The All Encompassing FIRE KUBIAK thread

[kiwitexansfan]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I have none. But I've got 4 games worth of evidence that says they'll find a way to win.

Maybe the truth of the NFL is that you can only afford so many talented people. We happen to have all ours on Offense and are backing ourselves to blow teams out of the water often enough to make the playoffs.

[ObsiWan]

Originally Posted by DexmanC

soooooooooooo.... I'm saying a coach that's taken his team to the playoffs
a couple times within 5 years gets more "benefit of the doubt." Kubiak's
in a position where he has to deliver, even if all 53 men on the roster are
lost, and he has to bring in reserve players from the CFL.

First, I think all head coaches this side of Sean Payton or Belichick have to deliver. Payton because he did the near impossible, made the Saints S/B champs, and Belichick because, love him or hate him, he produces year in/year out.

Second, let me understand something; you're saying that less is expected from Norv Turner (who's 2-4 Chargers were expected to win the AFC West going away this year) than from Kubiak who, as you guys delight in pointing out, does not yet have a winning record as a head coach.
You're saying Turner gets a free pass on a 2-4 record (did I mention he's 0-2 in his division?) because he couldn't replace TWO GUYS??

Yet Kubiak must produce even if he has to replace all 53? Is that what you just told us?

Didn't we lose our starting LT and two WRs at times this year? Oh, my bad, only other teams get to make excuses.

[Scooter]

edit: too drunk for coherant thought.

[DexmanC]

Originally Posted by ObsiWan

First, I think all head coaches this side of Sean Payton or Belichick have to deliver. Payton because he did the near impossible, made the Saints S/B champs, and Belichick because, love him or hate him, he produces year in/year out.

Second, let me understand something; you're saying that less is expected from Norv Turner (who's 2-4 Chargers were expected to win the AFC West going away this year) than from Kubiak who, as you guys delight in pointing out, does not yet have a winning record as a head coach.
You're saying Turner gets a free pass on a 2-4 record (did I mention he's 0-2 in his division?) because he couldn't replace TWO GUYS??

Yet Kubiak must produce even if he has to replace all 53? Is that what you just told us?

Didn't we lose our starting LT and two WRs at times this year? Oh, my bad, only other teams get to make excuses.

I know more about Kubiak than I do of Norv, and if Gary is on his job,
I'll have nothing to argue about. If Kubiak's doing what he's supposed
to, you'll have no reason to defend him. The very fact you can't just
dismiss what I'm saying is illustrative of the problem. Kubiak is walking
a VERY FINE LINE right now. How prepared his team comes out at
Indy, a team they play TWICE A YEAR, with TWO WEEKS TO PREPARE
for JUST Indy, will speak VOLUMES about his preparation and coaching.

I'm a Texans fan. Kubiak must show me why I should be a fan of HIM.

[JB]

Originally Posted by DexmanC

Yes, we're 4-2. Give up 24 points on any of our division teams,
Jets, or Ravens, that's a potential 7 losses right there. This defense,
that Kubiak's responsible for, is HORRRRREENNNNDOUSSS.

We can't count the loss of Demeco as an excuse, because they
were still horrendous with him in there. Cushing isn't the animal
he was last year, and the kiddie corners got worked by receivers
with bad hands today.

The run defense is merely average. When a team runs with dedication,
they will wear this defense SMOOTH OUT. The offense can NOT put up
35-40 points a week. If we're to sniff 6 more wins this season, the
defense MUST find a way to hold people under 20 points. Has
not happened yet, and we've played more than 1/3 of the season.

Wait. I thought you were saying it's all about the RESULTS...

Now you are saying it's not about the results but how we played? Make up your mind.

[DexmanC]

Originally Posted by JB

Wait. I thought you were saying it's all about the RESULTS...

Now you are saying it's not about the results but how we played? Make up your mind.

The results are incomplete.

Results = Playoff berth after 16 games
(I would add AFC South Division Title to this definition,
but some people would call that decision "mean.")

There is NO achievement at THIS point of the season, as we're only
1/3 of the way through. I will not say "job well done," with 2/3 of the
schedule still-to-play. My assessment of this team is on what I've
seen until all 16 have been played..

This trend of sloppy execution and horrible preparation is my biggest
gripe with this regime right now. Two weeks to prepare for the Colts
should negate ANY excuse to see on MNF what we've witnessed over
the last 6 games. I want to see this team well-prepared, well-coached,
and executing the game plan like a machine in two weeks.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by DexmanC

If they go to Indy and win, then I'll back off until they lose
3-in-a-row. Until then, I'll be criticizing all through the bye
week.

I doubt it. That you'll back off that is.

