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Old 04-27-2014   #1
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Default Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

I hope this is not just another campaign speech. The past dictates that the Texans have a pattern of REPEATING their mistakes.......far beyond the David Carr situation.


Quote:
Posted by Michael David Smith on April 27, 2014, 11:55 AM EDT


In 2002, the Texans used the first draft pick in franchise history on David Carr, who was beaten up while playing on a bad team and never developed into the kind of player Houston wanted him to be. Now the Texans own the first overall pick again, and owner Bob McNair says his team has learned from its mistakes.

McNair says the Texans now realize that a rookie quarterback shouldn’t play until he’s ready, and a veteran quarterback as a placeholder can be a wise investment.

“I think the main thing I look back on is that we should have had a veteran quarterback in there,” McNair said. “We should have let him start the season and let David learn what it takes to be an NFL quarterback.”

That suggests that if the Texans draft a quarterback next week, they’ll be drafting him with the idea that he’ll sit on the bench and learn while Ryan Fitzpatrick or Case Keenum or T.J. Yates opens the season as the starter. McNair also wants to make sure the Texans can provide a young quarterback better protection than the expansion team’s offensive line gave Carr.

“We weren’t able to give Carr the kind of protection we thought he should have,” McNair said. “I don’t put a lot of blame on him.”

If the Texans do draft a quarterback, they have to hope they’re not making excuses for his failures a dozen years down the road.
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Old 04-27-2014   #2
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

“We weren’t able to give Carr the kind of protection we thought he should have,” McNair said. “I don’t put a lot of blame on him.”
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Is that an apology for screwing up David's career I'm hearing from McNair ? Maybe they are gonna take his little brother so they can make everything right with the Carr family ?
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Old 04-27-2014   #3
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

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Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr
Because David isn't in this year's draft.
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Old 04-27-2014   #4
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

David isn't blameless in his lack of success, but the organization didn't exactly give him a chance to develop either. The lack of talent on the oline, bad offensive philosophy, and piss poor coaching played a role too.

I remember Steve Mckinney saying that Chris Palmer had our WR's running option routes in 2002 and you already have a rookie QB with a bad expansion team oline and you are running these slow developing plays instead of routes to get the ball out of his hand fast.
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Old 04-27-2014   #5
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

Our OL would've looked a lot different had our bookend OTs not had injury issues.
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Old 04-27-2014   #6
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

Mario Williams wasn't exactly a resounding success either. The top DE since Peppers who they passed on the first time. Fast forward to 2014 does anyone doubt McNair & Company can repeat their mistakes again? seriously it could happen. here's a novel idea how about trading down, haven't tried that before so would not be repeating same mistake again
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Old 04-27-2014   #7
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

I'd still rather have Mario Williams over the other options in 2006.
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Old 04-27-2014   #8
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

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Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
Mario Williams wasn't exactly a resounding success either. The top DE since Peppers who they passed on the first time. Fast forward to 2014 does anyone doubt McNair & Company can repeat their mistakes again? seriously it could happen. here's a novel idea how about trading down, haven't tried that before so would not be repeating same mistake again
Is there an expectation to win in the locker room?

That's the question to me. If the Texans locker room does not expect to win in 2014, then nothing's changed & whether we take Mario Williams, or David Carr, it won't make a difference.

If they're looking for a QB to give them a chance to win, or their #1 pick to be our defense, we're going down the same road. & unless we get a real special player, there's no way he can live up to that kind of 1-1 expectations.
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Old 04-27-2014   #9
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

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Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
Mario Williams wasn't exactly a resounding success either. The top DE since Peppers who they passed on the first time. Fast forward to 2014 does anyone doubt McNair & Company can repeat their mistakes again? seriously it could happen. here's a novel idea how about trading down, haven't tried that before so would not be repeating same mistake again
But how can you say that when the free agents market rewarded him with the top dollar contract of any defensive player ever at that point in time ? The NFL ultimately is a business, and the market spoke loud and clear about Mario's value when his services became available.
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Old 04-27-2014   #10
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

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David isn't blameless in his lack of success...
Blameful, imo.

In 2006, the team took 43 sacks total, 41 on Carr (a 5 year starter).

In 2007, the team took 22 sacks total on 60 more attempts.

We added Jordan Black and lost Zach Wiegert (OTs), and our first 4 draft picks were Amobi Okoye, Jacoby Jones, Fred Bennett, and Brandon Harrison.

So was it the offensive line, or was it the QB (Schaub/Rosenfels vs Carr)?

In 2007, Carr took 13 sacks in just 136 attempts for Carolina, a ~10% sack rate. Transposing to 2007 Texans attempts, that would've been 51 sacks.

