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View Full Version : Texans agree to terms with CB McCain


Lurvinator11
03-19-2013, 10:09 PM
Per McClain

John McClain ‏@McClain_on_NFL 3m
Texans have agreed to terms with CB Brice McCain

Good. I liked him.

DX-TEX
03-19-2013, 10:19 PM
Brice McCain ‏@McCain21 12m
Thank you to my agent @davidcanter I just agreed to terms on a new 3 year deal to remain with @houstontexans

Yep

TEXANRED
03-19-2013, 10:20 PM
Thank God!

tru80texan
03-19-2013, 10:30 PM
One of the players I felt that the Texans already had his replacement on the team. Brandon Harris showed flashes when given the opportunity & I believe he has some potential. Harris is a former 2nd round pick that the Texans need to figure out what they got in him before his rookie contract is up in a few years. I think McCain gets in the way of that. Can't say I'm overly excited about this move, but at least the Texans have a pulse during this FA period.

TEXANRED
03-19-2013, 10:35 PM
One of the players I felt that the Texans already had his replacement on the team. Brandon Harris showed flashes when given the opportunity & I believe he has some potential. Harris is a former 2nd round pick that the Texans need to figure out what they got in him before his rookie contract is up in a few years. I think McCain gets in the way of that. Can't say I'm overly excited about this move, but at least the Texans have a pulse during this FA period.

Brandon Harris couldn't carry McCain's helmet. Harris is a wash/bust, whatever you wanna call him. McCain was extremely important to sign.

WolverineFan
03-19-2013, 10:45 PM
One of the players I felt that the Texans already had his replacement on the team. Brandon Harris showed flashes when given the opportunity & I believe he has some potential. Harris is a former 2nd round pick that the Texans need to figure out what they got in him before his rookie contract is up in a few years. I think McCain gets in the way of that. Can't say I'm overly excited about this move, but at least the Texans have a pulse during this FA period.

Harris was awful last year. McCain is one of the better slot CB's in the league.

Allstar
03-19-2013, 10:52 PM
Dat corner market

mussop
03-19-2013, 10:52 PM
One of the players I felt that the Texans already had his replacement on the team. Brandon Harris showed flashes when given the opportunity & I believe he has some potential. Harris is a former 2nd round pick that the Texans need to figure out what they got in him before his rookie contract is up in a few years. I think McCain gets in the way of that. Can't say I'm overly excited about this move, but at least the Texans have a pulse during this FA period.

Frank Bush is that you? :wadepalm:


You're worried about a guy playing because of where he was drafted? :cheese: McCain is clearly the better player.

tru80texan
03-19-2013, 10:54 PM
Brandon Harris couldn't carry McCain's helmet. Harris is a wash/bust, whatever you wanna call him. McCain was extremely important to sign.

Harris was awful last year. McCain is one of the better slot CB's in the league.

McCain had 1 good season in 2011 & had issues of his own last season. He wasn't nearly as good last season as he was in 2011. Prior to 2011 McCain was a complete disaster in 2010 right behind KJ. Based on that, I think it's a bit of an exaggeration to call him 1 of the best based on 1 good season.

Harris got limited playing time last season & still showed some potential. Calling him a bust after very limited playing time is a bit premature & foolish IMO. I also believe it's a bit of a double standard when Kareem played below par for 2 seasons w/ tons of playing time & countless excuses were made for him & here we are throwing Harris under the bus after 2 seasons & very little playing time. That math doesn't add up & it will take more then very limited playing time in 2 seasons before I deem him a bust. If that was the case, Kareem & McCain should've been declared busts & benched a long time ago.

tru80texan
03-19-2013, 10:59 PM
Frank Bush is that you? :wadepalm:


You're worried about a guy playing because of where he was drafted? :cheese: McCain is clearly the better player.

Draft position is what got Kareem his playing time despite being a complete disaster his rookie season. Acting as if that is not a factor in certain situations is foolishness.

I said the Texans need to figure out what they got in Harris & he needs an opportunity to prove it. Yes, he was a 2nd rounder & the Texans may have wasted it if they dont figure out what they got. I thought he showed flashes of potential & think he could get better if he gets on the field. Its not that difficult to understand.

76Texan
03-19-2013, 11:09 PM
What does it matter?
The guy that shows more consistency in practice will play more.
There will be time when all 4 CBs find the field at the same time.
There will be time when JJo and KJax need a breather.
There's always a chance for injury and right now McCain has more experience on the outside (both in colllege and in the pros).
We can use them both, along with Carmichael too.
They will all see ST snaps as well.

mussop
03-19-2013, 11:11 PM
Draft position is what got Kareem his playing time despite being a complete disaster his rookie season. Acting as if that is not a factor in certain situations is foolishness.

I said the Texans need to figure out what they got in Harris & he needs an opportunity to prove it. Yes, he was a 2nd rounder & the Texans may have wasted it if they dont figure out what they got. I thought he showed flashes of potential & think he could get better if he gets on the field. Its not that difficult to understand.

just because they did it with jackson doesn't mean it was the right thing to do. His sorry play cost us at least a couple of games. He should of been benched but we had a ****ty DC that thought like you.

