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AngryNateFTW
05-26-2013, 01:17 AM
Surprised nobody has shown a pic of Polamalu yet. :D

Hopkins needs to bulk up if he doesn't wanna get tackled by his hair. Nobody would try to tackle Steven Jackson by his hair.

DocBar
05-26-2013, 01:49 AM
Surprised nobody has shown a pic of Polamalu yet. :D

Hopkins needs to bulk up if he doesn't wanna get tackled by his hair. Nobody would try to tackle Steven Jackson by his hair.WTF?

AngryNateFTW
05-26-2013, 02:04 AM
WTF?

Polamalu got whipped around like a rag doll because his hair is too long.

DocBar
05-26-2013, 02:24 AM
Polamalu got whipped around like a rag doll because his hair is too long.Really? I have yet to see Polamalu miss a game because of his hair. Got any evidence to support this other than 1 play in a game against the Chiefs? I don't believe that Troy went on IR or missed any time because of this play.

AngryNateFTW
05-26-2013, 02:28 AM
Really? I have yet to see Polamalu miss a game because of his hair. Got any evidence to support this other than 1 play in a game against the Chiefs? I don't believe that Troy went on IR or missed any time because of this play.

Nobody said anything about anyone missing time in regards to getting pulled down by hair. The subject was brought up because of Hopkins' long hair.

Polamalu got dragged down by his hair, no other evidence needed unless you'd enjoy a link to the video.

DocBar
05-26-2013, 02:32 AM
Nobody said anything about anyone missing time in regards to getting pulled down by hair. The subject was brought up because of Hopkins' long hair.

Polamalu got dragged down by his hair, no other evidence needed unless you'd enjoy a link to the video.I've seen the video. No need for discussion on it. No need to discuss Hopkins' hair. If it's long, you deal with it.

Playoffs
05-26-2013, 09:04 AM
Yes, but is it football hair? Does Hopkins have football hair or is his hair just posing?

We don't need no poser hair on the Texans. http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/images/smilies/m0727.gif

CloakNNNdagger
05-26-2013, 09:11 AM
Surprised nobody has shown a pic of Polamalu yet. :D

Hopkins needs to bulk up if he doesn't wanna get tackled by his hair. Nobody would try to tackle Steven Jackson by his hair.

Polamalu VIDEO:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVO93amUv7Y

Of course, a player expected to carry the ball often (such as a RB and WR, as opposed to a defensive player) would be the more likely target.





http://coedbc.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/sin-lfl-6.jpg


So, just as I was asked the question by my teacher in 3rd grade after I pulled the hair of the girl sitting in the desk in front of me and as I was being taken to the principal's office................. "Why did you go after the hair?"......................"Because it was there." :pirate:

BTW, I never even thought of doing it again.:)

TexansBull
05-26-2013, 11:45 AM
How come they don't shave his head like they did Cushing? Release the beast and keep the tradition alive with first round draft picks and their long hair. (You got lucky Reed)

Sent from my RM-820_nam_att_100 using Board Express

Rey
05-26-2013, 12:24 PM
Cushing came in with relics. This is the new improved nfl where players get to keep their swag.

infantrycak
05-26-2013, 12:48 PM
Cushing came in with relics. This is the new improved nfl where players get to keep their swag.

Well the relics who did it were DeMeco, Schaub and Anderson and it was voluntary - and he immediately changed it to a mohawk.

drs23
05-26-2013, 12:55 PM
Well the relics who did it were DeMeco, Schaub and Anderson and it was voluntary - and he immediately changed it to a mohawk.

Correction Councillor, he immediately changed it to a Cushhawk. :D

Rey
05-26-2013, 05:27 PM
Well the relics who did it were DeMeco, Schaub and Anderson and it was voluntary - and he immediately changed it to a mohawk.

Relics.

I know it was voluntary. I'm just talking.

CloakNNNdagger
06-01-2013, 09:36 PM
Hopkins gives voice to a controversial subject.

Deandre Hopkins has lesbian sister, would welcome gay Houston Texans teammate (http://www.outsports.com/2013/5/30/4380236/deandre-hopkins-houston-texans-lesbian-gay-nick-gruber)

ObsiWan
06-02-2013, 01:06 PM
Hopkins gives voice to a controversial subject.

Deandre Hopkins has lesbian sister, would welcome gay Houston Texans teammate (http://www.outsports.com/2013/5/30/4380236/deandre-hopkins-houston-texans-lesbian-gay-nick-gruber)

Man, things really are sloooow when this is post-worthy.
:D

Playoffs
06-02-2013, 02:35 PM
Off the Turf with Scurf Podcast with DeAndre Hopkins (http://old.houstontexans.com/news/PodcastCentral2.asp?AUTO=Y&EID=2885)

DeAndre & WR Coach Larry Kirksey are guests with Nick Scurfield

ObsiWan
06-02-2013, 06:31 PM
Off the Turf with Scurf Podcast with DeAndre Hopkins (http://old.houstontexans.com/news/PodcastCentral2.asp?AUTO=Y&EID=2885)

DeAndre & WR Coach Larry Kirksey are guests with Nick Scurfield

Text from the podcast here (http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-2/DeAndre-Hopkins-focused-on-team-goals-not-individual/eead0fba-45ff-48c3-b974-9b3ee73fd530)...


He already sounds like Johnson off the field.

Asked about his individual goals for this season, Hopkins replied with a team-first answer reminiscent of Johnson, the Texans’ all-time leading receiver who has been with the team since 2003.

“My goal is to win a Super Bowl,” Hopkins, 20, said Friday for the ‘Off the Turf with Scurf’ podcast (http://old.houstontexans.com/news/PodcastCentral2.asp?AUTO=Y&EID=2885). “Hopefully, that’s everybody on the team’s goal. I don’t have any individual goals but to win a Super Bowl.”well, he certainly talks the right talk...
:thumbup

AngryNateFTW
06-02-2013, 07:34 PM
Text from the podcast here (http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-2/DeAndre-Hopkins-focused-on-team-goals-not-individual/eead0fba-45ff-48c3-b974-9b3ee73fd530)...

well, he certainly talks the right talk...
:thumbup

Except on NFL Fan Pass when he said Calvin Johnson was better than Andre... :mcnugget:

bhsman
06-02-2013, 08:21 PM
Except on NFL Fan Pass when he said Calvin Johnson was better than Andre... :mcnugget:

Ironically that makes him even more like Andre. :cow:

AngryNateFTW
06-02-2013, 10:08 PM
Ironically that makes him even more like Andre. :cow:

Only because Andre is extremely modest. :kingkong:

b0ng
06-03-2013, 08:49 AM
Except on NFL Fan Pass when he said Calvin Johnson was better than Andre... :mcnugget:

Andre would've said the same thing.

Playoffs
06-03-2013, 09:28 AM
Andre would've said the same thing.

Yep.

Allstar
06-03-2013, 10:47 PM
Only because Andre is extremely modest. :kingkong:

And a realist.

Wolf
07-22-2013, 06:12 PM
Just flashed on my phone that he signed. I don't have details yet

4years 7.62

Swearinger and brennan williams signed too

Playoffs
07-25-2013, 02:02 PM
Devier Posey very impressed with DeAndre Hopkins...

James Palmer ‏@JPalmerCSN
Posey was also shocked at the size of Hopkins hands. Says he wears 3x gloves. Added that he's an amazing WR. #texanstalk

Tania Ganguli ‏@taniaganguli
"I've never seen a guy with his ability, can run and jump. And what big hands he has," Posey on @Nukdabomb #Texans

Playoffs
07-27-2013, 12:52 PM
Hopkins Working Hard (http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-2/Hopkins-Working-Hard/b65194ab-4aac-4b63-b2ba-ec890578fe95)

First-round pick DeAndre Hopkins had one goal this offseason.

“It was mastering my playbook,” he said Friday. “I wanted to come out here and not think about my routes so much but just go out and do it so I can come out here and run my routes smoothly.”

Hopkins may have had preparation on his side, but that was no substitute for increased speed and intensity going into the NFL. The rookie wide-out noted that the margin for error is much smaller now.

“Everything that you do, you have to be on point,” said Hopkins. “There’s no room for any mistakes. The difference between a 10-yard route and an 11-yard route makes a big difference between these guys out here than in college.”

Hopkins has been relying on fellow teammate Andre Johnson as his mentor. The Texans’ all-time leading receiver has been helping to prepare Hopkins for what to expect in the league.

“Just being around guys like (WR) Andre Johnson, you see how they act and him being who he is and just watching him and just trying to do everything he does,” Hopkins. “It’s great. I couldn’t ask to be in a better situation to watch a guy like him go to work every day.”

...

“He’s told me everything that a veteran should tell a rookie,” said Hopkins. “He’s a guy that’s on every single wide receiver out here, not just me. He’s not just focusing in on just DeAndre Hopkins. He’s paying attention to all the guys out here and helping all of us out. He’s giving all of us great things to work on and telling us what we need to do.”

...

“It was a good day for me,” Hopkins said. “I feel I came out and I knew my assignments pretty well. I feel like, the team and as a wide receiver corps, we had a good practice.”

pissknocker
07-27-2013, 05:14 PM
Watch alert espnu chk fil a bowl on now. Nuk about to go off. 4th qtr

bayoudreamn
07-27-2013, 09:03 PM
Just being around guys like (WR) Andre Johnson, you see how they act and him being who he is and just watching him and just trying to do everything he does,” Hopkins. “It’s great. I couldn’t ask to be in a better situation to watch a guy like him go to work every day.” ---DeAndre' Hopkins

...

Understanding the nuances......that is what maturity is all about. It was said that D Hopkins was the "most NFL ready" going into the draft. I think this comment and the cumulative value of what he has been and done since he got here is important. Maturity is something we need for that spot....I'm willing to discount the hotel thing if that's all that ever applies negatively to him.

He gives credit to Andre....I'm glad he recognizes that, there is NONE BETTER than Andre Johnson for demonstrating and being premium quality on and off the field.

RipTraxx
07-28-2013, 11:07 AM
Watch alert espnu chk fil a bowl on now. Nuk about to go off. 4th qtr

Watched it twice...he was a god among insects.

Playoffs
07-31-2013, 04:21 PM
This guy thought he has big hands until he met Nuk.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BQhX-VWCQAAmF-b.jpg

pissknocker
08-04-2013, 03:11 PM
Are we all gonna chant NUUUUKK! when he makes a catch, ala Heath miller in Pittsburgh. I feel like we will be doing a lot of that if so.

AngryNateFTW
08-04-2013, 03:31 PM
I'm going on record that Smith will trade up in the 3rd to get Swopes if he's still on the board. I think that young man will be a star in the NFL.

Good call. :rolleyes:

The Pencil Neck
08-04-2013, 04:04 PM
Are we all gonna chant NUUUUKK! when he makes a catch, ala Heath miller in Pittsburgh. I feel like we will be doing a lot of that if so.

Well. We all will be in my house.

Playoffs
08-06-2013, 03:19 PM
http://prod.images.texans.clubs.nflcdn.com/image-web/NFL/CDA/data/deployed/prod/TEXANS/assets/images/imported/HOU/photos/clubimages/2013/08-August/temp_BB28811--nfl_mezz_1280_1024.JPG

Rey
08-06-2013, 03:27 PM
http://prod.images.texans.clubs.nflcdn.com/image-web/NFL/CDA/data/deployed/prod/TEXANS/assets/images/imported/HOU/photos/clubimages/2013/08-August/temp_BB28811--nfl_mezz_1280_1024.JPG

He looks like an Avatar in that picture...

Playoffs
08-06-2013, 03:38 PM
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e316/Soizic22/a%20smilie/laugh-1.gif
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110610231436/jamescameronsavatar/images/5/5a/I_See_You_Gesture.gif

drs23
08-06-2013, 07:51 PM
I'm lovin' me some Nuk.

When Hopkins and the Texans hit the turf at Mall of America Field in the Metrodome Friday evening, it will be a special moment, but not overwhelming.

“It’s going to be great,” Hopkins said. “It’s a dream come true, but I’m not really worried about that. As soon as I got out here the first day, all the dreams and stuff go out the window and it’s time to go to work.”

That right there Ladies & Gentlemen is a 21 year old Pro. I can't wait to see this cat under the lights. He's been there before in school. He ain't gonna wilt!

EllisUnit
08-06-2013, 08:52 PM
http://www.houstontexans.com/tv-media/videos/Extended-Cut-WR-DeAndre-Hopkins/930bf7bf-6320-4b84-b45d-1e420fd9e633

You know Hopkins says "you know" more than anyone i have ever heard you know. I couldnt finish it you know. You know thats really annoying hopkins. :pissed:

AngryNateFTW
08-06-2013, 08:54 PM
http://www.houstontexans.com/tv-media/videos/Extended-Cut-WR-DeAndre-Hopkins/930bf7bf-6320-4b84-b45d-1e420fd9e633

You know Hopkins says "you know" more than anyone i have ever heard you know. I couldnt finish it you know. You know thats really annoying hopkins. :pissed:

I forget what Mercilus says in his interviews but he over does it, as well.

I think he says "like" but I can't remember.

EllisUnit
08-06-2013, 09:00 PM
I forget what Mercilus says in his interviews but he over does it, as well.

I think he says "like" but I can't remember.

yeah that stuff annoys me, i cant even focus on what they are saying, all i am listening for is the damn word/words they keep saying.

Brisco_County
08-06-2013, 09:57 PM
Nervous habits. These are kids. They're intimidated enough talking to adults, not to mention a TV crew.

drs23
08-06-2013, 10:44 PM
Nervous habits. These are kids. They're intimidated enough talking to adults, not to mention a TV crew.

It has to be intimidating.

Ya know? :kitten:

76Texan
08-12-2013, 11:25 AM
Deandre made a heck of a catch in that game, and he showed a lot promises in general; however, I still think that we need to temper the enthusiasm.

The Vikings didn't play their top five CBs.

The sixth one is #27 Brandon Burton; I haven't zeroed in to see if Hopkins had any catch on this guy or not.

Actually, the sixth one is Marcus Sherels #35.

