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pissknocker
03-06-2013, 07:20 PM
Ill be the first to say it bring him in for a looksee. Lets get arian back to form . We all like the caveman

If hes injured nevermind though

Sidenote-poor Luke joeckel gonna waste his talents in kc what a shame

JamesBill
03-06-2013, 07:24 PM
We have cap problems of our own so unless he is willing to play for not much more than Newton makes no way do I want him here.


Nevermind, they actually saved cap space. But only 700K and they are down a starting O-Line starter so unless they fill that with a guy making 700K or less they will have less cap space. Still don't want him.

76Texan
03-06-2013, 07:28 PM
Well, they now have $700K to find his replacement.

Just wonder what his new price tag is going to be now that he has some pocket money already.

JamesBill
03-06-2013, 07:31 PM
Well, they now have $700K to find his replacement.

Just wonder what his new price tag is going to be now that he has some pocket money already.

His agent is Drew Rosenhaus, so I wouldn't count on anything beyond going to the highest bidder.

Allstar
03-06-2013, 08:41 PM
Bring 'em back!

Stemp
03-06-2013, 08:48 PM
I wonder if we make an inquiry to his agent.

steelbtexan
03-06-2013, 08:52 PM
Overrated

But still better than Newton/Harris.

Setting up himself for a career in the media seems to be more important to Winston than improving his craft.

TEXANRED
03-06-2013, 08:52 PM
I wonder if we make an inquiry to his agent.

I hope so.

gary
03-06-2013, 09:31 PM
What's in store for Eric Winston now?

JimBaker488
03-06-2013, 09:59 PM
Looks like Smith & Kubiak knew what they were doing last year, makes them look a lot smarter now with the move to cut Winston a year ago.

GP
03-06-2013, 10:05 PM
Conflicted on this one.

His run blocking was better than anything we had on the right side in 2012.

But one has to wonder if he's thrown in the towel and is ready to pick up the microphone for a new career pursuit.

Then there's that whole messy "You cut me last year, Rick and Gary..." thing going on. With a splash of Drew HoseYourAss who is commanding the highest dollar on anything he represents. So....yeah, not much to see here. IMO.

Lucky
03-06-2013, 10:18 PM
Overrated

But still better than Newton/Harris.

Setting up himself for a career in the media seems to be more important to Winston than improving his craft.
Overrated? Well, overpaid (is that the same thing?). Still better than what the Texans currently have a RT. And I don't see Winston's aspirations getting in the way of his on field performance. He's just what he is - an average RT that's a better run than pass blocker.

Looks like Smith & Kubiak knew what they were doing last year, makes them look a lot smarter now with the move to cut Winston a year ago.
I don't think cutting Winston was about being smart. They had to make cuts somewhere and thought Butler & Newton could handle the job. They were wrong. But, they had little choice but to cut him loose.

Playoffs
03-06-2013, 10:32 PM
Wouldn't hurt to kick the tires on this one. :kitten:

Scooter
03-06-2013, 10:32 PM
1 year with the chiefs and he got cut, his market value just hit the floor. unless we're planning on spending a first or second on offensive tackle (which i'd prefer), i'd most certainly try to bring him back. winston is what he is - a below average pass blocker but a heck of a run blocker who fits very will into our system. his pass pro is better than anyone else we could currently start at RT however, and somehow is solid in comparison to most RT's.

being unable to run consistently to the right side, the supposed strong side, was a huge hindrance late in the season. winston instantly improves that without any time needed to "gel". if we can get him at a hometown discount, rick smith should jump on it - again unless we plan on drafting the position.

76Texan
03-06-2013, 10:36 PM
Overrated? Well, overpaid (is that the same thing?). Still better than what the Texans currently have a RT. And I don't see Winston's aspirations getting in the way of his on field performance. He's just what he is - an average RT that's a better run than pass blocker.


I don't think cutting Winston was about being smart. They had to make cuts somewhere and thought Butler & Newton could handle the job. They were wrong. But, they had little choice but to cut him loose.

