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dalemurphy
03-13-2013, 02:58 PM
As of 3pm on Wednesday, the Texans were one of four teams not to have signed a free agent:

Jets- who are in cap hell and reorganizing

Packers

Patriots

** So, I don't think the inactivity is something to panic over. Just like the Texans, the Packers and Patriots are losing key contributors to their teams.

Packers, beyond Jennings and Charles Woodson, have lost some contributors and have other players dangling out in the wind

Patriots are about to lose Welker and have lost key elements of their offensive line.

JamesBill
03-13-2013, 02:59 PM
I would say the Texans are closer to the Jets than the Pats or Packers. Having QB makes you look a hell of a lot smarter than you are.

Nawzer
03-13-2013, 03:02 PM
I'm not panicking at all. If anything it's kind of fun to talk about something football related. My happiness or sadness doesn't depend on a football team.

djohn2oo8
03-13-2013, 03:04 PM
John McClain ‏@McClain_on_NFL
Now that Glover Quin is signing with the Lions, Texans will turn their attention to another veteran safety to replace him.

jtexas
03-13-2013, 03:06 PM
As of 3pm on Wednesday, the Texans were one of four teams not to have signed a free agent:

Jets- who are in cap hell and reorganizing

Packers

Patriots

** So, I don't think the inactivity is something to panic over. Just like the Texans, the Packers and Patriots are losing key contributors to their teams.

Packers, beyond Jennings and Charles Woodson, have lost some contributors and have other players dangling out in the wind

Patriots are about to lose Welker and have lost key elements of their offensive line.

I trust them not to overpay for players, BUT we are clearly a worse team at this time than we finished last season. If we don't make a few key vet signings, this team shouldn't expect more than a 9-7 finish.

houstonspartan
03-13-2013, 03:06 PM
I have not heard one ounce of panic from any Texans fan. Neither personal friends, nor people on this message board, nor the normal yahoos on the radio are worried, it seems.

At this point, yes, we do trust the front office. Not sure why you assume we don't.

deucetx
03-13-2013, 03:07 PM
No panic from me either. Only thing I am skeptical on is Quin and if we offered something worthwhile. If not then that is something I think should be a bit more than irritating. But it's possible the Lions just blew it out the water. They tend to act on the side of deperate.

Bulls on Parade
03-13-2013, 03:08 PM
John McClain ‏@McClain_on_NFL
Now that Glover Quin is signing with the Lions, Texans will turn their attention to another veteran safety to replace him.
Why bother? We can draft one and beef up our front seven in the draft as well. The defense is going to be fine. Our attention in free agency has to be wide receiver. Can we put together enough cap space to at least make Greg Jennings an offer? The Vikings, a team with a lot of cap room, said they felt Jennings would be too expensive according to NFL Live on ESPN. Ugh, that doesn't look good then. If the Broncos sign Wes Welker they are the current favorites in the AFC entering the 2013 season, but we can answer back their big addition with one of our own.

Fili
03-13-2013, 03:08 PM
They have a #12 on their team.

pec0sb0b
03-13-2013, 03:08 PM
If Quin goes to Detroit, I think Michael Huff could bring the team the same versatility in Phillips' defensive scheme.

Huff’s Versatility

We see many safeties double as slot corners in sub packages but it’s very rare that a safety can make the move to a traditional cornerback role and have success. That’s exactly what Huff did in Week 3 when injuries forced the move to left cornerback. The Pittsburgh Steelers attacked him often (completing eight of the 11 balls thrown his way), but they were mostly of the short variety and Huff’s -3.1 grade in that game stemmed mostly from his three missed tackles.

After the tough first game, Huff continued to show improvement and seemed to make the position switch official when he picked up three passes defensed and an interception (and a +2.3 coverage grade) against the Atlanta Falcons’ wide receiver duo of Roddy White and Julio Jones in Week 6. Huff finished the season at cornerback and graded at +2.1 at his new home. It was an impressive performance as he performed admirably at a position where most safeties would be exploited.

When you add it all up, opponents completed only 53 percent of passes into Huff’s coverage and he finished with nine passes defensed and two interceptions. All of this came two years removed from Huff grading at +17.2 as our No. 2 safety in the league, and one year removed from his strong play when filling in as the team’s slot cornerback. He’s essentially succeeded in three different positions over a three-year period.

Any team looking to sign Huff will likely put him back at his more natural spot at safety, but his experience playing in the slot and on the outside will prove invaluable. In a league that covets versatility, Oakland’s releasing Huff may have vaulted him to the top of the free agent safety rankings.
-https://www.profootballfocus.com/blo...d-heyward-bey/

Bulls on Parade
03-13-2013, 03:10 PM
No panic from me either. Only thing I am skeptical on is Quin and if we offered something worthwhile. If not then that is something I think should be a bit more than irritating. But it's possible the Lions just blew it out the water. They tend to act on the side of deperate.
If we don't land a legitimate number two wide receiver, somebody established, in free agency we better panic because we'll be another divisional round loser (at best) again next year. We can't draft a WR and expect that to be the answer. We have too many young and inconsistent guys as it is. Heck, I'll take DeVier Posey (when healthy) and Keshawn Martin over any WR we could possibly draft with pick number 27. Chances are that guy would be a huge bust and even if he pans out, it will take two or three seasons before we know. By then Andre Johnson will be washed up and we'll be in the market for a new number one.

Dutchrudder
03-13-2013, 03:14 PM
If Quin goes to Detroit, I think Michael Huff could bring the team the same versatility in Phillips' defensive scheme.


-https://www.profootballfocus.com/blo...d-heyward-bey/

I'd be fine with Huff if the price is right, but I like Adrian Wilson more. I think we will see them address the position through free agency rather than the draft. It will be interesting to see what they find for cheap on June 2nd.

mussop
03-13-2013, 03:17 PM
If we don't land a legitimate number two wide receiver, somebody established, in free agency we better panic because we'll be another divisional round loser (at best) again next year. We can't draft a WR and expect that to be the answer. We have too many young and inconsistent guys as it is. Heck, I'll take DeVier Posey (when healthy) and Keshawn Martin over any WR we could possibly draft with pick number 27. Chances are that guy would be a huge bust and even if he pans out, it will take two or three seasons before we know. By then Andre Johnson will be washed up and we'll be in the market for a new number one.

WR is a ways down on the importance list as far as winning is concerned. S, NT, ILB, OLB and OT are the more important positions to worry about right now.

Bulls on Parade
03-13-2013, 03:20 PM
WR is a ways down on the importance list as far as winning is concerned. S, NT, ILB, OLB and OT are the more important positions to worry about right now.
I understand that but I think my trust in Wade Phillips and our track record drafting defensive players in recent years, gives me more optimism that we can land some impact guys on defense. I think our offense, which features what, six or seven pro bowlers (Schaub to me wasn't one the final month of season and playoffs), just needs a couple more additions through free agency

ASidd_1990
03-13-2013, 03:20 PM
Screw Rick Smith and Gary Kubiak!

Pisses me off!

eriadoc
03-13-2013, 03:20 PM
I'll go ahead and own up to it - I don't trust them. That doesn't mean I'm panicking or worried, but last offseason, the team got worse. We saw the Texans losing players and the team was worse. Everyone pushed their concerns to the back because we all heard how the Texans were just a QB away from an AFC Championship game, since Schaub was injured. Well, now they're still a QB away from an AFC CG, and they're still losing players. And every time we talk about a free agent, someone comes along to remind us that the team doesn't have room under the salary cap. Well, that situation didn't just magically create itself. The salary cap is managed by the front office. So the team keeps losing players and still has salary cap problems that prevent them from signing adequate replacements.

I have enough faith in the scheme and defensive coaching that I'm not terribly worried about it, but unless they have an outstanding draft (read: way better than last year), the loss of talent is going to catch up. You have to replace lost talent somewhere. The Texans have chosen to do it through the draft. That's fine, but then you have to hit on your draft picks and you have to keep the ones you hit on.

76Texan
03-13-2013, 03:23 PM
If we don't land a legitimate number two wide receiver, somebody established, in free agency we better panic because we'll be another divisional round loser (at best) again next year. We can't draft a WR and expect that to be the answer. We have too many young and inconsistent guys as it is. Heck, I'll take DeVier Posey (when healthy) and Keshawn Martin over any WR we could possibly draft with pick number 27. Chances are that guy would be a huge bust and even if he pans out, it will take two or three seasons before we know. By then Andre Johnson will be washed up and we'll be in the market for a new number one.