The Vikings had made some off-season moves; basically with the addition of Jacob Lacey (a 5th-yr spot starter for the Colts until he got injured) and Xavier Rhodes in the draft, so Sherels was bumped to the 7th spot.

Bobby Felton, the guy that Hopkins abused, was a PS player, and considered to be the 8th CB on their depth chart.

Unless there's an injury or two, Felton will most likely see the PS again.

I do like Hopkins a lot, and had upgraded the possibility of him to become a number one down the road if he keeps working hard on his craft.
(From 5% around draft time to 10-12% at the moment.)

I did assess that eventually, Hopkins should be an upgrade over Walter; however, I'm still not sure that I want to expect 40 plus catches in his rookie year (if all the main weapons for the Texans remain relatively healthy.)
There's a decent possibility, not a strong probability.

Lead not the cart in front of the horse, but enjoy what should unfold in his future.
Knock on wood, Hopkins doesn't incur an injury himself.

thunderkyss
08-12-2013, 11:38 AM
Deandre made a heck of a catch in that game, and he showed a lot promises in general; however, I still think that we need to temper the enthusiasm.

The Vikings didn't play their top five CBs.

The sixth one is #27 Brandon Burton; I haven't zeroed in to see if Hopkins had any catch on this guy or not.


This is preseason. Personally I think even if it were their top CB, we don't know if he's playing at 100% or if he "understands" it's a preseason game.

All offseason, we heard that DeAndre is the kind of receiver you could throw the ball up for & he'll go get it. We saw him do that. Good for us. Whether he can do it with any regularity won't be "known" until Dec 30th.

I think that's why some folks are so discouraged with LeStar Jean. They put too much stock in that first preseason performance, even though they know it was all meaningless & does not translate as well into the regular season as we'd hope.

Football is a team game & the way the defense plays you in the regular season, is totally different from the way they play you in the preseason. Schemes are different, teammates are different, situations are different..

ArlingtonTexan
08-12-2013, 11:39 AM
Assuming health and the number of snaps expected only 40 catches (2.5 average per game) would be a mild disappointment, although not career damning.

thunderkyss
08-12-2013, 11:44 AM
Assuming health and the number of snaps expected only 40 catches (2.5 average per game) would be a mild disappointment, although not career damning.

I honestly don't care what his receiving yards are, or his total catches. I'll be disappointed if he's got less than a 13 ypc average. I'd like for it to be over 16.

Whether that comes off of YAC or a bunch of deep passes doesn't matter. It stretches the defense & that's what we need our WR to do. Back them up & spread them out.

If he's got KDub numbers, less than 13 ypc he's not much of an upgrade. He's an undersized TE.

76Texan
08-12-2013, 11:49 AM
Assuming health and the number of snaps expected only 40 catches (2.5 average per game) would be a mild disappointment, although not career damning.

Not really Arlington; I think it's a realistic goal considering Kubiak's penchant to work the ball to AJ and spread the wealth depending on how the defense plays us.

OD and Graham may see a lot of catches if the D doesn't want to get burned by the play action.

Foster may see 74 catches like he did that one year if the D decide to play deep.

Or the Texans may see only 467 attempts like in 2011 (thus limiting the pass catching opportunity for everybody on the roster.)

ArlingtonTexan
08-12-2013, 12:03 PM
There were 114 players in the league who caught at least 40 catches last year. On average that is around 3.5 players per team. Even if Hopkins winds up as the Texans 4th option he should be 50/50 at worst to clear 40 reception.

the Texans force the ball the Andre Johnson because the rest of the WRs, were not good WRs (when walter was his better version of himself he was 60 catch guy) As good as he is, Johnson could easily take one less catch per game still have 100 catches probably being more efficient/effective.

If you force me I will list some the unimpressive WRs in bad passing games with way worse QBs who caught 40 balls. That is not a standard of anything significant.

ArlingtonTexan
08-12-2013, 12:22 PM
I honestly don't care what his receiving yards are, or his total catches. I'll be disappointed if he's got less than a 13 ypc average. I'd like for it to be over 16.

Whether that comes off of YAC or a bunch of deep passes doesn't matter. It stretches the defense & that's what we need our WR to do. Back them up & spread them out.

If he's got KDub numbers, less than 13 ypc he's not much of an upgrade. He's an undersized TE.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/standings

Jacoby jones did exactly what you said as a Texans at least catch, stretching the defense and people could not wait to run him out of town.

and undersized TE describes Walter.

Hopkins was drafted and is expected to be a legitimate starting NFL WR. This means he is a complete player...get open, catch the ball several times a game, get yards per catch, block well enough..and on occasion make a play that average WRs can't make.

steelbtexan
08-12-2013, 12:26 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/standings

Jacoby jones did exactly what you said as a Texans at least catch, stretching the defense and people could not wait to run him out of town.

and undersized TE describes Walter.

Hopkins was drafted and is expected to be a legitimate starting NFL WR. This means he is a complete player...get open, catch the ball several times a game, get yards per catch, block well enough..and on occasion make a play that average WRs can't make.

Hopkins appears to have better hands than the trio of crap named Jean/Jones/Walter. (Blasphemy)

76Texan
08-12-2013, 12:43 PM
There were 114 players in the league who caught at least 40 catches last year. On average that is around 3.5 players per team. Even if Hopkins winds up as the Texans 4th option he should be 50/50 at worst to clear 40 reception.

the Texans force the ball the Andre Johnson because the rest of the WRs, were not good WRs (when walter was his better version of himself he was 60 catch guy) As good as he is, Johnson could easily take one less catch per game still have 100 catches probably being more efficient/effective.

If you force me I will list some the unimpressive WRs in bad passing games with way worse QBs who caught 40 balls. That is not a standard of anything significant.

You really don't need to because - seriously - we have gone over this.

Teams are not alike in their make-up and their offensive philosophy.

Bad teams, for example, find themselves behind the eight-ball very often, and are forced to open up their passing game.

Some teams run a spread with more emphasis on their receivers than TEs, FB (some don't even have a FB) and RBs.

There are several reasons why things happened, and they vary for different teams.

But the Texans are not one of those teams.

It is possible that the defense might allow Kubiak to target Hopkins more, but it's not a given.

Look at Ashley Lelie, who was drafted at #19 overall by the Broncos in 2002.
He had 35 catches as a rookie and 37 in his second year, and the dude was 6'3.

ArlingtonTexan
08-12-2013, 01:29 PM
You really don't need to because - seriously - we have gone over this.

Teams are not alike in their make-up and their offensive philosophy.

Bad teams, for example, find themselves behind the eight-ball very often, and are forced to open up their passing game.

Some teams run a spread with more emphasis on their receivers than TEs, FB (some don't even have a FB) and RBs.

There are several reasons why things happened, and they vary for different teams.

But the Texans are not one of those teams.

It is possible that the defense might allow Kubiak to target Hopkins more, but it's not a given.

Look at Ashley Lelie, who was drafted at #19 overall by the Broncos in 2002.
He had 35 catches as a rookie and 37 in his second year, and the dude was 6'3.

The Texans passing game did not work against good football teams, so they need something more than some replacement level 40 catches from the "other" guy. lestar jean can drop 40 passes with enough snaps. This is not a Texans offense works this way thing, this is a Texans offense did not work when it mattered thing. I don't need screen shots and watching games 8 times to tell me the obvious. The obvious is that 40 catches from your number 2 WR does not work in the current NFL (Ashlie L...really).

thunderkyss
08-12-2013, 01:30 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/standings

Jacoby jones did exactly what you said as a Texans at least catch, stretching the defense and people could not wait to run him out of town.

and undersized TE describes Walter.


I've said time & time again if I had to choose between Walter & Jacoby, I'm going with Jacoby. The Texans chose to go with Watler & we got what we did in 2012.. still a respectable offense, but I blame our quantity over quality run game squarely on that decision.

Jacoby was as good a blocker as KDub, but Jacoby was blocking 40 yards down field.

ArlingtonTexan
08-12-2013, 01:47 PM
I've said time & time again if I had to choose between Walter & Jacoby, I'm going with Jacoby. The Texans chose to go with Watler & we got what we did in 2012.. still a respectable offense, but I blame our quantity over quality run game squarely on that decision.

Jacoby was as good a blocker as KDub, but Jacoby was blocking 40 yards down field.

TK, there is something to this post ...like it.

ArlingtonTexan
08-12-2013, 01:47 PM
I've said time & time again if I had to choose between Walter & Jacoby, I'm going with Jacoby. The Texans chose to go with Watler & we got what we did in 2012.. still a respectable offense, but I blame our quantity over quality run game squarely on that decision.

Jacoby was as good a blocker as KDub, but Jacoby was blocking 40 yards down field.

TK, there is something to this post ...like it.

ArlingtonTexan
08-12-2013, 02:27 PM
BTW, for those who think I am being meanly dismissive of A. lelei

never caught more than 54 ( was a high YPA catch dude though) and was gone after 4 season with 3 years under 40 catches. Basically, was a 1st round bust.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/L/LeliAs00.htm

infantrycak
08-12-2013, 02:47 PM
2006 Eric Moulds 57 rec.
2007 Kevin Walter 65 rec.
2008 Kevin Walter 60 rec.
2009 Kevin Walter 53 rec.
2010 Kevin Walter & Jacoby Jones 51 rec. each
2011 Kevin Walter 39 rec.- without Schaub for a third of the season.
2012 Kevin Walter 41 rec.

Not seeing where Kubiak's system keeps WRs not named AJ below 40 rec.

Also I think it is more than a little absurd to think they drafted Hopkins and are going to turn around and treat him just like Walter.

noxiousdog
08-12-2013, 02:55 PM
The Texans passing game did not work against good football teams, so they need something more than some replacement level 40 catches from the "other" guy. lestar jean can drop 40 passes with enough snaps. This is not a Texans offense works this way thing, this is a Texans offense did not work when it mattered thing. I don't need screen shots and watching games 8 times to tell me the obvious. The obvious is that 40 catches from your number 2 WR does not work in the current NFL (Ashlie L...really).

It worked just fine against Denver, Baltimore, and Cincinnati.

That being said, upgrading is necessary. Part of the 2nd guy issue is all the throws to the tight ends. Owen Daniels had 60 catches last year, and Garrett Graham had another 28. Daniels is certainly the 2nd best pass catcher the Texans have had. There's a good chance that changes this year, due to both Owen being a little older (lowest y/r since his rookie year) and Hopkins being that good.

ArlingtonTexan
08-12-2013, 04:07 PM
It worked just fine against Denver, Baltimore, and Cincinnati.

.

So you missed the last month of the NFL season and a couple weeks of the playoffs save one game?

noxiousdog
08-12-2013, 04:11 PM
So you missed the last month of the NFL season and a couple weeks of the playoffs save one game?

Ah, so what you really meant was "the last month of the season and one of the two playoff games" as opposed to "against good teams."

My bad.

In which case, I'd say that the right side of the line has more experience and is healthier and Hopkins/ healthy Graham/Daniels > Daniels/Walter/injured Graham.

76Texan
08-13-2013, 10:52 AM
2006 Eric Moulds 57 rec.
2007 Kevin Walter 65 rec.
2008 Kevin Walter 60 rec.
2009 Kevin Walter 53 rec.
2010 Kevin Walter & Jacoby Jones 51 rec. each
2011 Kevin Walter 39 rec.- without Schaub for a third of the season.
2012 Kevin Walter 41 rec.

Not seeing where Kubiak's system keeps WRs not named AJ below 40 rec.

Also I think it is more than a little absurd to think they drafted Hopkins and are going to turn around and treat him just like Walter.

Were these guys rookies?

76Texan
08-13-2013, 10:55 AM
BTW, for those who think I am being meanly dismissive of A. lelei

never caught more than 54 ( was a high YPA catch dude though) and was gone after 4 season with 3 years under 40 catches. Basically, was a 1st round bust.

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/L/LeliAs00.htm

So it did happen.
It is possible for a first round draft pick not to have too many catches in Kubiak's system.
It's not just a possibility; it's a fact.

Texian
08-13-2013, 11:44 AM
DeAndre Hopkins is 73" HT; 33.08" arms; 10.08" hands, 36" vertical jump

Hopkins size gives him distinct advantage over all DBs. However the dinks & dunks, quick out, quick slant over the middle neutralize much of D's advantages against defensive backs and makes Hokins much less effective. In order for DeAndre to be at his best and to take advantage of DB's he must play in space.

thunderkyss
08-13-2013, 12:56 PM
So it did happen.
It is possible for a first round draft pick not to have too many catches in Kubiak's system.
It's not just a possibility; it's a fact.

The difference with LeLee(sp) & Hopkins is that LeLee was a one trick pony. Go routes & that's about it, & his hands were questionable.

Hopkins isn't a burner, so where Ashley only got thrown to on quick slants & go routes, Hop is going to get more targets on all kinds of other routes.

That said, the thing that makes me think he won't come close to KDub's receptions, is that Schaub is pretty conservative. Instead of risking a bad throw at a guy he don't trust, he'll toss it in the stands, or move to his next read.

If there was someone within 5 yards of Jacoby, Matt wasn't throwing him the ball. I don't know what his comfort zone is going to be with DeAndre, but I doubt it's going to be as tight as what he had with Walter... Walter could have a guy drapped on him & Matt would still throw the ball at him.

So we'll see.

Blake
08-13-2013, 04:06 PM
Bust!!!

Vance87
08-13-2013, 06:03 PM
Bust!!!

Bustin' TD's ALL OVER DB's faces. CHYEAH!

TexansSeminole
08-13-2013, 07:12 PM
DeAndre Hopkins is 73" HT; 33.08" arms; 10.08" hands, 36" vertical jump

Hopkins size gives him distinct advantage over all DBs. However the dinks & dunks, quick out, quick slant over the middle neutralize much of D's advantages against defensive backs and makes Hokins much less effective. In order for DeAndre to be at his best and to take advantage of DB's he must play in space.

What?

It's hard reading some of these posts sometimes, I swear.

thunderkyss
08-13-2013, 07:50 PM
What?

It's hard reading some of these posts sometimes, I swear.