You mean two Wongs don't make one Wight? :hides:

Trap_Star
03-06-2013, 10:40 PM
What's in store for Eric Winston now?

security at a northside cantina.

76Texan
03-06-2013, 10:42 PM
security at a northside cantina.

LOL!

76Texan
03-06-2013, 10:52 PM
1 year with the chiefs and he got cut, his market value just hit the floor. unless we're planning on spending a first or second on offensive tackle (which i'd prefer), i'd most certainly try to bring him back. winston is what he is - a below average pass blocker but a heck of a run blocker who fits very will into our system. his pass pro is better than anyone else we could currently start at RT however, and somehow is solid in comparison to most RT's.

being unable to run consistently to the right side, the supposed strong side, was a huge hindrance late in the season. winston instantly improves that without any time needed to "gel". if we can get him at a hometown discount, rick smith should jump on it - again unless we plan on drafting the position.

I don't know how much pressure Winston gave up, but the combo of Harris and Newton combined to allow the same number of sacks as Winston (but with one fewer penalty.) That with Newton playing hurt or less than 100% for awhile and Winston was averaging 7.5 sacks allowed the previous two years.

The only thing we can say for sure is that Winston was the better run blocker; but Newton and Harris didn't have much time to gel with the rest of the O-line, which never had continuity to start with - having 3 different guys playing at RG.

We don't know if Newton will improve enough next year, but we can't rule that out either.

I don't think the Texans can afford more than a couple of mils for a FA; but who knows, maybe they will surprise us ?!?

ObsiWan
03-06-2013, 10:56 PM
Conflicted on this one.

His run blocking was better than anything we had on the right side in 2012.

But one has to wonder if he's thrown in the towel and is ready to pick up the microphone for a new career pursuit.

Then there's that whole messy "You cut me last year, Rick and Gary..." thing going on. With a splash of Drew HoseYourAss who is commanding the highest dollar on anything he represents. So....yeah, not much to see here. IMO.

I'm with you. I think he's worth a look but not if Drew whatshisname wants top dollar.
Wonder what sort of inquires he'll get from other teams...

Brisco_County
03-06-2013, 11:03 PM
I don't see how any of the parties involved could compromise enough to make it work.

Lucky
03-06-2013, 11:14 PM
I don't know how much pressure Winston gave up, but the combo of Harris and Newton combined to allow the same number of sacks as Winston (but with one fewer penalty.) That with Newton playing hurt or less than 100% for awhile and Winston was averaging 7.5 sacks allowed the previous two years.
It's not just the sack numbers. Schaub's QB rating and yards per attempt were down in 2012 from 2011. He became uncomfortable in the pocket and was less willing to look downfield. Not suggesting the Texans go after Winston. Just that Newton/Harris were a downgrade.

76Texan
03-06-2013, 11:26 PM
It's not just the sack numbers. Schaub's QB rating and yards per attempt were down in 2012 from 2011. He became uncomfortable in the pocket and was less willing to look downfield. Not suggesting the Texans go after Winston. Just that Newton/Harris were a downgrade.

Playing better defenses than the previous year (IMO) makes it worse.

paycheck71
03-06-2013, 11:28 PM
Winston only gave up 3 sacks last year for KC. One of the best in the league.

ChampionTexan
03-06-2013, 11:32 PM
I don't see how any of the parties involved could compromise enough to make it work.

I have a strong feeling money will keep him from ever having a chance to talk to the Texans. There's enough teams with a need at RT, and cap room that I think he'll find a new home quickly - probably before the UFA signing period begins.

Miami and St. Louis are two potential landing spots that come to mind quickly. I'm not sure exactly where St. Louis is cap-wise, but they have a need and were interested in Winston last year.

Scooter
03-06-2013, 11:32 PM
I don't know how much pressure Winston gave up, but the combo of Harris and Newton combined to allow the same number of sacks as Winston (but with one fewer penalty.) That with Newton playing hurt or less than 100% for awhile and Winston was averaging 7.5 sacks allowed the previous two years.

