Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQDonate Automatic Monthly Contribution Members List Mark Forums Read


Texans Talk Football talk only please. Keep it to the game, the players, the coaches and management.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-03-2009   #1
Wolf
100% Texan
 
Wolf's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Kerrville
Age: 44
Posts: 37,158
Rep Power: 99659 Wolf is a quality contributor and well respectedWolf is a quality contributor and well respectedWolf is a quality contributor and well respectedWolf is a quality contributor and well respectedWolf is a quality contributor and well respectedWolf is a quality contributor and well respectedWolf is a quality contributor and well respectedWolf is a quality contributor and well respectedWolf is a quality contributor and well respectedWolf is a quality contributor and well respectedWolf is a quality contributor and well respected
Default SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

Quote:
his is the ninth in a series of team-by-team breakdowns that will run on SportingNews.com before the start of training camp.

Reporting date: July 30

Houston finished the 2008 season on an upward tick, winning five of its last six games to tie a franchise record with an 8-8 record.

The Texans entered '08 with high expectations after posting a .500 mark in '07, too. So mediocrity appears to be wearing out its welcome in Houston. The club now expects to make a push toward the postseason.

"We've obviously gotten better over the course of the last two years," Texans coach Gary Kubiak said. "We have a bunch of young players. They are not young anymore. It's time for us to take the next step."

Central to that evolution into playoff contender will be significant improvement on defense. After another season of inconsistency and underperformance, Kubiak fired defensive coordinator Richard Smith, secondary coach Jon Hoke and line coach Jethro Franklin, promoting Frank Bush to coordinator and hiring Bill Kollar to coach the line and David Gibbs the secondary.

Quote:
An opponent breaks down the Texans:

"Their strength on defense is the defensive line. They've got some quick inside guys in (Amobi) Okoye and (Travis) Johnson, and they've got Mario (Williams) coming off the edge. They've got a pretty good middle linebacker (DeMeco Ryans), who is somewhat overrated but still a good player. I'd say Ryans is the only linebacker considered a 'real' NFL starter.

"In the secondary, they've got only the corner (Dunta Robinson) who is a good player. After that, they didn't really have any other starters on the back end. If they couldn't get pressure up front—which they did sometimes—the secondary would give up a lots of plays deep because they don't have any players back there.

"Offensively, they're real aggressive. They're going to get the ball to Andre Johnson—short, on slants, on crossing routes—and they're going to make you have to account for him. Because teams focus so much attention on Andre, the tight end (Owen Daniels) is going to come open on crossing routes and (Kevin) Walter is also going to make plays. (Running back Steve) Slaton came on strong last season, but at his size you have to wonder if he can do it again."
Bottom Line
http://www.sportingnews.com/nfl/arti...snt-pass-grade
Wolf is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2009   #2
Thorn 
Dirty Old Man
 
Thorn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Houston
Section: Restrained in the mental ward
Age: 63
Posts: 21,654
Rep Power: 224197 Thorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respectedThorn is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

from the article:
Quote:
Led by end Williams, the defensive line is a solid unit, capable of becoming dominant. But if the linebackers and defensive backs behind them don't produce, the Texans could be eyeing a third consecutive .500 season.
True, very true, and also completely obvious. The key to this year is defensive improvement, if that doesn't happen, we don't compete like we want to.
__________________


"Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid." --- John Wayne
Thorn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2009   #3
Texan4Ever
Hall of Fame
 
Texan4Ever's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: The Great State of Texas
Section: My couch
Age: 24
Posts: 4,087
Rep Power: 17475 Texan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respectedTexan4Ever is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

Travis Johnson, a quick guy? He's anything but quick IMO!
Texan4Ever is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2009   #4
False Start
On # 69
 
False Start's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Waiting For the Turning Point!
Section: 420
Posts: 12,737
Rep Power: 69312 False Start is a quality contributor and well respectedFalse Start is a quality contributor and well respectedFalse Start is a quality contributor and well respectedFalse Start is a quality contributor and well respectedFalse Start is a quality contributor and well respectedFalse Start is a quality contributor and well respectedFalse Start is a quality contributor and well respectedFalse Start is a quality contributor and well respectedFalse Start is a quality contributor and well respectedFalse Start is a quality contributor and well respectedFalse Start is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

Quote:
They've got a pretty good middle linebacker (DeMeco Ryans), who is somewhat overrated but still a good player.
__________________

RIP DIMEBAG DARRELL - 1966-2004 - GETCHA PULL!