I think what he's saying, is that Hopkins isn't going to run past anyone. He's going to catch the ball, but so did KDub, without Hopkins' advantages. But he's going to have to catch the ball in space to take advantage of his play making ability.

I don't necessarily agree with that. But that's what he's saying.



I think.

ArlingtonTexan
08-13-2013, 08:19 PM
I just say that is way more important to see how HC Kubiak WRs number 2 have performed with the Texans than how OC Kubiak used a bust 1st round pick 10-12 years ago...see this thread in January.

DocBar
08-13-2013, 09:27 PM
I just say that is way more important to see how HC Kubiak WRs number 2 have performed with the Texans than how OC Kubiak used a bust 1st round pick 10-12 years ago...see this thread in January.I'm not convinced that Kubes knows what to do with a legit #2 WR. His version of the WCO seems to revolve around a #1 WR, TE, RB progression with a #2 WR being 4th, at best, on the list. Hopefully, having a legit #2 WR will expand his play calling to where AJ will be a decoy on more plays and allow the #2 (whether it's DH or KM) to make more plays to keep the D guessing. That should only help to serve the Texans and individual stats.

76Texan
08-13-2013, 09:52 PM
I'm not convinced that Kubes knows what to do with a legit #2 WR. His version of the WCO seems to revolve around a #1 WR, TE, RB progression with a #2 WR being 4th, at best, on the list. Hopefully, having a legit #2 WR will expand his play calling to where AJ will be a decoy on more plays and allow the #2 (whether it's DH or KM) to make more plays to keep the D guessing. That should only help to serve the Texans and individual stats.

I think it depends on the make-up of the team in a given year.

First off, when the Broncos won their two SBs with Elway,
they had a balanced attack, but not a lot of depth at receiver in one year, so Ed McCaffey had 45 catches on year and 64 the next.

But he also had 4 great years for them as a 6'5 target, with 64, 69, 71, and 101 catches.
The year he had 100 catches, R White had 101.

So, it looks like he goes with the flow, depending on the players he has on the roster.

DocBar
08-13-2013, 09:54 PM
I think it depends on the make-up of the team in a given year.

First off, when the Broncos won their two SBs with Elway,
they had a balanced attack, but not a lot of depth at receiver in one year, so Ed McCaffey had 45 catches on year and 64 the next.

But he also had 4 great years for them as a 6'5 target, with 64, 69, 71, and 101 catches.
The year he had 100 catches, R White had 101.

So, it looks like he goes with the flow, depending on the players he has on the roster. MSR. My concern is that it's been too many years since he had a legit #2 and has gotten stuck in his ways. Only time will tell, I guess. Good points, though. Thanks for the info.

thunderkyss
08-13-2013, 10:24 PM
MSR. My concern is that it's been too many years since he had a legit #2 and has gotten stuck in his ways. Only time will tell, I guess. Good points, though. Thanks for the info.

I don't think our offense starts with Andre as the #1 option every time. Depending on who's where & what the defense is doing, Andre may be the first read, OD the second, Arian the third. On others, KDub may have been the first.

But I think there were so few matchups or situations he could count on Walter to beat, that Schaub forced the ball to Aj or OD a lot.

With DeAndre, hopefully he'll see more of those options & he won't check to the draw on 3rd & long nearly as often.

DocBar
08-13-2013, 10:28 PM
I don't think our offense starts with Andre as the #1 option every time. Depending on who's where & what the defense is doing, Andre may be the first read, OD the second, Arian the third. On others, KDub may have been the first.

But I think there were so few matchups or situations he could count on Walter to beat, that Schaub forced the ball to Aj or OD a lot.

With DeAndre, hopefully he'll see more of those options & he won't check to the draw on 3rd & long nearly as often.It will be interesting, to say the least, to see how the season unfolds with the talented young WR corp we have behind AJ.

The Pencil Neck
08-14-2013, 12:09 AM
I think it depends on the make-up of the team in a given year.

First off, when the Broncos won their two SBs with Elway,
they had a balanced attack, but not a lot of depth at receiver in one year, so Ed McCaffey had 45 catches on year and 64 the next.

But he also had 4 great years for them as a 6'5 target, with 64, 69, 71, and 101 catches.
The year he had 100 catches, R White had 101.

So, it looks like he goes with the flow, depending on the players he has on the roster.

Just to pile on with this, McCaffery had multiple 1000 yard seasons. And here's the kicker, Rod Smith had 1000 yards many of those same seasons.

A true #2 can flourish in this offense... along with a great TE.

With Kubiak as the OC, that Denver offense was top 10 in both points and yards 8 out of 11 years and only out of the top 10 in points ONE season.

I think Kubiak has been patching this offense together from scraps giving all the talent picks in the draft to the Defense trying to prop up a string of bad coordinators. Now he's finally been able to draft a weapon for his offense.

I'm expecting big things.

thunderkyss
08-14-2013, 09:57 AM
I think Kubiak has been patching this offense together from scraps giving all the talent picks in the draft to the Defense trying to prop up a string of bad coordinators. Now he's finally been able to draft a weapon for his offense.

I'm expecting big things.

Agreed

76Texan
08-14-2013, 10:01 AM
Let's hope we can put AJ in the HOF.

Texian
08-14-2013, 08:28 PM
What?

It's hard reading some of these posts sometimes, I swear.

I think what he's saying, is that Hopkins isn't going to run past anyone. He's going to catch the ball, but so did KDub, without Hopkins' advantages. But he's going to have to catch the ball in space to take advantage of his play making ability.

I don't necessarily agree with that. But that's what he's saying.



I think.

Hopkins is 73" in height, that is taller than almost all DBs = advantage in height. Hopkins has 33" arms and that is almost 2" inches longer than most DBs = advantage in reach. Hopkins has 10" hands = advantage to catch the ball. Hopkins has a 36" vertical leap, plus his height, plus his reach = a distinct advantage when he is in position to use his superiors and that is when he has the opportunity to separate from the DB.

However if Nuk's route assignments are dinks, dunks, quick slant or out (Kubiak's short passing game) that allows the DB to give DeAndre Hopkins a Prostrate Exam while at the same time defending against the pass, Nuk is not going to be nearly as effective and closer to average and mundane. I think you will find that Nuk will be much more successful on 10-12yd PLUS routes. I hope I did a better job this time at explaining my thoughts.

76Texan
08-14-2013, 09:07 PM
Hopkins is 73" in height, that is taller than almost all DBs = advantage in height. Hopkins has 33" arms and that is almost 2" inches longer than most DBs = advantage in reach. Hopkins has 10" hands = advantage to catch the ball. Hopkins has a 36" vertical leap, plus his height, plus his reach = a distinct advantage when he is in position to use his superiors and that is when he has the opportunity to separate from the DB.

However if Nuk's route assignments are dinks, dunks, quick slant or out (Kubiak's short passing game) that allows the DB to give DeAndre Hopkins a Prostrate Exam while at the same time defending against the pass, Nuk is not going to be nearly as effective and closer to average and mundane. I think you will find that Nuk will be much more successful on 10-12yd PLUS routes. I hope I did a better job this time at explaining my thoughts.

I'm still not sure what you've been trying to say, not for a lack of trying.
My opinion is that Hopkins will see plenty of under a

The Pencil Neck
08-16-2013, 01:12 PM
I didn't see this posted anywhere and thought it deserved some discussion...

(on following up on the last game performance) “If I graded myself, I’d give myself a D honestly. I’ve got a lot I can improve on and I can come back and do a lot better than I did.”

8/15 Quotes on HT.com (http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-2/Texans-Training-Camp-Quotes-August-15/d13a3eed-94be-4525-9c7a-722e497d32fc)

:clap:

I love this. This is the right attitude. Sounds like he's getting a strong dose of AJ and not letting things go to his head.

Hope he's not just blowing smoke...

Rey
08-16-2013, 04:05 PM
Our offense isn't really dink and dunk. Yeah we throw some short passes, but we stretch the field plenty.

Vance87
08-16-2013, 04:17 PM
Our offense isn't really dink and dunk. Yeah we throw some short passes, but we stretch the field plenty.

If our offense is dink and dunk so is New England's...and Denver's...anybody questioning them?

Playoffs
08-17-2013, 12:04 PM
Texans' Hopkins content to do his talking on the field

By Brian T. Smith/chron.com (http://www.houstonchronicle.com/sports/texans/article/Texans-Hopkins-content-to-do-his-talking-on-the-4739420.php?t=dbc90cb689d8ff4dd2)


"That's why I don't like doing interviews, honestly, right now," Hopkins said. "Because I haven't done anything on the field yet. I've got a lot of work to do. I don't want to talk myself up or anything."
...

Hopkins' grade on his debut: D. His take: "One preseason game."
...

"I really don't have any personal goals besides rookie of the year, which I would expect all rookies to have," Hopkins said. "Being on this team and knowing that they haven't got a championship, I just want to come in and contribute to be part of that."
...

"I don't think he's trying to be Andre Johnson," RickSmith said. "I think he's trying to be DeAndre Hopkins in a way that's authentic but shares similar characteristics with some of the things that make Andre great."
...

"All this is about the team," Hopkins said. "None of this is about me."
...

"This team is a lot of guys who just go out and work and don't do a lot of talking off the field," Hopkins said. "It just grows on you, how these guys are."

Brian T. Smith ‏@ChronBrianSmith
#Texans' DeAndre Hopkins on who's joined him in #Houston from South Carolina: "Nobody. This team is my family." #NFL

Chris Carter was DeAndre Hopkins' favorite wide receiver when he was growing up. Partly because of stats. Also because Carter played 16 years

CloakNNNdagger
08-19-2013, 09:11 AM
I posted this during the game in response to a question about risk of subsequent concussions following a previous concussion. I was asked to re-post the information so that people could "hang their hat" on trying to sort out such a situation.

Research suggests that if someone has already received one concussion, they are 1-2 times more likely to receive a second one. If they've had two concussions, then a third is 2-4 times more likely, and if they've had three concussions, then they are 3-9 times more likely to receive their fourth concussion.

76Texan
08-19-2013, 09:32 AM
I posted this during the game in response to a question about risk of subsequent concussions following a previous concussion. I was asked to re-post the information so that people could "hang their hat" on trying to sort out such a situation.

Man, I can't believe Montana was able to play all those years.
Do you know whether all those concussions had started to show some kind of an effect on him?

CloakNNNdagger
08-19-2013, 10:27 AM
Man, I can't believe Montana was able to play all those years.
Do you know whether all those concussions had started to show some kind of an effect on him?

Montana had 8 documented concussions. I've heard him speak of its life after football after effects. It only included head aches, minor visual difficulties and minor balance problems.......pretty minor after effects if that is all.

76Texan
08-19-2013, 10:41 AM
Montana had 8 documented concussions. I've heard him speak of its life after football after effects. It only included head aches, minor visual difficulties and minor balance problems.......pretty minor after effects if that is all.

I believed the Niners let him go even though Montana still wanted to play due to this reason?
Montana decided to keep playing and signed with the Chiefs right?
Do you think any team would have signed Montana in the present time?
I'm not sure his wife nor his agent would want him to continue playing knowing what we know today, would you agree?

CloakNNNdagger
08-19-2013, 12:53 PM
I believed the Niners let him go even though Montana still wanted to play due to this reason?
Montana decided to keep playing and signed with the Chiefs right?
Do you think any team would have signed Montana in the present time?
I'm not sure his wife nor his agent would want him to continue playing knowing what we know today, would you agree?

Absolutely agree! I believe that even though Aikman was said to have many more, 8 is also the documented number. Aikman chose to retire after considering 2 factors.........back problems.........and number of concussions..........and that was before all the info was released re. concussions. Today, we will still see "informed" players, including QBs case the glory and the money despite the potential life-changing risk. In a 2011 piece (http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/113137639.html) I came across, Aikman to date states that he is not experiencing any sequellae from his concussions.....yet. Sort of interesting that Aikman pretty much has stayed neutral on the subject concerning today's players.

CloakNNNdagger
08-22-2013, 11:37 PM
Hopkins was reported today as not having gotten out of "Phase I" of the Concussion Return to Play Protocol. Many of you may not be familiar with what these phases signify.

In brief, a player needs to complete five phases of exercise and recovery before taking the field. The phases consist of increasing levels of exertion:

I.Being symptom-free for 24 hours (essentially at total rest)

II.Performing light physical activity (e.g., walking) without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

III.Performing sport-specific activities (e.g., running) without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

IV.Participating in non-contact practice (e.g., sprinting, passing the ball, also weight lifting) without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

V.Participating in full-contact practice without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

If symptoms recur, the player must rest for 24 hours before resuming the process one step lower than when symptoms returned.

The report on Hopkins then fundamentally tells us that at rest, he is still exhibiting signs and/or symptoms of the concussion he sustained last Saturday.

Texn4life
08-22-2013, 11:49 PM
18 days to be cleared before Week 1. I think right now its best to keep him in Stage 1 and allow him to feel 100 percent like himself before he even thinks about stepping back on a practice field. There's no need to rush it at all. The Texans probably feel the same way.

Playoffs
08-22-2013, 11:51 PM
I was about to ask about the stages the NFL uses, thanks for posting. MSR

Vance87
08-22-2013, 11:58 PM
:thumbdown

DocBar
08-23-2013, 02:07 AM
Hopkins was reported today as not having gotten out of "Phase I" of the Concussion Return to Play Protocol. Many of you may not be familiar with what these phases signify.

In brief, a player needs to complete five phases of exercise and recovery before taking the field. The phases consist of increasing levels of exertion:

I.Being symptom-free for 24 hours (essentially at total rest)

II.Performing light physical activity (e.g., walking) without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

III.Performing sport-specific activities (e.g., running) without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

IV.Participating in non-contact practice (e.g., sprinting, passing the ball, also weight lifting) without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

V.Participating in full-contact practice without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

If symptoms recur, the player must rest for 24 hours before resuming the process one step lower than when symptoms returned.