I don't know what you THOUGHT you saw but apparently no one else here nor one of the best DC's in the NFL seen it. If so don't you think he would of been on the field more considering how bad (YOU THOUGHT) McCain played?

There is OTA's and training camp. If Harris wants to see the field more he needs to earn it there. It's not that hard to understand.

False Start
03-19-2013, 11:12 PM
Good deal, glad to be able to keep him.

WolverineFan
03-19-2013, 11:12 PM
McCain had 1 good season in 2011 & had issues of his own last season. He wasn't nearly as good last season as he was in 2011. Prior to 2011 McCain was a complete disaster in 2010 right behind KJ. Based on that, I think it's a bit of an exaggeration to call him 1 of the best based on 1 good season.

Harris got limited playing time last season & still showed some potential. Calling him a bust after very limited playing time is a bit premature & foolish IMO. I also believe it's a bit of a double standard when Kareem played below par for 2 seasons w/ tons of playing time & countless excuses were made for him & here we are throwing Harris under the bus after 2 seasons & very little playing time. That math doesn't add up & it will take more then very limited playing time in 2 seasons before I deem him a bust. If that was the case, Kareem & McCain should've been declared busts & benched a long time ago.

That's because he was playing outside. He was rated as the top slot CB in the league in 2011. Last year he wasn't rated as good because he played outside half the time with Joseph being in and out of the lineup.

Playing Nickel and lining up outside on a #1 or #2 WR is completely different. He's very good at what he does.

powda
03-19-2013, 11:14 PM
I'd say i'm happy about this but I want to hear numbers first.

Lucky
03-19-2013, 11:16 PM
McCain>>>Harris.

Still, I would like the Texans to look for a CB on the 3rd day of the draft. It's a pretty deep draft for corners.

greekdbag
03-19-2013, 11:34 PM
Could Harris be the third safety now? I remember them talking about getting him reps at safety last year.

bhsman
03-20-2013, 12:02 AM
IIRC Harris had some good plays at some points late in the season. Being asked to cover Wes Welker as a rookie probably earns you some leniency.

Lucky
03-20-2013, 12:07 AM
IIRC Harris had some good plays at some points late in the season. Being asked to cover Wes Welker as a rookie probably earns you some leniency.
Harris was in his 2nd year in 2012.

imatexan
03-20-2013, 12:38 AM
Good news just for the fact that Harris moved down a spot and hopefully is gone, he is terrible.

Mari-OWNED!
03-20-2013, 12:58 AM
ITT: Fans writing off Brandon Harris after just two seasons. Spending his rookie year on the bench, and his sophomore season in only limited action.

Obviously as of now McCain is the better corner, but to criticize Harris at this point in his career is laughable. Cornerback at the NFL level is one position that takes a lot of development for them to grow, and the best way develop is playing time. All I'm saying is give the guy a chance before you crucify him. There's a reason rookies sign four-year contracts.

On topic: Love the re-sign of McCain. In today's NFL you have to have at least three good corners and nickel corners are becoming a valuable commodity.

bhsman
03-20-2013, 01:10 AM
Harris was in his 2nd year in 2012.

Whoops, my bad.

Scooter
03-20-2013, 06:18 AM
good signing. you cant have too many good corners in today's game and mccain's a solid #3, as well as bringing a ton of speed to the position. much like others, i didnt see very many positives from harris and wouldnt be comfortable with him being a step away from starting.

Lucky
03-20-2013, 06:55 AM
ITT: Fans writing off Brandon Harris after just two seasons. Spending his rookie year on the bench, and his sophomore season in only limited action.

Obviously as of now McCain is the better corner, but to criticize Harris at this point in his career is laughable. Cornerback at the NFL level is one position that takes a lot of development for them to grow, and the best way develop is playing time. All I'm saying is give the guy a chance before you crucify him. There's a reason rookies sign four-year contracts.
I'm happy to bring you such amusement. But if a player can't make it in two years (aside from QBs), he's probably not going to make it. Richard Sherman came out of the same draft as Harris (3 rounds later) and is an All Pro. Harris came out of a big time program and wasn't drafted as a project. He doesn't have the tools that are worth waiting on. Harris is a back end of the roster player who the Texans spent a 2nd round pick on. I don't think it's all that funny.

thunderkyss
03-20-2013, 07:10 AM
He doesn't have the tools that are worth waiting on. Harris is a back end of the roster player who the Texans spent a 2nd round pick on. I don't think it's all that funny.

I was quite pleased with what I saw from Harris. I think he's got the tools to be a star.

TEXANRED
03-20-2013, 07:17 AM
I'm happy to bring you such amusement. But if a player can't make it in two years (aside from QBs), he's probably not going to make it. Richard Sherman came out of the same draft as Harris (3 rounds later) and is an All Pro. Harris came out of a big time program and wasn't drafted as a project. He doesn't have the tools that are worth waiting on. Harris is a back end of the roster player who the Texans spent a 2nd round pick on. I don't think it's all that funny.

Rick Smith: 6 drafts, 47 picks, 11 of those picks are CB's, of those 11 picks 2 have been able to be productive (KJ/McCain).

What kills me is we rely on signing FA's to fill our starter spots (JJO, Manning, Pollard, Allen, etc) despite the fact that Rick Smith has drafted CB's 23% of the time.