CLIFF BURTON 1962-1986 - CLIFF EM' ALL!
WINTERFELL - BECAUSE STANNIS PUSHED IT
False Start is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2009   #5
Maddict5
Hall of Fame
 
Maddict5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 5,477
Rep Power: 5500 Maddict5 is a quality contributor and well respectedMaddict5 is a quality contributor and well respectedMaddict5 is a quality contributor and well respectedMaddict5 is a quality contributor and well respectedMaddict5 is a quality contributor and well respectedMaddict5 is a quality contributor and well respectedMaddict5 is a quality contributor and well respectedMaddict5 is a quality contributor and well respectedMaddict5 is a quality contributor and well respectedMaddict5 is a quality contributor and well respectedMaddict5 is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

i dont think the d-line is 'solid'. doesnt rush the passer well (bar mario) and just about average in stopping the run
Maddict5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2009   #6
TheRealJoker
Hall of Fame
 
TheRealJoker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Conroe
Age: 27
Posts: 3,644
Rep Power: 8652 TheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respectedTheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respectedTheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respectedTheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respectedTheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respectedTheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respectedTheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respectedTheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respectedTheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respectedTheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respectedTheRealJoker is a quality contributor and well respected
Send a message via AIM to TheRealJoker
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

Interesting article but I think the writer overrates the DL just a tad. For all intensive purposes Mario has been a 1 man pass rush and nobody other than him stands out against the run or the pass. Okoye showed flashes the first half of his rookie season, Bulman is a good change of pace high motor type player, but other than that we dont deserve the "close to dominant" label the writer gives us. Hopefully Okoye makes the jump Mario made and someone emerges at NT, sprinkle in Antonio Smith not being Anthony Weaver and Connor Barwin being someone other than Mario that QBs have to look out for and maybe the DL will be a solid unit!
__________________
What did the city of Houston do to anger the football gods?
TheRealJoker is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2009   #7
nero THE zero
Hall of Fame
 
nero THE zero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Spring
Age: 30
Posts: 2,654
Rep Power: 17337 nero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respectednero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respectednero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respectednero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respectednero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respectednero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respectednero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respectednero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respectednero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respectednero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respectednero THE zero is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maddict5 View Post
i dont think the d-line is 'solid'. doesnt rush the passer well (bar mario) and just about average in stopping the run
I've been wondering about this. We constantly hear from NFL-people that we have a very talented defensive line. Lance Zierlein, prior to our opening game last season, said his dad focused on our d-line and was very worried about it, I remember getting a lot of praise from a coach last season about the d-line (Belichick I want to say,) and now this "opponent" parrots those sentiments.

It seems to be unanimous among people in the game (re: not pundits, but people in the know) that we have a very talented defensive line. Yet, we aren't realizing that potential. Is the switch to Bush and Kollar going to help bring it out? Will the upgrade at LB have a positive effect? Or will it be same story, different season?
nero THE zero is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored links
Old 07-03-2009   #8
gtexan02
Working?
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Boston
Age: 30
Posts: 15,605
Rep Power: 58645 gtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respectedgtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respectedgtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respectedgtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respectedgtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respectedgtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respectedgtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respectedgtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respectedgtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respectedgtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respectedgtexan02 is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

So we have Dunta an Demeco on defense behind our DL, and those are our only 2 "starters"? Yeah, right... this guy only cares about name recognition
__________________
Drinking the kool aid
gtexan02 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-03-2009   #9
gary
Hall of Fame
 
gary's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Wheelchair
Age: 22
Posts: 21,043
Rep Power: 33836 gary is a quality contributor and well respectedgary is a quality contributor and well respectedgary is a quality contributor and well respectedgary is a quality contributor and well respectedgary is a quality contributor and well respectedgary is a quality contributor and well respectedgary is a quality contributor and well respectedgary is a quality contributor and well respectedgary is a quality contributor and well respectedgary is a quality contributor and well respectedgary is a quality contributor and well respected
Send a message via AIM to gary
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

