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Old 03-09-2013   #1
Ktexan68
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Default What the hell did we do?

To be in such a horrible salary cap situation? Did Rick completely crap the bed on this one? It's not like we've won multiple super bowls yet we can't add anyone of note and we'll be extremely lucky to not lose more important players.

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Old 03-09-2013   #2
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Default

Having to sign JoJo and Manning was a big part of it. It's not as if we're in huge trouble salary cap wise. You can't always expect to have $20 million in space each season.
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Old 03-09-2013   #3
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

Both good and bad teams get into this problem. I mean the Steelers just cut Harrison because of his salary cap number. While he's slowed down some, Harrison is still a productive player. Its just part of the game.
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Old 03-09-2013   #4
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

Specifically, Texans inked Brown, Foster & Schaub long term. Questions?
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Old 03-11-2013   #5
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

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Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
Specifically, Texans inked Brown, Foster & Schaub long term. Questions?
Yup. Throw in the need to ink Cush and Watt next year.
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Old 03-11-2013   #6
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

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Originally Posted by Doppelganger View Post
Yup. Throw in the need to ink Cush and Watt next year.
Watt will just be finishing his 3rd season after next year. Under the new CBA he's signed to a 4 year contract and by the end of the 3rd year the Texans must decide if they will exercise the option for the 5th year.

I know teams can't renegotiate the contracts prior to the end of the 4th year, but what I don't know is if a team can give a player a long term deal after the 4th year rather than go with the 5th year option. In the case of Watt it would cost the team a lot more, but if he's earned it they might want to do it then. As it stands now the 5th year for him would be an average of the 3rd-25th highest paid players at his position.
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Old 03-09-2013   #7
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

Our owner spends too much!

Had the Texans blown the capless guidlines like the Redskins & Cowboys did, I'd be first in line to complain. But we only pressed hard against it ..... and got the two best seasons in franchise history.

Now the cap is virtually flatlined and teams with the spendiest owners are up against it and having to renegotiate like madmen & release some household names. Sucks, but it's the new normal.
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Old 03-09-2013   #8
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

The answer to the OP's question is that we drafted too well and we added good FA pickups. The teams with a lot of cap space have that space because they don't have any good players to spend their money on (Bills, Browns, Jaguars, etc.)
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Old 03-09-2013   #9
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

Paul Kuharsky has a plan.....

"Cut wide receiver Kevin Walter, saving $2.5 million in cap space. Restructure the deal of wide receiver Andre Johnson, reducing his base salary from $10.5 million to $940,000 (giving him the rest now as a bonus), resulting in a salary-cap savings of $7.17 million. Restructure the deal of cornerback Johnathan Joseph, reducing his base salary from $7.5 million to $940,000 (giving him the rest now as a bonus), resulting in a salary-cap savings of $4.373 million. Extend defensive end Antonio Smith, reducing his 2013 base salary of $6 million and his cap charge of $9.5 million significantly."



http://espn.go.com/blog/afcsouth/pos...houston-texans
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Old 03-10-2013   #10
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by texan279 View Post
Paul Kuharsky has a plan.....

"Cut wide receiver Kevin Walter, saving $2.5 million in cap space. Restructure the deal of wide receiver Andre Johnson, reducing his base salary from $10.5 million to $940,000 (giving him the rest now as a bonus), resulting in a salary-cap savings of $7.17 million. Restructure the deal of cornerback Johnathan Joseph, reducing his base salary from $7.5 million to $940,000 (giving him the rest now as a bonus), resulting in a salary-cap savings of $4.373 million. Extend defensive end Antonio Smith, reducing his 2013 base salary of $6 million and his cap charge of $9.5 million significantly."



http://espn.go.com/blog/afcsouth/pos...houston-texans
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Old 03-10-2013   #11
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by texan279 View Post
Paul Kuharsky has a plan.....

"Cut wide receiver Kevin Walter, saving $2.5 million in cap space. Restructure the deal of wide receiver Andre Johnson, reducing his base salary from $10.5 million to $940,000 (giving him the rest now as a bonus), resulting in a salary-cap savings of $7.17 million. Restructure the deal of cornerback Johnathan Joseph, reducing his base salary from $7.5 million to $940,000 (giving him the rest now as a bonus), resulting in a salary-cap savings of $4.373 million. Extend defensive end Antonio Smith, reducing his 2013 base salary of $6 million and his cap charge of $9.5 million significantly."



http://espn.go.com/blog/afcsouth/pos...houston-texans
That's an awful plan. Restructuring that much just means we'd be adding enormous amounts of salary in the future. Brian Cushing's contract is up next year. JJ Watt's contract is up the year after. The Texans are going to have to re-sign them, and restructuring current deals would make those signings very hard to pull off.
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Old 03-10-2013   #12
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by texan279 View Post
Paul Kuharsky has a plan.....