Lucky
03-20-2013, 07:17 AM
I was quite pleased with what I saw from Harris. I think he's got the tools to be a star.
That doesn't surprise me.

TEXANRED
03-20-2013, 07:18 AM
I was quite pleased with what I saw from Harris. I think he's got the tools to be a star.

You should tell him to bring his tools with him to work and stop forgetting them at home in his garage.

panamamyers
03-20-2013, 07:23 AM
I think the guys that are writing off Harris probably wrote off McCain when he was getting torched by the Jets and everyone else in 2010.
Harris showed marked improvement, and he was actually right close to average by the end of the year. He made a couple of good plays on the ball, and he was pretty much always at least in the area and very close to making a play.

I guess we will never find out now though about Harris.

TEXANRED
03-20-2013, 07:25 AM
I think the guys that are writing off Harris probably wrote off McCain when he was getting torched by the Jets and everyone else in 2010.
Harris showed marked improvement, and he was actually right close to average by the end of the year. He made a couple of good plays on the ball, and he was pretty much always at least in the area and very close to making a play.

I guess we will never find out now though about Harris.

A broken watch is right twice a day.

IDEXAN
03-20-2013, 07:42 AM
I'm thinking that McCain was one of the Texans' FAs who was definitely gone this off season, and now it turns out he's one of the few to resign and return to Houston.
But only 26 and just a 6th round pick back in 2009, this guy is value personified.
Matter of fact, with Glover Quin in the 4th round along with John Casey in the 5th, that 2009 Draft scored for the Texans with several value picks.

TexanSam
03-20-2013, 07:52 AM
For all the credit we give Wade Phillips for fixing the defense, he, Rick Smith, and Gary Kubiak have done a terrible job in drafting secondary players. Brandon Harris, Roc Carmichael, Shiloh Keo in 2011. Sherrick McManis, Fred Bennett, Brandon Harrison, Antwuan Molden are other busts that come to mind. KJ, Glover Quin, and Brice McCain are the only quality secondary players we've hit on.

panamamyers
03-20-2013, 07:55 AM
He's no longer a value though. They paid him well I am sure.
This is why I am glad they let Quin and Casey go.

You need value on the team. You can't pick guys and get a good value for what you pay them, and then end up paying them all what they are worth on their next contract. Not enough room under the salary cap for that.

They kind of did the same with Owen Daniels to me. They go from being a good value, to being overpaid in a sense. Hopefully letting Casey and Quin walk means they have changed their thinking on this type of stuff.

deucetx
03-20-2013, 07:57 AM
I think some of you are exaggerating or living off McCain's 2011 season. It's like I said in another thread, so far everyone in our secondary was good or great last season if we went by the board here yet our secondary got lit up like a Christmas tree. Sorry but that doesn't add up.

McCain had an awful 2012 season. And no, it had little to do with him playing outside. Joseph missed two games (Lions, Titans). Ball started the Lions game and McCain tried to start Titans game but that's the one he got injured and only had like 20 snaps. So no, his bad season was in the slot.

Put it like this:

2011: 45.5 rating, 47.1 catch% 0TD's allowed 2 interceptions 4.9 YAC Avg.
2012: 95.9 rating, 56.4 catch% 3TD's allowed 1 interception 21.5 YAC Avg.

So yeah...he was bad in 2012. It was night and day to 2011. For comparison sake here is Brandon Harris since folks are ripping him left and right but praising McCain:

2012: 95.5 rating, 50.0 catch% 1TD allowed 0 interceptions 17.43 YAC Avg.

Sorry but his numbers aren't too much different than McCain last year. They are actually slightly better and this from a kid that didn't get as many snaps come practice time and faced Brady and Luck twice. Does it mean Harris is better than McCain? No, not necessarily. He was in 2012. But writing him off while praising the other guy's last season is a stretch. It's good we signed McCain but I hope it wasn't too much as he should have to fight for his job if he can't revert to the 2011 form.

The secondary wasn't that good guys and as much as Joseph's injury is brought up no one in the secondary played better than he did except Kareem.

bckey
03-20-2013, 08:28 AM
For all the credit we give Wade Phillips for fixing the defense, he, Rick Smith, and Gary Kubiak have done a terrible job in drafting secondary players. Brandon Harris, Roc Carmichael, Shiloh Keo in 2011. Sherrick McManis, Fred Bennett, Brandon Harrison, Antwuan Molden are other busts that come to mind. KJ, Glover Quin, and Brice McCain are the only quality secondary players we've hit on.

I think we have to assign some of the bad secondary drafting to the scouting department. I'm no Rick Smith fan but he is only part of the problem.

Dutchrudder
03-20-2013, 08:39 AM
That's because he was playing outside. He was rated as the top slot CB in the league in 2011. Last year he wasn't rated as good because he played outside half the time with Joseph being in and out of the lineup.

Playing Nickel and lining up outside on a #1 or #2 WR is completely different. He's very good at what he does.

^ This.

And let's not throw in the towel on Brandon Harris yet. KJ looked terrible for his first two years too, but then again he was going against better competition on a regular basis.

badboy
03-20-2013, 08:50 AM
McCain had 1 good season in 2011 & had issues of his own last season. He wasn't nearly as good last season as he was in 2011. Prior to 2011 McCain was a complete disaster in 2010 right behind KJ. Based on that, I think it's a bit of an exaggeration to call him 1 of the best based on 1 good season.

