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Old 05-02-2005   #1
phan1
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Default Is our Oline looking any better so far?

Well, I think we can all agree that the Oline last year was the most horrible part of our team by miles. We couldn't pass block, and we could hardly run block. We got some new guys at the line, but they don't sound like immediate contributors. For the most part, it looks like the same personel from last year, which kinda worries me.

I would like to say it was the difficulty in learning a new system and not the players, but to my knowlege, pass blocking does not change in the new zoneblocking system. Please correct me if I'm wrong on that, because if I'm not, I'm rather pessimistic about out Oline situation. That would mean that the problem is the talent and not the system.

As for our D, it really sucks that we are losing our 2 starting middle linebackers (Sharper and Foreman), but I really have faith in Capers as a defensive coach and think he will end up getting the job done. But right now I'm still worried about our offensive line.
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Old 05-02-2005   #2
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The guy that worries me the most is McKinney, simply becuase he is a seasoned vet and has probably all ready gotten as good as he's going to get. At least with Wand you can make the case he's young and should get better. I'm really worried and I'm just keeping my fingers crossed. I really beleive our coaching staff is taking a gamble on this one and are banking their future on whether or not the oline actually deserves their pay this year. They must have a plan, thats all I can hope for, that they have some kind of plan.
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Old 05-02-2005   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phan1
Well, I think we can all agree that the Oline last year was the most horrible part of our team by miles. We couldn't pass block, and we could hardly run block. We got some new guys at the line, but they don't sound like immediate contributors. For the most part, it looks like the same personel from last year, which kinda worries me.

I would like to say it was the difficulty in learning a new system and not the players, but to my knowlege, pass blocking does not change in the new zoneblocking system. Please correct me if I'm wrong on that, because if I'm not, I'm rather pessimistic about out Oline situation. That would mean that the problem is the talent and not the system.

As for our D, it really sucks that we are losing our 2 starting middle linebackers (Sharper and Foreman), but I really have faith in Capers as a defensive coach and think he will end up getting the job done. But right now I'm still worried about our offensive line.
Capers and Casserly addressed the problem this offseason when they sat down and talked to Chris Palmer about the problems with his protection schemes. For instance, "Chris, we thought that next season when we play Indy, maybe you could use a RB or TE or someone else to help Seth Wand block Freeney on obvious passing downs. As it turns out, Jonathan Ogden can't handle him by himself either... just a thought, Chris."-

So, just based on that conversation, I expect Carr to have more time to throw this season.
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Old 05-02-2005   #4
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Reasons Carr will have more protection next year:

1. This is the first year that our Oline has actually returned to play the next season.

2. Last year we had 2 new linemen, and one lineman changing positions.. as well as a whole new blocking scheme to learn.. they will be better this year.

3. We are going to use more timing routes to get the ball out of Carrs hands quicker.

4. As was already said.. we have talked to Palmer.

5. With a more dominant running game, defenses will not be able to zero in on Carr.. hence the drafting of Vernand Morency. Also, the zone blocking makes our running game better.. you saw it at the end of last season, it will most likely carry over to this season.

6. Same with the passing game.. more timing routes, a better running game and (hopefully) the addition of Mathis will improve that.. Mathis may not make an impact till next season though.

7. Bennie Joppru
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Old 05-02-2005   #5
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The short answer is, yes there is room for hope (see above), but nothing yet to prove it true.
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Old 05-02-2005   #6
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you know i was sitting here thinking bout how in Minn. or how it used to be called the randy moss factor well i think our biggest problem is called the palmer factor IMO haha. naw im j/k the guy either calls really good plays or some really really bad ones.
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Old 05-02-2005   #7
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The organization has taken dramatic steps to elevate the play of the OL by
drafting a center in the 5th round and signing a couple of other undrafted college OLineman. I'm of course being sarcastic, because the team has basically done little more than squat in the offseason to improve O line play
ffor 2005. I dunno...one of their stategies is to have DC take a shorter, quicker drop when passing and to me that's just an admission of the lines
basic weakness. Its a little bit like the Dutch boy sticking his finger in the damn to prevent the flood, if one is familiar with that fable.
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Old 05-02-2005   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grid
Reasons Carr will have more protection next year:

1. This is the first year that our Oline has actually returned to play the next season.

2. Last year we had 2 new linemen, and one lineman changing positions.. as well as a whole new blocking scheme to learn.. they will be better this year.