Until they lose to Indy, I'm going to have faith that GK can get this team fixed. IMO, the biggest thing this team has lacked, has been fortitude. Forget the refs, forget the last play, forget that our Teammate has just been carted off the field. Forget they've been whup'n our butts for the last 3 Qtrs.... go play the best you can & win.

I'm very close to believing they've got it now. Very close. I think it's great that we got the light end of the schedule on the front end. I don't think this team would have done what it did today against the Ravens, or the Colts (I know they wouldn't have done it against the Colts), or the Jags or the Titans.


I'm freak'n ecstatic that they pulled this one out. ecstatic.

I hear what you're saying about our Defense. But I like the guys we got out there. I saw what they did last year, & we only added a few people to that side of the ball in the offseason, which to me is a plus. Gives me faith, that we can repeat what we did last year. If Kj can play as well as Dunta... & I already believe he can. If Kubiak will replace McCain (or if McCain would get back to the way he played last year)... If Demeco isn't seriously hurt..... we got this.

Dagnabbit, just found out Ryans is done for the season.

[DexmanC]

Demeco is done for the year. The LB corp needs to step its game up.
They've been horrible all year long.

[Pantherstang84]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

I doubt it. That you'll back off that is.

Until they lose to Indy, I'm going to have faith that GK can get this team fixed. IMO, the biggest thing this team has lacked, has been fortitude. Forget the refs, forget the last play, forget that our Teammate has just been carted off the field. Forget they've been whup'n our butts for the last 3 Qtrs.... go play the best you can & win.

I'm very close to believing they've got it now. Very close. I think it's great that we got the light end of the schedule on the front end. I don't think this team would have done what it did today against the Ravens, or the Colts (I know they wouldn't have done it against the Colts), or the Jags or the Titans.


I'm freak'n ecstatic that they pulled this one out. ecstatic.

I hear what you're saying about our Defense. But I like the guys we got out there. I saw what they did last year, & we only added a few people to that side of the ball in the offseason, which to me is a plus. Gives me faith, that we can repeat what we did last year. If Kj can play as well as Dunta... & I already believe he can. If Kubiak will replace McCain (or if McCain would get back to the way he played last year)... If Demeco isn't seriously hurt..... we got this.

I believe it has already been established that Demeco is seriously hurt.

[ObsiWan]

Look, for the record, I, too, hate the way our defense is playing. ...or rather NOT playing.
They suck. No question.
I totally agree that odds are we can't keep winning if we keep giving up nearly four TDs a game - our avg is 27.67 against. Abysmal. That needs to be fixed in a hurry.

But I also see this.... Whether it's the coaches not letting them quit, the players' own will to win, or the staff gathering the kind of players that don't ever quit; we're finding ways to win games that we would have given up on before. That's why I'm a Sunshine clubber. If this team ever starts to give up or quit on games then I'll get a pink soap avatar too.

But not until then.

[ObsiWan]

Originally Posted by DexmanC

Demeco is done for the year. The LB corp needs to step its game up.
They've been horrible all year long.

Hey, we agree on something. Their pass coverage has been attrocious.

[GP]

The Chiefs, today, played like the Texans usually play.

Get the lead, and still find a way to lose the game. The same sound you heard from the Chiefs today (that hissing noise as if air being released from a balloon) was eerily similar to what we are all well-accustomed to hearing.

We're the ones usually moaning about how we let one get away. Haley has his team playing pretty good ball overall, but they couldn't seal the deal. The pressure was too great. The pinhole in the balloon widened and all the air went out of it.

But us? We know we can do it and keep the thing aired up until the end. The biggest problem is that we're doing it against teams who crumble under the pressure. When we face a team who has its back against the wall, we revert back to the old "can't win for losing" attitude. Our guys take a proverbial vacation that week, somehow choosing to not really try on offense at all.

Our defense, though, at least they are consistent. You know every week they are going to allow pockets of open field for a receiver to sit down in and catch a 13-yard pass on 3rd and 11. Every week, they're going to let teams waltz down the field at will and eat up clock while doing it. At least we know who they are.

Our offense is erratic, and OBVIOUSLY inferior without Andre Johnson at near full strength/full strength.

How's THAT for a summary of where we are right now? I think that's accurate.

[Porky]

Kubes and Rick Smith need to go. This carriage is about to turn into a pumpkin, and whomever said all the talent is on offense may be right, but that is not faint praise of this braintrust because just about every #1 choice in the draft in the Kubiak era has been on defense, and most of the other high picks as well.

If they aren't performing up to snuff, they have nobody to blame but themselves, and at some point they have to own up to the failures. They could have hired a decent DC. Instead they took the easy road with Frank Bush. They could have kept Dunta and/or Reeves. They could have made appropriate trades. They could have drafted just ONE freaking safety with range who could potentially help with this kiddie corner group.