You'd better draft pocket presence, because its darned near impossible to teach at this level.
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Old 04-28-2014   #11
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

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Blameful, imo.

In 2006, the team took 43 sacks total, 41 on Carr (a 5 year starter).

In 2007, the team took 22 sacks total on 60 more attempts.

We added Jordan Black and lost Zach Wiegert (OTs), and our first 4 draft picks were Amobi Okoye, Jacoby Jones, Fred Bennett, and Brandon Harrison.

So was it the offensive line, or was it the QB (Schaub/Rosenfels vs Carr)?

In 2007, Carr took 13 sacks in just 136 attempts for Carolina, a ~10% sack rate. Transposing to 2007 Texans attempts, that would've been 51 sacks.

You'd better draft pocket presence, because its darned near impossible to teach at this level.
That's my point and that's why I still think TB is the best qb in this draft and should be taken early. Pocket presence and poise matters. Knowing situational football is a great assett. If its 3 and 3 on the negative side of the field and you can throw a bomb or dump it off and move the chains,that's situational football. Even the best qbs in the nfl complete balls 30 yds down the field at less than 50%. Move the chains,know the situation on down and distance and make the plays when neccessary.

Davis Carr as a college sr had pocket issues like his brother. Even when the line gave him protaction, he ran out of bounds behind the los. The dude because of his family obligations was not the 1st guy in and the last to leave. All that stuff matters in picking a qb.
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Old 05-03-2014   #12
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

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Originally Posted by Playoffs View Post
Blameful, imo.

In 2006, the team took 43 sacks total, 41 on Carr (a 5 year starter).

In 2007, the team took 22 sacks total on 60 more attempts.

We added Jordan Black and lost Zach Wiegert (OTs), and our first 4 draft picks were Amobi Okoye, Jacoby Jones, Fred Bennett, and Brandon Harrison.

So was it the offensive line, or was it the QB (Schaub/Rosenfels vs Carr)?

In 2007, Carr took 13 sacks in just 136 attempts for Carolina, a ~10% sack rate. Transposing to 2007 Texans attempts, that would've been 51 sacks.

You'd better draft pocket presence, because its darned near impossible to teach at this level.
LOL so for three years he gets no protection and then suddenly we get a little and he's supposed to just stand there like the last 3 years have never happened and not be a little gun shy?

Don't get me wrong David was to blame, but I also can't blame him for being gunshot after so many sacks and getting killed.
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Old 04-28-2014   #13
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

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Originally Posted by texanhead08 View Post
David isn't blameless in his lack of success, but the organization didn't exactly give him a chance to develop either. The lack of talent on the oline, bad offensive philosophy, and piss poor coaching played a role too.

I remember Steve Mckinney saying that Chris Palmer had our WR's running option routes in 2002 and you already have a rookie QB with a bad expansion team oline and you are running these slow developing plays instead of routes to get the ball out of his hand fast.
Rep.

Organization didn't give him what he needed to succeed, and CP was a QB killer from word go.

Carr developed some bad habits and shoulders some responsibility, but majority is on the team. Should have fortified the O-line and let him sit, before throwing him to the wolves.
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Old 04-28-2014   #14
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

Jeebus save us from the offseason.
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Old 04-29-2014   #15
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

Quote:
Posted by Michael David Smith on April 27, 2014, 11:55 AM EDT


In 2002, the Texans used the first draft pick in franchise history on David Carr, who was beaten up while playing on a bad team and never developed into the kind of player Houston wanted him to be. Now the Texans own the first overall pick again, and owner Bob McNair says his team has learned from its mistakes.

McNair says the Texans now realize that a rookie quarterback shouldn’t play until he’s ready, and a veteran quarterback as a placeholder can be a wise investment.

“I think the main thing I look back on is that we should have had a veteran quarterback in there,” McNair said. “We should have let him start the season and let David learn what it takes to be an NFL quarterback.”

That suggests that if the Texans draft a quarterback next week, they’ll be drafting him with the idea that he’ll sit on the bench and learn while Ryan Fitzpatrick or Case Keenum or T.J. Yates opens the season as the starter. McNair also wants to make sure the Texans can provide a young quarterback better protection than the expansion team’s offensive line gave Carr.

“We weren’t able to give Carr the kind of protection we thought he should have,” McNair said. “I don’t put a lot of blame on him.”

If the Texans do draft a quarterback, they have to hope they’re not making excuses for his failures a dozen years down the road.



