other corners mistakes and stuff to make kareem's screw ups someone elses fault.


And I said the lb was in zone. I didn't say anyone blitzed, I said the lb was in a zone.
Rey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #349
76Texan
Hall of Fame
 
76Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,033
Rep Power: 57325 76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rey View Post
You are writing your own narrative instead of seeing what actually happened. Boldin is their best receiver and it makes no sense to double him?

Seriously, why do you try to explain away anything bad Kareem does? Its hard to take your analysis serious. All you do is post stuff to highlight other corners mistakes and stuff to make kareem's screw ups someone elses fault.


And I said the lb was in zone. I didn't say anyone blitzed, I said the lb was in a zone.
Sorry, I meant to direct that blitzing part to TK.

So if your premise is to have Joseph and Quin double-teaming on their best receiver and leave Jackson covering half of the field playing man on the other, it's fine with me.
I simply give my take; we each write our own narrative!

It makes more sense to me if it was Kareem and Quin doubling on Boldin and Joseph in man coverage on the other WR if we were to play man.
76Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #350
Rey
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 14,475
Rep Power: 0 Rey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
Sorry, I meant to direct that blitzing part to TK.

So if your premise is to have Joseph and Quin double-teaming on a receiver and leave Jackson covering half of the field playing man, it's fine with me.
I simply give my take; we each write our own narrative!

It makes more sense to me if it was Kareem and Quin doubling on Boldin and Joseph in man coverage on the other WR if we were to play man.
Boldin is their best wr.

It makes more sense to double whoever Kareem is holding though.
Rey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #351
EllisUnit
Homerism Champ
 
EllisUnit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: San Antonio
Section: 2" from the TV, Screaming.
Age: 29
Posts: 5,589
Rep Power: 44018 EllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respectedEllisUnit is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

the fact is that KJ got burned, sure he needed safety help of course whn you are a sorry ass CB u always need safety help, so i can agree with you on every argument u have evenr made about KJ getting beat cause of no safety help. He HAS to have help other wise he gets burned, and burned and burned.
__________________
"Oh, yes, and one more thing, dear Lord about our enemies? Ignore their heathen prayers and help us blow those little bastards straight to hell. Amen again."
EllisUnit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-16-2011   #352
76Texan
Hall of Fame
 
76Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,033
Rep Power: 57325 76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

On the 56yd pass to Boldin, I can't really decide on what coverage the Texans were in.

Here's the sequence:

http://s1217.photobucket.com/albums/...20to%20Boldin/
76Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2011   #353
76Texan
Hall of Fame
 
76Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,033
Rep Power: 57325 76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

If this was man coverage then Manning lost the TE on the crossing route.

But KJ cut that guy off while Quin took the seam route.

Manning might have gotten into Joseph's way a little bit.
Joseph was close but still lost it to the other crosser (Boldin).

If it was cover 2 then Manning blew his coverage.

IMO, this is a more difficult pass and a more difficult catch.
Antonio and Watt got to Flacco just a fraction late.

So why didn't we double up on Boldin here, Rey?

In a sense we double up on the other receiver and Joseph was unable to defend Boldin on this play.
76Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2011   #354
leebigeztx
Hall of Fame
 
leebigeztx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: League City formerly of LaMarque
Age: 43
Posts: 1,519
Rep Power: 23128 leebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respectedleebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respectedleebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respectedleebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respectedleebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respectedleebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respectedleebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respectedleebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respectedleebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respectedleebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respectedleebigeztx is a quality contributor and well respected
Send a message via MSN to leebigeztx
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

76texan, I understand like your play breakdowns, but jackson just isn't good. He's not a technique or a speed. Once he opens his hips, his speed is gone.his route rocognition. Is very poor also. Smith is a sped guy and he still gave up one of 2 routes he can run. I wish there was an easy fix, but cbs who can't run just doesn't work.

On the bouldin 56 yd pass, it was a terrible throw that joseph lost track of.
__________________
Be a student of the game, not a fan.
leebigeztx is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2011   #355
76Texan
Hall of Fame
 
76Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,033
Rep Power: 57325 76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by leebigeztx View Post
76texan, I understand like your play breakdowns, but jackson just isn't good. He's not a technique or a speed. Once he opens his hips, his speed is gone.his route rocognition. Is very poor also. Smith is a sped guy and he still gave up one of 2 routes he can run. I wish there was an easy fix, but cbs who can't run just doesn't work.

