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Old 01-22-2009   #1
nunusguy
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Default LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

1. Detroit - Matthew Stafford, QB, Georgia: The Lions need a QB, but do they need this one? My guess is they will try and trade back but with no success. Stafford's football smarts have been questioned by a few insiders behind the scenes. The Lions could also look at Mark Sanchez in this spot.

2. St. Louis - Eugene Monroe, LT, Virginia: The Rams have an aging LT in Pace and a disappointing RT in Barron. Monroe helps them get better up front right away.

3. Kansas City - Andre Smith, OT, Alabama: The Chiefs are looking to get bigger on the offensive and defensive lines and Smith fits the bill. He can play RT opposite last year's first rounder, Brandon Albert.

4. Seattle - Mark Sanchez, QB, USC: Matt Hasselbeck is getting older and when teams buy into a young QB prospect, they love to pull the trigger. I'm guessing Seattle buys in.

5. Cleveland - Aaron Curry, OLB, Virginia: The Browns are still looking to fortify their pass rush and Curry is the type of all-around LB that would fit perfectly in the Browns 3-4.

6. Cincinnati - B.J. Raji, DT, Boston College: While the Bengals will be looking for someone to replace Stacy Andrews at RT in the draft, I think they will look for that later in the draft. Raji helps against the run and pass right away.

7. Oakland - Michael Oher, OT, Ole Miss : Al Davis loves size and speed, but he'll have to settle for size with Michael Oher anchoring the offensive line at either LT or RT.

8. Jacksonville - Malcolm Jenkins, CB, Jacksonville: The Jaguars pass defense was much poorer than expected last year as CB Florence had a disappointing season as a free agent. In a division that features Peyton Manning and the Texans, you must look for good CBs and Jenkins is the best this year.

9. Green Bay - Everette Brown, DE/OLB, Florida State: The Packers are smartly transitioning to a 3-4 which actually fits their personnel better. The Packers need to find a pass rusher in the worst way and Brown is a great fit. Brown reminds me a little bit of LaMarr Woodley but only with greater length.

10. San Francisco - Michael Crabtree, WR, Texas Tech: The Niners know that they have to get better on offense and one of their first priorities should be finding a top-notch #1 WR. If this isn't Crabtree then it could be the speedier Jeremy Maclin.

11. Buffalo - Brandon Pettigrew, TE, Oklahoma State
12. Denver - Ray Maualuga, ILB, USC
13. Washington - Aaron Maybin, DE, Penn State
14. New Orleans - Jason Smith, OT, Baylor

15. Houston - Peria Jerry, DT, Ole Miss: While most draft pundits might not have Jerry this high, scouts already believe that he might be better than Amobi Okoye right now. Jerry and Okoye both play the 3-technique DT but new defensive line coach doesn't mind rotating DTs in and out and Jerry's motor might be too much to pass up on. The Texans, however, could look at the defensive line as a position they've put too much money in already to invest another pick in. Then again, they might care more about getting the problem fixed. I honestly believe that USC OLB Brian Cushing could be a possibility here as well.

16. San Diego (8-8) - Brian Cushing, LB, USC
17. New York Jets (9-7) - Vontae Davis, CB, Illinois
18. Chicago (9-7) - Jeremy Maclin, WR, Missouri
19. Tampa Bay - D.J. Moore, CB, Vanderbilt
20. Detroit - Knowshon Moreno, RB, Georgia
21. Philadelphia - Alphonso Smith, CB, Wake Forest
22. Minnesota - Percy Harvin, WR, Florida
23. New England - Brian Orakpo, DE, Texas
24. Atlanta - Fili Moala, DT, USC
25. Miami - Clint Sintim, LB, Virginia
26. Baltimore - James Laurinaitis, LB, Ohio State
27. Indianapolis - Tyson Jackson, DE, LSU
28. Philadelphia - Chris Wells, RB, Ohio State
29. New York Giants - Darrius Heyward-Bey, WR, Maryland
30. Tennessee - Hakeem Nicks, WR, North Carolina
31. Arizona - Max Unger, C, Oregon
32. Pittsburgh - Alex Mack, C, Cal: For Steelers fans who are reading this, I just can't find an offensive tackle I like enough to put one in this spot so for now I'll stick with best available lineman.
http://blogs.chron.com/fantasyfootba..._draft_of.html
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I'm a big LZ fan, but I'd be very surprised if we drafted an Okoye clone, even
if Jerry is a slight upgrade of the origional.
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Old 01-22-2009   #2
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

