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-   -   Will Andre have Surgery... (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89054)

sbalderrama 01-15-2012 10:22 PM

Will Andre have Surgery...
 
to reattach the tendon that was severed so he could come back quicker? It seems like you'd want to have everything back to fully functional.

Big Lou 01-15-2012 10:26 PM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sbalderrama (Post 1883253)
to reattach the tendon that was severed so he could come back quicker? It seems like you'd want to have everything back to fully functional.

I thought that was the surgery he had.......

I'm pretty sure CND covered this in detail in a thread somewhere....

Carr Bombed 01-15-2012 10:39 PM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
I'm not a doctor, but I'm sure when they "clipped it", it was permanently "clipped".


I'm pretty sure when they decided on that procedure it wasn't something they thought they could go back 3-4 months later and reatach..



What Andre did months ago was the procedure and was the permanent fix. If he has to go under the knife again than I can only think that means something went horribly wrong and we're in deep doo doo.

thunderkyss 01-15-2012 10:52 PM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
I'm pretty sure the original poster is right. Andre should have another surgery to reattach his hamstring. The original surgery severed it so there would be less time to heal. But they should reattach it so he can get his explosiveness back.

edo783 01-15-2012 10:57 PM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderkyss (Post 1883294)
I'm pretty sure the original poster is right. Andre should have another surgery to reattach his hamstring. The original surgery severed it so there would be less time to heal. But they should reattach it so he can get his explosiveness back.

That is the way I remember CND explaining it.

XI CMURDER IX 01-15-2012 11:21 PM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderkyss (Post 1883294)
I'm pretty sure the original poster is right. Andre should have another surgery to reattach his hamstring. The original surgery severed it so there would be less time to heal. But they should reattach it so he can get his explosiveness back.

Yep, this is right.

Carr Bombed 01-15-2012 11:32 PM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
If that's the case then this medical staff is indeed completely incompetent... Andre did not gain any recovery time by trying out this new technique and now that they didn't go with a permanent fix, he has to go back under the knife if this is true. This is one part of our team that HAS to be addressed this offseason. There has been way too many muscle strains and shotty treatments for them.

When you have a doctor on a random message board calling your medical staff morons (and one that's proven correct time and time again), I think that should speak volumes about the quality of personnel you're currently employing.

Playoffs 01-16-2012 12:42 AM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
I dunno ..... maybe he should go on un-attached?


http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans...42-650x433.jpg

Scooter 01-16-2012 01:11 AM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
andre with two busted hamstrings is still a top 5 receiver, but i'm hoping the offseason surgery works because he wasnt himself out there. andre is known as a physical monster, but folks forget that he was a 100m sprinter and as a mack truck at receiver is impossibly fast (with killer hops). he lost the "fastest man" in the probowl against dante hall to 30 or 40 yards by half a step ... had it gone 60+ andre was leaving in usain bolt fashion. the man can move like noone that size should, and he was obviously missing that when he tried to play this season.

he took the more dangerous short term route to be with the team, but hopefully the surgery he put off can put the spring back in his step.

NastyNate 01-16-2012 03:30 AM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Carr Bombed (Post 1883354)
If that's the case then this medical staff is indeed completely incompetent... Andre did not gain any recovery time by trying out this new technique and now that they didn't go with a permanent fix, he has to go back under the knife if this is true. This is one part of our team that HAS to be addressed this offseason. There has been way too many muscle strains and shotty treatments for them.

When you have a doctor on a random message board calling your medical staff morons (and one that's proven correct time and time again), I think that should speak volumes about the quality of personnel you're currently employing.

Please stop spreading this nonsense. Just stop. Times 12 trillion, you are so wrong it pains me. Please, don't ever comment on this again.

amazing80 01-16-2012 08:00 AM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by NastyNate (Post 1883464)
Please stop spreading this nonsense. Just stop. Times 12 trillion, you are so wrong it pains me. Please, don't ever comment on this again.

LOL bazing!

Kthx 01-16-2012 08:18 AM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/sho...=andre+johnson

Some light reading for those who missed the surgery CND was talking about earlier in the season so you know what people mean by re-attaching tendons.

Playoffs 01-16-2012 09:11 AM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by NastyNate (Post 1883464)
Please stop spreading this nonsense. Just stop. Times 12 trillion, you are so wrong it pains me. Please, don't ever comment on this again.

:spit:

CloakNNNdagger 01-16-2012 11:19 AM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
To clarify my impressions regarding the possibility of re-attachment, here is what I posted (11/03/11) in the AJ Out a Few Weeks: Will Have Procedure thread:

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderkyss (Post 1819524)
Is this the kind of work you do? Do you have experience re-attaching tendons?

I ask, because I'd like to ask:

Would you have suggested the "complete the rupture" procedure then "re-attach" the tendon as a possible course? Or would you have suggested only the repair procedure?