The report on Hopkins then fundamentally tells us that at rest, he is still exhibiting signs and/or symptoms of the concussion he sustained last Saturday.Is this a screwed up way to make the pick of AJ more appealing?

thunderkyss
08-23-2013, 08:06 AM
Hopkins was reported today as not having gotten out of "Phase I" of the Concussion Return to Play Protocol. Many of you may not be familiar with what these phases signify.

In brief, a player needs to complete five phases of exercise and recovery before taking the field. The phases consist of increasing levels of exertion:

I.Being symptom-free for 24 hours (essentially at total rest)

The report on Hopkins then fundamentally tells us that at rest, he is still exhibiting signs and/or symptoms of the concussion he sustained last Saturday.

So what symptoms are we talking about? Are these symptoms he can easily hide, or is there some kind of objective measurement of them?

TexansSeminole
08-23-2013, 10:59 AM
So what symptoms are we talking about? Are these symptoms he can easily hide, or is there some kind of objective measurement of them?

Well, his spot is locked down. He is the #2, so he has no reason to try to get back on the field for a preseason game.

drs23
08-23-2013, 02:50 PM
Well, his spot is locked down. He is the #2, so he has no reason to try to get back on the field for a preseason game.

True but this being the PS game that's played closer to regular season games as far a time on the field for the 1's. It would have also helped Nuk get as close to "real bullet" practice as well as sharpening his timing with Matt being able to develop more on the field trust in him.

Just my way of thinking.

CloakNNNdagger
08-23-2013, 03:08 PM
As I previously posted before. This is not Hopkins' first concussion. Most are not aware that he sustained a concussion during an auto accident the end of 2011, just before the Orange Bowl. The handful of media that did report it, reported it as a "mild" concussion. They should have done a better job of investigating the incident. Despite the fact that he was allowed to play in the Bowl game within a week of the injury and did well, he did NOT sustain a "minor" concussion...........he sustained full loss of consciousness. Here is the eye witness account by his own receivers coach, Jeff Scott. (http://www.csnhouston.com/football-houston-texans/talk/crash-changed-hopkins-life)

Jeff Scott remembers the morning of Dec. 27, 2011 well.

All too well.

Scott, along with his wife Sara, was heading to Memorial Stadium to meet up with the rest of team. They were going to meet, pack up the buses, and head on the road to the 2012 Orange Bowl in Miami to face West Virginia.

That’s when the Clemson wide receivers coach saw a car crashed on the side of the highway.

That car belonged to then-sophomore receiver DeAndre Hopkins.

Scott and his wife were on a frontage road when they recognized the car to be Hopkins’ and they “got around there pretty quick” to arrive on the scene.

Scott got out of his car and braced himself for the worst possible news. After all, he didn’t know the severity of the accident. He didn’t know if Hopkins was hurt, or even worse, dead.

“When we got out of the car, the police detective was walking up to the car and it was one of those moments you don’t know what he’s about to tell you,” Scott said during a phone interview on Friday afternoon. “He told us he was OK. He was just really fortunate to be alive. It was definitely just a scary moment for all of us.”

And Hopkins was relatively fine. Scott said the policeman told him Hopkins was knocked unconscious but would be OK. Scott said the tires on the receiver’s car were worn too thin and he happened to hit a wet patch on the road. It was raining that morning, he recalled.

The sad thing is that the NCAA to this day, despite all the NFL emphasis and rules and protocols established for concussed players, does not have nor follow a truly standardized protocol for return to play. And if they had had one, there would have been no way the a player that had been totally knocked unconscious would have been allowed to play that early.............whether the concussion was sustained on the field or otherwise.

No matter how one wants to look at it, this is Hopkins' SECOND significant concussion, and he thus carries a 2-4 times chance of sustaining a third.

HJam72
08-23-2013, 03:18 PM
At least we know Swearinger won't hit him in the helmet in practice. :kitten:

badboy
08-23-2013, 03:32 PM
At least we know Swearinger won't hit him in the helmet in practice. :kitten:

No, we only know he will be fined if he does. chuckle

TexansSeminole
08-23-2013, 03:42 PM
True but this being the PS game that's played closer to regular season games as far a time on the field for the 1's. It would have also helped Nuk get as close to "real bullet" practice as well as sharpening his timing with Matt being able to develop more on the field trust in him.

Just my way of thinking.

Of course, more practice is always good for a rookie. My point was that he has no reason to hide the effects of his injury.

Brisco_County
08-23-2013, 03:44 PM
As I previously posted before. This is not Hopkins' first concussion. Most are not aware that he sustained a concussion during an auto accident the end of 2011, just before the Orange Bowl. The handful of media that did report it, reported it as a "mild" concussion. They should have done a better job of investigating the incident. Despite the fact that he was allowed to play in the Bowl game within a week of the injury and did well, he did NOT sustain a "minor" concussion...........he sustained full loss of consciousness. Here is the eye witness account by his own receivers coach, Jeff Scott. (http://www.csnhouston.com/football-houston-texans/talk/crash-changed-hopkins-life)



The sad thing is that the NCAA to this day, despite all the NFL emphasis and rules and protocols established for concussed players, does not have nor follow a truly standardized protocol for return to play. And if they had had one, there would have been no way the a player that had been totally knocked unconscious would have been allowed to play that early.............whether the concussion was sustained on the field or otherwise.

No matter how one wants to look at it, this is Hopkins' SECOND significant concussion, and he thus carries a 2-4 times chance of sustaining a third.

The NCAA has demonstrated that their rules and standards do not exist for the benefit of the players. Until they start getting sued like the NFL -- which they won't -- they really don't care about their well being.

Playoffs
08-23-2013, 04:11 PM
So what symptoms are we talking about? Are these symptoms he can easily hide, or is there some kind of objective measurement of them?
Here's a list of possible symptoms -- click for larger
http://img.docstoccdn.com/thumb/orig/101414650.png (http://img.docstoccdn.com/thumb/orig/101414650.png)
His symptoms will be graded through each Stage listed above...


I.Being symptom-free for 24 hours (essentially at total rest)

II.Performing light physical activity (e.g., walking) without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

III.Performing sport-specific activities (e.g., running) without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

IV.Participating in non-contact practice (e.g., sprinting, passing the ball, also weight lifting) without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

V.Participating in full-contact practice without re-developing symptoms for 24 hours

If symptoms recur, the player must rest for 24 hours before resuming the process one step lower than when symptoms returned.

CloakNNNdagger
08-23-2013, 04:42 PM
So what symptoms are we talking about? Are these symptoms he can easily hide, or is there some kind of objective measurement of them?

There are many baseline tests given to all of the players before the season begins. One of those important tests include the IMPACT test [CLICK HERE TO SEE THE ACTUAL TEST (http://www.nflevolution.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/nfl-concussion-tool-post-injury.pdf)]. It is the tool used to first assess potential concussions right after they are suspected. Other tests are given that test colors, shapes and memory association combinations. There are audio and visual light tests given. There are numerous computer programs that the players are presented with to test reflexes and timed cognitive responses. These are all compared to the baseline levels/scores established during these tests given before the season began. This is all above and beyond the comparative physical and psychological testing performed by the team doctors and neurologist that are performed at regular intervals.

The process, if followed as intended, is so complicated that it is pretty well accepted that it would be virtually impossible to fake "recovery."

Hope that answers your questions.

ObsiWan
08-24-2013, 10:47 PM
I was about to ask about the stages the NFL uses, thanks for posting. MSR

I got him for ya.
:tiphat:
...and for me too
Always educational.

ObsiWan
08-24-2013, 10:54 PM
There are many baseline tests given to all of the players before the season begins. One of those important tests include the IMPACT test [CLICK HERE TO SEE THE ACTUAL TEST (http://www.nflevolution.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/nfl-concussion-tool-post-injury.pdf)]. It is the tool used to first assess potential concussions right after they are suspected. Other tests are given that test colors, shapes and memory association combinations. There are audio and visual light tests given. There are numerous computer programs that the players are presented with to test reflexes and timed cognitive responses. These are all compared to the baseline levels/scores established during these tests given before the season began. This is all above and beyond the comparative physical and psychological testing performed by the team doctors and neurologist that are performed at regular intervals.

The process, if followed as intended, is so complicated that it is pretty well accepted that it would be virtually impossible to fake "recovery."

Hope that answers your questions.

Wow, that's a pretty extensive set of tests. Now is this form - this set of tests - administered during each phase?
:thinking:

The Pencil Neck
08-24-2013, 11:00 PM
Wow, that's a pretty extensive set of tests. Now is this form - this set of tests - administered during each phase?
:thinking:

He can't get out of phase I because the doctor keeps falling asleep halfway through the administration of all the tests!!!??!?!

CloakNNNdagger
08-24-2013, 11:26 PM
Wow, that's a pretty extensive set of tests. Now is this form - this set of tests - administered during each phase?
:thinking:

Each type of test............the IMPACT, 5 phases of rehab, cognitive, etc.......are all independent markers. Nothing can be made of any one alone.........including clearance to play by the team doctor or team neurologist. Any one or all of the testing can be repeated anywhere along the way, should it be deemed necessary, indicated or helpful. The only "in stone" step is the final release to return to play by the INDEPENDENT League-certified neurologist.

Texn4life
08-24-2013, 11:38 PM
Each type of test............the IMPACT, 5 phases of rehab, cognitive, etc.......are all independent markers. Nothing can be made of any one alone.........including clearance to play by the team doctor or team neurologist. Any one or all of the testing can be repeated anywhere along the way, should it be deemed necessary, indicated or helpful. The only "in stone" step is the final release to return to play by the INDEPENDENT League-certified neurologist.

Doc, Kubiak made a comment that stages 2 and 3 can be completed in 1 day. Based on what you've learned is this the case?

ObsiWan
08-24-2013, 11:44 PM
Doc, Kubiak made a comment that stages 2 and 3 can be completed in 1 day. Based on what you've learned is this the case?

Not the way I read that list. It looks to me to be a set of serial requirements. Doing stage two and three in the same 24-hr period would indicate that the tests can be administered in parallel. That doesn't make sense to me.
:mcnugget:
But that's me thinking like an engineer, not a doctor...

Texn4life
08-25-2013, 12:03 AM
Not the way I read that list. It looks to me to be a set of serial requirements. Doing stage two and three in the same 24-hr period would indicate that the tests can be administered in parallel. That doesn't make sense to me.
:mcnugget:
But that's me thinking like an engineer, not a doctor...

Yeah I know. That's why I asked. It doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to me either, but here's the quote.

(on if there has been any progress with WR DeAndre Hopkins) “He is still in phase one. He is feeling a lot better. In meetings today, doing a lot of stuff he wasn’t doing yesterday. I think we’re making progress and, like I said, I think you can go through phase two and three in one given day, so I think we can see some quick progress here over the weekend, but there was never any plan for him to play.”

August 23rd Practice Quotes (http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-2/Texans-Practice-Quotes-August-23/d38d84ea-2bcc-475a-9a6f-1b70c92b3ba1)

CloakNNNdagger
08-25-2013, 12:10 AM
Doc, Kubiak made a comment that stages 2 and 3 can be completed in 1 day. Based on what you've learned is this the case?

Not the way I read that list. It looks to me to be a set of serial requirements. Doing stage two and three in the same 24-hr period would indicate that the tests can be administered in parallel. That doesn't make sense to me.
:mcnugget:
But that's me thinking like an engineer, not a doctor...

Yeah I know. That's why I asked. It doesn't really make a whole lot of sense to me either, but he's the quote.



August 23rd Practice Quotes (http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-2/Texans-Practice-Quotes-August-23/d38d84ea-2bcc-475a-9a6f-1b70c92b3ba1)


I was just about to post Kubiak's quote (given yesterday).

It doesn't make sense, because it doesn't make sense.:shades:

Playoffs
08-25-2013, 12:17 AM
The important thing for me is to take care of this young man's life.

He had a serious concussion where he was knocked unconscious at the end of 2011, and now a 2nd concussion on what did not appear to be that violent of an impact.

Hold him out for as many games as he needs to get symptom free. If they push him back... if he fudges the test... his 3rd concussion could be his last as an NFL player. And the consequences likely to last years into his life.

CloakNNNdagger
08-25-2013, 08:09 PM
As of this late morning, Hopkins is still in Phase I.

amazing80
08-25-2013, 08:16 PM
As of this late morning, Hopkins is still in Phase I.

is it typical to take this long for phase 1?

CloakNNNdagger
08-25-2013, 08:38 PM
is it typical to take this long for phase 1?

I've seen patients stay in the equivalent of Phase I for weeks. "Minor" concussion not infrequently progress through Phase I in just a couple of days.

Playoffs
08-27-2013, 02:41 PM
Dave Zangaro ‏@DZangaro
DeAndre Hopkins might be cleared tomorrow to return.
Deepi Sidhu ‏@DeepSlant
Kubiak: DeAndre Hopkins in stage 4 of 5 in concussion protocol. Could play Thursday. @HoustonTexans

TdotTexas2Step
08-27-2013, 03:45 PM
That's huge. He needs all the reps he can get before the lights come on.

Now the only hurdle left is him not worrying about getting hit again. Because like mentioned before, his next concussion could be his last.

ObsiWan
08-27-2013, 08:40 PM
Cleared or not, I would sit him Thursday.
I'd give him another week of recovery time.
And give Cruse, Lemon, and EZ one last shot to stick around or at least be brought back to the P/S.

amazing80
08-27-2013, 08:56 PM
Cleared or not, I would sit him Thursday.
I'd give him another week of recovery time.
And give Cruse, Lemon, and EZ one last shot to stick around or at least be brought back to the P/S.

Id make him play for a quarter or 2 but not throw to him

Texn4life
08-27-2013, 09:14 PM
Id make him play for a quarter or 2 but not throw to him

Really? Whats the point of putting him out there at all then?

CloakNNNdagger
08-27-2013, 09:16 PM
Cleared or not, I would sit him Thursday.
I'd give him another week of recovery time.
And give Cruse, Lemon, and EZ one last shot to stick around or at least be brought back to the P/S.