Harris got limited playing time last season & still showed some potential. Calling him a bust after very limited playing time is a bit premature & foolish IMO. I also believe it's a bit of a double standard when Kareem played below par for 2 seasons w/ tons of playing time & countless excuses were made for him & here we are throwing Harris under the bus after 2 seasons & very little playing time. That math doesn't add up & it will take more then very limited playing time in 2 seasons before I deem him a bust. If that was the case, Kareem & McCain should've been declared busts & benched a long time ago.Excellent post! I am shocked that McCain did not move on and with all the wild offers out there for FAs, I thought he was gone. His 2012 reminds me somewhat of Barwin's.

thunderkyss
03-20-2013, 09:15 AM
I think the guys that are writing off Harris probably wrote off McCain when he was getting torched by the Jets and everyone else in 2010.
Harris showed marked improvement, and he was actually right close to average by the end of the year. He made a couple of good plays on the ball, and he was pretty much always at least in the area and very close to making a play.

I guess we will never find out now though about Harris.

He was also pretty physical with guys like Reggie Wayne, which I think shows toughness & that he's not "starstruck"

If McCain starts over Harris, I'd be surprised.

badboy
03-20-2013, 09:21 AM
I'd rather not carve up Texans but hope all do well. McCain is better than a lower round draft pick or any FA we would get so glad he is on roster.

Playoffs
03-20-2013, 10:02 AM
Brice McCain was rated 104 out of 113 CBs overall in 2012 (>25% of team snaps.) His coverage rating is what hurt him, putting him at 107th. His rush, run, and penalty ratings were middle of the pack.

Brice's company down that low in the ratings includes Nnamdi Asomugha and Janoris Jenkins.

Brandon Harris did not meet the >25% of team snaps, so we have a smaller sample size and larger population comparison. He rated 167 out of 217 CBs overall ( no minimum playing time.) Harris was middle of the pack in all areas except penalty, where he rated 211 of 217.

Harris equaled K.J.'s penalties, but K.J. did so in 1030 snaps compared to Harris' 177 snaps.

Ratings courtesy of ProFootballFocus (http://www.profootballfocus.com/).

tru80texan
03-20-2013, 11:23 AM
Brice McCain was rated 104 out of 113 CBs overall in 2012 (>25% of team snaps.) His coverage rating is what hurt him, putting him at 107th. His rush, run, and penalty ratings were middle of the pack.

Brice's company down that low in the ratings includes Nnamdi Asomugha and Janoris Jenkins.

Brandon Harris did not meet the >25% of team snaps, so we have a smaller sample size and larger population comparison. He rated 167 out of 217 CBs overall ( no minimum playing time.) Harris was middle of the pack in all areas except penalty, where he rated 211 of 217.

Harris equaled K.J.'s penalties, but K.J. did so in 1030 snaps compared to Harris' 177 snaps.

Ratings courtesy of ProFootballFocus (http://www.profootballfocus.com/).

No surprise on McCain having a bad rating. It was obvious at times this past season that he was struggling even in the slot position & not playing nearly as well as he did in 2011. So somebody's silly assumption that it was just my "THOUGHT" can now see it was FACT. Watching a game or 2 & doing a little research can go a long way. Just a THOUGHT. Lol! :rolleyes:

The penalties is the area for concern w/ Harris IMO. He did seem to get untimely penalties that were costly. I believe that is something that can be fixed. Harris played aggressive & made plays on the ball & that is what got him on occasion. With additional playing time I think the penalties improve because he can learn what he can & cannot get away w/ the refs. That type of knowledge is primarily gained by being on the field. Most know that cb's have to get physical, but they have to know the limits or be penalized...that's Harris' problem IMO. I liked how he played physical & was normally in position to make plays on the ball. He showed some decent awareness by normally being in the area to make a play & was effective at times against the likes of Welker & Wayne. Those are some qualities that eluded both McCain & Kareem early in their careers.

As I said before, writing Harris off as a bust after only 2 seasons w/ very limited playing time is shortsighted & foolish IMO. With the "2 seasons & done" thought process, McCain shouldn't even be talked today because according to some of y'all he, & KJ for that matter, should've been deemed busts & gone by now. Once again, a double standard that makes absolutely zero sense IMO.

Rey
03-20-2013, 11:36 AM
If McCain starts over Harris, I'd be surprised.

I was about to post the same thing.

Harris is a better player than Brice McCain, but it doesn't hurt to have McCain as insurance.

Brandon Harris looked good last season. It was his first significant playing time and he made some nice plays. He's more physical than McCain and I think he's got more playmaking ability. He made his fair share of mistakes, but again it was almost like his rookie season.

Bubbajwp
03-20-2013, 11:39 AM
Im usually a stat guy but im going with what I saw on this one. I agree its way to soon to call harris a bust but I saw him giving up alot of big plays and extending big drives at the end of games towards the end of the season when our D was falling apart.

This is a good signing. Three years is no long term commitment and by the end of that contract we will know what Harris is worth.

panamamyers
03-20-2013, 11:42 AM
I was about to post the same thing.

Harris is a better player than Brice McCain, but it doesn't hurt to have McCain as insurance.

