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View Full Version : Kevin Walter vs Nate Washington


Rey
05-01-2013, 10:00 AM
http://www.musiccitymiracles.com/2013/4/2/4174102/titans-sign-kevin-walter-nate-washington-release



Let's play a little game of would you rather. I am going to give you stat sheets on two receivers, and I want you to tell me which receiver you would rather have:

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2409645/receiverA_medium.jpg

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2409653/receiverB_medium.jpg

So, which one do you want? Before you give your final answer, I should also tell you that receiver B is two years younger than receiver A. I should also tell you that receiver A has played opposite one of the best receivers in the game for those four years while receiver B has not had that luxury.

My choice is receiver B, and it really isn't even close.



Seems like some Titan fans want to cut Nate Washington. Would you want him as a vet receiver if they did?

And if they keep him, KW could end up being a number 5 reciever.

ArlingtonTexan
05-01-2013, 10:09 AM
Really different WRs, so straight comparison is tough for me. I would rather the guy who get can behind the defense a few times a year, but the Texans value (if not overvalue) blocking and other little things more than I do.

76Texan
05-01-2013, 10:19 AM
Take receiver A, Kevin Walter, as he only costs $1MM
He's familiar with the system; he has good rapport with the coaches, players, and at least some fans (LOL).
You know what you get with him as he's willing to do the dirty work.
Playing next to a great receiver might have helped in some regards (but what about the time when AJ was injured? Walter was still doing the same thing. The load was simply spread around to other players who weren't on the field as much otherwise.)

Receiver B, Nate Washington costs a cool $4.2MM which you don't have.
He was given plenty of chance (ie. targets) because there isn't a true number one receiver on the team. His production was comparable to receiver A if you prorate the number of targets.
Throughout his career, he got paid better overall; more could have been expected of him; you spend more money on a car, you expect more according to the difference.
You don't know if receiver B is willing to do the dirty work or not, and he's not familiar with things around Reliant.

Value of $1M vs unjustified luxury of $4.2M
Easy decision!

Dutchrudder
05-01-2013, 10:24 AM
I'd like to see drops, as there is a huge difference in catch per target. Washington looks to be around 50%, and Walter is nearing 70%. That's a big difference, but it would be nice to know if it's Washington's fault or his QB's.

Rey
05-01-2013, 10:29 AM
Value of $1M vs unjustified luxury of $4.2M
Easy decision!

If Washington was cut I don't think we'd have to pick up that salary...But I could be wrong...I'm not a salary guy really...

Really I thought it was interesting from a Tits perspective...The writer is basically saying he'd rather have Nate Washington and that they'd be getting worse by replacing Walter with Washington...

Yet I get the feeling that here, most would rather have Walter...

I understand fan loyalty and Walter knowing the system and Walter maybe being a more reliable target when thrown to...But does Washington's seemingly better playmaking ability play a factor at all?

I don't know what KW's contract looks like, but one of these guys could end up cut...If you're looking for a vet WR and had to choose one which would you rather pick up off the scrap heap?

eriadoc
05-01-2013, 10:36 AM
Yet I get the feeling that here, most would rather have Walter...

I understand fan loyalty and Walter knowing the system and Walter maybe being a more reliable target when thrown to...But does Washington's seemingly better playmaking ability play a factor at all?

Most fans look at stats and form their opinion based on that. There is a distinction between production and stats. What does a WR do with the opportunities he is given? I am ignorant when it comes to Nate Washington, so I'm just speculating, but if he was given an opportunity to be the #1 WR, targeted quite a bit, and came up short of the goal, then he wasn't very productive. I'd rather have a WR that makes the most of his targets and does what the coaches ask of him than a guy who gets targeted 11 times and hauls in one catch (yes, JJ jab). As far as Walter goes, the coaches figured that his productivity vs. salary wasn't worth keeping around, and I doubt too many fans disagree with that, truthfully. But if the team goes out and signs a 3rd/4th/5th WR for a million bucks, don't you think Walter would be competitive in that role? People get caught up in the fact that he was the 2nd WR and shouldn't have been. But he didn't set his position on the depth chart.