I agree, no Okoye clones, as we already have a work in progress. We need a player that come in make an impact, but also to provide a skill set that is different than what we already have.

I like Brace in the 3rd, but I would rather jump up to take him in the 2nd than a reach for Jerry in the 1st. Both options I would rather not take.

I saw LZ thought Orakpo may slip, and his mock shows that. But Orakpo at 15 and Matthews in th 2nd make us faster, smarter and better on the Defensive side of the ball.
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Old 01-22-2009   #3
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Quote:
Originally Posted by LZ
I honestly believe that USC OLB Brian Cushing could be a possibility here as well.
That's also whom I'm starting to think will be the pick at 15.
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Old 01-22-2009   #4
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

We pass Orakpo for a 2nd round DT clone of a 1st round DT?

Thanks but no thanks.
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Old 01-22-2009   #5
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro View Post
I saw LZ thought Orakpo may slip, and his mock shows that. But Orakpo at 15 and Matthews in th 2nd make us faster, smarter and better on the Defensive side of the ball.
LZ obviously thinks Orako is not suited for the 4-3 and instead will need to
transistion to the 3-4 as an OLB in the NFL, else he'd probably take him if he was on the Board at #15.
If you've been watching the Senior Bowl practices you know Jerry has been impressive, but the #1 standout among DTs is B.J. Raji because he's got Jerry's quicks but he's 'bout 25-30 lbs bigger. We would take him at #15 because he's so much more than Jerry or Okoye, so much more versatile but he'll be long gone.
Cushing is a possibility and I dunno but wonder if he's not a better value for us than the overhyped Rey-Rey ?
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Old 01-22-2009   #6
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Jerry is most likely the best fit with the scheme we're alleged to be going with. He's quick, agile, and can get to the passer, which seems to be all we're focused on.

For those wanting us to take a clogger like Brace or Dorell Scott, it simply won't happen. Frank Bush claims to want players who will shoot the gaps and make plays in the backfield, and Kollar's DLs fit this mold as well. This probably fits our personnel better since we have a slew of one gap penetrators who are unable to even command a double team, much less beat one. What makes Jerry different than what we already have is his quickness. He's much quicker and more agile than anybody we have on the roster. That being said, that's pretty much all he has. He's going to be a 25 year old rookie who is undersized and not stout at the point of attack and gets pushed around in the running game. He has the makings of another guy who is more or less done if he doesn't beat the blocker with his quickness. I think he'd probably work best in a Tampa-2.

We'd probably be better off going with Orakpo at this pick and hoping for Ziggy Hood in the second or even Mitch King in the later rounds.
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Old 01-22-2009   #7
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Quote:
Originally Posted by nunusguy View Post
LZ obviously thinks Orako is not suited for the 4-3 and instead will need to
transistion to the 3-4 as an OLB in the NFL, else he'd probably take him if he was on the Board at #15.
If you've been watching the Senior Bowl practices you know Jerry has been impressive, but the #1 standout among DTs is B.J. Raji because he's got Jerry's quicks but he's 'bout 25-30 lbs bigger. We would take him at #15 because he's so much more than Jerry or Okoye, so much more versatile but he'll be long gone.
Cushing is a possibility and I dunno but wonder if he's not a better value for us than the overhyped Rey-Rey ?
I just see Orakpo as a multi dimensional player and believe the 4-3, 3-4 question is about Orakpo's draft value, more so if he can play one or the other. Smart, fast and strong go a long way in overcoming adversity in this league.

