nfl mock draft 1.0 off nfl.com

[Lucky]

Originally Posted by Hoth-Boy

I'm not convinced I want him on my team, as somebody said somewhere else "He looks like a skiner Vernon Gholston". That's not a compliment.

Now a player can be too fit? Really?

Originally Posted by bah007

To me, it looks like Maybin is pretty maxed out.

Maybin's 20 and he's already maxed out? Jeez.

The best reason not to take Maybin is his youth and inexperience. Kubiak needs to win now. He's still waiting for Okoye, the '07 wunderkind, to develop. Draft Maybin, and it might be the next head coach who reaps the benifit. Still, I would hate for this organization to pass on a player who in 3 seasons could be as good as any player in this draft.

[bah007]

Originally Posted by Lucky

Now a player can be too fit? Really?


Maybin's 20 and he's already maxed out? Jeez.

The best reason not to take Maybin is his youth and inexperience. Kubiak needs to win now. He's still waiting for Okoye, the '07 wunderkind, to develop. Draft Maybin, and it might be the next head coach who reaps the benifit. Still, I would hate for this organization to pass on a player who in 3 seasons could be as good as any player in this draft.

Not what I meant.

We were talking about Maybin being able to put on extra weight so he could play DE. I don't think he can.

[Lucky]

Originally Posted by bah007

Not what I meant.

We were talking about Maybin being able to put on extra weight so he could play DE.

I'm saying how is it possible that a 20 year old that's already around 245 lbs not be able to put on weight over the course of his career? The 2011 Maybin could look much different than the 2009 version. And likely will.

[bah007]

Originally Posted by Lucky

I'm saying how is it possible that a 20 year old that's already around 245 lbs not be able to put on weight over the course of his career? The 2011 Maybin could look much different than the 2009 version. And likely will.

Well how much do you think he can gain?

I'm not saying he is gonna weigh 245 for the rest of his life, but most teams like their three down DE's at least 265 (not all, but most) and JMO, but I don't think he will be able to add that much.

If you think he can, then great.

[Lucky]

Originally Posted by bah007

Well how much do you think he can gain?

I think you're overemphasizing weight. First, can he play? If so, then it's a matter of putting him in a position to succeed.

I could make a list of NFL DEs of similar size to Maybin when they were drafted. But, what's the point? The Texans need to find players who can make plays and put them in a position to do so. Not bind their decisions by metric limitations.

[bah007]

Originally Posted by Lucky

I think you're overemphasizing weight. First, can he play? If so, then it's a matter of putting him in a position to succeed.

I could make a list of NFL DEs of similar size to Maybin when they were drafted. But, what's the point? The Texans need to find players who can make plays and put them in a position to do so. Not bind their decisions by metric limitations.

Either I'm not a very good communicator or you're just not getting it.

A question was asked about whether or not Maybin could add more weight to his frame. I don't believe that he can. I just answered the question. That's all I did. I didn't add anything about how that affects him as a prospect.

I also believe that has nothing to do with him as a player.

If you read previous posts I have made then you will find that I think weight has very little importance at all. In the trenches it is all about leg strength, hip power, and leverage.

The common denominator between those things is size. Bigger guys are usually stronger. But that doesn't necessarily mean that a guy like Maybin can't be strong.

I have Maybin rated as my #3 DE. I list him as a DE because that is where I think he will play, regardless of how much he weighs.

I was just answering the question that was asked about his frame.

[Lucky]

Originally Posted by bah007

We were talking about Maybin being able to put on extra weight so he could play DE. I don't think he can.

Originally Posted by bah007

Either I'm not a very good communicator or you're just not getting it.

I have Maybin rated as my #3 DE. I list him as a DE because that is where I think he will play, regardless of how much he weighs.

OK. But, you can see how I thought the opposite.

[bah007]

Originally Posted by Lucky

OK. But, you can see how I thought the opposite.

I follow you. I didn't communicate my position very well.

I didn't mean that Maybin can't play DE. I meant that I don't think Maybin can get up to that 265 area that most teams would like him at.

[The Pencil Neck]

Originally Posted by bah007

A question was asked about whether or not Maybin could add more weight to his frame. I don't believe that he can.

The guy is ripped. He's at a very low bodyfat percentage. Is he going to be able to add 20 pounds of pure muscle to his frame? No but you don't want him to.

He doesn't have to gain muscle to gain weight that's going to make him more effective. The problem with Maybin is that he's probably in single-digit bf%. That's not the healthiest place to be* and that's not the strongest place to be although it's probably the fastest weight for him. If you look at bodybuilders, bodybuilders get ripped and send their bf% down to the low single digits but when they're at their most ripped and competing (and look the most impressive), they're not at their strongest. In their offseason, they allow their bodyfat percentages to go up to 12-15% and that's when they get their strongest and build the muscle mass that they show later. They don't/can't stay ripped year-round.