The only thing we can say for sure is that Winston was the better run blocker; but Newton and Harris didn't have much time to gel with the rest of the O-line, which never had continuity to start with - having 3 different guys playing at RG.

We don't know if Newton will improve enough next year, but we can't rule that out either.

I don't think the Texans can afford more than a couple of mils for a FA; but who knows, maybe they will surprise us ?!?

my eye tells me they arent directly comparable. winston was more of an anchor where as newton was a piece. i cant claim to know the responsibilities of either, but it seemed to me that we gave winston twice the duty that newton saw. newton certainly had a few moments in the sun, and flashed a bit of pass pro, but the consistency was non existent and their run blocking isnt in the same league.

going to PFF, newton was blasted for his inconsistent play and poor overall game ... "matching every solid performance with two poor ones. Struggling as a run blocker in particular, Newton also allowed 32 total pressures and was just inconsistent in general." winston was the cheif's #4 undervalued players and as a texan ranked no worse than #7 among right tackles in the nfl.

Norg
03-06-2013, 11:51 PM
i say does not hurt to put our name in the hat

i see more positive then neg if we make that move even bring in winston has a backup just in case knock on wood one of our tackles goes down

JamesBill
03-06-2013, 11:57 PM
my eye tells me they arent directly comparable. winston was more of an anchor where as newton was a piece. i cant claim to know the responsibilities of either, but it seemed to me that we gave winston twice the duty that newton saw. newton certainly had a few moments in the sun, and flashed a bit of pass pro, but the consistency was non existent and their run blocking isnt in the same league.

going to PFF, newton was blasted for his inconsistent play and poor overall game ... "matching every solid performance with two poor ones. Struggling as a run blocker in particular, Newton also allowed 32 total pressures and was just inconsistent in general." winston was the cheif's #4 undervalued players and as a texan ranked no worse than #7 among right tackles in the nfl.

From 2008 to the rest of his time as a Texan, Winston had Mike Brisiel to his left. In zone runs the Guard has a ton more to do than a tackle. The bottom fell out of the o-line when MB broke his leg in 2011 and Winston was still in there. I think the Texans believed they would be able to keep MB so cut Winston.

Our shell shocked QB needs pass pro more than our all pro RB needs run blocking. How much of our non existent cap room do you want to put on the line? We have Cody, Barwin, and Quin (all starters) who are unrestricted. We are paper thin at ILB. No one has hard numbers on the cap but it is very likely any money you add will require a cap saving cut. Not just a cut but a cut that saves you cap space.

76Texan
03-07-2013, 12:40 AM
Winston only gave up 3 sacks last year for KC. One of the best in the league.

SIX!

http://hosted.stats.com/fb/playerstats.asp?id=7815&team=12

http://hosted.stats.com/fb/playerstats.asp?id=25001&team=34

http://hosted.stats.com/fb/playerstats.asp?id=8324&team=34

Stats LLC and Elias Sports Bureau belongs to the same group of companies.
They are the official stats keeper for the NFL.

76Texan
03-07-2013, 12:46 AM
my eye tells me they arent directly comparable. winston was more of an anchor where as newton was a piece. i cant claim to know the responsibilities of either, but it seemed to me that we gave winston twice the duty that newton saw. newton certainly had a few moments in the sun, and flashed a bit of pass pro, but the consistency was non existent and their run blocking isnt in the same league.

going to PFF, newton was blasted for his inconsistent play and poor overall game ... "matching every solid performance with two poor ones. Struggling as a run blocker in particular, Newton also allowed 32 total pressures and was just inconsistent in general." winston was the cheif's #4 undervalued players and as a texan ranked no worse than #7 among right tackles in the nfl.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/11/28/sig-stat-snapshot-pass-blocking-efficiency/

I don't trust PFF completely, but at any rate, those numbers were up to Nov 28; neither Winston nor Newton made the good list or the bad list.

paycheck71
03-07-2013, 12:52 AM
SIX!

http://hosted.stats.com/fb/playerstats.asp?id=7815&team=12

http://hosted.stats.com/fb/playerstats.asp?id=25001&team=34

http://hosted.stats.com/fb/playerstats.asp?id=8324&team=34

Stats LLC and Elias Sports Bureau belongs to the same group of companies.
They are the official stats keeper for the NFL.

