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-   -   Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith? (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99054)

CloakNNNdagger 03-09-2013 10:17 AM

Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

Still rehabbing, Texans linebacker Brian Cushing urges chop-block ban

Houston Texans linebacker Brian Cushing has an urgent appeal to the NFL's competition committee as it mulls potential rules changes this week in Naples, Fla.:

Eliminate chop blocks – like the one that ended Cushing's season Oct. 8 with a shredded left anterior cruciate ligament.

In the second quarter of a Monday night game against the New York Jets, guard Matt Slauson ran past Cushing, then doubled back and cut him down with a blindside hit while Cushing was pursuing running back Bilal Powell.

"It's just asking for an injury when you get guys this big, this fast going full speed at legs," Cushing told USA TODAY Sports on Wednesday. "What do you think is going to happen?''

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Five months later, Cushing says he is still a week and a half away from returning to the field and running in a brace.

But surprisingly not everyone in the Texans organization sides with Cushing on the possible rule change – not the offensive linemen, and not head coach Gary Kubiak.

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"Me? I think you know that answer,'' Kubiak said at the NFL scouting combine last month. "It's part of what we do. I think it's part of football. We teach it the right way. Hopefully, that part stays with us.''
Quote:

Cushing is on one side, Kubiak is on the other. And if Texans general manager Rick Smith is the organizational swing vote, know this: He sounds like he's backing Cushing – and Smith is member of the competition committee.

"That block (on Cushing) is already illegal (outside the tackle box)," Smith said at the combine. "In the (tackle) box, it's legal. The question that we've got to answer is: Should it be? And I don't think anybody thinks so.

"So that's something that we've got to talk about and think about.''

Cushing understands the debate from offensive linemen since cut-blocking is integral to the way the Texans create lanes for running back Arian Foster.

"The guys I've talked to have all been for it, except for the offensive linemen,'' Cushing said. "But I just feel it can be done safely.''
LINK

Playoffs 03-09-2013 11:23 AM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
ZBS isn't the source of what happened to Cush.

thunderkyss 03-09-2013 11:27 AM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
There's a difference between a chop-block & a cut-block.

76Texan 03-09-2013 11:54 AM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
There's a difference between a legal block and an illegal block.

thunderkyss 03-09-2013 12:28 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
How many DLmen actually get hurt because of the cut-block? Everyone I can recall getting hurt, was off an illegal block.

Brisco_County 03-09-2013 12:43 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderkyss (Post 2133288)
How many DLmen actually get hurt because of the cut-block? Everyone I can recall getting hurt, was off an illegal block.

Exactly. How many people have been injured by the Texans' cut blocking? I've watched every Texans game in the Kubiak era, and I can't remember any injuries.

And Slauson's block was illegal. That's why they fined him.

76Texan 03-09-2013 12:45 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderkyss (Post 2133288)
How many DLmen actually get hurt because of the cut-block? Everyone I can recall getting hurt, was off an illegal block.

None when Chester Pitts performs the block.
He announces it an hour in advance so the DLmen can avoid it. :brando:

CloakNNNdagger 03-09-2013 12:48 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderkyss (Post 2133288)
How many DLmen actually get hurt because of the cut-block? Everyone I can recall getting hurt, was off an illegal block.

Not in any way making a case against cut blocking, but if I remember correctly, didn't Ziggy Hood and Casey Hampton both have ACLs as a result of cut blocks?

silvrhand 03-09-2013 06:25 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
sigh the NFL might as well take the pads off and put pink neon shirts on them and just play flag football at this point.

Cushing just needs to get back to work and deal with the rigors of the NFL.

thunderkyss 03-09-2013 07:15 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by silvrhand (Post 2133381)
sigh the NFL might as well take the pads off and put pink neon shirts on them and just play flag football at this point.

Cushing just needs to get back to work and deal with the rigors of the NFL.

I think they're turning Cushing's words into something it's not, or Cushing is extrapolating from his experience & coming to a poor conclusion.

I'm not saying this, because the Texans teach cut-blocking as part of their system. I just don't know of many people who get hurt this way. The horse collar.... seemed like they made a pretty good case for it, rolling onto the back of the QB's legs.... I got it. But I'm just not seeing players getting hurt by legal blocks.

Of course, if the Texans didn't teach it I wouldn't be concerned, but my opinion would be the same.

Brisco_County 03-09-2013 09:26 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
I'm venturing to guess that it's not the typical use of the cut block at the snap that Cushing objects to, but how allowing cut blocking creates dangerous situations after the snap. His own injury being the prime example.

Brisco_County 03-09-2013 09:32 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
What probably bothers most defenders is that they have to spend time learning to counter it. That's why we always hear about how risky it is, but hardly ever see injuries from it.

Quote:

Jets coach Rex Ryan has used what he calls a “big ball drill.” The exercise, done throughout training camp and periodically thereafter, entails pushing a large ball into the legs of defensive linemen as they try to stay on their feet and simultaneously push the ball away. It worked so well during Ryan’s time as defensive coordinator of the Ravens in preparing linemen to face teams that use cut/zone blocking that Ryan proclaimed he should seek a patent on the technique.

Bottom line? It’s not as big of an issue as the Steelers and Titans have made it out to be. And the best way to deal with the situation isn’t to complain about it, but to find a way to overcome it.
Link.

thunderkyss 03-10-2013 07:20 AM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Brisco_County (Post 2133410)
I'm venturing to guess that it's not the typical use of the cut block at the snap that Cushing objects to, but how allowing cut blocking creates dangerous situations after the snap. His own injury being the prime example.