Considering how ripped he is, Maybin could probably add a good 20 pounds (mostly fat) to his frame and still end up in the lower double digit bodyfat percentage. He'd probably be a lot stronger and feel better although he might get slightly slower. (He might NOT get slower.)


* When you're in the single digit bf%'s, your hormones can get screwy. You can also find yourself more prone to injury.

[threetoedpete]

Originally Posted by mussop

What makes any of you think Kubiack is okay with a small DE opposite Mario? Look at our current roster, all the DE's are in the Weaver mold. I think it is just a fan fantasy for us to have a Freeney type player on our team because of what he has done to us in the past. I just dont see us going with a smaller DE who isnt really good in run support early in the draft. I think some of you guys are forgetting how bad we are at stopping the run.

Well outside of Bullman's four....I'd say we could stand a little boost from You and McClain's tweener DT/RDE's. We have a choice here. Either we go get four elite DBs and eventually end up paying them ALL fourteen million per year guaranteed, try to out cover Manning's 2.5 second release. Or find the best first step guy we can get our hands on. Which would mean the extra pressure makes our Mid round and gray beard safety's more productive.

Like it or not, we're waiting on Okoye and Okam to grow up. Considering what the high end DTs are commanding in salary....I don't see Travis Johnson going any where any time soon. McClain keeps posting they'll take another DT and Safety...we'll see.

My other thought is they didn't release Weaver. Now we all saw it. Eye in the sky don't lie. There's got to be a reason Weaver is still on this roster. Weaver/Maybin in my mind, in spite of what McClain posts...in spite of what Kubiak prefers....makes a pretty potent rotation in 2009. I'd go to war with that.

[mussop]

Originally Posted by threetoedpete

Well outside of Bullman's four....I'd say we could stand a little boost from You and McClain's tweener DT/RDE's. We have a choice here. Either we go get four elite DBs and eventually end up paying them ALL fourteen million per year guaranteed, try to out cover Manning's 2.5 second release. Or find the best first step guy we can get our hands on. Which would mean the extra pressure makes our Mid round and gray beard safety's more productive.

Like it or not, we're waiting on Okoye and Okam to grow up. Considering what the high end DTs are commanding in salary....I don't see Travis Johnson going any where any time soon. McClain keeps posting they'll take another DT and Safety...we'll see.

My other thought is they didn't release Weaver. Now we all saw it. Eye in the sky don't lie. There's got to be a reason Weaver is still on this roster. Weaver/Maybin in my mind, in spite of what McClain posts...in spite of what Kubiak prefers....makes a pretty potent rotation in 2009. I'd go to war with that.

Im all for a speed rusher, just not on the first round. I would rather draft an interior OL that I new would upgrade our OL (just an example) than spend our first on a player that is only in the game in certain situations. First round players need to contribute more than just on occasion. There should be similar type smaller, fast DE's in the second and third rounds.

Weaver is a confusing situation. Even if that were the plan we still need to find his replacement. I cant imagine he will be around after this year. Of coarse I have been saying that every since he got here.

[TheRealJoker]

Originally Posted by mussop

Im all for a speed rusher, just not on the first round. I would rather draft an interior OL that I new would upgrade our OL (just an example) than spend our first on a player that is only in the game in certain situations. First round players need to contribute more than just on occasion. There should be similar type smaller, fast DE's in the second and third rounds.

Weaver is a confusing situation. Even if that were the plan we still need to find his replacement. I cant imagine he will be around after this year. Of coarse I have been saying that every since he got here.

How do you know he's going to be a speed rusher his entire career? Texans could keep Weaver around this year for run downs and give Maybin time in an NFL offseason conditioning program to bulk up and get stronger at the point of attack so he can play full time DE in year 2. They can play him at OLB on run downs if he can flip his hips and run with TEs (like an upgraded Chaun Thompson). They can do any number of things, but the main thing they need to do on defense is get someone who can produce more than 4 sacks opposite Mario.

[threetoedpete]

Originally Posted by TheRealJoker

How do you know he's going to be a speed rusher his entire career? Texans could keep Weaver around this year for run downs and give Maybin time in an NFL offseason conditioning program to bulk up and get stronger at the point of attack so he can play full time DE in year 2. They can play him at OLB on run downs if he can flip his hips and run with TEs (like an upgraded Chaun Thompson). They can do any number of things, but the main thing they need to do on defense is get someone who can produce more than 4 sacks opposite Mario.

Yeah the speculation is maybin is up to 250. That's Sam backer size. I'm not saying he could make the transition in four months....but the guy isn't 235 no more. We're going to find out tomorrow if he can flip his hips and cover.