If the Texans take a receiver at #27, that guy will be able to contribute early.

He will be better than either Posey, Martin, or Jean.
Actually, that guy is already better than them three.
That guy should become a legit #2, with a chance of becoming a #1.

dalemurphy
03-13-2013, 03:25 PM
I'll go ahead and own up to it - I don't trust them. That doesn't mean I'm panicking or worried, but last offseason, the team got worse. We saw the Texans losing players and the team was worse. Everyone pushed their concerns to the back because we all heard how the Texans were just a QB away from an AFC Championship game, since Schaub was injured. Well, now they're still a QB away from an AFC CG, and they're still losing players. And every time we talk about a free agent, someone comes along to remind us that the team doesn't have room under the salary cap. Well, that situation didn't just magically create itself. The salary cap is managed by the front office. So the team keeps losing players and still has salary cap problems that prevent them from signing adequate replacements.

I have enough faith in the scheme and defensive coaching that I'm not terribly worried about it, but unless they have an outstanding draft (read: way better than last year), the loss of talent is going to catch up. You have to replace lost talent somewhere. The Texans have chosen to do it through the draft. That's fine, but then you have to hit on your draft picks and you have to keep the ones you hit on.


I am choosing to trust them. It's difficult, though, not because of their track record, but because it is hard to see all these players signed and we are stagnant.

That being said, the money will dry up way before the available talent does. We should be in great position to buy at bargain price. It appears that has been the plan, but I will feel better once it takes place. I still have bad memories of the secondary going unadressed in 2009-2010

eriadoc
03-13-2013, 03:28 PM
I am choosing to trust them. It's difficult, though, not because of their track record, but because it is hard to see all these players signed and we are stagnant.

That being said, the money will dry up way before the available talent does. We should be in great position to buy at bargain price.

That is also why I am not panicking or upset. I'm just wary of blindly trusting Smithiak.

It appears that has been the plan, but I will feel better once it takes place. I still have bad memories of the secondary going unadressed in 2009-2010

These days, it's WR.

Bulls on Parade
03-13-2013, 03:28 PM
I have enough faith in the scheme and defensive coaching that I'm not terribly worried about it, but unless they have an outstanding draft (read: way better than last year), the loss of talent is going to catch up. You have to replace lost talent somewhere. The Texans have chosen to do it through the draft. That's fine, but then you have to hit on your draft picks and you have to keep the ones you hit on.
Same here. I truly believe we can build a really strong defense for the next several years. We are going to become the new Ravens in terms of having a dominating defense year in and year out.

Having guys like J.J. Watt, who is the best defensive player in the NFL and only 23 years old, Brian Cushing (26), Brooks Reed (26), Whitney Mercilus (22). We've got a great foundation of young studs for our 3-4 defense. I trust our front office to draft a solid nose tackle, another inside linebacker and safety. We will add even more talent soon. Even if they're not all home runs I believe Wade Phillips' coaching is enough to turn even a bad young defensive player into somebody good. If they are already good he can turn them into a pro bowler and superstar.

By the way, I haven't ruled out 23-year-old defensive end Jared Crick from developing into a special player in this league. All he needs is another year to get settled in but he has "beast ability" in my eyes. I'm kind of hoping he'll be our solution one day when Antonio Smith's contract runs out or if he's eventually released for cap savings.

eriadoc
03-13-2013, 03:30 PM
I trust our front office to draft a solid nose tackle ...

Seriously? There's nothing in the track record to suggest that they're remotely capable of doing that. The best nose tackle in Texans history is still Seth Payne.

Bulls on Parade
03-13-2013, 03:30 PM
If the Texans take a receiver at #27, that guy will be able to contribute early.

He will be better than either Posey, Martin, or Jean.
Actually, that guy is already better than them three.
That guy should become a legit #2, with a chance of becoming a #1.
I really hope you are right but deep down that makes me very nervous. I'd rather see the Texans draft a defensive player with pick number 27. That would make me a happy man, as I'm sure that will also make Wade Phillips happy. Our offense shouldn't struggle with seven pro bowlers on it. We just need one veteran wide receiver in free agency. If the offense still struggles then Gary Kubiak is too blame because he's the one calling the plays.

Hagar
03-13-2013, 03:31 PM
The Texans' are losing role players that can be replaced cheaply. Every team has its stars that they are going to pay big bucks for and lose role players. The question is have they chosen the right players to keep as the stars. AJ, Schuab, Cushing, Brown, Watt are the stars (maybe a couple others), everybody else can be replaced.

Bulls on Parade
03-13-2013, 03:32 PM
Seriously? There's nothing in the track record to suggest that they're remotely capable of doing that. The best nose tackle in Texans history is still Seth Payne.
Have we really tried to find one in the Wade Phillips era? Shaun Cody and Earl Mitchell have been serviceable. He's made mediocre players like that look decent at times in this 3-4 defense. I trust big Wade when it comes to finding defensive talent. I believe the next Casey Hampton is out there in this draft and we're going to find it baby!

ASidd_1990
03-13-2013, 03:32 PM
Seriously? There's nothing in the track record to suggest that they're remotely capable of doing that. The best nose tackle in Texans history is still Seth Payne.

LMAO please Shaun Cody is the best NT in the NFL and Kubiak will battlefight with him till the end!

eriadoc
03-13-2013, 03:36 PM
The Texans' are losing role players that can be replaced cheaply.

Not exactly true. Using Quin as an example - he is a role player. But replacing him cheaply is not as easy as you suggest. We could just as easily end up with another Antwan Molden as we could Glover Quin. The key for good teams is when they develop and coach up those mid-level players, especially a position shift like Quin, is to hang onto them for a reasonable price. Now, I don't know if $5M/yr is a reasonable price for Quin or not, but the fact that Texans never even offered him a contract and let him hit free agency makes me question what the hell they're thinking.

Anytime your strategy is to replace talent solely through the draft, you have to hit on your picks and the ramp-up time in coaching has to be accounted for. There's value in the mid-level guys that are solid contributors, as long as you know what that value is. By not even offering Quin, I question Rick Smith's assignation of value.

eriadoc
03-13-2013, 03:36 PM
Have we really tried to find one in the Wade Phillips era?

Also making my point for me. The team has never even tried to find one, so why would you TRUST that they're going to try now?

Playoffs
03-13-2013, 03:43 PM
Gotta reload, just like the Ravens have to do year in/year out.

Huff looks interesting, but he was due $8 million in 2013 -- we won't approach that number, other teams might.

ASidd_1990
03-13-2013, 03:44 PM
I don't care. Whatever it is, the Texans could've matched Glover Quin contract. They're choosing to be fiscally responsible for future years and ignoring the rapidly-closing window right in front of their faces. I don't give a **** if matching Quin and Barwin might lead to a massive purge come 2015/2016, because the fact of the matter is, those aren't likely to be contending years anyway. Not with this core, at least. You have maybe two more years of the Schaub/Foster/Johnson era. If you can make yourself a bigger Super Bowl contender in the meantime, it's well worth dropping from 8-8 to 5-11 in three years.

It's pretty much the exact opposite of the Daryl Morey approach (championship or bust). With the Texans, it's what keeps them competitive and in the playoff hunt for the longest possible time. There just isn't the emphasis on building a true contender.

SMH
:toropalm::toropalm:

Spled
03-13-2013, 03:46 PM
We need to sign someone. We've lost too many players.

TigerV1
03-13-2013, 03:48 PM
We need to sign someone. We've lost too many players.

This is the attitude that losing teams have. Winning teams look to the draft to reload. We are fine.

ASidd_1990
03-13-2013, 03:48 PM
Our championship window is rapidly closing and you go out and let valuable players go?

I would argue Quin was our 2nd best defensive player outside of Justin James Watt.

ASidd_1990
03-13-2013, 03:49 PM
This is the attitude that losing teams have. Winning teams look to the draft to reload. We are fine.

LMAO! Please the Ravens won a Superbowl because of their FA. Jacoby Jones, Bernard Pollard and Vonta Leach anyone?