That block on Cushing is not allowed. It was flagged & the player was fined.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brisco_County (Post 2133411)
What probably bothers most defenders is that they have to spend time learning to counter it. That's why we always hear about how risky it is, but hardly ever see injuries from it.
Quote:

Jets coach Rex Ryan has used what he calls a ďbig ball drill.Ē The exercise, done throughout training camp and periodically thereafter, entails pushing a large ball into the legs of defensive linemen as they try to stay on their feet and simultaneously push the ball away. It worked so well during Ryanís time as defensive coordinator of the Ravens in preparing linemen to face teams that use cut/zone blocking that Ryan proclaimed he should seek a patent on the technique.

Bottom line? Itís not as big of an issue as the Steelers and Titans have made it out to be. And the best way to deal with the situation isnít to complain about it, but to find a way to overcome it.

Link.

If not for cut blocks, less athletic defensive linemen could be more successful & extend their careers.

Brisco_County 03-10-2013 01:37 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderkyss (Post 2133459)
That block on Cushing is not allowed. It was flagged & the player was fined.

Right, but the fact that the blocks are even allowed means that a moron like Slauson is going to abuse it by making a careless decision.

Double Barrel 03-11-2013 06:08 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 76Texan (Post 2133263)
There's a difference between a legal block and an illegal block.

And sometimes the only difference between a block being legal or illegal is an imaginary line.

"That block (on Cushing) is already illegal (outside the tackle box)," Smith said at the combine. "In the (tackle) box, it's legal."

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderkyss (Post 2133459)
That block on Cushing is not allowed. It was flagged & the player was fined.

The bock is not allowed where it happened.

Had that exact same block occurred in the tackle box, it's legal.

infantrycak 03-11-2013 06:45 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Double Barrel (Post 2133922)
And sometimes the only difference between a block being legal or illegal is an imaginary line.

"That block (on Cushing) is already illegal (outside the tackle box)," Smith said at the combine. "In the (tackle) box, it's legal." .

I do not believe Smith is correct with regard to this hit. Cushing was not hit from the front as is required for a legal cut block. I do not think that was a legal hit anywhere on the field. The OLmen's whole body is behind Cushing except for his helmet impacting his knee from the side.

Double Barrel 03-11-2013 06:50 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by infantrycak (Post 2133938)
I do not believe Smith is correct with regard to this hit. Cushing was not hit from the front as is required for a legal cut block. I do not think that was a legal hit anywhere on the field. The OLmen's whole body is behind Cushing except for his helmet impacting his knee from the side.

But that is not what the article, and the league, are saying:

Quote:

Slauson was fined $10,000 for his illegal block on Cushing, who was, in effect, a defenseless defender, cut down by Slauson's peel-back block.

In a move to protect more players, the competition committee is considering a ban of these dangerous blocks, which remain legal inside the tackle box.

Double Barrel 03-11-2013 07:04 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Reading up on cut blocking vs. chop blocking and finding out the source of why the block on Cushing would have been legal in the box, I keep getting Rule 12, Section 2, Article 3 & 4 of the NFL rulebook.

Here is the wording:

Quote:

ILLEGAL BLOCKS BY OFFENSIVE PLAYER

Article 4 An offensive blocker cannot:

----------------------

(b) charge or fall into the back of an opponent above the waist, or use his hands or arms to push an opponent from behind in a manner that affects his movement, except in close-line play

Source
Bold added, but I believe this is the part of the rulebook that they might change, IMO.

It says "above the waist", so I'm a little confused if this is exactly what they are talking about updating.

edit: further reading, and I have always thought it was illegal no matter where it happens like 'cak mentioned, it specifically mentions "A player of either team may block (obstruct or impede) an opponent at any time, provided that the act is not: (j) an illegal cut block;" (Rule 12, Section 1, Article 1).

So I think the article is just wrong in confusing cut vs. chop blocking, and the questions to our GM and HC have been misconstrued to fit the article's agenda. JMO

CloakNNNdagger 03-11-2013 07:26 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Quote:

NFL competition committee seeks changes to chop blocks
Jarrett Bell, USA TODAY Sports12:24a.m. EDT March 11, 2013
2013-03-10-cushing


It appears that rehabbing Houston Texans linebacker Brian Cushing will get his wish.

During a week of meetings in Naples, Fla., the NFL's competition committee overwhelmingly agreed to support a rule change that would ban the type of peel-back block inside the tackle box that ended Cushing's 2012 season with a torn ACL, USA TODAY Sports has learned.

According to two people with knowledge of the nine-member committee's discussions, who would not speak publicly because proposed changes have not been announced, the committee will also seek to eliminate cut-blocks more than three yards outside the tackle box.

And the committee also wants to ban low, blindside blocks to defenders in pursuit of a quarterback who changed directions on a scramble after leaving the pocket.

Defensive players around the NFL -- who have long grumbled that the NFL doesn't protect them by rule as vigorously as it does offensive players -- may want to rejoice.
REST OF THE STORY

Wolf 03-19-2013 05:24 PM

Re: Blocking Rule Campaign: Cushing vs Kubiak vs Smith?
 
Just saw on tv. Blocks that took out cushing are now illegal


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