Interesting. PFF had him with 3. Don't know where they get their info.

@Ravensinsider Eric Winston gave up just three sacks last season, according to Pro Football Focus. Not too shabby

Wolf6151
03-07-2013, 12:53 AM
I'd take Eric Winston back if he came cheap, but lets remember his faults for a bit here. He has short arms and slow feet, he doesn't do well against speed rushers, thus giving up way to many sacks. I'd leave Newton at RT where I think he'll improve with experience, and move Winston to RG where I think his size, strength, and experience would benifit the Texans and Newton. His toughness and attitude would benifit the youngsters as well.

76Texan
03-07-2013, 01:12 AM
my eye tells me they arent directly comparable. winston was more of an anchor where as newton was a piece. i cant claim to know the responsibilities of either, but it seemed to me that we gave winston twice the duty that newton saw. newton certainly had a few moments in the sun, and flashed a bit of pass pro, but the consistency was non existent and their run blocking isnt in the same league.

going to PFF, newton was blasted for his inconsistent play and poor overall game ... "matching every solid performance with two poor ones. Struggling as a run blocker in particular, Newton also allowed 32 total pressures and was just inconsistent in general." winston was the cheif's #4 undervalued players and as a texan ranked no worse than #7 among right tackles in the nfl.
Scooter, also, I just reread all of the ReFocus pieces from PFF, and Newton was only mentioned negatively in 3 early games (Dolphins, Broncos, Packers) and in one loss to the Pats. All these teams have very good to great edge players. The good thing is that Newton seems to improve.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/category/teams/afc-south/texans/

Norg
03-07-2013, 01:23 AM
NVM im pretty sure the texans will stick with there young draft pick in newton

76Texan
03-07-2013, 01:25 AM
Interesting. PFF had him with 3. Don't know where they get their info.

That's why I said I don't trust PFF completely.
Once, I had mentioned a Giants blogger who questioned how PFF record QB Pressure. The player involved was a Giant, Tucker, I believe.
The blogger loves Tucker, but he showed a clip where PFF credited Tucker with a QB Pressure when Tucker was a couple of miles away from the QB, LOL!

Scooter
03-07-2013, 01:34 AM
Scooter, also, I just reread all of the ReFocus pieces from PFF, and Newton was only mentioned negatively in 3 early games (Dolphins, Broncos, Packers) and in one loss to the Pats. All these teams have very good to great edge players. The good thing is that Newton seems to improve.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/category/teams/afc-south/texans/

a little vague bud, not being mentioned as a negative isnt a positive. as for improving, he certainly did. my unprofessional opinion says his improvement showed us where his ceiling is, and it's a swing tackle. i understand defending a texan or deriding what could be a bad idea, but newton was bad last year. his poor play and inconsistency very much contributed to our problems late in the year offensively.

one player is being supported as "he's not THAT bad", while the other is a probowler and graded among the tops at his position being ridden down as "not THAT good".

Scooter
03-07-2013, 01:52 AM
From 2008 to the rest of his time as a Texan, Winston had Mike Brisiel to his left. In zone runs the Guard has a ton more to do than a tackle. The bottom fell out of the o-line when MB broke his leg in 2011 and Winston was still in there. I think the Texans believed they would be able to keep MB so cut Winston.