HOU-TEX
03-13-2013, 03:50 PM
Dude? You're quickly becoming a nuisance.

Stop with the knee-jerk commenting!!!

Nawzer
03-13-2013, 03:51 PM
If you're sick and tired then just stop following the team. It's just a sport, it should be fun.

TigerV1
03-13-2013, 03:52 PM
LMAO! Please the Ravens won a Superbowl because of their FA. Jacoby Jones, Bernard Pollard and Vonta Leach anyone?

Don't let facts guide you...make comments based on emotions because that's way more accurate. Keep on trolling...

PapaL
03-13-2013, 03:53 PM
Dude? You're quickly becoming a nuisance.

Stop with the knee-jerk commenting!!!

Glad I'm not the only one that feels this way.

Doppelganger
03-13-2013, 03:55 PM
Our championship window is rapidly closing and you go out and let valuable players go?

I would argue Quin was our 2nd best defensive player outside of Justin James Watt.

JJ Watt
Antonio Smith
Jonathan Joseph
Kareem Jackson
Daniel Manning/Brooks Reed

I strongly disagree. Quinn was maybe 7th best.
Remember all those big plays where the receivers got behind the defense and got big td receptions? It's the safety's responsibility to stop that from happening.

Dutchrudder
03-13-2013, 03:56 PM
I don't care. Whatever it is, the Texans could've matched Glover Quin contract. They're choosing to be fiscally responsible for future years and ignoring the rapidly-closing window right in front of their faces. I don't give a **** if matching Quin and Barwin might lead to a massive purge come 2015/2016, because the fact of the matter is, those aren't likely to be contending years anyway. Not with this core, at least. You have maybe two more years of the Schaub/Foster/Johnson era. If you can make yourself a bigger Super Bowl contender in the meantime, it's well worth dropping from 8-8 to 5-11 in three years.

It's pretty much the exact opposite of the Daryl Morey approach (championship or bust). With the Texans, it's what keeps them competitive and in the playoff hunt for the longest possible time. There just isn't the emphasis on building a true contender.

SMH
:toropalm::toropalm:

Translation:
http://i465.photobucket.com/albums/rr14/themishkin/GIFs/L7sq3.gif

:D

SCOTTexans
03-13-2013, 03:58 PM
If you have no patience then there is no way your a fan of this team....:rake:

coon
03-13-2013, 03:59 PM
I don't care. Whatever it is, the Texans could've matched Glover Quin contract. They're choosing to be fiscally responsible for future years and ignoring the rapidly-closing window right in front of their faces. I don't give a **** if matching Quin and Barwin might lead to a massive purge come 2015/2016, because the fact of the matter is, those aren't likely to be contending years anyway. Not with this core, at least. You have maybe two more years of the Schaub/Foster/Johnson era. If you can make yourself a bigger Super Bowl contender in the meantime, it's well worth dropping from 8-8 to 5-11 in three years.

It's pretty much the exact opposite of the Daryl Morey approach (championship or bust). With the Texans, it's what keeps them competitive and in the playoff hunt for the longest possible time. There just isn't the emphasis on building a true contender.

SMH
:toropalm::toropalm:

If we just match contracts to keep everyone, it will bite us back when J.J. WATT is a free agent. Glover is solid and I really wish we could have kept him, but not worth overpaying.

For the record, Morey DOES NOT overpay for players unless they are stars, so he would have done the same thing.

Playoffs
03-13-2013, 04:03 PM
I would argue Quin was our 2nd best defensive player outside of Justin James Watt.
Dude? You're quickly becoming a nuisance.

Stop with the knee-jerk commenting!!!
This.

And stop with the basketball references. Football ain't basketball, son. http://i1208.photobucket.com/albums/cc366/PlagueEleven/Smileys/no.gif

TexanBacker93
03-13-2013, 06:10 PM
LMAO! Please the Ravens won a Superbowl because of their FA. Jacoby Jones, Bernard Pollard and Vonta Leach anyone?

The Ravens used FA to supplement what they already had. Flacco, Rice, Suggs, Lewis, Reed, Ellerbe, and Ngata were all more important over the year and were all draft picks.

You build a foundation with draft picks. FA should be like adding granite countertops. They're nice, but mean nothing if the initial foundation isn't there.

houstonspartan
03-13-2013, 06:16 PM
If we just match contracts to keep everyone, it will bite us back when J.J. WATT is a free agent. Glover is solid and I really wish we could have kept him, but not worth overpaying.



Yep. We have got to start looking ahead to JJ's next contract. The federal reserve doesn't print enough money that it will likely take to pay him. His next contract is going to be MASSIVE, and Bob McNair will likely never, ever, ever, ever let him go. We have to prepare now.

Texan_Bill
03-13-2013, 07:21 PM
LMAO! Please the Ravens won a Superbowl because of their FA. Jacoby Jones, Bernard Pollard and Vonta Leach anyone?

:mcnugget:

They won because of their free agents?? :spit: Pollard was so instrumental the Ravens released him.

I guess guys like Ray Rice, Anquan Boldin, Suggs, Lewis weren't the reason???? Hell, as much as I dislike Flacco (and know he'll come back down to Earth), him? Shall I keep going?

BullBlitz
03-13-2013, 07:28 PM
I'm not panicking at all. If anything it's kind of fun to talk about something football related. My happiness or sadness doesn't depend on a football team.

Same here.

It's like the Keystone Cops down there. Actually funny to watch how they think they are being so shrewd, end up getting fans' hopes up every year and end the season with a thud.

Texan_Bill
03-13-2013, 07:34 PM
It's pretty much the exact opposite of the Daryl Morey approach (championship or bust). With the Texans, it's what keeps them competitive and in the playoff hunt for the longest possible time. There just isn't the emphasis on building a true contender.


This is coming from someone who is relatively a Daryl Morey "guy", how many Championships has Daryl won in now his 6th season, again? Hell, how many playoff series have the Rockets won under his watch...

Dumbest comparison, ever.


If we just match contracts to keep everyone, it will bite us back when J.J. WATT is a free agent. Glover is solid and I really wish we could have kept him, but not worth overpaying.

For the record, Morey DOES NOT overpay for players unless they are stars, so he would have done the same thing.


Exactly!! (On both points) Although I have an aside or two:

A) I do think the Texans should've or could've afforded Quin at what Detroit's offer was.

B) What superstar has Morey paid for? "The Beard" maybe a superstar in the making, but even still, Morey didn't overpay.

Other than that, you were spot on..........

AND FTR, I'm done with basketball comparisons.... I'm looking at you Asidd_1990

steelbtexan
03-13-2013, 07:37 PM
I'm not panicking at all. If anything it's kind of fun to talk about something football related. My happiness or sadness doesn't depend on a football team.

Yep,

This is what BoB is looking for in season ticet holders.

No resaon to strive to be the best.

Lets keep the $$$ rolling in.


I cant believe nataive Texans carry your sentiment.

76Texan
03-13-2013, 07:47 PM
Yep,

This is what BoB is looking for in season ticet holders.

No resaon to strive to be the best.

Lets keep the $$$ rolling in.


I cant believe nataive Texans carry your sentiment.

They've been spending all of their cap allowance every year, what else can they do?

dalemurphy
03-13-2013, 08:02 PM
Yep,

This is what BoB is looking for in season ticet holders.

No resaon to strive to be the best.

Lets keep the $$$ rolling in.


I cant believe nataive Texans carry your sentiment.

Guess what?: according to Baltimore sources, the Texans have been actively pursuing Ed Reed since early yesterday, at least.

In other words, we are reacting to incompetent and lazy local beatwriters not incompetent and lazy personnel management by the Texans. They are active but nobody knows it. Thanks JM.

Uncle Rico
03-13-2013, 08:11 PM
If Smith lets Hall of Famer Ed Reed leave town without a contract he should get ****canned immediately.

Texan_Bill
03-13-2013, 08:15 PM
Guess what?: according to Baltimore sources, the Texans have been actively pursuing Ed Reed since early yesterday, at least.

In other words, we are reacting to incompetent and lazy local beatwriters not incompetent and lazy personnel management by the Texans. They are active but nobody knows it. Thanks JM.

