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-   -   Trade with Miami? (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97141)

badboy 12-20-2012 07:52 PM

Trade with Miami?
 
Reggie Bush often injured is a free agent for Miami and will probably expect large increase. Would Dolphins be interested in a younger RB who plays 2013 for $575,000? I think so. Tate did not look good against Colts but he was on the field. If he closes out with a good kick through the playoffs, he could be worth a trade.

Prior to his hamstring injury he was 59 for 255 yds @ 4.3. He is on pace for 72/312 5.3. Let's say he is healthy and avg 5+.

Would Dolphins and you make the following deal?

Texans first round + Tate + our 4th for Miami's second round (#43 & #54) and Miami's third round ( #77 and # 82)?

To add substance and something to look at players that are rated by CBSsports near these picks:

#43= DT Kawaan SHort #39 & OT Oday Oboushi #40, CB Jordan Poyer #41, CB Desmond Trufant # 43, WR Justin Hunter #44, RB Giovani Bernard #45

#54 = Wr Robert Woods #49, OT DJ Fluker #52, WR Cordarrelle Patterson #54, FS Phillip Thomas #55

#77= OT Kyle Long # 75, FS Tony Jefferson #77, ILB Alexander Ogletree # 78, Da'Rick Rogers # 79,
# 82= OLB Brandon Jenkins #80, WR Kenny Stills #82, CB David Amerson # 83, Qb Landry Jones #84

I think I'd say hell yeah:

Second round: CB Trufant & WR Patterson then our own for NT Sylvester Williams #69

Third round: QB Landry Jones and our own 3 for OT Brennan Williams & comp ILB Andrew Jackson

I would use the third from Miami and our 5th to trade into late second as we did with Brandon Harris for RB Eddie Lacy #60.

IMO too good to be true so probably is.

Dutchrudder 12-20-2012 08:51 PM

No way that happens, teams in rebuild mode want more picks not less. Tate plus our third for one of their 2nds would make more sense.

ArlingtonTexan 12-20-2012 11:01 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
I would not do that if I were the Texans, much less Miami. That would be creating a weakness @ RB depth for extra draft picks which the Texans have too many (est 10) for 2013 already.

thunderkyss 12-20-2012 11:04 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder (Post 2084837)
No way that happens, teams in rebuild mode want more picks not less. Tate plus our third for one of their 2nds would make more sense.

Tate & a third for Wimbley..... what do you think?

76Texan 12-21-2012 10:43 AM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
It could make sense for the Dolphins if they can somehow work out a gentleman agreement with Tate's agent to extend his contract during the off-season.

With their two number 2, and one of their 3, they won't be assured of a good RB and what the Texans #1 can bring.

So I can see why they also need to swap another 3 with the Texans 4 to make the deal more equitable.

At the same time, the Texans need to be able to resign Forsett to make sure they have a backup RB.

But even if somebody wants to pay Forsett more, it's OK too.

We have money from Tate and Forsett to find another RB and/or bring back Grimes.

With a bunch of draft picks we can make all kinda of deals to move back up at the "right time" to select a position of our choices at those moments.

Basically, we will be moving Tate to shore up other positions.

I would strongly consider this trade.

Dutchrudder 12-21-2012 11:54 AM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fiddler (Post 2084883)
Tate & a third for Wimbley..... what do you think?

You mean Kamerion Wimbley of the Titans?



76, Grimes is under contract next year for cheap. After leaving the Jets, he signed a 2 year deal with us, and iirc he costs 550k next year. Could take Forsett's spot or possibly Tate's.

76Texan 12-21-2012 12:24 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder (Post 2085089)
You mean Kamerion Wimbley of the Titans?



76, Grimes is under contract next year for cheap. After leaving the Jets, he signed a 2 year deal with us, and iirc he costs 550k next year. Could take Forsett's spot or possibly Tate's.

What happens now that we just cut him?

Don't we have to resign him to a future contract or something like that?

How does it work?

Dutchrudder 12-21-2012 12:35 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 76Texan (Post 2085115)
What happens now that we just cut him?

Don't we have to resign him to a future contract or something like that?

How does it work?

Oh sorry, I missed that. Well, I would imagine he will be back on the p-squad and stay there for a while. I'm not sure how many games he was on active rosters this year, but I suspect he is still eligible for psquad.

You can't sign players to future/reserve contracts until after the season has ended, so I don't think that's the case.

badboy 12-21-2012 12:45 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by ArlingtonTexan (Post 2084880)
I would not do that if I were the Texans, much less Miami. That would be creating a weakness @ RB depth for extra draft picks which the Texans have too many (est 10) for 2013 already.

AT, as stated in my thread I would trade my own 3 & 5 for a second to draft Lacy. I would be willing to go Foster/Lacy/Grimes or another UDFA if Grimes does not return.

badboy 12-21-2012 12:55 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder (Post 2084837)
No way that happens, teams in rebuild mode want more picks not less. Tate plus our third for one of their 2nds would make more sense.

You would not trade two middle of second and two middle of third for a starting RB comparable to Bush yet younger and cheaper? Plus getting a first round and a 4th?

Miami first round #13 and 32 + their 4th and ours. Plus Tate. I think they jump all over that.

I would not trade Tate and a third for their second round # 43. I would trade Tate straight up for their #54. You don't focus on his value to us but his value to them. I believe in 2013 he matches Bush's 2012 estimated 1,000 yds.

Miami would want Ben to agree to long term deal.