If Raji were selected at #15, I would not be complaining.
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Old 01-22-2009   #8
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Surprising that he has the Texans taking Jerry, but I don't believe he'll be there at 15. I'm also surprised that he doesn't have Michael Johnson going in the 1st. I know there are a lot of questions out there about his work ethic and his dedication to the game, but I don't think the Texans can pass up that kind of athlete at a position of need. I wouldn't mind him or Orakpo. I just don't see him falling that far either.

I'm not a Brian Cushing fan. I'd rather the Texans go after Michael Boley from Atlanta who is an UFA.
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Old 01-22-2009   #9
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Orakpo is probaly going to grade out as being an OLB in a 3-4, which means he will not be a Texan.

I'm not sold on drafting Jerry, espically given that Okoye is still so young, but we shall see.
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Old 01-22-2009   #10
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

LOL, Jerry is not an Amobi clone at all. He's a very similar type of DT as Amobi, but the pick of AO was purely based on the kids upside and potential.

Jerry is not a 2nd round DT, he's the best UT in the draft and definitely worth a 1st rd pick. I'd even say he would come in and be better at stopping the run and rushing the passer than Amobi is right now.

I was where yall were sitting a while ago. I don't want another UT, we've got that. I want a Raji or maybe even a Brace later on. But that's not what this DL coach does. He doesn't have huge guys to eat up space, he has all four D-linemen rushing into the backfield practically every play. Brace, Okam aren't those guys. If we're going to pick a DT on the 1st day, he's going to be a guy that can get in the backfield.

Jerry would be a good pick. Not my favorite, but all the guys we really want will probably be gone and Jerry would be BPA. Amobi and Jerry would most likely start next to each other with Travis a backup.

Is Cushing starting to come back up the boards now? I thought that guy got injured every other play.

I will add Vontae Davis could be an intruiging selection.
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Old 01-22-2009   #11
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Hood and King look real good, and will be thre in the later rounds. I dont really like what Ive seen of Brace at Senior Bowl practice. I'd love to trade down in this instance and gather more picks.
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Old 01-22-2009   #12
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

I'm not a HUGE fan of taking another DT in the first. DE I wouldn't be opposed to. If Orakpo fell there I would be a little disappointed if we didn't take him. Guy is listed as 3 inches higher then Freeney but weighs about 8lbs less. I like that he took boxing and will probably use his hands intelligently as a pro. Not sure if we are "set" at DT but I don't we are hurting terribly enough to justify using a 1st. I think best value for the team would be a LB.
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Old 01-22-2009   #13
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

hope Rick can trade down like last year...........................
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Old 01-22-2009   #14
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

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hope Rick can trade down like last year...........................
I second that
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Old 01-22-2009   #15
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiser Toro View Post
I just see Orakpo as a multi dimensional player and believe the 4-3, 3-4 question is about Orakpo's draft value, more so if he can play one or the other. Smart, fast and strong go a long way in overcoming adversity in this league.

If Raji were selected at #15, I would not be complaining.
I agree 100%. Quick DTs like Peria may occasionally disrupt Qb but we better come up with a way to shut down the run. Lance's DT may be better than any we have but that just means we have a better talent that can't stop the RB. Orakpo I'd be ok with but does nothing for the run. Raji or Brace should stop run and still collapse pocket back pressuring the QB..
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Old 01-22-2009   #16
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Picks I disagree with:

4. Seattle - Mark Sanchez, QB, USC:

I think ESPN is getting the mock drafters to believe in the Sanchez hype. The guy isn't polished enough to go #4. Seattle would be a good place for him because he could sit behind Hasselbeck, but is this really their biggest need? I don't think so. I see Sanchez going 10-15. This looks like a reach to me.
.
.
10. San Francisco - Michael Crabtree, WR, Texas Tech

Agree that the Niners should take him if he is there. I just don't see him dropping to 10.
.
.
15. Houston - Peria Jerry, DT, Ole Miss

I am very high on Jerry. I would love this pick...if Orakpo weren't still on the board. Jerry can do it all and is very underrated at this point.