Our shell shocked QB needs pass pro more than our all pro RB needs run blocking. How much of our non existent cap room do you want to put on the line? We have Cody, Barwin, and Quin (all starters) who are unrestricted. We are paper thin at ILB. No one has hard numbers on the cap but it is very likely any money you add will require a cap saving cut. Not just a cut but a cut that saves you cap space.

whoever our right tackle is will have jones and/or brooks beside them, both an upgrade over brisiel IMO. as for the pass pro, you know that's not how it works. we're not built to drop back repeatedly. we have 3 legit runningbacks, a versatile fullback, and a purpose built offensive line ... we need to be able to run the ball in any and all situations, and work the pass off of those runs. that died at the end of the year because we were near crippled on the right side and teams were able to dictate our run game and force us to drop back.

if i had my way, i'd forget about winston and trade up heavily to take a wide receiver and offensive tackle in the first round. the monster in the NFL right now is the 49'ers, who basically made 2 quarterbacks all-pro's this year ... no wonder since they have 3 first rounders on the line, another at backup RG, 1st rounders at tightend and wide receiver and a former quarterback coaching them. i would LOOOOOVE to see kubiak with that kind of ammo. winston has proven himself has a really good run blocker and merely adequate pass blocker, he also has chemistry with our line and coaches ... that is very much a difference maker in january.

i realize we're bumping the cap, but as i understand it, we have a bit more flexibility this year. barwin's out and his replacement is already on the roster. mitchell is likely starting next year. walter is probably going to be cut or renegotiated. smith is up in the air. the only real concern regarding the cap is quin, and if it came to a safety or offensive lineman ... i for one believe the game is won and lost in the trenches.

Goatcheese
03-07-2013, 02:47 AM
Interesting. PFF had him with 3. Don't know where they get their info.

PFF assigns some sacks to the QB.

For example, if the LDE engages the RT, the QB rolls out into the flat and the LDE chases him down for a sack, PFF assigns it to the QB and Stats LLC assigns it to the RT.

leebigeztx
03-07-2013, 03:24 AM
Kinda strange,but I heard some chatter last night and sent my buddy a text at 830 about winston getting. Winston has trouble with speed rushers,but he's pretty good in the combat zone. They could play him at rg and he would be just fine. Btw,Joekell is gonna struggle with speed rushers also at lt.

thunderkyss
03-07-2013, 06:33 AM
I hate to say I told you so & toot my own horn, but I know damn well, no one else is going to do it.

If I remember right, we were paying Winston $5M/yr. I didn't think he was worth it. I don't think he is worth it.

I wouldn't be surprised if the Chiefs manage to acquire Joekel, & replace Winston.


Winston was what? A 6th year player & most likely led the team in false starts. He's a fine pass protector when going against your powerful strongside DEs (like a Mario Williams) but against a quicker, Freeny type, or a quick/explosive guy like Clay Matthews, he's like a wet paper sack. On the playside of a run..... I don't know there's a better tackle save maybe DBrown76. On the backside, lots of room for improvement. He didn't flat out suck.. but nowhere near where he should be.


It makes absolutely zero sense for the Texans to bring Winston back. Everyone is acting like he was an All-Pro from day one, when he never was at any point in his time here. He's a one trick pony & we need to get better at that position, not go backwards.

Derek Newton may not be the answer, but in my humble opinion he was much better in his rookie season than Eric Winston was in his first three seasons.

thunderkyss
03-07-2013, 06:39 AM
going to PFF, newton was blasted for his inconsistent play and poor overall game ... "matching every solid performance with two poor ones. Struggling as a run blocker in particular, Newton also allowed 32 total pressures and was just inconsistent in general." winston was the cheif's #4 undervalued players and as a texan ranked no worse than #7 among right tackles in the nfl.

Don't know what to tell you, they're wrong.

I doubt Winston will sign another $5M/yr deal. I'm sure he'll get picked up, but I doubt he'll be starting where ever he goes at the end of 2013, unless there's a major attitude adjustment & he actually gets better at his job. I've always had the feeling he thought he was "good enough"

thunderkyss
03-07-2013, 06:42 AM
I'd take Eric Winston back if he came cheap, but lets remember his faults for a bit here. He has short arms and slow feet, he doesn't do well against speed rushers, thus giving up way to many sacks. I'd leave Newton at RT where I think he'll improve with experience, and move Winston to RG where I think his size, strength, and experience would benifit the Texans and Newton. His toughness and attitude would benifit the youngsters as well.