3. We are going to use more timing routes to get the ball out of Carrs hands quicker.

4. As was already said.. we have talked to Palmer.

5. With a more dominant running game, defenses will not be able to zero in on Carr.. hence the drafting of Vernand Morency. Also, the zone blocking makes our running game better.. you saw it at the end of last season, it will most likely carry over to this season.

6. Same with the passing game.. more timing routes, a better running game and (hopefully) the addition of Mathis will improve that.. Mathis may not make an impact till next season though.

7. Bennie Joppru

You left out one important point ....


8. They cant do any worse ...... or can they ?
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Old 05-02-2005   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by corrosion
You left out one important point ....


8. They cant do any worse ...... or can they ?
we do have a record breaking Oline :woot
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Old 05-02-2005   #10
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The problems we should have addressed last year were both the O line AND the D line. On the surface it appeared that we did address the O line in offseason moves last year and while changing the blocking scheme. The problem is that Palmer (i d i o t) didn't watch enough film to know that Carr would need the additional pass protection from either lining up the TE behind the LT or in using the fullback as more of a pass blocker. Jeez, who can't figure that one out? But again, last year it was said that we would be using more 2 TE formations and that should've been adequate but it wasn't.

This year should've been the year we addressed the D line since we supposedly addressed the O line last year and what did we do? 16th pick we took Travis Johnson who might end up being pretty good. We signed Seth Payne to some ridiculous contract for someone his age and, once again, coming off a season ending injury. Just stupid in my opinion. Once again we have absolutely no depth on the D line unless you call Travis Johnson the depth. Now if we took Johnson to replace Gary Walker then what kind of a bonehead move was that last year by giving him a ridiculous contract?

Either way, if we have more than one injury on either of the O and D lines, we're screwed. We have no depth on either lines and we still haven't addressed it. But I'll tell you this...the next coaching staff will.

Last edited by ocd; 05-02-2005 at 07:04 PM.
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Old 05-02-2005   #11
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I think that our o line will improve, I mean if they are healthy the right side of the line can be dominant in the running game. The left side has had it's ups and downs and will only improve with time. McKinney has problems with big DTs but is there and C in the league that has not had problems with Stroud, Henderson or Hayesworth?
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Old 05-03-2005   #12
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Our receivers are not known for running precise routes which is required for timing routes. I'm well aware of what excellent receivers running precise routes can do to another team. I will let others comment on the ins and out of this process, but I'm concerned about our receivers ability to get to the spots on time as well as remembering where they are suppose to go. AJ needs to work on routes and so does Mathis. To rely on this as a way to shore up the O-line does bother me given the tendencies of our receivers. Everything points to BJ as being a plus in this area, but he hasn't played for quite awhile. If Carr can release to Mathis deep in a shorter period of time because of his speed, then we might catch a team or two by surprise, but that would be picked up on in a hurry. Therefore, I really believe the O-line itself must give David more time if we are to be successful offensively. I don't believe the timing routes are going to be effective until David is given more time. He throws a line drive, and if the receiver isn't on the same page, you could see a lot of interceptions. The other team is going to try disrupt what the receiver is trying to do. This means your receivers have to be able to get off the line of scrimmage, fake their coverage and get to the spot on time. If the defense is better at running your patterns than you are then you are in a lot of trouble. For example, Manning and Harrison work endless hours at this process. I do not see or hear of our receivers and David putting in the required time to run these kinds of routes. I believe AJ goes to Florida and Carr stays in Houston. These two need to know each other like the back of your hand. That's what makes affective combinations like Unitis to Barry, Star to McGee, Montana to Rice, and Manning to Harrison. They literally can run their routes in the dark. These combinations also have had the uncanny ability of knowing when the other is deviating and adjust accordingly. Its poetry in motion.
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Old 05-03-2005   #13
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Hey, I dont care how good your QB is...speaking as a College DE

If a D-line can just pressure a QB and make him un comfortble...hes not gonna be able to play his best. His throws will be off and he will always be looking for the hit instead of downfield....D Lines LOVE to hear that they are playing a team with a weak O Line because they know thats the core of the Offense....nothing can happen if the O line dosent get it done....WE HAVE GOT TO GET AN O LINE IF WE WANT SUCCESS.
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Old 05-04-2005   #14
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well even though Carr has taken his share of hits his first three years I think the O-Line will one part of the team that acctually surprises some people this year. Don't ask me why but I get the feeling that your line will do good, not great but good enough to let Carr, Davis/Morency have good season's and produce big numbers for you guys.
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