Not only "pancakes", don't forget to include ex-Jags beat writer Tania Ganguli!! She sucks too.

Titans Sux 72
03-13-2013, 08:18 PM
Same here. I truly believe we can build a really strong defense for the next several years. We are going to become the new Ravens in terms of having a dominating defense year in and year out.

Having guys like J.J. Watt, who is the best defensive player in the NFL and only 23 years old, Brian Cushing (26), Brooks Reed (26), Whitney Mercilus (22). We've got a great foundation of young studs for our 3-4 defense. I trust our front office to draft a solid nose tackle, another inside linebacker and safety. We will add even more talent soon. Even if they're not all home runs I believe Wade Phillips' coaching is enough to turn even a bad young defensive player into somebody good. If they are already good he can turn them into a pro bowler and superstar.

By the way, I haven't ruled out 23-year-old defensive end Jared Crick from developing into a special player in this league. All he needs is another year to get settled in but he has "beast ability" in my eyes. I'm kind of hoping he'll be our solution one day when Antonio Smith's contract runs out or if he's eventually released for cap savings.

I totally agree BOP. They are gonna build this team ie the rat birds. Very strong D to hide Schaubs weaknesses. One of these years they are gonna hit on a WR in the draft. It's like they used all of their WR mojo in the draft on AJ.
I trust the FO and their lack of participation in FA. See what happens to all these teams signing multiple FAs in the next 2 years. Total cap he77 and unloading of these players ie the Eagles 2 years ago. Dream team my azzzz!

Brisco_County
03-13-2013, 08:21 PM
Even if they weren't pursuing Reed, someone's first assumption should not be that the decision to release a player was made out of incompetence. That does happen on some teams, but Smith has earned benefit of the doubt ten times over. Even from people sitting in their underwear on the internet who would've been better GM's but just didn't feel like opening all those books.

Uncle Rico
03-13-2013, 08:25 PM
Even if they weren't pursuing Reed, someone's first assumption should not be that the decision to release a player was made out of incompetence. That does happen on some teams, but Smith has earned benefit of the doubt ten times over. Even from people sitting in their underwear on the internet who would've been better GM's but just didn't feel opening all those books.

Please educate me on how exactly Rick Smith has earned this free pass and the benefit of the doubt 'ten times over'. Perhaps you can convince a guy who feels that Rick Smith is actually not very good at his job. Not imcompetent, but not talented to where his ability is actually accounting for win shares.

76Texan
03-13-2013, 08:28 PM
Even if they weren't pursuing Reed, someone's first assumption should not be that the decision to release a player was made out of incompetence. That does happen on some teams, but Smith has earned benefit of the doubt ten times over. Even from people sitting in their underwear on the internet who would've been better GM's but just didn't feel opening all those books.

And besides, he does have to answer to Wade Phillip.

Uncle Rico
03-13-2013, 08:40 PM
And besides, he does have to answer to Wade Phillip.

LOL, well some people would have you believe that Wade didnt have any input on some of the defensive signings over the last 2 years either. It was all Rick Smith.

leebigeztx
03-13-2013, 08:41 PM
The best deals are after everyone spent their stimilus money early. There will be some great bargains real soon. As the draft nears, the deals get even better. This draft is very deep with quality players. The texans will need to add vets and that shouldnt be a real problem. One poster said what i had been thinking and talking about since at least yesterday. Huff,DHB,and Phillips would be excellent additions. They probably can get each for about 3m per with very little guaranteed money. Huff is actually a better player than quinn, but was under a monster deal. DHB is the deep threat who looked like he was on his way 2 yrs ago. He's big strong and fast, but still fights the ball, but maybe texans can help he resurrect his career. Phillips is a olb who wade has history with. Even when Merriman was lights out, phillips was the consistent 10 sack guy even though he didnt rush the passer alot.

Texecutioner
03-13-2013, 08:42 PM
As of 3pm on Wednesday, the Texans were one of four teams not to have signed a free agent:

Jets- who are in cap hell and reorganizing

Packers

Patriots

** So, I don't think the inactivity is something to panic over. Just like the Texans, the Packers and Patriots are losing key contributors to their teams.

Packers, beyond Jennings and Charles Woodson, have lost some contributors and have other players dangling out in the wind

Patriots are about to lose Welker and have lost key elements of their offensive line.

Yes, trust the Texans management Dale. Because they have done such wonders in their history as a franchise. Is this some sort of a joke?

ATXtexanfan
03-13-2013, 08:45 PM
Front office that extended schaub. Trust them alright

Brisco_County
03-13-2013, 08:51 PM
Please educate me on how exactly Rick Smith has earned this free pass and the benefit of the doubt 'ten times over'. Perhaps you can convince a guy who feels that Rick Smith is actually not very good at his job. Not imcompetent, but not talented to where his ability is actually accounting for win shares.

Mario Williams. Dunta Robinson. Bringing the payroll under an unexpectedly lowered cap and still going 12-4. Passing on Asomugha for Joseph. Danieal Manning. Is that still not enough?

Uncle Rico
03-13-2013, 08:59 PM
Mario Williams. Dunta Robinson. Bringing the payroll under an unexpectedly lowered cap and still going 12-4. Passing on Asomugha for Joseph. Danieal Manning. Is that still not enough?

LOL. okay. (pssss he was outbid for Namdi, but you didnt hear that from me, and if you think that wasnt his first choice then you smoking the cheeba - great consolation prize in Joseph, and only a checkbook made that happen, not like JJo turned down more money or anything like that either. Manning was a solid pickup, even though he did have a down year compared to the first. Yup he brought down the payroll by removing 40% of the starting offensive line, cutting players that strangely go on to become significant factors for other teams. Gets had on trades, when he does make one.

I guess to answer your question, no ... that is not enough. As fans we should have higher expectations especially now that we are winning.

leebigeztx
03-13-2013, 09:11 PM
LOL. okay. (pssss he was outbid for Namdi, but you didnt hear that from me, and if you think that wasnt his first choice then you smoking the cheeba - great consolation prize in Joseph, and only a checkbook made that happen, not like JJo turned down more money or anything like that either. Manning was a solid pickup, even though he did have a down year compared to the first. Yup he brought down the payroll by removing 40% of the starting offensive line, cutting players that strangely go on to become significant factors for other teams. Gets had on trades, when he does make one.

I guess to answer your question, no ... that is not enough. As fans we should have higher expectations especially now that we are winning.

Joseph had more money on the table in tampa who had like 50m in cap room.

Titans Sux 72
03-13-2013, 09:24 PM
LOL. okay. (pssss he was outbid for Namdi, but you didnt hear that from me, and if you think that wasnt his first choice then you smoking the cheeba - great consolation prize in Joseph, and only a checkbook made that happen, not like JJo turned down more money or anything like that either. Manning was a solid pickup, even though he did have a down year compared to the first. Yup he brought down the payroll by removing 40% of the starting offensive line, cutting players that strangely go on to become significant factors for other teams. Gets had on trades, when he does make one.

I guess to answer your question, no ... that is not enough. As fans we should have higher expectations especially now that we are winning.

And who are those "players" you speak of?
Jacoby Jones? You mean the same JJ that fumbled the punt and gift wrapped 7 points to the ratbirds in 2011? And then EVERYBODY wanted him gone?
Trindon Holliday? Guy had 2 yrs to Shiite or get off the pot and was taking a spot on the roster that they had to use due to Cush's injury. Oh well.

What other players did Rick Smith cut that were "significant factors" on other teams. Lol

Uncle Rico
03-13-2013, 09:28 PM
Joseph had more money on the table in tampa who had like 50m in cap room.

He also had an offer from Detroit, were they that much more than the 50 MILL he signed for here? Doubt it.

Uncle Rico
03-13-2013, 09:36 PM
And who are those "players" you speak of?
Jacoby Jones? You mean the same JJ that fumbled the punt and gift wrapped 7 points to the ratbirds in 2011? And then EVERYBODY wanted him gone?
Trindon Holliday? Guy had 2 yrs to Shiite or get off the pot and was taking a spot on the roster that they had to use due to Cush's injury. Oh well.