Dutchrudder 12-21-2012 02:12 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by badboy (Post 2085129)
You would not trade two middle of second and two middle of third for a starting RB comparable to Bush yet younger and cheaper? Plus getting a first round and a 4th?

Miami first round #13 and 32 + their 4th and ours. Plus Tate. I think they jump all over that.

I would not trade Tate and a third for their second round # 43. I would trade Tate straight up for their #54. You don't focus on his value to us but his value to them. I believe in 2013 he matches Bush's 2012 estimated 1,000 yds.

Miami would want Ben to agree to long term deal.

Why would Miami want to make a long term deal with a RB that's been hurt as much as Tate? Why would they want a guy who might just be a system RB with good ypc stats? Why would they pay a premium for that when they don't even have an o-line good enoguh to block for him? They aren't in position to do it, and I think you are greatly overvaluing Tate. He's worth a 4th alone at this point.

I think you need to package Tate and a pick for a single pick. That's it. You just don't see many trades involving multiple picks.

76Texan 12-21-2012 02:30 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder (Post 2085154)
Why would Miami want to make a long term deal with a RB that's been hurt as much as Tate? Why would they want a guy who might just be a system RB with good ypc stats? Why would they pay a premium for that when they don't even have an o-line good enoguh to block for him? They aren't in position to do it, and I think you are greatly overvaluing Tate. He's worth a 4th alone at this point.

I think you need to package Tate and a pick for a single pick. That's it. You just don't see many trades involving multiple picks.

It's not a premium, at least I don't think so.

It's more like a bird in hand, unless the Dolphins believe that Tate is nothing but an injury waiting to happen.

We don't have that kind of insider information.

We work on the premises that Tate has been showing well without any lingering effect from his injury.

Perhaps his value only worth the most to the Texans; they have the best knowledge about his well-being.

It might be difficult to sell when people don't trust one another.
But coaches and GMs have a certain circle (same as us) where they can see the mutual benefit.

It happens quite often, you know.

beerlover 12-21-2012 02:59 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Winning upcoming Super Bowl would be return enough, anything else gravy.

Playoffs 12-21-2012 03:03 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
I don't want Bush. Still.

IF, and I don't wish it one anyone, but if the Redskins find themselves needing an RB due to injury ... then I'd consider trading Tate for one of theirs.

thunderkyss 12-21-2012 04:42 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder (Post 2085089)
You mean Kamerion Wimbley of the Titans?



76, Grimes is under contract next year for cheap. After leaving the Jets, he signed a 2 year deal with us, and iirc he costs 550k next year. Could take Forsett's spot or possibly Tate's.

My bad, I meant Cameron Wake... I think.

Playoffs 12-21-2012 04:44 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Fiddler (Post 2085237)
My bad, I meant Cameron Wake... I think.


You do, but he's a 4-3 DE. Having a monster year.

thunderkyss 12-21-2012 04:49 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Playoffs (Post 2085239)
You do, but he's a 4-3 DE. Having a monster year.

He could take the spot left Vacant when Mario left & Barwin failed to show up.

badboy 12-21-2012 05:09 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutchrudder (Post 2085154)
Why would Miami want to make a long term deal with a RB that's been hurt as much as Tate? Why would they want a guy who might just be a system RB with good ypc stats? Why would they pay a premium for that when they don't even have an o-line good enoguh to block for him? They aren't in position to do it, and I think you are greatly overvaluing Tate. He's worth a 4th alone at this point.

I think you need to package Tate and a pick for a single pick. That's it. You just don't see many trades involving multiple picks.

They signed Reggie Bush didn't they? Tate's injury was a hamstring which is significant but not a knee for example or ACL. In 2011 he had 942 yds at 5.4 avg. That is about what Bush will do this year but at lesser avg. The "system" will be similar to Houston's ZBS as Mike Sherman runs a derivitive. Wasn't Bush called a system back when he came out?


In Sherman’s scheme, runners must display a decisive, quick burst through the hole, and possess reliable hands for the passing game. Pristine route-running, short-area quickness, and the ability to get tough yards after the catch are valued traits for a WR in Sherman’s scheme; size and straight-line speed are just gravy. The offensive linemen must be intelligent and stout at the point of attack, yet athletic enough to get out and block at the second level. http://nflsfuture.com/2012/12/20/mia...season-primer/

OT: Jake Long should stay in Miami and he is only 27. If neccesary, an OT could be taken at #32 in my scenario or a Cb which is another priority need. WR and OT in draft and Tate?


I think you are undervalung Tate, I rank him as a third but if he pluses out like I suggested in OP, his value to a team like Miami losing it's current RB is much higher. Give Tannehill a WR like Keenan Allen @ 13 + a younger version of Bush and solidify the OT with Barrett Jones or Lane Johnson? And if Long returns, a CB @ 32 strengthens the defense.

Coaches gamble with QBs, WRs, CBs and RBs. I think Tate would love to be the feature back in a city like Miami.

The more I think of this deal better I like it.

badboy 12-21-2012 05:12 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Playoffs (Post 2085174)
I don't want Bush. Still.

IF, and I don't wish it one anyone, but if the Redskins find themselves needing an RB due to injury ... then I'd consider trading Tate for one of theirs.

Where did you get idea Bush was coming to Houston? Maybe you should reread my thread? Unless another poster suggested and I missed that.

thunderkyss 12-21-2012 05:40 PM

Re: Trade with Miami?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by badboy (Post 2085250)
The more I think of this deal better I like it.

Sounds good for Miami, but we're taking the shaft.


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