What I'd actually love to have is two WRs that are as productive as AJ, but people in hell want ice water, I suppose LOL.

Rey
05-01-2013, 10:44 AM
Most fans look at stats and form their opinion based on that. There is a distinction between production and stats. What does a WR do with the opportunities he is given? I am ignorant when it comes to Nate Washington, so I'm just speculating, but if he was given an opportunity to be the #1 WR, targeted quite a bit, and came up short of the goal, then he wasn't very productive. I'd rather have a WR that makes the most of his targets and does what the coaches ask of him than a guy who gets targeted 11 times and hauls in one catch (yes, JJ jab). As far as Walter goes, the coaches figured that his productivity vs. salary wasn't worth keeping around, and I doubt too many fans disagree with that, truthfully. But if the team goes out and signs a 3rd/4th/5th WR for a million bucks, don't you think Walter would be competitive in that role? People get caught up in the fact that he was the 2nd WR and shouldn't have been. But he didn't set his position on the depth chart.

What I'd actually love to have is two WRs that are as productive as AJ, but people in hell want ice water, I suppose LOL.

Yeah...I'm not sure either way...It just depends on different variables...

You could argue that Nate Washington would actually be better here than he has been in Tennessee, but you could say Walter knows the system...has good hands and would fit better as a back up or short yardage slot guy...

But you could say that AJ is getting older and he might get nicked up as he has done in the past and it'd be more beneficial to have a guy that can step in as a play maker...

I just thought it was interesting that the Titans writer was comparing the two although he didn't go in much depth beyond the raw numbers...

76Texan
05-01-2013, 11:30 AM
Nate Washington actually cap includes an additional $900K that the Tits will have to incur if they cut him.
Any other team that signs him is not reponsible for that part, but that team has to pick up the remainder of his contract.

There's simply no way the Texans will spend $4.2M on a vet (it will be $4.8MM next year, the last one of his contract) especially after drafting Hopkins in the first round.
Knock on wood, I hope itt doesn't happen, I can only see the possibility if AJ gets injured.
Even then, it's more likely that the Texans try to negotiate for a lower salary with a guy like Washington or Brandon Lloyd if they are going to sign one of them.

Can they bring it down to the $2M level?
That's when it might become a reality, I think.

Dutchrudder
05-01-2013, 11:45 AM
Nate Washington actually cap includes an additional $900K that the Tits will have to incur if they cut him.
Any other team that signs him is not reponsible for that part, but that team has to pick up the remainder of his contract.

There's simply no way the Texans will spend $4.2M on a vet (it will be $4.8MM next year, the last one of his contract) especially after drafting Hopkins in the first round.
Knock on wood, I hope itt doesn't happen, I can only see the possibility if AJ gets injured.
Even then, it's more likely that the Texans try to negotiate for a lower salary with a guy like Washington or Brandon Lloyd if they are going to sign one of them.

Can they bring it down to the $2M level?
That's when it might become a reality, I think.

Washington has accrued 4 years in the NFL, so if he is cut, he immediately becomes an unrestricted free agent. He won't have to go on waivers, and he can negotiate anything he wants with any team. If he is traded the receiving team will take on his 4.2m in non-guaranteed salary this year, and 4.8 next year. The Titans will incur the 900k prorated signing bonus regardless of what happens with him.


http://www.overthecap.com/cap.php?Name=Nate%20Washington&Position=WR&Team=Titans

76Texan
05-01-2013, 11:51 AM
Washington has accrued 4 years in the NFL, so if he is cut, he immediately becomes an unrestricted free agent. He won't have to go on waivers, and he can negotiate anything he wants with any team. If he is traded the receiving team will take on his 4.2m in non-guaranteed salary this year, and 4.8 next year. The Titans will incur the 900k prorated signing bonus regardless of what happens with him.


http://www.overthecap.com/cap.php?Name=Nate%20Washington&Position=WR&Team=Titans

You're right.