What other players did Rick Smith cut that were "significant factors" on other teams. Lol

Winston comes to mind, but Im guessing you're in the "Winston sucks fold" and maybe I have worse eyesight than I care to admit, but didnt Holliday break a few records? Jacoby doing the Choppa City Juke in the Super Bowl? Catching the hail mary to win what was probably the most exciting game in NFL history? You so nonchalantly throw it out there as if its a note of distinction FOR Smith when actually it counts against him.

BullBlitz
03-13-2013, 09:41 PM
And who are those "players" you speak of?
Jacoby Jones? You mean the same JJ that fumbled the punt and gift wrapped 7 points to the ratbirds in 2011? And then EVERYBODY wanted him gone?
Trindon Holliday? Guy had 2 yrs to Shiite or get off the pot and was taking a spot on the roster that they had to use due to Cush's injury. Oh well.

What other players did Rick Smith cut that were "significant factors" on other teams. Lol

Who cares who he let go? The players he kept haven't done jack either. L O L

steelbtexan
03-13-2013, 09:48 PM
This is all about signing Cushing and Watt in the next 2 yrs. I wouldn't count on ordering those SB rings with a broken down QB any time soon though. Not that there will be any reprecussions from those decisions.

BTW, I'm all for letting Quin walk and accepting our fate as Texans fans, if it means re-signing a HEALTHY Watt- Cushing. Cushing is a hope, Quin is healthy as of now.

Titans Sux 72
03-13-2013, 09:49 PM
Winston comes to mind, but Im guessing you're in the "Winston sucks fold" and maybe I have worse eyesight than I care to admit, but didnt Holliday break a few records? Jacoby doing the Choppa City Juke in the Super Bowl? Catching the hail mary to win what was probably the most exciting game in NFL history? You so nonchalantly throw it out there as if its a note of distinction FOR Smith when actually it counts against him.

Winston was so great the Chiefs cut him. LMFAO.

Fail

Texan_Bill
03-13-2013, 09:51 PM
LOL, well some people would have you believe that Wade didnt have any input on some of the defensive signings over the last 2 years either. It was all Rick Smith.

:mcnugget: Who??

Texan_Bill
03-13-2013, 09:54 PM
Winston comes to mind, but Im guessing you're in the "Winston sucks fold" and maybe I have worse eyesight than I care to admit, but didnt Holliday break a few records? Jacoby doing the Choppa City Juke in the Super Bowl? Catching the hail mary to win what was probably the most exciting game in NFL history? You so nonchalantly throw it out there as if its a note of distinction FOR Smith when actually it counts against him.

Winston was so great the Chiefs cut him. LMFAO.

Fail

Winston certainly didn't suck, but at the same time it was smart to cut him at the time for both the Texans and Chefs.

tru80texan
03-13-2013, 10:02 PM
Winston was so great the Chiefs cut him. LMFAO.

Fail

That was a failed example on your behalf. Expand the horizons some. Some players fit certain schemes better then others & it's well known that Winston is a ZBS player which Reid does NOT utilize on a regular basis if at all. Winston had a good year a a Chief & was let go because of scheme & not poor play. Get the LMFAO under control because that was a horrible comeback. :pop:

Titans Sux 72
03-13-2013, 10:04 PM
Winston comes to mind, but Im guessing you're in the "Winston sucks fold" and maybe I have worse eyesight than I care to admit, but didnt Holliday break a few records? Jacoby doing the Choppa City Juke in the Super Bowl? Catching the hail mary to win what was probably the most exciting game in NFL history? You so nonchalantly throw it out there as if its a note of distinction FOR Smith when actually it counts against him.

You also guessed wrong. Never thought Winston sucked but you stated released players were "significant" additions to their new teams. Winston was NOT. if so he'd still be a Chief.

Titans Sux 72
03-13-2013, 10:10 PM
That was a failed example on your behalf. Expand the horizons some. Some players fit certain schemes better then others & it's well known that Winston is a ZBS player which Reid does NOT utilize on a regular basis if at all. Winston had a good year a a Chief & was let go because of scheme & not poor play. Get the LMFAO under control because that was a horrible comeback. :pop:

Ok I'll play.
Rico stated Released players by Rick Smith were "significant factors" on their new team.

Well was he?

If so why was he released?

I never questioned his play.

Scheme schmeme .... If he was a "significant factor" he'd still be a Chief. LMFAO

Brisco_County
03-13-2013, 10:12 PM
LOL. okay. (pssss he was outbid for Namdi, but you didnt hear that from me, and if you think that wasnt his first choice then you smoking the cheeba - great consolation prize in Joseph, and only a checkbook made that happen, not like JJo turned down more money or anything like that either. Manning was a solid pickup, even though he did have a down year compared to the first. Yup he brought down the payroll by removing 40% of the starting offensive line, cutting players that strangely go on to become significant factors for other teams. Gets had on trades, when he does make one.

I guess to answer your question, no ... that is not enough. As fans we should have higher expectations especially now that we are winning.

Asomugha was still available (and affordable) when Smith decided on Joseph. He deserves credit for the timing of the decision.

And Tampa would've paid Joseph more, but I don't see how that's relevant anyway.

And the portion of the offensive line he released is either damaged goods now or was overpaid.

And your tone sucks. It makes the discussion unenjoyable.

tru80texan
03-13-2013, 10:19 PM
Ok I'll play.
Rico stated Released players by Rick Smith were "significant factors" on their new team.

Well was he?

If so why was he released?

I never questioned his play.

Scheme schmeme .... If he was a "significant factor" he'd still be a Chief. LMFAO

Yes, Winston was a "significant factor" for the Chiefs as a ZBS team. If I recall he was rated as a Top 10 RT last season as well. That's not too shabby, IMO, & most would consider that "significant" contribution. Once again, it's a new HC who probably has a different type of T that he prefers & thus he chose to move on. Once again, doesn't mean Winston played bad or is bad player. Scheme plays a role in these types of decisions all time & Winston will get another starting job this season, I'm sure. Still a bad example IMO. Just saying...

tru80texan
03-13-2013, 10:27 PM
Asomugha was still available (and affordable) when Smith decided on Joseph. He deserves credit for the timing of the decision.

And Tampa would've paid Joseph more, but I don't see how that's relevant anyway.

And the portion of the offensive line he released is either damaged goods now or was overpaid.

And your tone sucks. It makes the discussion unenjoyable.

If I recall correctly, Asomugha was reported to have turned down more money from other teams to play for a team that he desired to play for which was the Eagles. One of those teams was rumored to be a 6-10 Texans team. Hard to blame him for that decision, but I think the Texans moved on from Asomugha because of his doing & not because Smith made a genius move in deciding between the 2. Joseph was the next best one & that wasnt exactly a tough decision. I'm glad Asomugha chose elsewhere & Joseph is a Texan, but it was an obvious move as opposed to great foresight IMO.

I agree Briesel was overpaid, but who was "damaged goods"? Winston played well last season according to most & the stats. That doesn't necessarily say "damaged goods" to me.

76Texan
03-13-2013, 10:42 PM
At the end of the day, it's win and loss that count.

The Texans 53 wins since 2007 trailed only 8 teams in the league.

That's a good job by the GM, especially considering a lot of folks don't think much of Kubiak and detest Richard Smith and Frank Bush.

tru80texan
03-13-2013, 10:54 PM
At the end of the day, it's win and loss that count.

The Texans 53 wins since 2007 trailed only 8 teams in the league.

That's a good job by the GM, especially considering a lot of folks don't think much of Kubiak and detest Richard Smith and Frank Bush.

I think that's a matter of opinion. What it boils down to, IMO, is since 2007 we only have 2 Division titles, 2 playoff appearances, & 2 Wild Card wins in those 2 appearances. That's not a whole lot to brag about IMO. Of those 53 wins none of them is the one that matters the most & I'm not sure this team is getting closer to or further away from that most important win w/ some their recent decisions, last offseason & this one so far. Time will tell but they don't hand championships out to the 9th team w/ the most wins since 2007 so I'm not feeling much better about celebrating a useless statistic. Just another example of celebrating baby steps accomplishments, IMO, but to each their own.

Brisco_County
03-13-2013, 10:59 PM
If I recall correctly, Asomugha was reported to have turned down more money from other teams to play for a team that he desired to play for which was the Eagles. One of those teams was rumored to be a 6-10 Texans team. Hard to blame him for that decision, but I think the Texans moved on from Asomugha because of his doing & not because Smith made a genius move in deciding between the 2. Joseph was the next best one & that wasnt exactly a tough decision. I'm glad Asomugha chose elsewhere & Joseph is a Texan, but it was an obvious move as opposed to great foresight IMO.