Brandon Harris looked good last season. It was his first significant playing time and he made some nice plays. He's more physical than McCain and I think he's got more playmaking ability.

Glad I'm not the only one. Sometimes people look at a couple of interference penalties, because it is something easy to latch onto.

76Texan
03-20-2013, 11:45 AM
You can't have too many decent CBs, especially when they showed potential.

Forget about the rating; a lot of the CBs on the list don't play man anywhere near often as our guys.

House of Pain
03-20-2013, 11:48 AM
As cool as it is to take shots at our draft classes (affectionately known on TT as: "The Offseason"), is it cool if we at least wait 3 years to determine if they are "busts" or not? IIRC, Wade wasn't in the draft room until the 2011 draft, so I think we can justifiably rate that 2011 class at the end of this season.

Or you can just be upset that the front office didn't overpay on every FA out there and land our team in the "Casserly" circle of Cap Hell. I know most of you like big splashy names that don't live up their contracts, so I'm going to guess that most of you will take this choice.

Carry on...just passing through...

dream_team
03-20-2013, 11:59 AM
We can't really call this a good or bad signing until we see the numbers. Have they been released yet?

thunderkyss
03-20-2013, 12:26 PM
The penalties is the area for concern w/ Harris IMO. He did seem to get untimely penalties that were costly. I believe that is something that can be fixed. Harris played aggressive & made plays on the ball & that is what got him on occasion.

I believe that is exactly why he got so many penalties (& I wonder if they counted his special teams penalties as well), but I don't know that they need to be "fixed"

The two that I think were most costly to us was the PI on Welker. They were about 5-6 yards from the LOS, Welker initiated the contact by running into Harris, then tried to turn & run back the other way. Harris didn't allow him to do that. I don't think that call is made 7 out of 10 times. Even though the ball is in the air, anything close to 5 yards usually get's "overlooked"

It sucks that the penalty was called, by letter of the law, he was guilty & they got a 1st down out of it. But had he not done what he did, Welker was just as likely to break that little dump off for a 20 to 40 yard gain & maybe even a TD.

Same thing with the one he got against Reggie Wayne. Reggie got into Harris then tried to get separation by pushing off. Harris didn't let him. We got a penalty, they got a 1st down for a pretty big gain, but again, it could have been a TD on a push off that normally isn't called. We got a raw deal on that one, but it's a penalty I want my guy to take every time. Simply because they rarely call OPI to the letter of the law.

If you remember what Quin looked like when he played CB for us, that's what Harris reminds me of, only more athletic. He's like a bulldog, he won't back down & he's going to be in your face all day. He's going to get his hands on the ball & next year, because he's more comfortable with game speed & all that, he's going to catch a lot of those balls, where that's just not Quin's game. He'll knock a lot of balls down, but he's not going to catch a whole lot of them.

Anyway, I'm very excited to see what we got in Brandon Harris.

infantrycak
03-20-2013, 12:39 PM
The two that I think were most costly to us was the PI on Welker. They were about 5-6 yards from the LOS, Welker initiated the contact by running into Harris, then tried to turn & run back the other way. Harris didn't allow him to do that. I don't think that call is made 7 out of 10 times. Even though the ball is in the air, anything close to 5 yards usually get's "overlooked"

Right now Harris' infractions are far too blatant and going to get consistently called. Somebody needs to tuck him into a room with Aaron Glenn footage to learn how you get away with contact. Glenn was a master at minor contact/arm fighting.

Goodwrench3
03-20-2013, 12:50 PM
Good news, good player.

ASidd_1990
03-20-2013, 12:52 PM
Great under the radar move.

Insideop
03-20-2013, 12:57 PM
As cool as it is to take shots at our draft classes (affectionately known on TT as: "The Offseason"), is it cool if we at least wait 3 years to determine if they are "busts" or not? IIRC, Wade wasn't in the draft room until the 2011 draft, so I think we can justifiably rate that 2011 class at the end of this season.

Or you can just be upset that the front office didn't overpay on every FA out there and land our team in the "Casserly" circle of Cap Hell. I know most of you like big splashy names that don't live up their contracts, so I'm going to guess that most of you will take this choice.

Carry on...just passing through...

That's not the way things are done around here! You should know that by now HoP! If they haven't shown anything after the 1st year, they're a BUST! Kubes, Smith, McNair, etc... don't know what they're doing and should be fired for keeping them any longer! :)

HOU-TEX
03-20-2013, 01:18 PM
Per McGobbler

John McClain‏@McClain_on_NFL1m
Brice McCain 3 year deal: $5.25 million, $2.25 guaranteed.

Jackie Chiles
03-20-2013, 01:29 PM
That looks very reasonable.

wolf123
03-20-2013, 01:45 PM
Way less then what his agent was trying to get.

76Texan
03-20-2013, 01:51 PM
That looks very reasonable.

I think so too.

rolyat93
03-20-2013, 02:18 PM
Per McGobbler

That's a damn good deal especially if he continues to progress.

Dutchrudder
03-20-2013, 04:05 PM
John McClain‏@McClain_on_NFL1m
Brice McCain 3 year deal: $5.25 million, $2.25 guaranteed.

