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Old 12-16-2013   #1
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Default Jake Matthews now #1

NFLDraftscout now has Matthews rated #1 and Bridgewater dropped to #4 on new board from today.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/p...kings/2014/all
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Old 12-16-2013   #2
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Darqueze Dennard to #7 top rated CB now.
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Old 12-16-2013   #3
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

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Originally Posted by beerlover View Post
Darqueze Dennard to #7 top rated CB now.
Hey! How are you evaluating McCarron now? He has climbed to second round. I think he will have a solid if not spectacular combine. Appreciate your views.
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Old 12-16-2013   #4
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Earlier in the season , I preferred Matthews .... In general I still do.

But .... Circumstances dictate course of action.

The circumstances here are simple - We don't have a quarterback. If you don't have a franchise QB , you go get one. Teddy , should he declare is probably your best bet to become that franchise QB , at least in this draft.

I don't want one of the scrap heap QB's that will be FA's this offseason , they have all proven they aren't "Franchise Quarterbacks." They are Schaub or worse .... I've had enough of that.

I guess you do have the option of drafting Matthews and letting Case act like an NFL QB for another season then drafting Jameis Winston or Marcus Mariota in the 2015 draft .... but I'm not so sure I can stomach another season like this one.
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Old 12-16-2013   #5
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

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Originally Posted by Corrosion View Post
Earlier in the season , I preferred Matthews .... In general I still do.

But .... Circumstances dictate course of action.

The circumstances here are simple - We don't have a quarterback. If you don't have a franchise QB , you go get one. Teddy , should he declare is probably your best bet to become that franchise QB , at least in this draft.

I don't want one of the scrap heap QB's that will be FA's this offseason , they have all proven they aren't "Franchise Quarterbacks." They are Schaub or worse .... I've had enough of that.

I guess you do have the option of drafting Matthews and letting Case act like an NFL QB for another season then drafting Jameis Winston or Marcus Mariota in the 2015 draft .... but I'm not so sure I can stomach another season like this one.
I dont want Matthews at 1-1.

I could live with Jason Campbell next yr if it meant getting one of the top 5 QB's in 2015. After filling in all of the holes in this yrs draft. Long term planning should be the key. Do I think BoB/Rick are capable of this? Nope. Gotta sell those tickets/jerseys etc... Get ready to buy your Bridgewater jersey because that's what BoB does. Regardless of if Bridgewater his best for the long term health of his franchise.

But as another poster said BoB doesn't owe us anything and this is true. Because if it wasn't true Rick Smith would be out of a JOB.
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Old 12-17-2013   #6
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

IMHO I don't think Matthews will be the first OT taken in the draft. There are a couple of more athletic OTs that could be in this draft. Matthews last few games were disappointing.
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Old 12-17-2013   #7
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

I have no issue taking Matthews if we'll have have a shot at a Bortles in the 2nd and/or a Mettenberger in the 3rd.

St. Louis would take Matthews or Clowney or Teddy, so they won't be a trade partner.

We won't get to see the most interesting part of this offseason, which will be the trade machinations/offers/scenarios.
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Old 12-17-2013   #8
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

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Originally Posted by Playoffs View Post
I have no issue taking Matthews if we'll have have a shot at a Bortles in the 2nd and/or a Mettenberger in the 3rd.

St. Louis would take Matthews or Clowney or Teddy, so they won't be a trade partner.

We won't get to see the most interesting part of this offseason, which will be the trade machinations/offers/scenarios.
Not likely barring some unforeseen event. Bortles is basically a top 20 lock at this point and Mettenberger won't make it out of the top half of the second round.

This is also the problem with all the trade back scenarios. How do you ensure that you can trade back and still get the guy you want?
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Old 01-21-2014   #9
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

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Originally Posted by Texian View Post
IMHO I don't think Matthews will be the first OT taken in the draft. There are a couple of more athletic OTs that could be in this draft. Matthews last few games were disappointing.
and now there is talk of him playing center....not surprised.
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Old 01-21-2014   #10
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Did he get measured recently? Are his arms really short? Why are people discussing him as a center instead of a guard or tackle? That's a big downgrade.
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Old 12-17-2013   #11
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

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Originally Posted by Corrosion View Post
Earlier in the season , I preferred Matthews .... In general I still do.

But .... Circumstances dictate course of action.

The circumstances here are simple - We don't have a quarterback. If you don't have a franchise QB , you go get one. .
"Jane, you ignorant slut!"

This draft is rich with QB's.... Just sayin'....

I mean after all Derek Carr would be available...
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Old 12-17-2013   #12
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

What's the point of having a RT if he has no one worth protecting?

What's the point in having the first pick if you can't confidently draft an above average (at least) starter at multiple positions?

What's the point in drafting if you aren't willing to take a little risk?

We have been drafting ****ty in the later rounds for years. Most teams find their RT in free agency or later rounds of the draft. There's no reason why the Texans can't do that, or shouldn't try. You rarely see a team spend 2 first round picks on both tackle positions, because it's just too damn much to spend on a position that should be filled for less resources. If you can't find a competent RT in rounds 3-1 though 7 then you need a new GM (which I am in favor of!).

