Thread: Manziel
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Old 11-20-2012   #96
Dutchrudder 
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Default Re: Manziel

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan B. View Post
My post was referring to QB rating primarily (which if anything underrates rushing stats). I'm not asking whether Cam Newton or Tim Tebow had fewer total passing yards or rushing yards. Feel free to count his 27 rushing yards against the Tigers, although I'm guessing Stemp won't. I'm asking if any Heisman winning QB ever had a game like the one Johnny had against LSU.

I honestly don't know if anyone has had a game like that -- for all I know Ware, Weintze, or someone like that did and I just don't recall it. I used Tebow because he was brought up, and Cam and RGIII because they were the last two to win and I knew they didn't have a game like that.
It's a valid question, and I can't really answer it off the top of my head. I do recall RG3 having an awful game against an undefeated OK State, but covering it up in the stats with a bunch of garbage TDs. I recall him giving away that game in my mind, but I don't have it in front of me so I can't really check. However, I don't recall how much it hurt him in the voting, it was mid-season so maybe the timing was early enough to not affect him.

Iirc he had a rather poor game against a bad A&M defense last year too. Dunno if that qualifies as "laying an egg"

I don't think the one game should ruin Manziel's chances of winning, and the same goes for Colin Klein. That Baylor game alone shouldn't be enough to knock him out of the top 3, given all he accomplished up to that point. But comparing the two of them, I have to give it to Manziel.

Quote:
If Notre Dame beats USC, and especially if their defense holds the Trojans in check, I think T'eo wins it. I think arguments about how many solo tackles he has are silly, because as any fan of defense knows the stats on that side of the ball are much less indicative of the value of the player. They may not be getting tackles because they are taken out of the play.

I do think Manziel absolutely belongs on the podium. He could even eventually win 2. I just don't think that he'll win it this year. Putting aside his dismal LSU game:

Number of Freshmen to win the Heisman: 0
Number of 3,000 yards passers, 1,000 yards rushers to win the Heisman: 0
Yeah, I'm not buying the Teo koolaide. I would much rather see Marquis Lee get it over him. Lee has had some insane games against good teams, although I'll admit haven't looked up their secondary rankings to compare. Honestly, I could vote him #1 over Manziel, he has been amazing this year and could be really special in years to come.

I really don't understand why Teo is in the discussion. Just look at this pic about Teo's stats and competition:



I'm not even sure if the INT against Michigan State shouldn't be a fumble recovery. The QB was running to the sideline and then either flips the ball sideways or just loses it somehow and it goes right to Teo. Kind of makes a difference if people are going to vote for him because of 6 INTs.

I think Shembo might be the best defensive player on that team. He gets lots of pressure, causes a ton disruption at the line. I know I have seen him make a lot of QB hits, and I think he's an interesting NFL draft prospect. Steven Tuitt is another seemingly unsung hero of that defense.

Going into this year, ND was expected to have the toughest strength of schedule, but it appears that was just hype. The Big 10 isn't nearly as strong as years past, and ND still struggled with some of those teams thanks to their anemic offense. They had trouble with teams like BYU, Purdue, and they nearly lost to Pitt in OT. I don't have a doubt in my mind that if Teo was on any other team in the nation, his name would never be mentioned for Heisman. But because he's on the Dallas Cowboys of college football, we might have an ILB with mediocre stats as the winner of the Heisman.
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