You're right.... I'll recant a little.

He won't be starting at tackle at the end of 2013.

thunderkyss
03-07-2013, 06:50 AM
i understand defending a texan or deriding what could be a bad idea, but newton was bad last year. his poor play and inconsistency very much contributed to our problems late in the year offensively.

one player is being supported as "he's not THAT bad", while the other is a probowler and graded among the tops at his position being ridden down as "not THAT good".

Don't forget, Newton didn't play much at all his rookie season, this is pretty much the first extended action he got. Down the stretch, he was not 100% & we really don't know how bad the knee was.

Inconsistency is something we should expect from all our young players. With time, we hope that works out.

Again, I'm not tooting the Texans' horn, I'm not defending the Texans' decisions. I don't know that Newton is the long term answer, but RT has been the weakest spot (imo & I've said so many times before 2012) on our OL for years.

TexanSam
03-07-2013, 07:37 AM
Even if they wanted to bring back Winston, the Texans still have the same issue as last offseason. Lack of cap room.

IDEXAN
03-07-2013, 08:03 AM
The Chiefs thought last year they were contenders for the AFC West title and a playoff berth before the season began and needed just a couple more pieces to make their team complete, including an upgrade at RT so they reached when Winston became available. Anyway, as we know their season turned out to be a disaster (they got the first overall pick next month, right?), and now they've got a new regime which wants to pass alot more than the previous one that signed Winston primarily for his rush-blocking abilities, and consequently Winston is on the street this morning. But he's 9 M richer (before expenses) after just one year with the Chiefs and he already got one sweet contract with the Texans so maybe he'll just retire ? On the other hand I'm pretty sure he still lives in Houston and if he'd take the minimum to be a reserve and/or perhaps compete for a starting guard position which would allow him to stay at home with wife and child, maybe he and Rick Smith could work something out ?

deucetx
03-07-2013, 08:45 AM
Interesting. PFF had him with 3. Don't know where they get their info.

As someone else stated, PFF doesn't just take numbers and go with that. That is what those official NFL stats provides. PFF is about a deeper evaluation about the plays and gives credit as should be assigned to the player. It's why some actual GM's utilize PFF and gathers information/reports from them. And if actual GM's roll with it then I'm cool with it too, heh.

As for Winston he is still too one dimensional. He is better than Newton at run blocking but he still has too many issues pass blocking for the type of salary he commands. He would have to take a heck of a paycut to come back here and chances are that won't be necessary since someone will give him a salary closer to what he is use to then we can.

As for Newton...we really need to stop making him more than he was as well. He was not good last year. Simple as that. All we can do is hope that he improves. There is no guarantee he will and there is no guarantee he won't. So we need to sign someone who can at least challenge him at an affordable price.

Newton was up and down all season. Only contender he played halfway decent had a lousy defense (Packers). Just like the Pats playoff game. Couldn't run to the right side til he was taken out and Ryan Harris put in (who isn't all that great himself). That should not have to happen and Kubiak stated early before the season he had no intentions of players sharing the position. But play on the field proved otherwise and it had to happen. We're trying to contend for the Bowl, not just AFC South titles so yes, we need more out of the spot. Hopefully Newton is ready to step it up a notch and develop.

So if we wish to bring up the continuity of the offensive line we can only blame the players/coaches themselves. It was their shaky play that made Kubes and Dennison go that direction. Not just injuries which are part of the game in any case.

JamesBill
03-07-2013, 10:02 AM
whoever our right tackle is will have jones and/or brooks beside them, both an upgrade over brisiel IMO.

What are you basing this opinion on? When mike brisiel played, the right side of the line was fine. When he was out, not so much. Plus guard>tackle in run blocking.

tru80texan
03-07-2013, 10:44 AM
Seems the Texans have possibly already contacted Winston on a reunion. I think he will have to play for less then his $5M per yr, but he may be willing to comeback w/ hopes of winning. I think Newton has room to grow & could get better, but the Texans are built to win now & it would be one less excuse for Schaub if he can't get the job done.