I call Bull**** on the 2 highlighted areas. McNair was more interested in recouping his investment by selling seats and jerseys than on winning games or really building a successful team from the inside out. He drafted the pretty boy QB and trotted him out there as a face of the franchise. McNair was much more interested in money than wins. The Texans were absolutely able to get some protection for Carr, but O-line isn't a sexy position and doesn't sell tickets. We're 12 yrs. into this franchise now and the Texans have never made the O-line a high priority.
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Old 04-27-2014   #16
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

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Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
Quote:
Posted by Michael David Smith on April 27, 2014, 11:55 AM EDT


In 2002, the Texans used the first draft pick in franchise history on David Carr, who was beaten up while playing on a bad team and never developed into the kind of player Houston wanted him to be. Now the Texans own the first overall pick again, and owner Bob McNair says his team has learned from its mistakes.

McNair says the Texans now realize that a rookie quarterback shouldn’t play until he’s ready, and a veteran quarterback as a placeholder can be a wise investment.
All this tells me, is that McNair admits that David was not ready. Has absolutely no bearing on whether our next rookie QB is ready or not. However, if he is not ready this statement suggests he will not start.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
Quote:
Posted by Michael David Smith on April 27, 2014, 11:55 AM EDT
“I think the main thing I look back on is that we should have had a veteran quarterback in there,” McNair said. “We should have let him start the season and let David learn what it takes to be an NFL quarterback.”
This is still talking about David Carr. It only pertains to our next QB if he is not ready. If he is ready & the team is good enough to support him it is possible that he'll start like Russell Wilson did, or Andrew Luck, or Matthew Stafford.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger View Post
Quote:
Posted by Michael David Smith on April 27, 2014, 11:55 AM EDT
That suggests that if the Texans draft a quarterback next week, they’ll be drafting him with the idea that he’ll sit on the bench and learn while Ryan Fitzpatrick or Case Keenum or T.J. Yates opens the season as the starter. McNair also wants to make sure the Texans can provide a young quarterback better protection than the expansion team’s offensive line gave Carr.
This is where the reporter strays from reporting the news & adds his own commentary. However, McNair's comments do not suggest what he believes at all. They may be drafting him with the idea that he will compete for the starting job. McNair's comments about David Carr have nothing to do with the Texans "ideas" about a new QB, Fitzpatrick, Keenum, or Tj.

If McNair's comments suggests wanting a strong offensive line, that could also have draft implications.
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Quote:
Posted by Michael David Smith on April 27, 2014, 11:55 AM EDT
“We weren’t able to give Carr the kind of protection we thought he should have,” McNair said. “I don’t put a lot of blame on him.”

If the Texans do draft a quarterback, they have to hope they’re not making excuses for his failures a dozen years down the road.
That last statement, the one that starts with "if" also suggests the possibility that the Texans won't draft a QB in the 2014 draft at all. After all, the Texans have not had much success drafting QBs period. But have had success with QBs they've traded for or signing veteran QBs.
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Old 04-29-2014   #17
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

I hate hearing the excuses for David Carr. Most franchises that have the #1 pick don't have great protection for a young QB. That's why they have the #1 pick.

Carr didn't study film nearly enough and he has admitted that himself. He didn't study defenses and become a master at recognizing coverages and take on that leadership role. Sure, the Texans had some negligence at the Oline, but the Steelers had that problem for years with Ben and so did that Packers with Rodgers and both guys played through it and had some great seasons. Carr was never going to be a good QB no matter where he played or what the Texans did.
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Old 05-03-2014   #18
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Default Re: Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

Hopefully that the team will not just when they and if they draft a QB. They will give him protection as that is what they lacked in protecting David Carr. All of those sacks had to take a wear and tear on his body!
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Old 04-29-2014   #19
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Yes it is where were you?Are you satisfied that we traded all 2014 picks for picks in 2015? My sources tell me we are going to move up and take Winston..if he is not in prison.

Didn't we draft him and cut him once already?
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Old 05-02-2014   #20
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Default Bob McNair: Texans won’t repeat mistakes we made with David Carr

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What makes you think the fruit of that foresight isn't taking shape now? I see the moves they made(shedding several overpaid contracts)/didn't make (throwing money away in FA) as a positive start toward turning this franchise around. I think anyone with an open mind, sans an agenda (which I KNOW is too much for some to give up).

I would agree that's it's too early to know for sure but it seems to me they've been proactive as far as the cap is concerned and we only have to wait a little over a week to see how the draft plays out.

I'm off the Kool-Aid but at the same time am willing to take a wait and see stance before I'm ready to pull the pitch fork out. I know that's not an overly popular stance. So be it.

Agree with you 1000%. Some people can't see the possibility that we are currently in a stage where we are re-booting the franchise. Not just "the team," but the entire Houston Texans as an organization.

I'll give O'Brien the benefit of the doubt until they give me reason not to. I'm not 100% on kool aid, either, but, I don't see where this franchise can go but up.


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