Is there any reason to believe re-attaching would be less successful at a later date than immediate re-attachment?

Quote:

Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger (Post 1819552)
I have personally had a good deal of experience with tendon injuries, their complications. But not this particular tendon (semitendinosus). It is a very uncommon type of injury and has very limited coverage in the medical literature. Although with tendon injuries, there are still some basic principles that apply universally and one of those is that you try to reconstruct them anatomically whenever possible to best recreat the function of the muscle of tendon. The procedure that was done for AJ was mainly in consideration of getting him back as quick as possible without the risk of re-tear if the re-attachment was performed and then stressed too early. If the goal was not limited in time of recovery, and a resignation to the typical months required for full healing of a tendon repair, in return for anatomic reconstruction, then that would have probably been the ideal. But AJ would have had to go on IR, and evidently no one wanted to take that route.

As far as reattachment LATER. I understand the surgery entailed cutting out the torn tendon. If the muscle is allowed to retract upwards with scarring over even a couple of months, even in a fairly limited fashion, it may be too short to mobilize and stretch what's left to re-attach it to the bone, or without it pulling apart because of too much tension. And if the tendon was indeed entirely cut out, a muscle to bone re-attachment is much less predictable than tendon to bone. Sometimes other procedures can be entertained, but you can see, it gets quite complicated, and again less predictable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderkyss (Post 1819585)
when they did my daughters ACL, we were given the option to use a donor from a cadaver. Would that be an option here?

Quote:

Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger (Post 1819625)
Sorry to hear about your daughter.

That's what the trend is going to in the US, because of the morbidity that has been encountered in the graft donor sites. I mentioned this in another post:

[EDIT: I reread your question and I guess you were referring to attaching the retracted muscle to the bone by a cadaver (allograft) tendon graft. You are still limited by the weakest link which would then again be the muscle attachment......this time to the tendon. Although if they left some tendon on the muscle side and didn't remove the whole thing, then sewing the interposition cadaver tendon to the bone on one end and to the remaining hamstring tendon on the other end would be possible. However, trying to separate all the scar tissue to mobilize the semitendinosus (separate/loosen from the surrounding tissues) muscle would still very like lead to some element of morbidity and unpredictability.]

In summary, I feel that re-attachment surgery would not be the most practical or prudent route to consider, and would potentially create more problems to Andre's ultimate outcome than without him undergoing further surgery.

edo783 01-18-2012 12:18 AM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CloakNNNdagger (Post 1883777)
In summary, I feel that re-attachment surgery would not be the most practical or prudent route to consider, and would potentially create more problems to Andre's ultimate outcome than without him undergoing further surgery.

OK, lets assume they go down the road of NOT doing the re-attachment. Is it possible for you to quantify what you think may be the amount of/reduction of speed/burst/explosivness that AJ may wind up with? I know that is probably difficult to do. Do you see this as a career shortener and if so, what sort of progression in quality of play might we expect to see over say the next 5 years.

CloakNNNdagger 01-18-2012 05:01 PM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by edo783 (Post 1885136)
OK, lets assume they go down the road of NOT doing the re-attachment. Is it possible for you to quantify what you think may be the amount of/reduction of speed/burst/explosivness that AJ may wind up with? I know that is probably difficult to do. Do you see this as a career shortener and if so, what sort of progression in quality of play might we expect to see over say the next 5 years.

EDO,

Unfortunately, I don't believe anyone can predict what the final effect on his performance will be. There are not enough cases like this, let alone of elite WRs, to make that call. If I were to hazard a guess, it would probably have no more than a 10% effect. In most cases of athletes, this would probably have little appreciable effect on perceived performance. But, in the NFL, this is percentage of effect which sometimes means the distinction between a very good WR and an elite WR. I do not believe that this will be a career shortener, though.

sbalderrama 01-18-2012 05:17 PM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
It seemed like this year Andre wasn't getting the burst and separation that we were used to, but it's hard to tell how much of that was from the hamstring issue versus just never really getting a chance to get in 100% game shape.

thunderkyss 01-18-2012 09:38 PM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sbalderrama (Post 1885675)
It seemed like this year Andre wasn't getting the burst and separation that we were used to, but it's hard to tell how much of that was from the hamstring issue versus just never really getting a chance to get in 100% game shape.


He was still getting WTF open during both play-off games. Looks promising tp me.

But I'm not a doctor.

sbalderrama 01-19-2012 01:30 AM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thunderkyss (Post 1885773)
He was still getting WTF open during both play-off games. Looks promising tp me.

But I'm not a doctor.

I'm just thinking of straight line speed. Dude still has the moves.

Ryan 01-19-2012 01:22 PM

Re: Will Andre have Surgery...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sbalderrama (Post 1885829)
I'm just thinking of straight line speed. Dude still has the moves.


Also comes with age too. The reason some WRs can play late into their 30's is because they get craftier at route running and can't necessarily stretch the field the way they used to.


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