Think of it this way, how much does the average RT cost in the NFL? How much dose the average strong-side pass rusher cost? How much does the average QB cost?

Figure out where to spend picks based on scarcity and costs so you don't over-allocate resources to one position. Picking Matthews, IMO, is overallocating resources to the OT position. It would be a reactionary pick due to the poor play at RT, rather than a calculated pick based on salary-cap football.
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Old 12-17-2013   #13
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutchrudder View Post
What's the point of having a RT if he has no one worth protecting?

What's the point in having the first pick if you can't confidently draft an above average (at least) starter at multiple positions?

What's the point in drafting if you aren't willing to take a little risk?

We have been drafting ****ty in the later rounds for years. Most teams find their RT in free agency or later rounds of the draft. There's no reason why the Texans can't do that, or shouldn't try. You rarely see a team spend 2 first round picks on both tackle positions, because it's just too damn much to spend on a position that should be filled for less resources. If you can't find a competent RT in rounds 3-1 though 7 then you need a new GM (which I am in favor of!).

Think of it this way, how much does the average RT cost in the NFL? How much dose the average strong-side pass rusher cost? How much does the average QB cost?

Figure out where to spend picks based on scarcity and costs so you don't over-allocate resources to one position. Picking Matthews, IMO, is overallocating resources to the OT position. It would be a reactionary pick due to the poor play at RT, rather than a calculated pick based on salary-cap football.
You are entitled to your opinion .... and in theory I don't disagree.


But QB being the greatest position of need .... Either there is one you feel is a franchise QB or not. If you feel he is the real deal you draft him.

If not .... then you have the #1 pick in the wrong damn year , tough luck.

I'd prefer to trade down because I don't believe there is a franchise QB in this draft and that none of the other players are worth taking (For this team) at #1 overall. I wouldn't touch Clowney in the first round , Barr is good player ... but over rated.

But .... to move down you have to have someone willing to move up.

If you cant move down and aren't taking Bridgewater .... Matthews is probably the safest pick in this draft. He fills a dire need and can eventually replace your franchise LT when he is cut , traded or retires.
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Old 12-17-2013   #14
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrosion View Post
You are entitled to your opinion .... and in theory I don't disagree.


But QB being the greatest position of need .... Either there is one you feel is a franchise QB or not. If you feel he is the real deal you draft him.

If not .... then you have the #1 pick in the wrong damn year , tough luck.

I'd prefer to trade down because I don't believe there is a franchise QB in this draft and that none of the other players are worth taking (For this team) at #1 overall. I wouldn't touch Clowney in the first round , Barr is good player ... but over rated.

But .... to move down you have to have someone willing to move up.

If you cant move down and aren't taking Bridgewater .... Matthews is probably the safest pick in this draft. He fills a dire need and can eventually replace your franchise LT when he is cut , traded or retires.
I agree with all that, but CJ Mosely awfully tempting if we can get a trade down to about 5
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Old 12-18-2013   #15
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Corrosion View Post
You are entitled to your opinion .... and in theory I don't disagree.


But QB being the greatest position of need .... Either there is one you feel is a franchise QB or not. If you feel he is the real deal you draft him.

If not .... then you have the #1 pick in the wrong damn year , tough luck.

I'd prefer to trade down because I don't believe there is a franchise QB in this draft and that none of the other players are worth taking (For this team) at #1 overall. I wouldn't touch Clowney in the first round , Barr is good player ... but over rated.

But .... to move down you have to have someone willing to move up.

If you cant move down and aren't taking Bridgewater .... Matthews is probably the safest pick in this draft. He fills a dire need and can eventually replace your franchise LT when he is cut , traded or retires.
Best player available. If that's a tackle, so be it. It's not like the team doesn't need a tackle as well. So you can pair need and BPA. That's a win-win scenario.

Oh yeah, people want to force the QB pick. The only way I buy the argument that you have to draft a QB high if you have that pick is if you are willing to give up on him after one season. Because the next year, you might have a high draft pick and a better QB might be available. I mean, we're all about getting a great QB, right? Or did we want to set the franchise back 2-4 years while they figure out if the last #1 guy was the right pick?

How long do you give a new QB? 6 games? 10 games? 2 years? 4 years? Or does it just depend on if the QB was someone you touted and wanted brought in?

:smfh:
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Old 12-17-2013   #16
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutchrudder View Post
What's the point of having a RT if he has no one worth protecting?

What's the point in having the first pick if you can't confidently draft an above average (at least) starter at multiple positions?

What's the point in drafting if you aren't willing to take a little risk?

We have been drafting ****ty in the later rounds for years. Most teams find their RT in free agency or later rounds of the draft. There's no reason why the Texans can't do that, or shouldn't try. You rarely see a team spend 2 first round picks on both tackle positions, because it's just too damn much to spend on a position that should be filled for less resources. If you can't find a competent RT in rounds 3-1 though 7 then you need a new GM (which I am in favor of!).