Good deal, I bet it's structured so that third year is worth 3 million. 2 years 2.25 million sounds great to me, especially considering this won't affect our compensatory picks for next year.

SCOTTexans
03-20-2013, 04:44 PM
John McClain‏@McClain_on_NFL1m
Brice McCain 3 year deal: $5.25 million, $2.25 guaranteed.

Good deal, I bet it's structured so that third year is worth 3 million. 2 years 2.25 million sounds great to me, especially considering this won't affect our compensatory picks for next year.

I don't think the texans could have done much better then that... :handshake:

Rufus Jarvis
03-20-2013, 05:03 PM
I am very pleased with this deal w/ McCAIN.

Bubbajwp
03-20-2013, 05:59 PM
This deal was a nobrainer.

Maddict5
03-20-2013, 06:48 PM
not a huge brice fan after last yr but a great value signing at that price

TheMatrix31
03-20-2013, 06:49 PM
I don't care for McCain too much. He did stupid **** on the field and had a lot of lapses. Meh. I guess if we can't upgrade, might as well keep him.

thunderkyss
03-20-2013, 07:02 PM
not a huge brice fan after last yr but a great value signing at that price

I hate to be the one dissenting opinion, but that's too much money. A million a year would have been too much. I could see them doing $1M/yr maybe one & a qtr.. But once we start getting close to $2M for a nickel when you've got two really good corners & stable of young'ns waiting to prove themselves......

eh.

Rey
03-20-2013, 07:09 PM
Personally I'd have let McCain walk. I don't think he's more than a #4 corner and I think you can find a rookie corner in the draft that could compete with Harris for the nickel duties.

I like that McCain is experienced, but I just dont believe he's more than back end depth. Not good on the outside at all and he's a bit below avg in the slot. I think he looked better last season because of the teams we faced and the pressure we got.

I think Brandon Harris is a much better player overall and I imagine he'll get the starting nickel spot over him.

thunderkyss
03-20-2013, 07:23 PM
I think Brandon Harris is a much better player overall and I imagine he'll get the starting nickel spot over him.

What do you think about cutting Keo?

Harris plays the nickel, when we go to dime, Harris takes Demps/Keo spot, McCain comes in to play the slot?

When Reed finally rides off into the sunset, Harris becomes our Reed?

Perki-Perk
03-20-2013, 07:41 PM
Brice McCain was rated 104 out of 113 CBs overall in 2012 (>25% of team snaps.) His coverage rating is what hurt him, putting him at 107th. His rush, run, and penalty ratings were middle of the pack.

Brice's company down that low in the ratings includes Nnamdi Asomugha and Janoris Jenkins.

Brandon Harris did not meet the >25% of team snaps, so we have a smaller sample size and larger population comparison. He rated 167 out of 217 CBs overall ( no minimum playing time.) Harris was middle of the pack in all areas except penalty, where he rated 211 of 217.

Harris equaled K.J.'s penalties, but K.J. did so in 1030 snaps compared to Harris' 177 snaps.

Ratings courtesy of ProFootballFocus (http://www.profootballfocus.com/).

What I remember seeing is that Harris' penalties were from being aggressive, where KJax penalties were from getting burnt.

Rey
03-20-2013, 08:01 PM
What do you think about cutting Keo?

Harris plays the nickel, when we go to dime, Harris takes Demps/Keo spot, McCain comes in to play the slot?

When Reed finally rides off into the sunset, Harris becomes our Reed?

I Think the texans have been wanting to try Harris at safety.

I'm fine with cutting keo...never wanted him to make the team and I think Eddie pleasant is a better player.

I like the idea of trying Harris at safety. I love the way he attacks the ball in the air and I think he would have good range and be physical enough for the position.

mariowillshine15
03-20-2013, 08:56 PM
I Think the texans have been wanting to try Harris at safety.

I'm fine with cutting keo...never wanted him to make the team and I think Eddie pleasant is a better player.

I like the idea of trying Harris at safety. I love the way he attacks the ball in the air and I think he would have good range and be physical enough for the position.

Move Harris to safety and have him learn from Reed. Both from the U. Mold that aggressiveness into skill and he'd be a hell of a replacement for Reed in a few years.

thunderkyss
03-20-2013, 09:30 PM
Move Harris to safety and have him learn from Reed. Both from the U. Mold that aggressiveness into skill and he'd be a hell of a replacement for Reed in a few years.

This is what I think we should do. But the chances of the Texans doing it... slim.

Paying McCain like a salty Vet..... that's a lot of money to sit behind a nickel corner. But, imo, Harris played to well to bury him on the bench, not good enough to trade mind you, but it won't make sense to not play him.

Rey
03-20-2013, 09:41 PM
This is what I think we should do. But the chances of the Texans doing it... slim.


I don't know what the odds of that move would be, but the year before when manning got hurt kubiak specifically mentioned Brandon Harris as a potential safety on gamedays. He said he had been working as a safety in practice.

I wouldn't be surprised if Harris was the third "safety" with McCain being the nickel corner when/if we still use that look.

From a coverage standpoint I think having Jjo, Kareem, McCain, Harris, reed, and manning on the field with Cushing as the lb trumps anything we put on the field this past year by far.

Texan_Bill
03-20-2013, 09:45 PM
Good news just for the fact that Harris moved down a spot and hopefully is gone, he is terrible.