Maybe the DL wasn't a solid unit last year but this year I think the Texans have enough tools in place to start becoming a solid unit. TJ better start getting his game more up to par or I don't see him being the Texans roster much longer. Now that there is different coaching in place maybe TJ's game will improve significantly to ensure him a spot on the roster same goes for Amobi. As for Smith and Barwin they should help out the pass rush if not this year then certainly down the line as they both learn together the way the way the Texans run their D plays which will help out the play of the second dary in a huge way.
__________________
Without the strength to endure the crisis, one will not see the opportunity within. It is within the process of endurance that opportunity reveals itself.
Chin-Ning Chu -
gary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2009   #10
LZ
Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 263
Rep Power: 5396 LZ is a quality contributor and well respectedLZ is a quality contributor and well respectedLZ is a quality contributor and well respectedLZ is a quality contributor and well respectedLZ is a quality contributor and well respectedLZ is a quality contributor and well respectedLZ is a quality contributor and well respectedLZ is a quality contributor and well respectedLZ is a quality contributor and well respectedLZ is a quality contributor and well respectedLZ is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

Quote:
Originally Posted by nero THE zero View Post
I've been wondering about this. We constantly hear from NFL-people that we have a very talented defensive line. Lance Zierlein, prior to our opening game last season, said his dad focused on our d-line and was very worried about it, I remember getting a lot of praise from a coach last season about the d-line (Belichick I want to say,) and now this "opponent" parrots those sentiments.

It seems to be unanimous among people in the game (re: not pundits, but people in the know) that we have a very talented defensive line. Yet, we aren't realizing that potential. Is the switch to Bush and Kollar going to help bring it out? Will the upgrade at LB have a positive effect? Or will it be same story, different season?
I think the feeling on the defensive line pre-season vs. postseason was much different.
LZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-26-2009   #11
DocBar
Hall of Fame
 
DocBar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: I'm international
Section: Channel 700-ish on NFL Sunday Ticket
Age: 44
Posts: 9,349
Rep Power: 76476 DocBar is a quality contributor and well respectedDocBar is a quality contributor and well respectedDocBar is a quality contributor and well respectedDocBar is a quality contributor and well respectedDocBar is a quality contributor and well respectedDocBar is a quality contributor and well respectedDocBar is a quality contributor and well respectedDocBar is a quality contributor and well respectedDocBar is a quality contributor and well respectedDocBar is a quality contributor and well respectedDocBar is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

I agree with most of this analysis. The DL IS very talented but they have been very poorly coached and put into situations that don't suit the talents of the players. This is very obvious and commented on constantly. Are Bush and Kollar the answer? We're about to find out. I think the LB corps was better than expected last year but still not up to snuff. I've never heard ANYONE but the opponent analysis guy say Ryans is OVERrated. He's been the one standout at LB we've ever really had. The guy hit the secondary on the head. Reeves wasn't as bad as he seemed last year, but was still FAR from dominant. IMO he needs to work on his neck flexability. He can't turn to look for the ball for sh*t. All in all, I think we're in for a much more productive season on the D side because of a change in scheme, better personnel at some key positions and MW and DRYANS are being great leaders.
DocBar is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-26-2009   #12
Vinny
shiny happy fan
 
Vinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Age: 50
Posts: 21,825
Rep Power: 156418 Vinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

This team reminds me of the Rams team before Lovie Smith took over the D (Smith used his successful stint as Rams DC to land the Bears HC job). Before Smith, the Rams were all high powered offense and a defense only a Mother would love. Perhaps Bush can do what Lovie did for that SB bound Rams team.
__________________
http://twitter.com/#!/TexansTalk


"A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves" - Edward R. Murrow
Vinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-26-2009   #13
dalemurphy
Hall of Fame
 
dalemurphy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Austin
Section: Bullpen/ 636
Age: 40
Posts: 5,734
Rep Power: 56079 dalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respecteddalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respecteddalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respecteddalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respecteddalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respecteddalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respecteddalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respecteddalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respecteddalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respecteddalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respecteddalemurphy is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
This team reminds me of the Rams team before Lovie Smith took over the D (Smith used his successful stint as Rams DC to land the Bears HC job). Before Smith, the Rams were all high powered offense and a defense only a Mother would love. Perhaps Bush can do what Lovie did for that SB bound Rams team.
Vinny, I like the analogy. I was so angry last year at the soft and unaggressive defense. If a team has a potent offense, it only makes sense to be aggressive on defense, makes some plays- even at the expense of giving up more big plays. At the end of the day, if our defense increases the tempo of the game, the end result is a couple more posessions a game for our best unit: offense. I'm encouraged that we actually will see an aggressive defense this season. As long as they can make plays, I won't cry over them giving up some long TDs in the second quarter.
dalemurphy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-26-2009   #14
Vinny
shiny happy fan
 