I agree Briesel was overpaid, but who was "damaged goods"? Winston played well last season according to most & the stats. That doesn't necessarily say "damaged goods" to me.

Asomugha had no aversion to the Texans at the time, and he was in serious talks with Smith.

We mentioned last night that the Texans were working hard to sign either Nnamdi Asomugha or Johnathan Joseph last night.

According to NFL Network’s Michael Lombardi, Houston is now in the “lead” for Asomugha’s services. He believes the deal would average between $12-14 million per season.

Link (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/28/texans-reportedly-in-lead-for-asomugha/).

After talking with the Texans, Nnamdi sought another bid, and Smith cashed his chips rather than waiting to counter.

Briesel played below expectations in 2012 due mostly to injury. After the season, he had "major" ankle surgery. The Raiders re-signed him, but he took a pay cut and won't be ready for camp. Winston played fine as a Chief, though.

76Texan
03-13-2013, 11:14 PM
I think that's a matter of opinion. What it boils down to, IMO, is since 2007 we only have 2 Division titles, 2 playoff appearances, & 2 Wild Card wins in those 2 appearances. That's not a whole lot to brag about IMO. Of those 53 wins none of them is the one that matters the most & I'm not sure this team is getting closer to or further away from that most important win w/ some their recent decisions, last offseason & this one so far. Time will tell but they don't hand championships out to the 9th team w/ the most wins since 2007 so I'm not feeling much better about celebrating a useless statistic. Just another example of celebrating baby steps accomplishments, IMO, but to each their own.

You can count with one hand the number of teams that won their division more than twice since 2007.

tru80texan
03-13-2013, 11:20 PM
Asomugha had no aversion to the Texans at the time, and he was in serious talks with Smith.



Link (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/28/texans-reportedly-in-lead-for-asomugha/).

After talking with the Texans, Nnamdi sought another bid, and Smith cashed his chips rather than waiting to counter.

Briesel played below expectations in 2012 due mostly to injury. After the season, he had "major" ankle surgery. The Raiders re-signed him, but he took a pay cut and won't be ready for camp. Winston played fine as a Chief, though.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=asomugha%20tuns%20down%20more%20money%20to%20sig n%20with%20eagles&source=web&cd=21&ved=0CC8QFjAAOBQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.newsday.com%2Fsports%2Ffootba ll%2Fasomugha-surprised-he-became-an-eagle-too-1.3064713&ei=rUxBUbmBNdO64AOJMQ&usg=AFQjCNE25Up5C8-Gba97G-fVzikQy69y9A&bvm=bv.43287494,d.eWU

I'm not sure how "serious" the talks could've been if by Asomugha's own admission he made the decision at the last minute because he felt the Eagles gave him the best chance to win & he admits to turning down more money to do so in the 5th or 6th paragraph of the link I provided. Asomugha strung the Texans along until a better offer came along & then he left them at the alter per say. Once again,IMO, it wasn't a genius move on Smith's behalf to move on from Asomugha, it was the only & obvious move to go to the next best thing being Joesph.

Briesel became "damaged goods" AFTER he left the Texans. Thats not why the Texans didn't sign him. It's kinda misleading to insinuate that. Briesel was overpaid & it was understandable on why the Texans didn't re-sign him for that reason & not being "damaged goods". I'm also pretty sure he didn't take a pay cut, but restructured it to a bonus.

The agent for Raiders RG Mike Brisiel clarified that his client lost no money upon restructuring his contract.
Initially believed to have taken a pay cut, Brisiel will instead receive a guaranteed roster bonus of $3 million next week in exchange for slashing his salary from $4.35 million to $1.35 million. The $3 million payment will be treated like a signing bonus and prorated over the contract's life, lowering Brisiel's 2013 salary cap charge but increasing his cap number in future years. Mar 5 - 12:15 AM
Source: Associated Press

tru80texan
03-13-2013, 11:44 PM
You can count with one hand the number of teams that won their division more than twice since 2007.

You are correct, but how does that pertain to the Texans because that is not something that they have accomplished either considering they have only won it twice. Yet 10 teams have matched the Texans in winning their division at least twice since 2007 & many of those teams have more then 2 playoff wins in that time frame as well. Once again, it's celebrated "baby steps" that are not the ultimate goal for most, but held in high regard in Houston...for some.

Uncle Rico
03-14-2013, 12:06 AM
I felt the F.O. got cocky. Had a good year and felt like they thought they could easily replace some of these guys, and it backfired big time. When in a playoff game you are rotating in and out the whole right side of the line there is a problem.

When you're using a TE to lead block for you. Problem.

Glad you brought up Briesel, I loved that guy. Ol' boy went out there on a freaking broken leg and gave you his heart and soul. Warrior in the trenches, and I guess its just me, but he was a great OL in my eyes.

Yea Winston sucks, he's only helped block for a top 5 back like what the last 4 years in a row?

There are alot of really good players out there signing some bargain deals, you dont have to be 20 MILL under the cap to find good value.

Brisco_County
03-14-2013, 12:45 AM
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=asomugha%20tuns%20down%20more%20money%20to%20sig n%20with%20eagles&source=web&cd=21&ved=0CC8QFjAAOBQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.newsday.com%2Fsports%2Ffootba ll%2Fasomugha-surprised-he-became-an-eagle-too-1.3064713&ei=rUxBUbmBNdO64AOJMQ&usg=AFQjCNE25Up5C8-Gba97G-fVzikQy69y9A&bvm=bv.43287494,d.eWU

I'm not sure how "serious" the talks could've been if by Asomugha's own admission he made the decision at the last minute because he felt the Eagles gave him the best chance to win & he admits to turning down more money to do so in the 5th or 6th paragraph of the link I provided. Asomugha strung the Texans along until a better offer came along & then he left them at the alter per say. Once again,IMO, it wasn't a genius move on Smith's behalf to move on from Asomugha, it was the only & obvious move to go to the next best thing being Joesph.

Briesel became "damaged goods" AFTER he left the Texans. Thats not why the Texans didn't sign him. It's kinda misleading to insinuate that. Briesel was overpaid & it was understandable on why the Texans didn't re-sign him for that reason & not being "damaged goods". I'm also pretty sure he didn't take a pay cut, but restructured it to a bonus.

The agent for Raiders RG Mike Brisiel clarified that his client lost no money upon restructuring his contract.
Initially believed to have taken a pay cut, Brisiel will instead receive a guaranteed roster bonus of $3 million next week in exchange for slashing his salary from $4.35 million to $1.35 million. The $3 million payment will be treated like a signing bonus and prorated over the contract's life, lowering Brisiel's 2013 salary cap charge but increasing his cap number in future years. Mar 5 - 12:15 AM
Source: Associated Press

The Niners, Jets, Cowboys, and Texans were all courting him, and Philly wasn't part of the picture yet. The Jets were the most aggressive, but at that point he had spent the most time negotiating with the Texans. When it became apparent that Joseph would be gone by the time Asomugha reached a decision, Smith pulled out of the sweepstakes and signed Joseph. That caught all other parties by surprise, and left Rob Ryan competing with Rex Ryan for him. After almost a week of that, Philly swooped in with a $60 million offer that no one saw coming. The whole thing was a circus. But negotiations ended on Smith's decision, not Asomugha's.

Not implying that Brisiel was already damaged goods, just that he's injury prone. He missed 21 games in his final three seasons in Houston, and his first season in Oakland perpetuated the trend.

dalemurphy
03-14-2013, 12:52 AM
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=asomugha%20tuns%20down%20more%20money%20to%20sig n%20with%20eagles&source=web&cd=21&ved=0CC8QFjAAOBQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.newsday.com%2Fsports%2Ffootba ll%2Fasomugha-surprised-he-became-an-eagle-too-1.3064713&ei=rUxBUbmBNdO64AOJMQ&usg=AFQjCNE25Up5C8-Gba97G-fVzikQy69y9A&bvm=bv.43287494,d.eWU

I'm not sure how "serious" the talks could've been if by Asomugha's own admission he made the decision at the last minute because he felt the Eagles gave him the best chance to win & he admits to turning down more money to do so in the 5th or 6th paragraph of the link I provided. Asomugha strung the Texans along until a better offer came along & then he left them at the alter per say. Once again,IMO, it wasn't a genius move on Smith's behalf to move on from Asomugha, it was the only & obvious move to go to the next best thing being Joesph.