"Cut wide receiver Kevin Walter, saving $2.5 million in cap space. Restructure the deal of wide receiver Andre Johnson, reducing his base salary from $10.5 million to $940,000 (giving him the rest now as a bonus), resulting in a salary-cap savings of $7.17 million. Restructure the deal of cornerback Johnathan Joseph, reducing his base salary from $7.5 million to $940,000 (giving him the rest now as a bonus), resulting in a salary-cap savings of $4.373 million. Extend defensive end Antonio Smith, reducing his 2013 base salary of $6 million and his cap charge of $9.5 million significantly."



http://espn.go.com/blog/afcsouth/pos...houston-texans
He makes a lot of good points. I'm still strongly against drafting a wide receiver. The help we need at the number two position opposite of Andre Johnson can only come through free agency. We need to sign an impact guy right away like Mike Wallace. The Dolphins and Vikings are already hot in pursuit when it should be us finding a way to make that big splash. You can also restructure the deals of Matt Schaub and Arian Foster to create even more cap space.

We're not going to find that instant help at wide receiver in the draft. We already have tons of inconsistent young guys on the roster. It's going to take two or three years before we know if that rookie wideout is a legitimate pro bowler. By then Andre Johnson will no longer be a dominating number one. Our window to win a Super Bowl with Andre still being an elite player is 2013, 2014 and maybe 2015. We're talking about three more seasons starting now.

I'm all for doing what it takes to win "right now".
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Old 03-11-2013   #13
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by texan279 View Post
Paul Kuharsky has a plan.....

"Cut wide receiver Kevin Walter, saving $2.5 million in cap space. Restructure the deal of wide receiver Andre Johnson, reducing his base salary from $10.5 million to $940,000 (giving him the rest now as a bonus), resulting in a salary-cap savings of $7.17 million. Restructure the deal of cornerback Johnathan Joseph, reducing his base salary from $7.5 million to $940,000 (giving him the rest now as a bonus), resulting in a salary-cap savings of $4.373 million. Extend defensive end Antonio Smith, reducing his 2013 base salary of $6 million and his cap charge of $9.5 million significantly."



http://espn.go.com/blog/afcsouth/pos...houston-texans
Sure doing these things helps the cap situation today , for this season .... but what about the future impact of those actions.

It inflates the cap figures of each of AJ , JJo and Smith for those future years.

What are you going to do next season ... when you have Cushing hitting free agency or a couple years down the line when JJ Watt reaches FA - He's going to cost big bucks to retain (MW money?)


You can only put off paying guy' (cap hits) for so long .... eventually you have to bite the bullet.
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Old 03-09-2013   #14
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dc_txtech View Post
The answer to the OP's question is that we drafted too well and we added good FA pickups. The teams with a lot of cap space have that space because they don't have any good players to spend their money on (Bills, Browns, Jaguars, etc.)
I should have read through the thread first, I would have chosen to quote you and then say "This ^^^^."
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Old 03-10-2013   #15
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

i think we were supposed to win the SB around 2011 and 2012 now we are kinda in a cap funk because we didnt win it
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Old 03-09-2013   #16
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

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Originally Posted by TexanSam View Post
Having to sign JoJo and Manning was a big part of it. It's not as if we're in huge trouble salary cap wise. You can't always expect to have $20 million in space each season.
Not around here. The Texans must have All-Pros at every position, win the Super Bowl every season, and have $20 million free every season to sign whatever big name is available.

The Texans have very little dead money right now. This is compared to yearly issues with Casserly. We have some good players making very good money which hurts, but it's better than having horrible players making that money.

The only real bad contract we have right now is Schaub. Was it premature to sign him to an extension? In hindsight, yeah. Remember that he was having his best season before the injury. He might have been telling the Texans that he wanted an extension in place before the end of the season or he was going to explore other options. There are no other QBs available right now that can step in and do as well as he has done. I think there are better QBs out there, a lot of them, but they aren't available. Had they waited, based on the struggles he had at the end of the season, they'd probably have been able to keep him for less than they signed him for. What if (I hate it, too, but you have to remember the Texans were looking at this in week 1) Schaub didn't struggle down the stretch and he pulled a Flacco? How many QB desperate teams would have jumped at him? The Texans were in a tough spot with him. QB is the most important position and a team that wants to win the Lombardi trophy needs to have a good signal caller.

As for all the pissing and moaning about Winston's release, DeMeco's trade, the inability to resign Brisiel I say look around the league every March. The Steelers just released Harrison. Yeah, he's been hurt, but he's still a former Defensive player of the year and on his worst day is better than Winston. Good teams let go of good players. They're good because they have good players that other teams want. When you lose a good player someone else will take him.

Do we want the days of Casserly when our cut players finished their degrees and got jobs like ours?

We can't keep every player. We can't bring in the top free agents every year. Name me the last Super Bowl winner to feature a guy that was signed away from another team as a top tier free agent? The Saints with Brees? He wasn't exactly a hot commodity after leaving San Diego with an injured shoulder.

Build through the draft. Find guys that can take over for leaving players (Mercilus for Barwin maybe) and put the money towards the players that you don't find in every draft (Andre, Watt). To stay successful over a long period of time you have to make a few tough decisions every year. Heck, the Patriots have gotten rid of pretty good players every year and it doesn't seem to faze them. Of course, they haven't won a Super Bowl in 10 years so maybe it has fazed them. Still, they are one of the top 4 or 5 teams every year by plugging in the next man up.