I would share your feelings. His first concussion being a knock out. Now this one being caused by a relatively mild trauma. The extra reps he gets against 3rd and 4th stringers......most of which will be watching games this season from their couches........he will be just as challenged as if he were running routes in practice without his team mates trying to lay him out. With a history of past concussions, protocols should be adjusted to lengthen the time from phase 4 to 5 to ultimate return to game play. Missing this game to let his brain regain its normal metabolic processes decreases the chance that he sustains another concussion following lesser trauma......a concussion which will surely take him out of competition for quite a while.....and make him 3-9 times more likely to sustain a fourth. He may be fortunate if put out there, and he makes it through the game without incident. But if they stick him out there this Thursday, I would truthfully have to wonder who else got hit in the head to make that decision.:kubepalm:

Brandon420tx
08-27-2013, 09:29 PM
Maybe we can make a fan wide plea on the twitterverse to keep Hopkins from playing game 4

pissknocker
08-28-2013, 08:25 AM
As a sophomore at Clemson, DeAndre Hopkins suffered a concussion in an automobile accident on his way to Memorial Stadium for the Orange Bowl against West Virginia.
The crash happened on December 27, 2011. Police said Hopkins was "knocked unconscious" after hitting a wet patch in the road. "He started out in the front seat and the car spun around and went up a tree and he ended up in the backseat," described Hopkins' mother. Hopkins still played in the bowl game. Now an NFL rookie, Hopkins has been slow to recover from an August 17 concussion. Aug 28 - 7:59 AM
Source: CSN Houston


Is this news? News to me. Scratch that just read a few posts back.

HJam72
08-28-2013, 08:29 AM
Maybe we can make a fan wide plea on the twitterverse to keep Hopkins from playing game 4

Well, I'm in.

HoustonFrog
08-28-2013, 08:51 AM
As a sophomore at Clemson, DeAndre Hopkins suffered a concussion in an automobile accident on his way to Memorial Stadium for the Orange Bowl against West Virginia.
The crash happened on December 27, 2011. Police said Hopkins was "knocked unconscious" after hitting a wet patch in the road. "He started out in the front seat and the car spun around and went up a tree and he ended up in the backseat," described Hopkins' mother. Hopkins still played in the bowl game. Now an NFL rookie, Hopkins has been slow to recover from an August 17 concussion. Aug 28 - 7:59 AM
Source: CSN Houston


Is this news? News to me. Scratch that just read a few posts back.

Just saw this on Rotoworld too. That's scary. Had no clue about the guy.

badboy
08-28-2013, 02:23 PM
Tania Ganguli @taniaganguli
DeAndre Hopkins has been totally cleared to return to practice. Good chance he plays Thursday. #Texans1:33 PM - 27 Aug 2013

CloakNNNdagger
08-28-2013, 03:43 PM
Tania Ganguli @taniaganguli
DeAndre Hopkins has been totally cleared to return to practice. Good chance he plays Thursday. #Texan1s1:33 PM - 27 Aug 203

"Totally cleared to return to practice" leaves it unclear as to non-contact or contact practice. And with a Thursday game, when would he have had an opportunity to participate in a contact practice? From after yesterday's practice: (on if WR DeAndre Hopkins has progressed in the protocol stages of his concussion) “Yeah, he’s doing good. He has not been totally cleared to return to practice. That could happen tomorrow. I want to say he’s in like stage four right now. He did do a lot of work today with the trainers.”

Either way, if we see him against the Cowboys, I stand on my previous statement that someone in the coaching staff or the front office must have also taken a hit to the head.

badboy
08-28-2013, 03:48 PM
"totally cleared to return to practice" leaves it unclear as to non-contact or contact practice. And with a Thursday game, when would he have had an opportunity to participate in a contact practice?

Either way, if we see him against the Cowboys, I stand on my previous statement that someone in the coaching staff or the front office must have also taken a hit to the head.Posting info but 100% agree we don't need to see him on field tomorrow and maybe not first game. Allow Jean and Martin to get the reps against Dallas. This could also be for concussions :vincepalm:

Playoffs
08-29-2013, 11:18 PM
Tania Ganguli ‏@taniaganguli
Hopkins hasn't passed the final concussion test, but Kubiak thinks if he took one today he would've passed. #Texans

infantrycak
08-29-2013, 11:22 PM
Tania Ganguli ‏@taniaganguli

She has no idea what she is talking about.

Playoffs
08-29-2013, 11:35 PM
Tania Ganguli ‏@taniaganguliHopkins hasn't passed the final concussion test, but Kubiak thinks if he took one today he would've passed. #Texans

She has no idea what she is talking about.

Drew Dougherty ‏@DoughertyDrew
Kubiak: WR DeAndre Hopkins still hasn't passed all the protocols in concussion testing.

infantrycak
08-29-2013, 11:41 PM
Drew Dougherty ‏@DoughertyDrew

I'll believe it when the NFL announces the fine. The protocol is not discretionary with the teams.

ChampionTexan
08-29-2013, 11:44 PM
I'll believe it when the NFL announces the fine. The protocol is not discretionary with the teams.

Fine for what - what rule would be broken assuming that the tweets are accurate?

infantrycak
08-29-2013, 11:50 PM
Fine for what - what rule would be broken assuming that the tweets are accurate?

Players have to complete all five steps of the protocol to play. The last step is being cleared by the Texans medical staff and an independent physician.

ChampionTexan
08-29-2013, 11:53 PM
Players have to complete all five steps of the protocol to play. The last step is being cleared by the Texans medical staff and an independent physician.

But he didn't play did he?

infantrycak
08-29-2013, 11:54 PM
But he didn't play did he?

My bad then. I thought someone said he was out there for a few plays.

ChampionTexan
08-29-2013, 11:56 PM
My bad then. I thought someone said he was out there for a few plays.

There was talk of it if he was cleared, but from the sounds of it, they didn't even try to clear him in time to play.

Brisco_County
08-30-2013, 12:00 AM
Ganguli must have tweeted that from happy hour.

CloakNNNdagger
08-30-2013, 08:33 AM
Tania Ganguli @taniaganguli
DeAndre Hopkins has been totally cleared to return to practice. Good chance he plays Thursday. #Texans1:33 PM - 27 Aug 2013


"Totally cleared to return to practice" leaves it unclear as to non-contact or contact practice. And with a Thursday game, when would he have had an opportunity to participate in a contact practice? From after yesterday's practice:

Either way, if we see him against the Cowboys, I stand on my previous statement that someone in the coaching staff or the front office must have also taken a hit to the head.

As I tried to point out before, this was reported by Tania Ganguli on Tues after practice. Kubiak later said he was in (not necessarily passed) Phase 4. The "clearance" could have only been for Phase 4 (non-contact practice). With a Thursday game, you know there was no way there would have been a contact practice on Wednesday for him to even try to test out a Phase 5 (even if he had passed Phase 4). He could have never been cleared prior to the Cowboys game. On top of that, we haven't really been told to date whether he ever passed his Phase 4 without recurrence of symptoms. It seems that the media and Kubiak have questionable understanding of the workings of the Concussion Protocol.

Playoffs
08-30-2013, 09:39 AM
...It seems that the media and Kubiak have questionable understanding of the workings of the Concussion Protocol.
Agree, although I'm guessing Kubiak is the culprit and media just pukes out what he says.

I just hope Nuk isn't hiding symptoms, and Texans aren't rushing him.

CloakNNNdagger
09-01-2013, 01:33 PM
When you are trying to prevent recurrent nausea following concussion, you may try avoiding THIS.........:kubepalm:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BTCsdE2CUAAVBBV.jpg

ObsiWan
09-01-2013, 09:22 PM
When you are trying to prevent recurrent nausea following concussion, you may try avoiding THIS.........:kubepalm:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BTCsdE2CUAAVBBV.jpg

Orrrrr...
Perhaps wearing that shirt w/o barfing is confirmation that he's no longer susceptible to nausea...
Then again, with those colors how can one tell...?
:kitten:

CloakNNNdagger
09-01-2013, 09:24 PM
Orrrrr...
Perhaps wearing that shirt w/o barfing is confirmation that he's no longer susceptible to nausea...
Then again, with those colors how can one tell...?
:kitten:

If so, he must be avoiding mirrors.......

htowntexans1985
09-03-2013, 01:32 PM
DeAndre has been cleared to play week one. Per 610.

281
09-03-2013, 01:51 PM
DeAndre has been cleared to play week one. Per 610.

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/image.php?u=39055&dateline=1377480765

thunderkyss
09-03-2013, 01:54 PM
http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/image.php?u=39055&dateline=1377480765

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/image.php?u=39055&dateline=1377480765

Allstar
09-03-2013, 02:08 PM
http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/image.php?u=39055&dateline=1377480765

http://m2.nflrush.com/bz/ap453278836081.jpg

The Pencil Neck
09-10-2013, 12:45 PM
5 catches, 66 yards -- Deandre Hopkins after 1 game.
6 catches, 65 yards -- Keshawn Martin after 6 games of rookie season.
6 catches, 151 yards -- Lestar Jean, after entire 2012 season.

If Hopkins continues to produce like this, he could have a monster year.

thunderkyss
09-10-2013, 01:40 PM
5 catches, 66 yards -- Deandre Hopkins after 1 game.
6 catches, 65 yards -- Keshawn Martin after 6 games of rookie season.
6 catches, 151 yards -- Lestar Jean, after entire 2012 season.

If Hopkins continues to produce like this, he could have a monster year.

That's not right.

Maybe you're trying to be funny. Sure we had high hopes that LeStar & KeShawn could beat out KDub for that roster spot. But we shouldn't be comparing Hopkins to them.

That's like looking at every Texans' milestone in relation to the Chiefs or the Lions... or Buffalo. We've turned that corner & should be comparing ourselves to New England, Pittsburgh, & Dallas (yes..... Dallas).

76Texan
09-10-2013, 02:08 PM
It looked a bit shaky at first, but when Hopkins came through with that low catch, I'm sure Schaub feels much more confident going to him.

badboy
09-10-2013, 02:15 PM
It looked a bit shaky at first, but when Hopkins came through with that low catch, I'm sure Schaub feels much more confident going to him.You naillin it on the QB confidence and that is why Hopkins hands will make up for lack of blazing speed. MS zeroes in on AJ and OD who hang onto the ball. IMO, we have two more option for MS now including Cierre Wood who will eventually get on field and earn his confidence as a receiving RB. Sure I am crazy but wait and see.

The Pencil Neck
09-10-2013, 02:34 PM
That's not right.

Maybe you're trying to be funny. Sure we had high hopes that LeStar & KeShawn could beat out KDub for that roster spot. But we shouldn't be comparing Hopkins to them.

That's like looking at every Texans' milestone in relation to the Chiefs or the Lions... or Buffalo. We've turned that corner & should be comparing ourselves to New England, Pittsburgh, & Dallas (yes..... Dallas).

I don't see why we shouldn't compare them to DeAndre.

One of my points was that DeAndre is already producing. Granted, it's one game but after that one game, he's already looking the way you want a first rounder to look. I think it's interesting that he already has as almost as many catches as Keshawn and Lestar did last year.

One of my other points is that it looks like he's already a part of this offense and that Schaub is trusting him and finding him.

ANOTHER one of my points is... did you see the Lestar Jean ypc? Holy crap!

CretorFrigg
09-10-2013, 02:37 PM
I don't see why we shouldn't compare them to DeAndre.

One of my points was that DeAndre is already producing. Granted, it's one game but after that one game, he's already looking the way you want a first rounder to look. I think it's interesting that he already has as almost as many catches as Keshawn and Lestar did last year.

One of my other points is that it looks like he's already a part of this offense and that Schaub is trusting him and finding him.

ANOTHER one of my points is... did you see the Lestar Jean ypc? Holy crap!

Of course it's not a fair comparison. Deandre is a 1st round pick. He's EXPECTED to contribute. He's EXPECTED to be a star. That's what teams expect from 1st rounders.

Keshawn was a lower draft pick. He was forced into a role last year due to lack of depth.

dream_team
09-10-2013, 02:46 PM
I loved that jump ball thrown at him in the end zone when he was single covered, even though it went incomplete. But as time goes, DeAndre is going to learn how to either catch that ball more often or cause a PI call.

thunderkyss
09-10-2013, 04:44 PM
I don't see why we shouldn't compare them to DeAndre.


Yeah, we can compare them to Hopkins. But we should be comparing Hopkins to JulioJones, Aj Green, Dez Bryant, or Victor Cruz.

Saying he's better than Keyshawn & LeStar isn't really saying a lot... that's all I'm saying.


One of my points was that DeAndre is already producing.

I think it's interesting that he already has as almost as many catches as Keshawn and Lestar did last year.


I think that's because of Schaub/Kubiak on any other team, these guys would get a lot more opportunities.



ANOTHER one of my points is... did you see the Lestar Jean ypc? Holy crap!

He's a play-maker. If we get him on the field more often & get him the ball 1 or 2 times every two or three weeks, defenses will have to pay attention to him.

chenjy9
09-10-2013, 05:19 PM
5 catches, 66 yards -- Deandre Hopkins after 1 game.
6 catches, 65 yards -- Keshawn Martin after 6 games of rookie season.
6 catches, 151 yards -- Lestar Jean, after entire 2012 season.

If Hopkins continues to produce like this, he could have a monster year.

That's like comparing a Bentley to a Honda to a Pinto. You can't really compare a legitimately talented wide out projected as the top 1 or 2 in the draft with backups and scrubs like Martin and Jean. Speaking of Jean by the way, how the hell is this garbage player not cut yet?

TexansSeminole
09-10-2013, 05:29 PM
I understand the comparison. It shows how involved Hopkins is in the offense early on. 5 catches in the first game by a rookie in Kubiak's offense shows trust and an expectation to produce. The only thing holding Hopkins back is a lack of confidence in him by the coaching staff or Schaub. Things look good so far.

In regards to that long pass, Hopkins has the ability to make that catch, even one handed. I think we will see more of that as teams continue to focus on AJ, especially over the top.

infantrycak
09-10-2013, 05:47 PM
I understand the comparison. It shows how involved Hopkins is in the offense early on.