Think of it this way, how much does the average RT cost in the NFL? How much dose the average strong-side pass rusher cost? How much does the average QB cost?

Figure out where to spend picks based on scarcity and costs so you don't over-allocate resources to one position. Picking Matthews, IMO, is overallocating resources to the OT position. It would be a reactionary pick due to the poor play at RT, rather than a calculated pick based on salary-cap football.
Your first sentence is the issue DR as we can get something to protect in second round. Bortles, McCarron and Mettenberger all rated after #38. Other teams may draft RT in FA or later rounds, well we did also with minimal results. Antonio Richardson is the only OT after first round that can start for us and I am very concerned he will go in late first and I don't automatically project him to RT anyway. I do need to add that JuWaan James could start but the further you go less chance he will be there.

I am not concerned about cost as Matthews would be on at least a four year contract for reasonable money as was DB. 4-5 years from now we worry about Brown's last years. Sometimes you draft a good player and cut costs elsewhere. You control your cap by wisely bringing in cheap young draft picks and cheap FA and occasionally UDFA and knowing when to move on from your expensive vets. I am definitely not arguing cap with you but just offering my POV.
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Old 12-18-2013   #17
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Quote:
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Your first sentence is the issue DR as we can get something to protect in second round. Bortles, McCarron and Mettenberger all rated after #38. Other teams may draft RT in FA or later rounds, well we did also with minimal results. Antonio Richardson is the only OT after first round that can start for us and I am very concerned he will go in late first and I don't automatically project him to RT anyway. I do need to add that JuWaan James could start but the further you go less chance he will be there.

I am not concerned about cost as Matthews would be on at least a four year contract for reasonable money as was DB. 4-5 years from now we worry about Brown's last years. Sometimes you draft a good player and cut costs elsewhere. You control your cap by wisely bringing in cheap young draft picks and cheap FA and occasionally UDFA and knowing when to move on from your expensive vets. I am definitely not arguing cap with you but just offering my POV.
Your first sentence is the issue Badboy as you think using a sports website big board in December is a legitimate Guide to making a viable decision on draft strategy. That is something I would expect from Texian.
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Old 12-18-2013   #18
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Honestly what I would really like for them to do if they get the number one pick is trade down. There generally is always someone who reaches and with so many teams needing a quarterback they may want the position to get the one they want. As long as our asking price isn't something idiotic a good GM should be able to make this happen. Now if Smith is a good one remains to be seen as I think many of us have some doubts in that area. This will probably be the first draft he has more power in the decision making depending on the coach hire.
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Old 12-18-2013   #19
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dutchrudder View Post
What's the point of having a RT if he has no one worth protecting?

What's the point in having the first pick if you can't confidently draft an above average (at least) starter at multiple positions?

What's the point in drafting if you aren't willing to take a little risk?

We have been drafting ****ty in the later rounds for years. Most teams find their RT in free agency or later rounds of the draft. There's no reason why the Texans can't do that, or shouldn't try. You rarely see a team spend 2 first round picks on both tackle positions, because it's just too damn much to spend on a position that should be filled for less resources. If you can't find a competent RT in rounds 3-1 though 7 then you need a new GM (which I am in favor of!).

Think of it this way, how much does the average RT cost in the NFL? How much dose the average strong-side pass rusher cost? How much does the average QB cost?

Figure out where to spend picks based on scarcity and costs so you don't over-allocate resources to one position. Picking Matthews, IMO, is overallocating resources to the OT position. It would be a reactionary pick due to the poor play at RT, rather than a calculated pick based on salary-cap football.
You can get someone worth protecting in the second round. Your RT (and future LT) can protect that guy and guys who come in the years after (if that proves necessary) for years to come. This RT/LT comes from a family of NFL players with epic longevity and quality.

You insist on looking at Matthews at 1-1 as a pick for a RT and wasted opportunity right now when in reality it's an investment in two positions (one now and the other later). You still have three positions on the line that are filled with your late-round bargain guys. You will lose Duane Brown at some point and when you do you'll slide Matthews over to take his place.

It's the safe play and if the trade down isn't there (which I would very much like to see. This is a draft with no clear 1-1 player) then I think it's a good pick. By the time you're having to pay Matthews what he's worth you'll probably be seeing Duane Brown go out the door for more money or Duane Brown in decline and pointing him toward the door.

You want to gamble on the guy you take in the first round. I would prefer to gamble on the guy I take in the second round. Granted it's all a gamble to some degree and we both know that.
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Old 12-18-2013   #20
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Default Re: Jake Matthews now #1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
You can get someone worth protecting in the second round.
Can you? Certainly. But the odds are not in your favor.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hervoyel View Post
You want to gamble on the guy you take in the first round. I would prefer to gamble on the guy I take in the second round. Granted it's all a gamble to some degree and we both know that.
Passing on Bridgewater in the 1st to take Mettenberger/McCarron/etc in the 2nd is just as much a gamble as just drafting Bridgewater.

Matthews seems to be the key here. Many people would like Matthews + another QB than Bridgewater + another OT. I don't see much difference between Matthews and the other OT's available.
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