Briesel became "damaged goods" AFTER he left the Texans. Thats not why the Texans didn't sign him. It's kinda misleading to insinuate that. Briesel was overpaid & it was understandable on why the Texans didn't re-sign him for that reason & not being "damaged goods". I'm also pretty sure he didn't take a pay cut, but restructured it to a bonus.

The agent for Raiders RG Mike Brisiel clarified that his client lost no money upon restructuring his contract.
Initially believed to have taken a pay cut, Brisiel will instead receive a guaranteed roster bonus of $3 million next week in exchange for slashing his salary from $4.35 million to $1.35 million. The $3 million payment will be treated like a signing bonus and prorated over the contract's life, lowering Brisiel's 2013 salary cap charge but increasing his cap number in future years. Mar 5 - 12:15 AM
Source: Associated Press

This is very cynical and intellectually dishonest... You make assumptions about how things transpired, beyond the known facts... and, anywhere credit is due Smith you argue it is "obvious" or the only decision... Based on what? on your presumption that he's not a good GM. So, you view each event as it unfolds as if Smith doesn't know what he's doing, interpret the events assuming his weakness, and then criticize him if things go poorly while discrediting his contributions if they go well. Okay... I can't argue with you.

dalemurphy
03-14-2013, 01:03 AM
You are correct, but how does that pertain to the Texans because that is not something that they have accomplished either considering they have only won it twice. Yet 10 teams have matched the Texans in winning their division at least twice since 2007 & many of those teams have more then 2 playoff wins in that time frame as well. Once again, it's celebrated "baby steps" that are not the ultimate goal for most, but held in high regard in Houston...for some.

Nobody is suggestint the Texans have reached the ultimate goal. This discussion is about the effectiveness of the current decison-makers in the Texans' organization. Nobody is nominating them for the Hall-of-Fame. We are saying they are making consistently effective decisions and that they have put the team in position for multiple shots at the "ultimate goal".

Frame it however you would like. The Texans' organization is currently behaving like one of the better organizations in the NFL. Out of 32 teams, you would be hard-pressed to study each of them indepth and find more than a three or four who are operating better than the Texans in terms of any set of the following criteria:

1. wins
2. drafting
3. value based on contract dollars to on-field production
4. age of starters/heavy contributors
5. dead money in the cap this year and/or next year
6. bad contracts eating cap dollars and difficult to cut loose from.
7. # of picks in 2013 or likely in 2014
8. opinion of NFL insiders
9. stability


*** however you look at it, things are very good. We are speaking about the present and the future. I am not arguing that they failed to win a Superbowl in 2009 or 2010 or 2011... I know that. But, that's the past. My concern, now is only: are they making decisions that increase the probability of a Superbowl in the next few years?.. I think, "yes... definitely".

beerlover
03-14-2013, 02:51 AM
Nobody is suggestint the Texans have reached the ultimate goal. This discussion is about the effectiveness of the current decison-makers in the Texans' organization. Nobody is nominating them for the Hall-of-Fame. We are saying they are making consistently effective decisions and that they have put the team in position for multiple shots at the "ultimate goal".

Frame it however you would like. The Texans' organization is currently behaving like one of the better organizations in the NFL. Out of 32 teams, you would be hard-pressed to study each of them indepth and find more than a three or four who are operating better than the Texans in terms of any set of the following criteria:

1. wins
2. drafting
3. value based on contract dollars to on-field production
4. age of starters/heavy contributors
5. dead money in the cap this year and/or next year
6. bad contracts eating cap dollars and difficult to cut loose from.
7. # of picks in 2013 or likely in 2014
8. opinion of NFL insiders
9. stability


*** however you look at it, things are very good. We are speaking about the present and the future. I am not arguing that they failed to win a Superbowl in 2009 or 2010 or 2011... I know that. But, that's the past. My concern, now is only: are they making decisions that increase the probability of a Superbowl in the next few years?.. I think, "yes... definitely".

excellent post but still your dipping into the :koolaid: nothing wrong with that & I hope you are right but losing top draft picks on their second contracts is disturbing & somewhat self destructive.

Texans have an average QB & should be paid as such, this basically caps your core players moving forward since its the highest paid position. Your a good guy for numbers, can you tell me how much Texans have spent on QB position relative to cap numbers since inception? My guess its just under 20% of the teams cap room & performance to date does not support that as a good investment. I would much rather see that money spent on keeping Cushing & Watt.

infantrycak
03-14-2013, 02:58 AM
My guess its just under 20% of the teams cap room...

2013 will be about 8.6%, 2014 about 11.5%.

dalemurphy
03-14-2013, 03:26 AM
excellent post but still your dipping into the :koolaid: nothing wrong with that & I hope you are right but losing top draft picks on their second contracts is disturbing & somewhat self destructive.

Texans have an average QB & should be paid as such, this basically caps your core players moving forward since its the highest paid position. Your a good guy for numbers, can you tell me how much Texans have spent on QB position relative to cap numbers since inception? My guess its just under 20% of the teams cap room & performance to date does not support that as a good investment. I would much rather see that money spent on keeping Cushing & Watt.

Matt's cap hit this year is just under $11 million, so less than 10% of the cap.

2014 it is about $14 million, so between 11 and 12% of the cap...

After 2014, the Texans can cut Schaub loose for a $7 million cap hit. So, if the Texans find their next guy, you won't have to see Schaub after that, unless he willingly renogitiates his contract.

thunderkyss
03-14-2013, 06:24 AM
Matt's cap hit this year is just under $11 million, so less than 10% of the cap.

2014 it is about $14 million, so between 11 and 12% of the cap...

After 2014, the Texans can cut Schaub loose for a $7 million cap hit. So, if the Texans find their next guy, you won't have to see Schaub after that, unless he willingly renogitiates his contract.

Well, that's still too much. He should not be getting paid more than Tim Tebow.

:kitten:

IDEXAN
03-14-2013, 07:31 AM
So many Texans' fans are crying and whining about Rick Smith not getting or
retaining some all of these FAs. Well boys & girls, daddy Rick got a new car for the family a couple years ago when he signed the likes of JayJoe & Manning and others and he can't get a new car for us every year. He needs to save up for another new car in the next couple years, see familys finances won't allow a new car every year. So grow up and learn that lesson, OK ?

SCOTTexans
03-14-2013, 07:33 AM
This is very cynical and intellectually dishonest... You make assumptions about how things transpired, beyond the known facts... and, anywhere credit is due Smith you argue it is "obvious" or the only decision... Based on what? on your presumption that he's not a good GM. So, you view each event as it unfolds as if Smith doesn't know what he's doing, interpret the events assuming his weakness, and then criticize him if things go poorly while discrediting his contributions if they go well. Okay... I can't argue with you.

Completely agree with the bold. repped

All the non-facts he turns into negative assumption towards the texans FO to try to prove a point...

handswarmer
03-14-2013, 09:38 AM
You can count with one hand the number of teams that won their division more than twice since 2007.

In the AFC, Pats (5 times), Ravens (2 times), Steelers (3 times), Colts (3 times), Texans (2 times), Broncos (2 times), Chargers (3 times).

Thats a seven fingered hand.


In the NFC, Giants (2 times), Cowboys (2 times), Packers (3 times), Vikings (2 times), Falcons (2 times), Saints (2 times), 49ers (2 times), Seahwaks (2 times) and Cardinals (2 times).

Thats a nine fingered hand.


Creepy.

handswarmer
03-14-2013, 09:39 AM
How many GM's have the Texans had since inception?

dalemurphy
03-14-2013, 09:50 AM
In the AFC, Pats (5 times), Ravens (2 times), Steelers (3 times), Colts (3 times), Texans (2 times), Broncos (2 times), Chargers (3 times).

Thats a seven fingered hand.