Bingo. There were predictions Hopkins wouldn't get targeted as much as Walter last year and so would end up with 35 rec. for 350 or so yds. Playing a partial game after missing significant practice he was already much more involved than that.

phantom17
09-10-2013, 06:01 PM
I'm very glad we got this guy! Excellent first NFL game debut, not including pre season! Kube's offense is not the easiest to master right away. This kid can be really special sooner not later. Seems like he has high FB IQ. I like his diving catch for 30yds(?). If he continues to improve, Andre can have a MONSTER season! :swatter:

76Texan
09-10-2013, 06:17 PM
Bingo. There were predictions Hopkins wouldn't get targeted as much as Walter last year and so would end up with 35 rec. for 350 or so yds. Playing a partial game after missing significant practice he was already much more involved than that.

The "prediction" was based on the Texans comfortable ahead in games against a weak opponent like the Chargers.

That didn't happen and so the Texans had to open up their game plan.
How many times were Hopkins targeted in the first half and how many yards did he get?

If it were the Texans that led 21-7 at half time, how many times do you realistically think that Schaub would put the ball up in the second half?

76Texan
09-10-2013, 06:33 PM
The Texans called 29 pass plays in the second half; that works out to be 928 plays over the course of a 16-game season, not even counting overtime.

Does anybody really expect that figure?

infantrycak
09-10-2013, 06:33 PM
The "prediction" was based on the Texans comfortable ahead in games against a weak opponent like the Chargers.

That didn't happen and so the Texans had to open up their game plan.
How many times were Hopkins targeted in the first half and how many yards did he get?

If it were the Texans that led 21-7 at half time, how many times do you realistically think that Schaub would put the ball up in the second half?

I think your supposition on play calling is off as AJ demonstrates - he gets his targets when we are behind much of the season and when we are ahead much of the season.

Looking at complete seasons for ease of comparison:

2006 6-10, 166 tgts, -99 pts
2008 8-8, 170 tgts, -28 pts
2009 9-7, 170 tgts, +55 pts
2012 12-4, 164 tgts, +86 pts

Hopkins has been brought in to be the #2 and they are going to treat him as such until he proves himself incapable like Keyshawn and Jean did last season by having butter fingers. 5 receptions on 6 targets coming off of injury is not going to make Schaub or Kubiak stop targeting Hopkins.

ArlingtonTexan
09-10-2013, 06:52 PM
The "prediction" was based on the Texans comfortable ahead in games against a weak opponent like the Chargers.

That didn't happen and so the Texans had to open up their game plan.
How many times were Hopkins targeted in the first half and how many yards did he get?

If it were the Texans that led 21-7 at half time, how many times do you realistically think that Schaub would put the ball up in the second half?

The concept is that Hopkins is talented enough to demand more enough of the offense than Walter did in last couple of seasons. Again even when kevin was a better version of himselk he was 55 to 60 catch guy. The Texans offense was never desgned for the 2nd wr to be a 40 catch blocker. Many times the obvious answer is the answer.

DocBar
09-10-2013, 06:53 PM
That's not right.

Maybe you're trying to be funny. Sure we had high hopes that LeStar & KeShawn could beat out KDub for that roster spot. But we shouldn't be comparing Hopkins to them.

That's like looking at every Texans' milestone in relation to the Chiefs or the Lions... or Buffalo. We've turned that corner & should be comparing ourselves to New England, Pittsburgh, & Dallas (yes..... Dallas).

Hopkins through 1 game: 5 catches 66yds.

Kevin Walter through 2 games in 2012: 5 catches for 50 yds.

That's apples to apples as far as WR2 is concerned.

It shows me that DHop should have a reasonable shot at beating KW's performance last season. :brando:

Playoffs
09-10-2013, 07:34 PM
Does anybody really expect that figure?

No way. Matt averaged 34 attempts last year & had 45 vs. SD.

Fred
09-10-2013, 08:05 PM
5 catches, 66 yards -- Deandre Hopkins after 1 game.
6 catches, 65 yards -- Keshawn Martin after 6 games of rookie season.
6 catches, 151 yards -- Lestar Jean, after entire 2012 season.

If Hopkins continues to produce like this, he could have a monster year.

Andre Johnson after 1 game of his rookie year: 6 catches, 76 yards. Deandre, you need to step up your game.

The "prediction" was based on the Texans comfortable ahead in games against a weak opponent like the Chargers.

That didn't happen and so the Texans had to open up their game plan.
How many times were Hopkins targeted in the first half and how many yards did he get?

If it were the Texans that led 21-7 at half time, how many times do you realistically think that Schaub would put the ball up in the second half?

Come on, this is having it both ways. The prediction was "Hopkins won't make many valuable contributions to the team". Now you are saying "his numbers will only be low in routs, in games where we actually need him, he will be clutch". Completely different spin there.

Of course if the Texans jump out to a huge lead (10 points in the first half or 3 points in the second half) everyone knows it is time to grind down the clock for the win, and there won't be a lot of passing. That is completely different than the receivers are not contributing when needed, which was clearly the implication of the predictions.

76Texan
09-10-2013, 08:10 PM
No way. Matt averaged 34 attempts last year & had 45 vs. SD.

Right; the Texans averaged 34.625 pass attempts last year.
That's included the two overtime games.

Also, the premise is for the Texans defense to get back to the level of 2011, maybe even better.
With a good D, a kicka punter, and a better FG kicker, it is within reason to "presume" that the Texans will have a much better chance playing with a 10-14 lead, and less of a chance of having to play catch-up.

This didn't happen last night.
Also, eventually, the trio of backup receivers should also see some target.

Most importantly, the premise is that Kubiak stays with the balance approach so as to allow the defense the opportunity to rest and stay fresh.

There's always a chance that Kubiak feels more comfortable with Schaub, as long as he continues to demonstrate that he can handle pressure well, and work the game plan to have more passes than rushes.
But until Schaub proves to be consistent under duress, there's no reason to suggest that Kubiak would change his philosophy radically.

Obviously, if Hopkins continues to make the tough catch, he should see his share of target. Too early to call it one way or another though.

76Texan
09-10-2013, 08:11 PM
Andre Johnson after 1 game of his rookie year: 6 catches, 76 yards. Deandre, you need to step up your game.



Come on, this is having it both ways. The prediction was "Hopkins won't make many valuable contributions to the team". Now you are saying "his numbers will only be low in routs, in games where we actually need him, he will be clutch". Completely different spin there.

Of course if the Texans jump out to a huge lead (10 points in the first half or 3 points in the second half) everyone knows it is time to grind down the clock for the win, and there won't be a lot of passing. That is completely different than the receivers are not contributing when needed, which was clearly the implication of the predictions.Go back and read all of my posts in this thread.

76Texan
09-10-2013, 08:17 PM
Along with all the things I recently recount, another point of mine is that the Texans do have a lot of weapons.

Besides the fact that Kubiak continues to maintain that they will target AJ, the rest of the guys should deter Hopkins from having a large number of targets in his rookie season - again, that is taking into consideration all of the premises.

leebigeztx
09-10-2013, 08:23 PM
Right; the Texans averaged 34.625 pass attempts last year.
That's included the two overtime games.

Also, the premise is for the Texans defense to get back to the level of 2011, maybe even better.
With a good D, a kicka punter, and a better FG kicker, it is within reason to "presume" that the Texans will have a much better chance playing with a 10-14 lead, and less of a chance of having to play catch-up.

This didn't happen last night.
Also, eventually, the trio of backup receivers should also see some target.

Most importantly, the premise is that Kubiak stays with the balance approach so as to allow the defense the opportunity to rest and stay fresh.

There's always a chance that Kubiak feels more comfortable with Schaub, as long as he continues to demonstrate that he can handle pressure well, and work the game plan to have more passes than rushes.
But until Schaub proves to be consistent under duress, there's no reason to suggest that Kubiak would change his philosophy radically.

Obviously, if Hopkins continues to make the tough catch, he should see his share of target. Too early to call it one way or another though.

Those were some tough catches by hopkins. Those weren't good throws by schaub. I really wish gary would just open up early. I mean you can still have balance and be opened up. I wish he would roll more 11 personel,no huddle,and just create that offset. They could go big 11 with hopkins and posey as the x and z with andreas the y or small 11 with martin as the y. Just let schaub call the plas from the los and jsut roll. Get the lead ,then start pounding.

thunderkyss
09-10-2013, 08:58 PM
Bingo. There were predictions Hopkins wouldn't get targeted as much as Walter last year and so would end up with 35 rec. for 350 or so yds. Playing a partial game after missing significant practice he was already much more involved than that.

My comments weren't so much a prediction as it was an attempt to temper expectations. I'd hate for people to start calling him a bust if Schaub doesn't "trust" him.

thunderkyss
09-10-2013, 09:01 PM
It shows me that DHop should have a reasonable shot at beating KW's performance last season. :brando:

You don't have to sell me on that.

JCTexan
09-10-2013, 09:05 PM
After one game for Deandre Hopkins he looked exactly like I wanted him to: Like a legit #2 WR. Something the Texans have never had in their history.

76Texan
09-15-2013, 04:44 PM
Good job, Mr. Hopkins.
I take it all back.
You're no longer a rookie.

:bravo::fans:

jaayteetx
09-15-2013, 04:58 PM
DeAndre...DeMan!

Playoffs
09-15-2013, 04:59 PM
Good job, Mr. Hopkins.
I take it all back.
You're no longer a rookie.

:bravo::fans:Manned up today. Really proud of DeAndre. :clap:

cstyle42
09-15-2013, 04:59 PM
Good job, Mr. Hopkins.
I take it all back.
You're no longer a rookie.

:bravo::fans:

I don't know when we Texans fans gonna learn. Is Hopkins gonna have to play on another team and win a super bowl too? It's Schaub and Kubiak.

legacy_gt
09-15-2013, 05:00 PM
this guy is the real deal!

Porky
09-15-2013, 05:00 PM
Hopkins is a freak, and not in a bad way. Dude has hands like I don't think I have ever seen before. Just unreal.

Mr. Texan
09-15-2013, 05:13 PM
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-XNU9ZxJdR6U/UjYdS4K0xsI/AAAAAAAAAu0/nhRCGJMtT_Q/s400/sch111.gif
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-X8mCeqXN2Pk/UjYd-lKzAII/AAAAAAAAAu8/7JDX04FvTxc/s400/hopnow1.gif

Tesuns
09-15-2013, 05:14 PM
Reminds me of Randy Moss.

SAMURAITEXAN
09-15-2013, 05:15 PM
It seems like nuk has glue on his hands. He will only get better.

Fili
09-15-2013, 05:15 PM
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-XNU9ZxJdR6U/UjYdS4K0xsI/AAAAAAAAAu0/nhRCGJMtT_Q/s400/sch111.gif
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-X8mCeqXN2Pk/UjYd-lKzAII/AAAAAAAAAu8/7JDX04FvTxc/s400/hopnow1.gif

If his hands were as big as they were...

RCPM
09-15-2013, 05:16 PM
Me likey!

kiwitexansfan
09-15-2013, 05:22 PM
Reminds me of Randy Moss.

Without the game changing speed.

welsh texan
09-15-2013, 05:23 PM
It's only two games and of course there will come a point when dams have tape on this guy and hell still have to find a way to beat double coverage, but...we may just have two #1 wr's here!!

With Posey looking good at the end of last season and Martin having all the tools to develop, we are looking set moving forward at receiver!!

There was a time when I was scared of AJ eventually declining, I'm beginning to believe that we will overcome that when it comes and maybe even be able to make use of him for a few years after he's #1 material if this cast of young guns continue to step up to the plate. Of course it's a very positive right now too.

The oline needs to give Schaub the time and comfidence to hit these guys and there is work to be done there, but today we've seen another clutch QB, performance, our rookie receiver step up to #1 when it mattered, our backup RB put in a great performance, just sort the oline because we have the playmakers.

thunderkyss
09-15-2013, 06:03 PM
It's only two games and of course there will come a point when dams have tape on this guy and hell still have to find a way to beat double coverage, but...we may just have two #1 wr's here!!


That's what I'm thinking. I can't remember when we've had a receiver step up & take "Andre's place"

Hop did.

Like you, I'm not saying we have two #1s..... but we've definitely got a #2

revan
09-15-2013, 06:21 PM
That's what I'm thinking. I can't remember when we've had a receiver step up & take "Andre's place"

Hop did.

Like you, I'm not saying we have two #1s..... but we've definitely got a #2

Walter and Davis stepped in good when Dre went down but you are right ONE receiver has never stepped up like this.

rolyat93
09-15-2013, 07:18 PM
Without the game changing speed.

Reminds me more of Derrick Mason/ a skinnier Anquan Boldin.

thunderkyss
09-15-2013, 09:07 PM
7 for 117

16.7 avg......that's a WR.

Allstar
09-15-2013, 09:12 PM
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BUO7S-mCQAE5Gfu.jpg

hradhak
09-15-2013, 09:15 PM
7 for 117

16.7 avg......that's a WR.

I like that he and AJ have different skill sets. AJ has never been a jump ball receiver, but a great route runner with good hands. Hop looks like a guy who can catch it in traffic and grab the ball out of the air. They will complement each other well and will give Schaub a real #2.

Texecutioner
09-16-2013, 01:23 AM
I like that he and AJ have different skill sets. AJ has never been a jump ball receiver, but a great route runner with good hands. Hop looks like a guy who can catch it in traffic and grab the ball out of the air. They will complement each other well and will give Schaub a real #2.

Not true at all. AJ has always been able to go up in the air with the best of them and bring it down. His play today was further evidence of that. Kubiak has failed to design plays to get AJ the ball in the red zone over the years. AJ can go up in the air and muscle his way into a catch against anyone pretty much.

Playoffs
09-16-2013, 11:35 AM
http://sinfl.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/deandre-hopkins-nfl-week-2-wild-finishes.jpg

Dave Zangaro ‏@DZangaro
The previous youngest was Patrick Patterson (21-118), who scored on a punt return on 11/6/11.