16. San Diego (8-8) - Brian Cushing, LB, USC

Where does Cushing fit in a 3-4 defense? Does he have the speed to be an edge rusher?
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.
20. Detroit - Knowshon Moreno, RB, Georgia

Seemed to me like Kevin Smith and Calvin Johnson were the only good players the Lions had last season. Now they will replace one of them? I don't buy that.
.
.
23. New England - Brian Orakpo, DE, Texas

I get the pick, but no chance Orakpo falls to 23. None. LZ has him going to a 3-4 defense so he obviously had him fall because he doesn't think he will fit the 4-3. I disagree. Orakpo is one of the top two weak side DE pass rushers in this draft (only Brown is potentially better, I think). His ability against the run is not a strength, but he is serviceable enough in that area that it is not a weakness either.
.
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27. Indianapolis - Tyson Jackson, DE, LSU

I thought Indianapolis loved speed on defense? Jackson will make a great strong side DE, but he is a run stuffer. Doesn't do much as far as pass rush. Had 8 sacks as a soph, but then 3.5 as a junior, and 4.5 as a senior.

Everything else looks great. I especially like the Pettigrew and Laurinaitis picks.
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Old 01-22-2009   #17
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ole Miss Texan View Post
LOL, Jerry is not an Amobi clone at all. He's a very similar type of DT as Amobi, but the pick of AO was purely based on the kids upside and potential.

Jerry is not a 2nd round DT, he's the best UT in the draft and definitely worth a 1st rd pick. I'd even say he would come in and be better at stopping the run and rushing the passer than Amobi is right now.

I was where yall were sitting a while ago. I don't want another UT, we've got that. I want a Raji or maybe even a Brace later on. But that's not what this DL coach does. He doesn't have huge guys to eat up space, he has all four D-linemen rushing into the backfield practically every play. Brace, Okam aren't those guys. If we're going to pick a DT on the 1st day, he's going to be a guy that can get in the backfield.

Jerry would be a good pick. Not my favorite, but all the guys we really want will probably be gone and Jerry would be BPA. Amobi and Jerry would most likely start next to each other with Travis a backup.

Is Cushing starting to come back up the boards now? I thought that guy got injured every other play.

I will add Vontae Davis could be an intruiging selection.
I know you like you're guy, he's from your school, but we've got not one but 2 first round Draft picks who are already of the same style/type, i.e., there all basically one-gap DTs. And based upon from I've seen, Jerry is clearly the best of the three. But the Texans just don't have so much
talent that they can afford the luxury of that kind of redunduncy, even if Jerry is the BPA at #15.
If LZs Board were to really play out that way in April, there's atleast a half dozen players I'd take before Jerry, to maybe include even one or 2 offensive prospects.
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Old 01-22-2009   #18
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

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Originally Posted by nunusguy View Post
I know you like you're guy, he's from your school, but we've got not one but 2 first round Draft picks who are already of the same style/type, i.e., there all basically one-gap DTs. And based upon from I've seen, Jerry is clearly the best of the three. But the Texans just don't have so much
talent that they can afford the luxury of that kind of redunduncy, even if Jerry is the BPA at #15.
If LZs Board were to really play out that way in April, there's atleast a half dozen players I'd take before Jerry, to maybe include even one or 2 offensive prospects.
He's not my guy, my guy this year is Raji. (Patrick Willis in '07 and Brandon Albert in '08) I think Jerry is the real deal and going to be a star in the NFL. With that said, I'm not a homer and will tell it like it is. I'd rather have Raji than Jerry. The fact we've got two 1st rd picks at DT already is a moot point to me. If their salaries were awful, it'd be a problem but I don't think having Amobi, Travis and Jerry at DT would hurt our team financially in the least bit.