I don't think Smith has been perfect. We've missed on a few picks, but I'm happy that we're not having to cut players to get under the cap each year (yeah I'm looking at you Washington). I do think fans here play too much Madden and don't have a realistic understanding of what it reallly takes to run a team. I know I'm no expert, but I at least can see that we are in much better shape with Smith than most of the teams are with their GMs.
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Old 03-09-2013   #17
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

What the hell did we do?

We threw caution to the wind in the early part of the off-season in 2011 and finally purchased DECENT talent in J-Jo and Manning, for starters. That takes money, my friend. And that means eating up some cap space.

We've got AJ under contract, too, so there's some cap hit right there.

We gave Owen Daniels more money. That's less cap space to work with.

Duane Brown, Chris Myers, Arian Foster. All those guys got new deals.

How about Matt Schaub's new deal? More money, less cap space.

Who do you not pay? Do you not pay J-Jo...or Manning...or AJ...OD...Duane...Chris...Arian...Matt...which guy do you not pay?

We're no different than any other team. The teams with the best cap space will soon find themselves in the same position as us one day--Either having to shed salary because they overpaid a role player or two, OR because they have too many role players who started playing like superstars and they now want superstar money all of a sudden.

But hey, by all means...let's ***** about the GM finally being given the green light by the owner to go out and spend the cap space we DID have. Remember those days, those days when we knew we had cap space but we never spent it? Yeah, well we finally took a step forward in 2011 and it bought us two AFC South divisions and two divisional round playoff appearances. Not too shabby.

I don't understand the constant hand-wringing about the cap space here. We used to have plenty of space, but never did anything with it. Result? Scrubs at every position not manned by Mario and AJ. Now we have little cap room, but we have two AFC South division titles and two divisional round appearances...and suddenly Rick **** the bed on the cap.

LOL. Wonderful off-season conversations, as always.
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Old 03-10-2013   #18
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

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Originally Posted by Ktexan68 View Post
To be in such a horrible salary cap situation? Did Rick completely crap the bed on this one? It's not like we've won multiple super bowls yet we can't add anyone of note and we'll be extremely lucky to not lose more important players.

I apologize upfront for sounding rude but you seem ignorant (lack of knowledge) of NFL salary cap. Texans have gone from being apprx. $20 million over 2012 cap to apprx. $8 million under now. Kuharski's suggestions have been discussed at length for months on this MB and you can get some input by reading Dutchrudder's thread. We are in a good situation cap wise imo and have an outstanding mix of long term vets/younger guys.
As others have pointed out, IF and that is a big if, free agents are identified Ric Smith wants, players can be restructured to recapture money for them. Money isn't the problem, spending wisely to get biggest bang for the buck is. Huge contracts are risky even with our own players such as Schaub, AJ and Antonio Smith due to player age; however, the first two (criticize them or not) were two of top team players when contracted. Smith is young enough to get another restructure and play 2-3 more seasons.

Let's say we go after a WR like Wallace and he just doesn't work out, the MBs and talk show would explode & rightfully so. Smith proved he would spend McNair's $ when he went after Manning and Joseph then wrapped up AJ, Schaub, Foster and Duane Brown with great contracts. The last two could restructure in 2014 to capture Cushing.

Question is not can we spend but how we spend.
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Old 03-10-2013   #19
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

We've been spoiled.

Since 1994, the salary cap increased significantly year after year, until the end of the last CBA. I don't recall the terms used, or the exact reasoning, but there was a reason the 2011 salary cap was set below the 2009 salary cap. 2012's cap will be roughly equal to the 2009 cap.

I'd expect the cap will continue to increase, but no where near the rate at which it grew pre-2010.
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Old 03-10-2013   #20
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Default Re: What the hell did we do?

Correct me if I'm wrong on the following, this is just more ramblings and musings than anything else:

The new CBA was geared toward making all rookie contracts expire after 4 years. The rookies are now slotted in terms of their first rookie deal; how much they earn...which has wiped out the huge-ass deals the 1st round rookies used to receive (in short: players cannot as easily "retire" after being awful for their first couple of years).

In addition, the cap has not been raised to higher levels than anticipated.

So we've got less money being spent on rookie contracts, which last for three more years after their initial rookie year expires.

Then you've got a less-than-stellar cap ceiling to work with, which SHOULD seem to be OK since rookie deals are lower in price and standard in length (4 years).

So what's causing the pinch for so many teams? Could it take about 3 years from now for free agent contracts to normalize a bit...essentially lowering the FA contract amounts because the rookie deals were lower, to begin with, so that should theoretically mean that that player's first FA contract would be relative to what they HAD been making the previous four seasons under the new CBA's slotted salary system.

I'm just trying to figure out how teams are expected to handle success on a long-term basis if the cap figures do not keep in-step with "inflation" of each year's new Mega Deals that then make other players' deals jump accordingly.

Hope that makes sense, ya' know what I'm saying? There has to be some sort of logical explanation as to where things WERE and where things are HEADED. Otherwise, what was the point of the new CBA's attempt to reign in rookie contracts but then to have a low cap ceiling each year that isn't growing proportionally with each new round of Free Agents???
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