At 21 years and 101 days old, DeAndre Hopkins became the youngest player in NFL history to score a touchdown in overtime. #Texans

According to the NFL, DeAndre Hopkins is the first rookie WR to catch a TD in OT since Santonio Holmes on Dec. 31, 2006. #Texans

Rey
09-16-2013, 12:09 PM
Hop reminds me of fitz.

The less than ideal top end speed. The ability to high point the ball and make catches over defenders. The good route running.

And the dreads.

Allstar
09-16-2013, 12:54 PM
Hop reminds me of fitz.

The less than ideal top end speed. The ability to high point the ball and make catches over defenders. The good route running.

And the dreads.

I think Roddy White with Boldin sprinkled in.

Playoffs
09-16-2013, 01:25 PM
Hop reminds me of Fitz.

The less than ideal top end speed. The ability to high point the ball and make catches over defenders. The good route running.

And the dreads.

Better comparison, me too.

dream_team
09-16-2013, 01:52 PM
Hop reminds me of fitz.

The less than ideal top end speed. The ability to high point the ball and make catches over defenders. The good route running.

And the dreads.

100% agree. I've been telling people this after the first time I saw him play.

thunderkyss
09-16-2013, 02:36 PM
I think Roddy White with Boldin sprinkled in.

I'm thinking the same thing.

Fitzgerald is a beast with the ball in his hands. Roddy & Boldin, while they can get some YaC..... not in the same class as Fitz & Andre.

At least we haven't seen anything on that level yet.

thunderkyss
09-16-2013, 09:56 PM
Nuk...

Just doesn't sound as good as Nuke, right? I mean he's a football palyer, he's a badd a55. Nuke is more descriptive of what we want right?

I mean we could have

http://msrb.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/mushroom-cloud-hb.jpg

or this

http://www.nuk-usa.com/images/products/nuk/new2013/nuk_camo_orthodontic_pacifier_B.jpg


I'm just going to call him Nuke

Playoffs
09-16-2013, 10:26 PM
Nuk...

Just doesn't sound as good as Nuke, right?
It is pronounced "nuke", like nuclear: 10 things to know about DeAndre Hopkins (http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/2013/04/10-things-to-know-about-deandre-hopkins/)

steelbtexan
09-16-2013, 10:30 PM
Hopkins will have a better yr than Walter ever had. IMHO

Provided that he doesn't sustain yet another concussion.

Hopkins talent is undeniable though.

Uncle Rico
09-16-2013, 10:35 PM
Tennis rackets for hands, with stick em and Velcro all over them, almost like Spiderman the way he just contorts and then ;SNIKT: somehow just snags it. Cant teach that stuff, God given all the way.

Texan_Bill
09-16-2013, 10:39 PM
Tennis rackets for hands, with stick em and Velcro all over them, almost like Spiderman the way he just contorts and then ;SNIKT: somehow just snags it. Cant teach that stuff, God given all the way.

Uncle Rico.......

Only Tim Tebow has a worse release than you!!!! :pirate:

Texan_Bill
09-16-2013, 10:45 PM
Hopkins will have a better yr than Walter ever had. IMHO

Provided that he doesn't sustain yet another concussion.

Hopkins talent is undeniable though.

ABSOFREAKINLUTELY!!! I liked Kevin Walter BUT he was never the danger to defenses that this rookie is!!

This guy is a true threat! Kevin Walter was serviceable at best.

Concussions are a true concern, but AJ just sustained one. I imagine he'll be just fine!!


BTW, I wanna give Walter some props! He served his time here in Houston well!!

The Pencil Neck
09-17-2013, 12:02 AM
Hopkins will have a better yr than Walter ever had. IMHO

Provided that he doesn't sustain yet another concussion.

Hopkins talent is undeniable though.

When we first drafted Hopkins, my initial reaction was that he'd have a better year than the best year that KW ever had.

Then, I thought that might be too aggressive and too hopeful. I mean, that's a 60 catch, 899 yard season. And to give him his credit, KW had 3 games in his career where he caught more than Hopkins did in this game. But KW never had more than 1 100+ yard game in a season and they were kinda few and far between.

I have a feeling Hopkins is going to demolish that.

GuerillaBlack
09-17-2013, 01:09 AM
When we first drafted Hopkins, my initial reaction was that he'd have a better year than the best year that KW ever had.

Then, I thought that might be too aggressive and too hopeful. I mean, that's a 60 catch, 899 yard season. And to give him his credit, KW had 3 games in his career where he caught more than Hopkins did in this game. But KW never had more than 1 100+ yard game in a season and they were kinda few and far between.

I have a feeling Hopkins is going to demolish that.

Texans probably gonna have two 1000 yard receivers. Maybe two thousand yard rushers too.

ChampionTexan
09-17-2013, 01:14 AM
Nuk...

Just doesn't sound as good as Nuke, right? I mean he's a football palyer, he's a badd a55. Nuke is more descriptive of what we want right?

I mean we could have

http://msrb.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/mushroom-cloud-hb.jpg

or this

http://www.nuk-usa.com/images/products/nuk/new2013/nuk_camo_orthodontic_pacifier_B.jpg


I'm just going to call him Nuke

Well, if it makes you feel any better, his Twitter handle is "Nukdabomb".

ObsiWan
09-17-2013, 01:36 AM
It is pronounced "nuke", like nuclear: 10 things to know about DeAndre Hopkins (http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/2013/04/10-things-to-know-about-deandre-hopkins/)

Still, number 3 says...

3. When Hopkins was an infant, the only brand of pacifier he wanted was “Nuk.” His mother nicknamed him Nuk because of that and the nickname has stayed with him to this day. It’s pronounced “nuke.”

I can work with either meaning since (a) he catches bombs and (b) he seems to be making suckers out of opposing DBs.
:D

76Texan
09-17-2013, 02:12 AM
A good match for Schaub; a good catch radius .

I wish plenty of health to AJ and Hopkins both.

Playoffs
09-21-2013, 07:58 PM
Greatest expectations are those carried by Texans' Hopkins (http://www.houstonchronicle.com/sports/texans/article/Greatest-expectations-are-those-carried-by-4828814.php?t=536abb10e0d8ff4dd2)

...
They knew and believed. They just never thought it would happen this fast.

Tommy Plumblee's first lasting memory of DeAndre Hopkins: The Texans rookie wide receiver is a quiet, skinny 10th-grader at D.W. Daniel High School in Central, S.C. Yet Hopkins is already rare and unique - a deep thinker with a wondering young mind matched only by oversized hands.

"People around the country are getting to see what we got to see on Friday nights," said Plumblee, a former Lions defensive coach and now the school's athletic director.

For the next two years, Jeff Scott heard about the Friday nights. But there was an even better Hopkins profile: a basketball artist who doubled as a defensive back/wide receiver and played just down the road from Clemson University.

"He was already a legend," said Scott, the Tigers' wide receivers coach.

After triple-extra large hands pulled down a 3-yard fade pass from quarterback Matt Schaub for a game-winning touchdown Sunday in the Texans' 30-24 overtime victory over the Titans at Reliant Stadium, Hopkins' 21-year-old name began to ring out in the NFL.

The same traits that awed his high school and college coaches - a highly athletic but graceful and contortable body; a small-town, down-home personality, rooted in familial pride and tragedy; a brain that never stops exploring and a work ethic to match - have become the foundation for looped highlight reels on "Monday Night Football," "SportsCenter" and the NFL Network.

The No. 27 overall pick of the 2013 draft has overcome a preseason concussion and the all-eyes-on-me pressure of lining up next to veteran wideout Andre Johnson, a likely Hall of Famer. After collecting a game-high 117 yards on seven receptions in just his second pro contest, Hopkins declared he can be better than Johnson - and he modestly and respectfully made the words make sense.

"We nicknamed him 'Superman' for a reason," said Randy Robinson, D.W. Daniel's football coach. "The joke around our coaching staff was he just had to go into the phone booth for the Texans."

Visionary on hardwood

The Lions didn't know who Hopkins was supposed to be when he arrived at D.W. Daniel.

Hopkins' first sports home was the hardwood. His long hands were built to dominate a basketball...

TheMatrix31
09-21-2013, 09:21 PM
Nothing's "happened this fast."

It's been two games.

Two. ****ing. Games.

drs23
09-22-2013, 10:08 AM
Nothing's "happened this fast."

It's been two games.

Two. ****ing. Games.

Whuut? "It's been two games." What's that mean? Nuk is faking it? The young man looks like all of the Real Deal to me. What are you asking him to do? All game, every game heroics? Or what?

I'm not following your sentiment at all. But alas, this is not the first time.

HJam72
09-22-2013, 10:12 AM
You guys do realize it's Nuke's fault we didn't win the Superbowl last year, right?

Because he wasn't here.

thunderkyss
09-22-2013, 12:13 PM
You guys do realize it's Nuke's fault we didn't win the Superbowl last year, right?

Because he wasn't here.

First in to correct the rookie's nickname.


Ahem, it's Nuk... The pacifier, not the bomb.

:kitten:

CloakNNNdagger
10-25-2013, 01:43 PM
Top rookie NFL receiver so far. But just like Keenum, he isn't satisfied with his play.

But the 21-year-old from Clemson remains his harshest critic.

“I give myself a two of out 10,” Hopkins said when asked to grade his performance through the bye.

Why the low mark?

“Because,” he said. “I could do a lot better.”

Hopkins is second in the NFL in receptions among rookies with 28 and is first in yards with 416. He also has two touchdown catches. Hopkins is the first player with his stat line through seven games since A.J. Green in 2011 and is the 14th player since 1960.

But those statistics didn’t change anything for the rookie.

“Numbers don’t reflect the wins that we have,” he said. “We got two wins, so I give myself a two out of 10.”

Being tough on himself is nothing new for the rookie. After the first preseason game, he was overly critical, saying he wasn’t where he wanted to be.

And that hasn’t changed during the season.

Hopkins, while sitting at his locker on Tuesday, the last day players had media availability, said he’s been replaying the third down play from early in the third quarter against the Chiefs in his head.

With the ball inside the 5-yard line, Case Keenum threw a fade to Hopkins in the end zone. The rookie went up for the ball, had it briefly, but cornerback Marcus Cooper knocked it away at the last second.

“Any ball I touch my hands on, I should catch it,” he said. “Good defense by the defender. My motto is if the ball touches my hands, I should catch it and I didn’t catch it.”link (http://www.csnhouston.com/football-houston-texans/talk/bye-hopkins-still-his-harshest-critic)

JCTexan
10-25-2013, 03:35 PM
“Any ball I touch my hands on, I should catch it,” he said. “Good defense by the defender. My motto is if the ball touches my hands, I should catch it and I didn’t catch it.”

That's the type of motto you want your receivers to have.

thunderkyss
10-25-2013, 05:09 PM
Top rookie NFL receiver so far. But just like Keenum, he isn't satisfied with his play.
Hopkins is second in the NFL in receptions among rookies with 28 and is first in yards with 416. He also has two touchdown catches. Hopkins is the first player with his stat line through seven games since A.J. Green in 2011 and is the 14th player since 1960.
link (http://www.csnhouston.com/football-houston-texans/talk/bye-hopkins-still-his-harshest-critic)


Good to know he isn't comparing himself to rookies.

Playoffs
10-25-2013, 06:14 PM
We haven't scratched the surface yet on DHop. Wait until we get a QB who knows how to "throw a receiver open". Add in some back shoulder passes. He's not going to be the best WR in the NFL, but he can be top 10 with a QB. He's made a lot of little mistakes, but still shining through pretty darn good.

Master your craft, grasshopper... master your craft. :fostering:

Vance87
10-25-2013, 06:19 PM
And he's doing all of it with shoddy QB play.

Dishman
10-25-2013, 08:37 PM
That's the type of motto you want your receivers to have.

I imagine this gets ingrained in many receivers heads early on. In HS all we ever heard as receivers is "if you can you touch you can catch it". 20 years later it has stuck with me.

CloakNNNdagger
10-25-2013, 09:01 PM
I imagine this gets ingrained in many receivers heads early on. In HS all we ever heard as receivers is "if you can you touch you can catch it". 20 years later it has stuck with me.

Sort of like VD, huh?

Carr Bombed
10-26-2013, 12:41 AM
That's the type of motto you want your receivers to have.

Any NFL receiver worth his salt who is able to get both his hands on a ball will tell you he should make the catch. Was the pass perfect, no, but that's picking at straws.. it was good enough and QBs don't always make perfect passes, sometimes you just have to make a play for your QB. This comment has nothing to do with what I think about Hopkins' ability as Andre doesn't even always make the play. I'm sure Hopkins will make plenty of tougher catches in the future, it just didn't happen this time.

This kid is going to seamlessly slip into the #1 role once Andre hangs up the cleats.. he gets it. Every receiver believes they should make the catch, but not every receiver is willing to come out and say it and put blame on themselves. Plenty will point fingers elsewhere or say nothing at all. The fact that this kid is truly down in the dumps for not making a great catch, on what was a great play by the DB, is what is going to make him a great receiver going forward. :) Out of what is now looking like a crappy draft, we definitely nailed this pick

TexansSeminole
10-26-2013, 01:11 AM
This kid is going to seamlessly slip into the #1 role once Andre hangs up the cleats.. he gets it. Every receiver believes they should make the catch, but not every receiver is willing to come out and say it and put blame on themselves. Plenty will point fingers elsewhere or say nothing at all. The fact that this kid is truly down in the dumps for not making a great catch, on what was a great play by the DB, is what is going to make him a great receiver going forward. :) Out of what is now looking like a crappy draft, we definitely nailed this pick

He's definitely a special player. Everyone in the NFL has ability, some guys have more of it. Hopkins is blessed with great ability, but he also has drive and the attitude that often is the difference between a good player and a great player. I'm excited to have him as a Texan.

Vance87
10-26-2013, 01:25 AM
WEAKNESSES: lacks track speed and won’t be able to leave NFL defenders in his dust vertically or win with speed alone…

http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_images/2013/10/20/KeenumTD.gif

Boosh.

TexansSeminole
10-26-2013, 02:44 AM
http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_images/2013/10/20/KeenumTD.gif

Boosh.

He honestly pushed off there but your point still stands. His has good enough speed to beat people.