Eric Winston - T - Free Agent
According to the Philadelphia Daily News, the Eagles and Texans were the first two teams to reach out to free agent RT Eric Winston.
Winston certainly won't hurt for work after grading out as the league's No. 9 right tackle last season. In Philadelphia, he could slide right in as a starter and allow Todd Herremans to solidify the problematic right guard spot. He's also very familiar with the Texans' zone-blocking scheme after spending the first six years of his career there.
Related: Texans, Eagles
Source: Philadelphia Daily News Mar 7 - 11:13 AM

tru80texan
03-07-2013, 10:49 AM
What are you basing this opinion on? When mike brisiel played, the right side of the line was fine. When he was out, not so much. Plus guard>tackle in run blocking.

They were more then "fine". The o-line w/ Briesel & Winston were considered one of the best in the NFL. Those 2 leave & o-line takes a step back in both pass protection & run blocking & yet we have some who foolishly insist that somehow one of the best o-lines improved despite the production saying otherwise. Just another classic example of "bash the ex-Texan because they moved on" silliness. The current o-line has potential, but havent proven much just yet. The former o-line proved they were one of the best to many.

76Texan
03-07-2013, 11:47 AM
First of all, I haven't heard a single person who ever said that the line has improved this year.

This is my evaluation, which I had mentioned before:

Duane Brown was good for the first two third of the season, but tailed off down the stretch. Overall, he's about the same as the previous year or marginally better.

Wade Smith really had a down year; the difference in play here was quite big in both aspects of the offense, run and pass.

Myers also had a down year. In 2011, he had a great year; last year, it was at best average.

Briesiel was always underated. Caldwell, Jones, and Brooks were all wildly inconsistent. The diminishing in play might be the most pronounced at this spot.

There was also a drop-off at RT as well, but the difference here was not as pronounced as at the two guard spots.
It might be less of a problem than the Center spot as well (if we're talking about the difference between the two years.)
In 2011, Myers' play was great; last year, it was below average.

In 2011, the RT's play was just above average; last year, it was slightly below average or average.

I rewatched 4 games (Titans second game, Vikings - two games in which Foster went nowhere) and the two play-off games using the condensed format from NFL Game Rewind (plays start when the two teams are ready to go, no commercial, no time-out, no huddle) and Newton's play was quite encouraging.
(I also look at the end zone view from one of the All-22 cameras to check out all the runs for fewer than 3 yards and the incompletions + interceptions.)

Winston would have been at best a stalemate in these games as compared to the combo of Newton and Harris.

Harris was an unsung hero of sort. IMO, his overall play for the whole season was slightly better than Winston in 2011; however, we simply don't know if he can hold up if asked to play full-time.

jtexas
03-07-2013, 12:39 PM
Get it done! This could be the positive story of the off season. Everyone expects we will either flat-line or get worse with the players lost in FA. This could give our offense the "hype" again.

Out of 80 tackles, Newton was the 76th best run blocker. These grades are on a cumulative basis meaning the more playing time a guy gets the more opportunities he has to rank higher. He was outperformed by a number of low snap fillers.

Netwon was 47 / 80 on pass blocking. That is acceptable for a young player, but Eric was in the top 25 in both categories.

htowntexans1985
03-07-2013, 01:08 PM
Bring the caveman back!!!

TexanSam
03-07-2013, 01:20 PM
If bringing Winston back meant being able to pound the ball like we did in 2010 and 2011, then I'd be all for it. It would also probably mean that we'd have less of a chance at signing Glover Quin though which would leave a huge hole in the secondary.

Dutchrudder
03-07-2013, 01:26 PM
I kind of wonder what Winston would be like if we brought him back and made him the right guard. I think he's the kind of bulldozer you want on the inside for runs and he has the athleticism to be a lead blocker on counter plays.