Vinny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Age: 50
Posts: 21,825
Rep Power: 156418 Vinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respectedVinny is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny View Post
This team reminds me of the Rams team before Lovie Smith took over the D (Smith used his successful stint as Rams DC to land the Bears HC job). Before Smith, the Rams were all high powered offense and a defense only a Mother would love. Perhaps Bush can do what Lovie did for that SB bound Rams team.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dalemurphy View Post
Vinny, I like the analogy. I was so angry last year at the soft and unaggressive defense. If a team has a potent offense, it only makes sense to be aggressive on defense, makes some plays- even at the expense of giving up more big plays. At the end of the day, if our defense increases the tempo of the game, the end result is a couple more posessions a game for our best unit: offense. I'm encouraged that we actually will see an aggressive defense this season. As long as they can make plays, I won't cry over them giving up some long TDs in the second quarter.
Smith brought an uptempo style to the Rams just like what Bush is trying to install here...a more of an attacking style, instead of a more passive read and react with the front 7
Quote:
Last season, pre-Smith, the Rams' defense allowed a league-high 471 points, the worst performance ever by a playoff team. The defense was so soft that running back Marshall Faulk volunteered to be a two-way player and double as a cornerback.

Coach Mike Martz, tired of knowing that his offense had to score 30 or more points a game to have a chance to win, fired four defensive coaches. Then he hired Smith away from Tampa Bay, where he was an assistant under Tony Dungy.

Smith, from Big Sandy, Tex., population 500, had earned his stripes, first building an impressive résumé as a college assistant working at Tulsa, Wisconsin, Arizona State, Tennessee, Kentucky and Ohio State. It was the last program where Smith, as coach of the defensive backs, developed six players into first- or second-round draft picks.

Once in St. Louis, Martz and Smith brought in a number of new Rams defenders, with this year's defense featuring an incredible eight new starters.

This is where almost everyone in football shakes their head in amazement. In football it normally takes years for a system to jell after that kind of turnover, but the Rams are enjoying a smooth transition. The defense is allowing just over 13 points a game, down more than two touchdowns from last season.

Last year St. Louis gave up 70 points in its first two games; this season it has allowed only 67 points after five. St. Louis's defense, after spending much of last season ranked at the bottom, is now in the top 10.

''Defensively, I am real excited about where we are,'' Martz said. ''I think we are a complete football team right now.''

Smith has engineered the turnaround by bringing the Buccaneers' style of play to St. Louis. He tells his players to be aggressive, pursue the football and create turnovers.
http://www.nytimes.com/2001/10/17/sp...se-around.html
__________________
http://twitter.com/#!/TexansTalk


"A nation of sheep begets a government of wolves" - Edward R. Murrow
Vinny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-26-2009   #15
Norg
Hall of Fame
 
Norg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,615
Rep Power: 11489 Norg is a quality contributor and well respectedNorg is a quality contributor and well respectedNorg is a quality contributor and well respectedNorg is a quality contributor and well respectedNorg is a quality contributor and well respectedNorg is a quality contributor and well respectedNorg is a quality contributor and well respectedNorg is a quality contributor and well respectedNorg is a quality contributor and well respectedNorg is a quality contributor and well respectedNorg is a quality contributor and well respected
Default Re: SN:Texans camp countdown: Offense is playoff-worthy, but D doesn't pass the grade

well good thing our divison isnt a pass happy Divison other then the colts who i think will regress this season

IMO aganist Titans Jags and COlts our team will not need to get to the QB maybe just pressure him and play zone all the teams will throw short yardage dinks and dunks
Norg is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Houston Texans Message Board & Forum - TexansTalk.com > The Great Fans of the Houston Texans > Texans Talk
Home Forums Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:54 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Ad Management by RedTyger