There are two DT spots so you need two DTs to fill them. If the new DL coach can get Travis to turn the corner (which I think could be a possibility) then its a different story. Amobi has another few years to mature and he could be a beast. Travis is a FA after this year, i think? If he plays like crap, he's gone or he gets a much lower backup salary. I think he'd be a good backup. Which brings me to the next point... who do you have starting at DT? I see a lot of good depth on this team but no real starters.

I think spending another high draft pick on the DL (assuming they are worth their selection) is a MUST. We've already invested so much in the DL, we're trying to make it the stength and foundation of the D... why quit now? We can't be scared, we've got to get our players more help or else Amobi will never be able to shine. I think DT and DE are both needs.

Like you said though, there are several other players that could be viable picks at 15 if they decide not to go the DT route. Trade down this year could be a really good thing.
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Old 01-22-2009   #19
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

I pretty much agree with bah007, I would not mind the pick at all other than the fact that Orakpo is still on the board. I know Lance has some scouts he trusts that don't think Orakpo is a top 10-15 guy but I have to disagree. Now if he is off the board Jerry would be a fine pick. We would still need a pass rusher either in FA or the draft, and it would maybe be another year without a good safety prospect but if he looks like the best available you gotta do it. TJ is probably gone after 1 more season and with Jerry, Okoye, and Robinson rotating at DT we could have a real solid middle.
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Old 01-22-2009   #20
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Default Re: LZs premiere 2009 Mock has us taking a DT. No Way !

Quote:
Originally Posted by bah007 View Post
Picks I disagree with:

4. Seattle - Mark Sanchez, QB, USC:

I think ESPN is getting the mock drafters to believe in the Sanchez hype. The guy isn't polished enough to go #4. Seattle would be a good place for him because he could sit behind Hasselbeck, but is this really their biggest need? I don't think so. I see Sanchez going 10-15. This looks like a reach to me.
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10. San Francisco - Michael Crabtree, WR, Texas Tech

Agree that the Niners should take him if he is there. I just don't see him dropping to 10.
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15. Houston - Peria Jerry, DT, Ole Miss

I am very high on Jerry. I would love this pick...if Orakpo weren't still on the board. Jerry can do it all and is very underrated at this point.

16. San Diego (8-8) - Brian Cushing, LB, USC

Where does Cushing fit in a 3-4 defense? Does he have the speed to be an edge rusher?
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20. Detroit - Knowshon Moreno, RB, Georgia

Seemed to me like Kevin Smith and Calvin Johnson were the only good players the Lions had last season. Now they will replace one of them? I don't buy that.
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23. New England - Brian Orakpo, DE, Texas

I get the pick, but no chance Orakpo falls to 23. None. LZ has him going to a 3-4 defense so he obviously had him fall because he doesn't think he will fit the 4-3. I disagree. Orakpo is one of the top two weak side DE pass rushers in this draft (only Brown is potentially better, I think). His ability against the run is not a strength, but he is serviceable enough in that area that it is not a weakness either.
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27. Indianapolis - Tyson Jackson, DE, LSU

I thought Indianapolis loved speed on defense? Jackson will make a great strong side DE, but he is a run stuffer. Doesn't do much as far as pass rush. Had 8 sacks as a soph, but then 3.5 as a junior, and 4.5 as a senior.

Everything else looks great. I especially like the Pettigrew and Laurinaitis picks.
Cushing played DE, ILB, OLB and some safety at USC. I think he's could enough to be an outstanding 4-3 SLB, or a 3-4 LB that could see some snaps at OLB and some at ILB. His ability to cover is way underrated at this point.

Of course all of this is my opinion, and I'd love for Cushing to play for the Texans.
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