.
To me, on this play, Jackson (in cover 4) was looking to play a possible corner or seam route by the WR and the out route by the TE.

If it was man, then Jackson was bad on top of the usual poor scheme.

For in man coverage, to have a CB playing outside leverage against an inside release by the receiver is bad percentage.

"For a QB, a throw to the open field is an easy throw and also gives the receiver the whole field to work with.

On the other hand, a throw to the outside is a longer, more difficult throw. Besides, you have the sideline as your friend even if the receiver does make the catch."
76Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2011   #356
Vinny
shiny happy fan
 
Vinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Age: 50
Posts: 21,512
Rep Power: 109004 Vinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rey View Post
Boldin is their best wr.

It makes more sense to double whoever Kareem is holding though.
why? Torrey Smith is a rookie that is a one trick pony. He's still a poor route runner and is a long ball specialist (only)...that's why Jackson has the massive cushion.

I don't see what 76 sees in Jackson...all I see is a bunch of rationalizations. Don't get me wrong, rationalizations are more important than sex, so I can see where you are coming from.
__________________
http://twitter.com/#!/TexansTalk


"A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves" - Edward R. Murrow
Vinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2011   #357
Rey
Hall of Fame
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 14,475
Rep Power: 0 Rey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respectedRey is a quality contributor and well respected
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
why? Torrey Smith is a rookie that is a one trick pony. He's still a poor route runner and is a long ball specialist (only)...that's why Jackson has the massive cushion.

I don't see what 76 sees in Jackson...all I see is a bunch of rationalizations. Don't get me wrong, rationalizations are more important than sex, so I can see where you are coming from.
I was joking. Being facetious. Poking fun at Jackson.

Kareem has not been a good player.
Rey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2011   #358
76Texan
Hall of Fame
 
76Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,033
Rep Power: 57325 76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
why? Torrey Smith is a rookie that is a one trick pony. He's still a poor route runner and is a long ball specialist (only)...that's why Jackson has the massive cushion.

I don't see what 76 sees in Jackson...all I see is a bunch of rationalizations. Don't get me wrong, rationalizations are more important than sex, so I can see where you are coming from.
Against fast receiver, it's not uncommon for a CB to give more cushion than normal.
Ask Jason Allen when he gave up the long TD pass to Mike Wallace last year.

In this case, however, as I've mentioned to Rey before, it can be similar as in the Saints game, where Joseph was the one who normally gave more cushion to the receiver (at least in the last 3 scoring drives for the Saints that I took the screen shots of) regardless of whom he was on.

It depends on the coverage call, from what I see.

BTW, to be exact, KJ's cushion was 7 yards in a backpedal; Allen's was 8 yard in the shuffle:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bDdr6...eature=related
76Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2011   #359
76Texan
Hall of Fame
 
76Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,033
Rep Power: 57325 76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected76Texan is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

On a side note, it's kind of weird when people think that Kubiak's job is on the line and he keeps putting Jackson out there over Allen.
Perhaps Wade went along so he can take over Kubiak's job.
But wait, isn't Wade the guy who decides which guys play on defense?
So if he chooses to bench the better player, shouldn't it be on him?

76Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-17-2011   #360
Vinny
shiny happy fan
 
Vinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Age: 50
Posts: 21,512
Rep Power: 109004 Vinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: Kareem Jackson's plight.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 76Texan View Post
On a side note, it's kind of weird when people think that Kubiak's job is on the line and he keeps putting Jackson out there over Allen.
Perhaps Wade went along so he can take over Kubiak's job.
But wait, isn't Wade the guy who decides which guys play on defense?
So if he chooses to bench the better player, shouldn't it be on him?

I don't think that either Jackson or Allen are starting caliber guys. Sure they have the body for it, but their body of work says that Allen is a dime corner, and Jackson is a nick. Texans just don't have anyone better really.
__________________
http://twitter.com/#!/TexansTalk


"A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves" - Edward R. Murrow
Vinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk > Texans Talk Archive
Home Forums Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:50 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Ad Management by RedTyger