I dunno about terrible. Not good, certainly BUT at least we know that Kilo Sheo (or whatever) is gone.

b0ng
03-21-2013, 08:39 AM
Eh, a little more guaranteed money than I would've liked but I guess we'll see.

TexanBacker93
03-21-2013, 09:11 AM
This is what I think we should do. But the chances of the Texans doing it... slim.

Paying McCain like a salty Vet..... that's a lot of money to sit behind a nickel corner. But, imo, Harris played to well to bury him on the bench, not good enough to trade mind you, but it won't make sense to not play him.

It seems that with the higher emphasis on passing throughout the league teams are using their nickels a lot more than they used to. I don't know what they tend to get outside of Houston, but I can see how agents and the players will push to get more even if they are just a nickel. I wouldn't be surprised if our nickel is on the field more than our 2nd ILB.

Vinny
03-21-2013, 10:56 AM
McCain was an important signing. Didn't he start two games last year before his injury? He's way better than Harris. Everybody behind McCain is replaceable if you ask me.

Insideop
03-21-2013, 11:08 AM
I dunno about terrible. Not good, certainly BUT at least we know that Kilo Sheo (or whatever) is gone.

I'm not so sure he's gone. Right now the Texans have Manning, Reed, Demps, and Keo as their Safeties with Pleasant on the PS. If they draft a Safety, and I expect them to, that will give them 6 on the roster for 4 or possibly 5 spots. That 4th, and possibly 5th, spot could come down to who plays the best Special Teams. Also, Pleasant could be stashed on the PS again. Remember, Keo stuck last year when a lot thought he would be cut, so I'm thinking VJ or Marciano must like him for some reason.

El Tejano
03-21-2013, 11:10 AM
I'm not so sure he's gone. Right now the Texans have Manning, Reed, Demps, and Keo as their Safeties with Pleasant on the PS. If they draft a Safety, and I expect them to, that will give them 6 on the roster for 4 or possibly 5 spots. That 4th, and possibly 5th, spot could come down to who plays the best Special Teams. Also, Pleasant could be stashed on the PS again. Remember, Keo stuck last year when a lot thought he would be cut, so I'm thinking VJ or Marciano must like him for some reason.

Demps needs to go!!!

deucetx
03-21-2013, 11:13 AM
Demps needs to go!!!

Unless I missed something last I checked Demps is a free agent still and not part of the Texans roster.

ArlingtonTexan
03-21-2013, 11:19 AM
I don't see this is either/or or one is better than the other. Given that so many teams play 3/4 WR sets as much if not more than the classic 2-back `1TE set, the needs need as many guys who have cover skills as possible.

Both McCain and Harris will probably take more snaps than a run stuffing NT and maybe the 2nd ILB. Neither played well enough in 2012.

On McCain specifically, I watch only 6 or 7 Texans games from home, so I can't screen shot this, but i think that teams figured out ways to make McCain attempt to cover guys bigger stronger than him. he is good with smaller pure slot Wrs and guys with average talent, but struggles when having to cover guys with even average size (I think at least) and some Wr skill.

Vinny
03-21-2013, 11:21 AM
I'm not so sure he's gone. Right now the Texans have Manning, Reed, Demps, and Keo as their Safeties with Pleasant on the PS. If they draft a Safety, and I expect them to, that will give them 6 on the roster for 4 or possibly 5 spots. That 4th, and possibly 5th, spot could come down to who plays the best Special Teams. Also, Pleasant could be stashed on the PS again. Remember, Keo stuck last year when a lot thought he would be cut, so I'm thinking VJ or Marciano must like him for some reason.This is supposedly a strong S class....if we start the season with Keo on the roster I'm gonna scream.

Playoffs
03-21-2013, 11:28 AM
Unless I missed something last I checked Demps is a free agent still and not part of the Texans roster.He still needs to go. http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e316/Soizic22/a%20smilie/laugh-1.gif

76Texan
03-21-2013, 12:47 PM
I'm not so sure he's gone. Right now the Texans have Manning, Reed, Demps, and Keo as their Safeties with Pleasant on the PS. If they draft a Safety, and I expect them to, that will give them 6 on the roster for 4 or possibly 5 spots. That 4th, and possibly 5th, spot could come down to who plays the best Special Teams. Also, Pleasant could be stashed on the PS again. Remember, Keo stuck last year when a lot thought he would be cut, so I'm thinking VJ or Marciano must like him for some reason.

Pleasant was brought up to the active roster late in the season.
So he's on the team... until and if he's waived.

76Texan
03-21-2013, 12:48 PM
He still needs to go. http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e316/Soizic22/a%20smilie/laugh-1.gif

Let's resign Demps without signing bonus nor guaranteed money and then cut him again just for kick! lOL

mussop
03-21-2013, 01:32 PM
No surprise on McCain having a bad rating. It was obvious at times this past season that he was struggling even in the slot position & not playing nearly as well as he did in 2011. So somebody's silly assumption that it was just my "THOUGHT" can now see it was FACT. Watching a game or 2 & doing a little research can go a long way. Just a THOUGHT. Lol! :rolleyes:

The penalties is the area for concern w/ Harris IMO. He did seem to get untimely penalties that were costly. I believe that is something that can be fixed. Harris played aggressive & made plays on the ball & that is what got him on occasion. With additional playing time I think the penalties improve because he can learn what he can & cannot get away w/ the refs. That type of knowledge is primarily gained by being on the field. Most know that cb's have to get physical, but they have to know the limits or be penalized...that's Harris' problem IMO. I liked how he played physical & was normally in position to make plays on the ball. He showed some decent awareness by normally being in the area to make a play & was effective at times against the likes of Welker & Wayne. Those are some qualities that eluded both McCain & Kareem early in their careers.