Carr Bombed
10-26-2013, 03:11 AM
He honestly pushed off there but your point still stands. His has good enough speed to beat people.

Michael Irvin had a HOF career doing that. He called it "creating space" and was a master of it as he also wasn't the fastest guy. The thing about offensive players is people read to much into their 40 times.. 40 times matter more in defensive players as they need to be more reactive. The offensive player already knows what he wants to run and where he's going to run before the play is even snapped (proactive) and that's accounts for a good one tenth of a second (advantage is always to the offense).

His long strides and route running eats up ground (ala Foster). The guy flat out has a uncanny ability to get open and the ability to create a window. (route running, which is a VERY RARE commodity with young WRs.. that's usually the last battle and he already has it.) He just needs a QB who can recognize when he's open before Andre goes out with a injury...

P.S. Andre needs the same type of QB.. hence why a HOF type of WR has never recorded a single double digit TD season in his career... which will be his biggest knock if he comes up short of HOF recognition. Andre has played with crap QBs when you think about it.. think of his prime.. think of his prime with a QB like Brees, Brady, or Brees.. think about that for a second. It
s sad.

Dishman
10-26-2013, 08:09 AM
Sort of like VD, huh?

LOL! Yeah, pretty much.

CloakNNNdagger
10-26-2013, 10:23 AM
Michael Irvin had a HOF career doing that. He called it "creating space" and was a master of it as he also wasn't the fastest guy. The thing about offensive players is people read to much into their 40 times.. 40 times matter more in defensive players as they need to be more reactive. The offensive player already knows what he wants to run and where he's going to run before the play is even snapped (proactive) and that's accounts for a good one tenth of a second (advantage is always to the offense).

His long strides and route running eats up ground (ala Foster). The guy flat out has a uncanny ability to get open and the ability to create a window. (route running, which is a VERY RARE commodity with young WRs.. that's usually the last battle and he already has it.) He just needs a QB who can recognize when he's open before Andre goes out with a injury...

P.S. Andre needs the same type of QB.. hence why a HOF type of WR has never recorded a single double digit TD season in his career... which will be his biggest knock if he comes up short of HOF recognition. Andre has played with crap QBs when you think about it.. think of his prime.. think of his prime with a QB like Brees, Brady, or Brees.. think about that for a second. It
s sad.




The 40 Yard Dash can be broken down into 3 distinct parts: the Drive, the Transition, and Top Speed. The Drive is basically the first 7 steps or so right off the line. Good form is to explode out of the line at a 45 degree angle. Bad form is to jump straight up, and then run forward. The Transition is the middle part of the sprint. This phase is kind of like 2nd-4th gear in a car. You are basically just trying to get up to top speed.

Top Speed is a little bit of a misnomer because sprinters usually cannot achieve top speed in 40 yards. Most athletes don't reach maximum top speed until at least 55 yards. For this reason, good form is to pretend like you are running a 60 yard dash so that you are continuing to accelerate THROUGH the finish line. This fact explains why some players have what is called "deep speed". Some players like Terrell Owens may not have been fast between 0-40 yards, but between 40-60 yards they start to run past cornerbacks. And this is another reason why Usain Bolt's (the Jamiacan world class sprinter) top speed of 27 miles per hour occurs AFTER the first 40 yards.

So for WRs, it is many times much more important what they can do AFTER 40 yds.

If you ask most people, "Why does the NFL use the 40 yd time to evaluate players........where did it come from?", they won't be able to tell you. Well, certainly the 40 yard dash has long been a way of evaluating the speed of football players by scouts for the NFL Draft..........and the origin actually comes from the average distance of a punt being ~40 yards.

76Texan
10-26-2013, 01:29 PM
He honestly pushed off there but your point still stands. His has good enough speed to beat people.

Somewhere fifteen yards or so beyond the LOS, Hopkins turned to look at the ball. It looks to me like he was selling the CB an intermediate route. This is the normal break where the receiver can either go inside or outside.
The CB bought it too; he turned and looked at the ball.
Undoubtedly, in doing so, he lost some speed and got beat as Hopkins only one thought in mind, and that was going deep.
IMO, this is why it doesn't pay for the DB to try to locate the ball when he doesn't have the route "secured" yet.

michaelm
10-26-2013, 04:09 PM
He's on apace for around 64 catches for 955 yards this year and 4-5 TDS.
If you'd have asked me at the beginning of the season if I'd take that, the answer would have been hell yes.

thunderkyss
10-26-2013, 04:46 PM
He's on apace for around 64 catches for 955 yards this year and 4-5 TDS.
If you'd have asked me at the beginning of the season if I'd take that, the answer would have been hell yes.

If Schaub is out of the picture, then all of our "conservative" predictions can go out the window as well. The 30 catch predictions were predicated more on Schaub than the rookie.

infantrycak
10-26-2013, 05:06 PM
If Schaub is out of the picture, then all of our "conservative" predictions can go out the window as well. The 30 catch predictions were predicated more on Schaub than the rookie.

And didn't prove to be reality when Schaub was in there either.

With Schaub, Hopkins was on pace for 87 rec., 101 tgts and 907 yds.

thunderkyss
10-26-2013, 05:08 PM
And didn't prove to be reality when Schaub was in there either.

True.

Rey
10-26-2013, 05:49 PM
He honestly pushed off there but your point still stands. His has good enough speed to beat people.

Must have not been that bad...The corner wasn't complaining...

klockWork
10-26-2013, 05:54 PM
Somewhere fifteen yards or so beyond the LOS, Hopkins turned to look at the ball. It looks to me like he was selling the CB an intermediate route. This is the normal break where the receiver can either go inside or outside.
The CB bought it too; he turned and looked at the ball.
Undoubtedly, in doing so, he lost some speed and got beat as Hopkins only one thought in mind, and that was going deep.
IMO, this is why it doesn't pay for the DB to try to locate the ball when he doesn't have the route "secured" yet.

I rather have our DB play the ball everytime for a couple of reasons :
1) If the pass is under thrown you give yourself a chance for an int or at least a PD.
2) If under thrown you eliminate yourself from PI.
If it's a perfectly thrown pass like the Hopkins then you pretty much screw anyway. Tip your hat to them and force them to do it again.

Being a great defensive team means forcing the offense to play a perfect game to beat you. If the QB is having issues with his accuracy then you don't bail them out with pass interference. (Looking at you, Kareem Jackson.)

thunderkyss
10-26-2013, 06:44 PM
I rather have our DB play the ball everytime for a couple of reasons :

Unless the corner is beat, he should be looking for the ball. In that situation, the corner failed to locate the ball.

If he's beat, the corner needs to play the hands, looking for the ball is only going to get him more beat.

But I see '76s point. The receiver still has to make the catch if that CB stayed on his man, he would have had an opportunity to prevent Hopkins from making the catch.... the ball was placed very well, he had no shot there. But if he were close enough to tackle Hopkins, DeAndre may not have maintained possession, or even a push.... Hopkins would have had a tougher time getting both feet down.

But since that guy got lost looking for the ball, DeAndre caught it unchallenged.

76Texan
10-26-2013, 07:37 PM
At least, get last the 17-18 yards cut-off where the receiver's cut is in effect.
At that point, the DB can be sure that it's a deep route; in the meantime, the DB can try to squeeze the receiver a little more toward the sideline.

klockWork
10-26-2013, 07:51 PM
since that guy got lost looking for the ball, DeAndre caught it unchallenged.

That's a gamble worth taking. Their cb force our QB to make a perfect pass which Hopkins caught it in full stride. Even if Smith ran with him all the way he would still have to time his play on the ball or his man, and not knowing where or when Hopkins would raise his hands would make the task that much more difficult.

Being stride for stride with a receiver doesn't guarantee a DB can make a play if he doesn't know where or when the ball would come down. At least if he played the ball the only way he get beat is by a perfect pass. If he play his man he can get beat by a well-placed pass, he could get beat by him suddenly stopping and jumping back to get the ball, OR get beat by being called for running into the receiver.

In the NFL a deep pass hitting a receiver in full stride is very rare. Either the ball it's over or under thrown. In this league a DB has to use that number in his favor by playing the ball.

klockWork
10-26-2013, 08:09 PM
If you look at all or most of the top corners in the NFL ie; Revis or Sherman most their pass break ups are from them playing the ball. BTW, the separation that Hopkins got from Smith was not just by because the cb lost the ball, it's by the rookie hitting it in fourth gear. Dude has back pocket speed. He will be a beast.

thunderkyss
10-26-2013, 10:18 PM
That's a gamble worth taking.

Being stride for stride with a receiver doesn't guarantee a DB can make a play if he doesn't know where or when the ball would come down. At least if he played the ball the only way he get beat is by a perfect pass. If he play his man he can get beat by a well-placed pass, he could get beat by him suddenly stopping and jumping back to get the ball, OR get beat by being called for running into the receiver.


I'd be irate if that was one of our CBs. Unless a safety totally blew his responsibility, there's no way he should have allowed Hop to get behind him like that.

He's beat.

If he's beat he needs to be working on catching up, not looking for an underthrown ball.

Again..... I don't have a problem with a DB playing the ball, unless he's beat. If he is beat, he has no business looking for the ball.

Time for gambling is over. At the time that guy looked for the ball he's hoping the QB doesn't see this wide open guy in the end zone.

thunderkyss
04-21-2014, 11:40 AM
Just trying to get this discussion out of the Swearinger thread.

I guess you didn't watch many Viking games then. He was more impressive in every way over Hopkins. Plenty of nice plays from scrimmage and for extra credit you can enjoy the rac that Hopkins only dreams about at 2:17 where he takes the pitch lined up as a rb from the I formation and scores. Reality and versitility trumps imagination.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1Y9Tee8vbs

I guess it all depends on what you're looking for from your players.

So far, I don't see Cordarrelle Patterson as a WR. That's fine, he was a rookie & normally it takes a while for a rookie to establish himself as a WR.

I am old school & to me, a WR is your deep threats, I want to see 14+ ypc. It doesn't matter to me whether it's YAC, or just catching the ball 14+ yards down the field.

Well, Wes Welker doesn't get a 14+ ypc, never has, & he's clearly a WR...

So clearly there are exceptions to the rule. But I'd never acquire Wes Welker, consistently line him up outside & expect him to stretch the field.

Maybe Patterson can become that type of player, but there aren't a lot of those guys that are successful in the NFL for very long... I wouldn't use a first round pick on them. Darren Sproles & Wes Welker are the only two that I would consider as successful over a long period of time. You've got Percy Harvin & Dexter McCluster, but they've got to put some time in... & I'd really like to see Wes Welker continue his streak outside of New England, because while he was a great role player in Miami, I never thought he would have the success he had, or become that focal point of an offense like he did in New England.

So yeah, if you're looking for a Percy Harvin type football player, Patterson is probably that guy & he had a great rookie season being that guy. But if you're looking for a WR, someone to stretch the field & make the defense honor every blade of grass... DeAndre is much better at that than Percy Harvin (which would be like having a running back with 500 yards receiving... but if we get a healthy Arian back... )

thunderkyss
04-21-2014, 11:53 AM
They also have/had guys with world class speed to stretch the field. (Moss/Bethel Johnson/Slater etc.... Who is currently on the roster with that kind of speed at any position including ST's? Johnson was a gunner/KR/PR guy. Slater is one of the best ST's guys in the NFL.

Also the Pats have had a RB in each of the 5 yr cycles that are very fast and contribute on ST's Faulk/Woodhead/Vereen.

So yes, the Pats have a system but they adapt their system to fit their players. This is the reason I think a Sims/Archer would be great fits in BOB's offense.

I don't know about that. Seems like you're saying they adapt the production they get out of the players... WRs stretch the field, with the exception of Welker, who was used more like a Joker TE...

To me, if you've got an offense where your best WR averages less than 13 ypc, then you've got a problem at WR. They aren't performing their function. We were looking for someone who would force the secondary to think about someone other than Andre Johnson. DeAndre does that. Patterson may be able to do that & in our system, maybe he would have. But his performance in 2013 doesn't lead you to believe that.

In the future, if his numbers get closer to 13 ypc then I'll say we made a mistake (if DeAndre's numbers fall).

But you're right, it depends on what you want from the players you pick.

Vance87
04-21-2014, 01:46 PM
Why is this the only thread in archive? :thinking:

steelbtexan
04-25-2014, 12:48 AM
I don't know about that. Seems like you're saying they adapt the production they get out of the players... WRs stretch the field, with the exception of Welker, who was used more like a Joker TE...

To me, if you've got an offense where your best WR averages less than 13 ypc, then you've got a problem at WR. They aren't performing their function. We were looking for someone who would force the secondary to think about someone other than Andre Johnson. DeAndre does that. Patterson may be able to do that & in our system, maybe he would have. But his performance in 2013 doesn't lead you to believe that.

In the future, if his numbers get closer to 13 ypc then I'll say we made a mistake (if DeAndre's numbers fall).

But you're right, it depends on what you want from the players you pick.

I want players other teams fear.

Do defenses really fear Hopkins?

Do they fear Patterson ?

leebigeztx
05-06-2014, 06:30 PM
I want players other teams fear.

Do defenses really fear Hopkins?

Do they fear Patterson ?

They don't fear patterson either. To me, Hunter is that dude. He's a tall,fast guy with hands. He will never probably be a 90rec guys,but he will be a 70 rec 1200 yd type.

HJam72
05-07-2014, 02:12 AM
I want players other teams fear.

Do defenses really fear Hopkins?

Do they fear Patterson ?

If we get a QB that will throw him a good fade pass in the endzone, they dang sure will. Schaub's unwillingness to look for him (often enough) in this regard was probably part of his downfall.

bash
05-19-2014, 03:08 PM
any updates? i know aj isnt happy, so now he must ve zat number von

Vinnie
05-19-2014, 03:24 PM
Deandre is a grown man, and I'm sure will take a hold of the situation in his own hands.

Hervoyel
05-19-2014, 03:40 PM
Yeah, he's an adult and hopefully he'll take hold of the situation in his own hands..... and this time it won't end up in a picture posted to twitter.