In the NFC, Giants (2 times), Cowboys (2 times), Packers (3 times), Vikings (2 times), Falcons (2 times), Saints (2 times), 49ers (2 times), Seahwaks (2 times) and Cardinals (2 times).

Thats a nine fingered hand.


Creepy.

He said "more than twice": Patriots, Colts, Steelers, Chargers, Packers...

* His point is that based on that criteria, there are only 5 teams to be more successful than the Texans since Smith arrived. Given the unpredictability of the NFL playoffs, the best method for Superbowl success seems to be to get the team into the tournament as often as possible and hope the stars align. I can't recall the last time the best team in the regular season won the Superbowl... It's been years!

beerlover
03-14-2013, 10:06 AM
2013 will be about 8.6%, 2014 about 11.5%.

thank you

does that include all players for position (Yates/Keenum)?

still gonna really be hard to keep Watt, Cushing with 10% designated for one position.

steelbtexan
03-14-2013, 03:49 PM
So many Texans' fans are crying and whining about Rick Smith not getting or
retaining some all of these FAs. Well boys & girls, daddy Rick got a new car for the family a couple years ago when he signed the likes of JayJoe & Manning and others and he can't get a new car for us every year. He needs to save up for another new car in the next couple years, see familys finances won't allow a new car every year. So grow up and learn that lesson, OK ?

But the Eagles/Pats/Broncos/Bears/49ers etc... seem to be able to buy that new car every yr. Texans seem to be able to buy that new car once every decade and that was only when the defense was historically bad and the loyal fanbase was about to turn against them. Coincedence?

Rick is an avg GM, for most of the fanbase that's good enough. No need to strive to get better.

TexansFight
03-14-2013, 05:56 PM
Front office that extended schaub. Trust them alright

THIS!! Smithiak regime sucks. The window we had is barely open. Instead of maximizing the window to rock this team just panders to being a real contender. BOO SMITHIAK.

dalemurphy
03-14-2013, 06:18 PM
We are 72 hours into free agency and there are still nearly 400 free agents available... and some very good ones. Lying in the woods waiting is a great strategy. We will find out over the next week or two if that is what the Texans are doing or if they are simply not committed to winning. Big next ten days for me and my optimistic view of the organization. If they sit and do next to nothing, choosing to address gaping holes through the draft and with undrafted rookies, then I'll join all of you in bitterness and resent.

GP
03-14-2013, 06:25 PM
How many GM's have the Texans had since inception?

Two.

Charley "I Am Famous Because I Was GM in Washington When They Won A Super Bowl" Casserly, and now Rick Smith.

Though it is believed that Rick Smith and Gary Kubiak are somehow joined at the hip with their connection to Denver...it needs to be mentioned that Gary was hired as HC well before Rick Smith was made new GM. So, it's not like the GM helped the owner select a HC...instead, the GM was hired after the HC.

Now, some will say that it was probably a done deal with Rick Smith anyways, and that we had him pegged as being the GM because he and Gary Kubiak had ties with one another...blah blah blah...but I don't buy it.

I have always said that Rick Smith will be GM here long past Kubiak's exit. He's been shrewd in his dealings with players--the 2011 spending spree to get Manning and Joseph was, IMO, an effort to purchase what we needed for Wade Phillip's defense (a gamble that paid off, seeing as how we were total crap prior to that). People despise Rick Smith because they think he takes a dump on our guys when he doesn't "need to," such as the outright release of Winston last year...the lack of even making an offer at all to Mario Williams...and you should have seen this place when DeMeco Ryans was traded last year too!

All in all, though, I think he has done way more than Charley Casserly ever did. Charley was awful. AWFUL. I suppose he had to deal with expansion issues, but still...he wasn't very good.

If Rick Smith finds a way to get guys restructured, and we add Ed Reed and maybe even more FA's we don't know about yet, there will be some posters here who might think differently about him. Right now, the book on Rick is that he mismanaged the cap and we're paying for it. Frankly, I think Bob was on board with the risk back in 2011 and is along for the ride with the concept of seeing what it does for us. After 2010, our owner was soul-crushed by the way we weren't making progress with Gary's choices at d-coord. He had two massively huge turds at d-coord and each one failed in BIG ways.

Along comes Wade Phillips, add two free agents in Manning and Joseph, plus Wade helped draft JJ Watt....I mean, looks like things are going pretty well from where I'm sitting. Just we got a QB situation all of a sudden, which wasn't a problem prior to 2012. Bad timing.

eriadoc
03-14-2013, 06:52 PM
thank you

does that include all players for position (Yates/Keenum)?

still gonna really be hard to keep Watt, Cushing with 10% designated for one position.

According to CP on 790 this afternoon, four players on the roster (AJ, JJo, Schaub, and ASmith) make up pretty close to 40% of the cap. OD makes over $5M, and Chris Myers is somewhere in that neighborhood as well, with a $7M hit next season. I'm not a math major, but unless they hire some Congressmen to work this budget, I don't think it's going to work out.

Playoffs
03-14-2013, 07:02 PM
Sometimes you're gonna get outbid. It's obvious Quin wasn't in our plans, and Barwin got a bigger second plus year commitment than many thought was warranted based on 2012.

:tiphat: G'luck boys, until you're lined up across from us. http://www.vpsingles.com/pics/bull.gif

76Texan
03-14-2013, 07:31 PM
According to CP on 790 this afternoon, four players on the roster (AJ, JJo, Schaub, and ASmith) make up pretty close to 40% of the cap. OD makes over $5M, and Chris Myers is somewhere in that neighborhood as well, with a $7M hit next season. I'm not a math major, but unless they hire some Congressmen to work this budget, I don't think it's going to work out.

Until you realize that the Broncos only need 3 players to get to that level (as compared to the Texans 4) and the Broncos are supposed to be in a little better cap position (for now).

It's like looking at a company's Income Statement and Balance sheet , you have to go through all the details in the hope of knowing the real thing (if they don't cook the book.)

dalemurphy
03-14-2013, 07:32 PM
According to CP on 790 this afternoon, four players on the roster (AJ, JJo, Schaub, and ASmith) make up pretty close to 40% of the cap. OD makes over $5M, and Chris Myers is somewhere in that neighborhood as well, with a $7M hit next season. I'm not a math major, but unless they hire some Congressmen to work this budget, I don't think it's going to work out.

ASmith's deal is at the end. They could renegotiate now and save millions, cut him and save $6 million. Or, next year, $9.5 million come off the books. OD, also, can be cut or renegotiated easily next year (2014 is his last). Joseph's is easy to renegotiate after next year as well (in other words, high base salary but very little prorated signing bonus left).

thunderkyss
03-14-2013, 07:54 PM
ASmith's deal is at the end. They could renegotiate now and save millions, cut him and save $6 million. Or, next year, $9.5 million come off the books. OD, also, can be cut or renegotiated easily next year (2014 is his last). Joseph's is easy to renegotiate after next year as well (in other words, high base salary but very little prorated signing bonus left).

I also heard on 610, that Schaub, Myers, & Brown's caphits increase something like $10-13M collectively next year.

dalemurphy
03-14-2013, 08:01 PM
I also heard on 610, that Schaub, Myers, & Brown's caphits increase something like $10-13M collectively next year.

Brown's may tick up slightly, but it's pretty flat throughout the life of the deal. Same with Myers. Schaub's dropped a couple million from 2012 but then rebounds up about 4 mil next year.

Still, Wade Smith's $4 mil will be off the books. Antonio's $9.5 mil will be off the books. Also, Manning and OD will both be in the last year of deals and can be cut to save another $10 million or extended if the team desired to. There's plenty of room for next season. Cushing's 1st year charge under a new deal won't be much different (unless they design it that way) than his charge for 2013. The key is that they have other business to get done and may need to have the option available to franchise Cushing, which requires more cap space.

Here are some other 2014 free agents:
Garrett Graham
Tim Jamison
Ben Tate
Wade Smith
Antonio Smith
Earl Mitchell
plus Cushing.

76Texan
03-14-2013, 08:10 PM
I second Dale.
Based on my estimation (after looking at Dutch's and several websites on cap in the last month), the uptick in the core group is pretty manageable at least for the short-term.

We don't have anything crazy going on; but we don't have a lot of room either (considering Watt and Cushing.)

They are running a pretty good ship far as I can tell.