They did none of that. This all comes back on RS and GK, and it's time for a change to someone that understands the value of a good safety in this day and age, and can actually draft one. Two regimes = no decent safety in 8 years. I'm still waiting.

For the record, I am against firing Kubiak in the middle of the season ESPECIALLY considering we are sitting at 4-2. But when I look into my crystal ball, I am concerned about the next 10 games considering how we have played in the first 6 and how porous our defense has looked.

[thunderkyss]

Originally Posted by Ckw5814

For the record, I am against firing Kubiak in the middle of the season ESPECIALLY considering we are sitting at 4-2. But when I look into my crystal ball, I am concerned about the next 10 games considering how we have played in the first 6 and how porous our defense has looked.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. I doubt there is a sunshiner anywhere who isn't concerned about our defense. Some of us (raises hand) are concerned about our offense as well.

But I'm not going to say it's about Wins & Losses one year & then tell you it's about consistency the next.

I also won't insult this team & say they don't want to win, or that they have no "fire" when they get beat from time to time like every other team.

[steelbtexan]

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. I doubt there is a sunshiner anywhere who isn't concerned about our defense. Some of us (raises hand) are concerned about our offense as well.

But I'm not going to say it's about Wins & Losses one year & then tell you it's about consistency the next.

I also won't insult this team & say they don't want to win, or that they have no "fire" when they get beat from time to time like every other team.

Agreed

Lets see how the rest of the season plays out. It's impossible to fully get behind team schitzophrenia.

But if they dont make the playoffs it's time for the pink soap.

Originally Posted by thunderkyss

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. I doubt there is a sunshiner anywhere who isn't concerned about our defense. Some of us (raises hand) are concerned about our offense as well.

But I'm not going to say it's about Wins & Losses one year & then tell you it's about consistency the next.

I also won't insult this team & say they don't want to win, or that they have no "fire" when they get beat from time to time like every other team.

I think you guys misunderstand the "Fire Kubiak Club." Sure, it is about wins and losses. But it is also about HOW you play the game and get those wins. Last year even though we had our first winning record in franchise history, we did not play the game how we needed to play the game, and that is why we did not make the playoffs.

Also, as another poster said, the wins and losses argument is incomplete. We haven't even completed the season. Some of us invision what the future will be like if we continue to play the way we have been playing in the past and present. It is not a pretty sight.

Finally, at the end of the day, the "Fire Kubiak Club" cares about one thing: playoffs. Some have used the term results but our interpretation of results needs to be clarified. We don't care about 4-2. Sure it is nice, but 4-2 could EASILY, with this schedule, turn into 6-10. We want playoffs, and we want to be shown a sign that this team can compete in the playoffs. If we get blown out by every big time team we face, sure we got to the playoffs but still can't compete in the playoffs. That is what we are after.

[awtysst]

Originally Posted by Rey

I've seen coaches get fired even after taking their teams to the play-offs.

I'm not saying Kubiak should be fired (yet), but I do not think that he has done a great job this season...despite his W/L record...

See, it works both ways....

A coach can be doing a better job than his record indicates, or he can be doing a worse job than his record indicates...

I'd actually like to Kubiak, just present a team that comes out and plays good football from all aspects in one of the wins we've had...Or hell...even one of the losses...Doesn't matter...

"How" this team has been playing is poorly for the most part. I'm very happy we got the win today,but c'mon...You'd really have to be sticking your head in the sand to ignore the many shortcomings we have...especially defensively...

I actually think the offense is fine, but I doubt we are going to be able to win shootouts every week...

Can you give examples? It would be interesting to see how the team fared in subsequent years.

[JB]

Originally Posted by awtysst

Can you give examples? It would be interesting to see how the team fared in subsequent years.

Marty S. comes to mind. He got fired after the Chargers went 14-2 and to the AFC championship game iirc.

Bum Phillips was also fired after going to the wild card game.

[Double Barrel]

Originally Posted by gary

Dom had five seasons here is only fair Gary has the same amount of time. Injuries or not the good teams find ways to overcome those.

Capers was here for four seasons. 4-12, 5-11, 7-9, 2-14.

This is Kubiak's fifth season as HC.

I said it before the season started and I'm sticking to it: I reserve judgment on Kubiak until the season is over.

While I certainly understand the frustration in this thread about the inconsistent football that we are witnessing, I'm not going to lie, 4-2 feels great!!!

The Texans snatched victory from the jaws of defeat yesterday, and like most every other Texans fan, I thought we were going to lose for 59 minutes and 32 seconds. But man, you've got to give credit where it's due, and both the players and coaches showed us something that this franchise is not known for: resilience.

Who knows what the future holds, but I do know that we - as fans - should sit back, take a breather on the bye-week, and just enjoy 4-2 right now.