As I said before, writing Harris off as a bust after only 2 seasons w/ very limited playing time is shortsighted & foolish IMO. With the "2 seasons & done" thought process, McCain shouldn't even be talked today because according to some of y'all he, & KJ for that matter, should've been deemed busts & gone by now. Once again, a double standard that makes absolutely zero sense IMO.

LOL! :evil: can't wait till I have time to respond to this.

deucetx
03-21-2013, 01:40 PM
Let's resign Demps without signing bonus nor guaranteed money and then cut him again just for kick! lOL

LOL you guys are harsh! Granted I think I would have entertained similar thoughts last season. It's one thing to get burnt due to lack of skill. It's another to get burnt because of repeated mental lapses because you keep biting on fakes over...and over...and over

tru80texan
03-21-2013, 11:16 PM
LOL! :evil: can't wait till I have time to respond to this.

Yippy!!! I can't wait!:spin: Your posts are always so insightful & entertaining. Lol! :headhurts:

Besides, what makes you think that post had anything to do w/ you? Play nice. Lol!:nicedog:

leebigeztx
03-21-2013, 11:26 PM
The entire secondary struggled last year when cushing went out. In this day and age, you need 3 or 4 quality cbs. Mccain was missed big time last year when hurt because he went down when cushing went down. The pass rush was suspect also and it hurt everyone even jjo. Now they have a ball hawk at safety and now they will have 4 cbs with experience.

deucetx
03-22-2013, 08:40 AM
The entire secondary struggled last year when cushing went out. In this day and age, you need 3 or 4 quality cbs. Mccain was missed big time last year when hurt because he went down when cushing went down. The pass rush was suspect also and it hurt everyone even jjo. Now they have a ball hawk at safety and now they will have 4 cbs with experience.

Huh and what? Cushing went down against the Jets in week 5...McCain didn't go out til week 13 against the Titans. You must mean that he was out while Cush was out. McCain was missed while he was on the field because he was playing bad. So yeah he was missed...the 2011 version of him.

otisbean
03-22-2013, 08:50 AM
The entire secondary struggled last year when cushing went out. In this day and age, you need 3 or 4 quality cbs. Mccain was missed big time last year when hurt because he went down when cushing went down. The pass rush was suspect also and it hurt everyone even jjo. Now they have a ball hawk at safety and now they will have 4 cbs with experience.

You're spot on about the pass rush. It needs to be addressed big time. Watt was superb and Smith was very solid but we got little to nothing from everyone else. With teams scheming to stop Watt other guys should have been freed up to make plays and it didn't happen.

We'll continue to struggle against the top QBs until we ramp up our pass rush. The Giants have owned the Pats I recent years with a rather pedestrian secondary and a fearsome pass rush. The blueprint is out there we just need to follow it.

mussop
03-22-2013, 07:17 PM
You're spot on about the pass rush. It needs to be addressed big time. Watt was superb and Smith was very solid but we got little to nothing from everyone else. With teams scheming to stop Watt other guys should have been freed up to make plays and it didn't happen.

We'll continue to struggle against the top QBs until we ramp up our pass rush. The Giants have owned the Pats I recent years with a rather pedestrian secondary and a fearsome pass rush. The blueprint is out there we just need to follow it.

This is exactly what I have been saying. There will be good WR's available with our second and third round picks. In the first we have to get D front seven guys that can get to the QB.

EllisUnit
03-22-2013, 07:34 PM
This is exactly what I have been saying. There will be good WR's available with our second and third round picks. In the first we have to get D front seven guys that can get to the QB.

Especially now that i think QBs wont look deep on us as much with reed back there. Meaning QBs will hold the ball for less time then they were.

BUT with that said i think we need to help the offense out, especially the WR corp.

greekdbag
03-23-2013, 12:54 AM
This is exactly what I have been saying. There will be good WR's available with our second and third round picks. In the first we have to get D front seven guys that can get to the QB.

I agree with you. But I'd also be okay with them taking a receiver in the first and then trading up for a pass rushing big nasty in the 2nd.

otisbean
03-23-2013, 03:54 AM
I agree with you. But I'd also be okay with them taking a receiver in the first and then trading up for a pass rushing big nasty in the 2nd.

I'd love to see a good WR in the first and Jamie Collins in the second. Collins is going to be good

thunderkyss
03-23-2013, 07:57 AM
I'd love to see a good WR in the first and Jamie Collins in the second. Collins is going to be good

It really depends on who is there & who may be within our reach later. If there's only one outside pass rusher available & 5 WR of equal talent, I'm taking that pass rusher, provided he fits what we are trying to do.

I like Newton as well, but I'm not opposed to picking up another tackle. While I don't see it as a need, the right guy will put this team on another level (I think).