Dutchrudder
03-07-2013, 01:39 PM
Well, the Texans are looking at him:

Andy Reidís new team said goodbye to right tackle Eric Winston on Wednesday, a move that piqued the interest of Reidís old team.

Les Bowen of the Philadelphia Daily News reports that the Eagles were one of the first two teams to reach out to Winston after his announcement of his departure from the Chiefs hit the wires. Winstonís durability is likely part of the reason for the teamís interest. Winston has started all 96 games over the last six seasons while the Eagles were playing a season-long game of musical chairs in 2012 thanks to a slew of serious injuries to their projected starting offensive linemen.

Bowen reports that the other team to show interest in speaking to Winston was the Texans, who drafted him in 2006 and employed him until his release last March. Derek Newton started at right tackle for Houston in 2012.

When Winston was released last year, he was out of work for less than a week before landing in Kansas City. Given the early interest in his services, it may be another short spell on the unemployment line for Winston again this year.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/03/07/report-eagles-texans-reach-out-to-eric-winston/related/

Double Barrel
03-07-2013, 02:04 PM
Give us the hometown discount, Eric!

Otherwise, you will probaby be a loser Eagle.

Bulls on Parade
03-07-2013, 02:16 PM
Can Derek Newton play right guard? I'd love to have Big-E back.

JamesBill
03-07-2013, 03:04 PM
They were more then "fine". The o-line w/ Briesel & Winston were considered one of the best in the NFL. Those 2 leave & o-line takes a step back in both pass protection & run blocking & yet we have some who foolishly insist that somehow one of the best o-lines improved despite the production saying otherwise. Just another classic example of "bash the ex-Texan because they moved on" silliness. The current o-line has potential, but havent proven much just yet. The former o-line proved they were one of the best to many.

Yes they were more than fine WITH Mike Briseil. Without him they collapsed on the right side. When he came back in the playoffs they dominated. Yet for some reason you give all the credit to Winston and none to Mike Briseil. I was just asking why. So, why?

drs23
03-07-2013, 04:21 PM
Bring the caveman back!!!

For better or for worse, not gonna happen. There are teams with bucks already standing on his doorstep.

Could be wrong like I usually am but I think not in this case.

I do like the sound of moving him inside with Newton gaining experience I think he's going to surprise some haters. Then, of course, perhaps not.

jtexas
03-07-2013, 07:06 PM
For better or for worse, not gonna happen. There are teams with bucks already standing on his doorstep.

Could be wrong like I usually am but I think not in this case.

I do like the sound of moving him inside with Newton gaining experience I think he's going to surprise some haters. Then, of course, perhaps not.

Something also tells me that if the texans weren't willing to restructure his contract last year, they probably won't be offering anything long-term.

Lucky
03-07-2013, 07:54 PM
Can Derek Newton play right guard? I'd love to have Big-E back.

I think Newton is a guard. I don't think he has the feet to play Tackle. Not that I'm advocating signing Winston (at least not to anything long term). Just that Newton is not the answer.

BTW, Winston was on the Palillo show on 790 around 6 pm. Did anyone listen to that interview? Just wondering what was said.

IDEXAN
03-08-2013, 08:43 AM
RT Eric Winston confirms through Twitter that he's been released by the Chiefs. Winston spent just one season in KC and his attack on fans in his "sickening" & "disgusting" rant made him a polarizing player.
http://www.610sports.com/
*****
Looks like there was also an "off field incident" that may have been a factor in Winston's hasty exit out of KC when the new HC appeared on the scene ?

False Start
03-08-2013, 08:50 AM
I wouldnt mind having caveman back.

http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii202/J4103V/cave5.jpg

TexanSam
03-08-2013, 09:07 AM
I think Newton is a guard. I don't think he has the feet to play Tackle. Not that I'm advocating signing Winston (at least not to anything long term). Just that Newton is not the answer.

BTW, Winston was on the Palillo show on 790 around 6 pm. Did anyone listen to that interview? Just wondering what was said.

I haven't listened to it yet either, but here's the link to the podcast.
http://www.sports790.com/cc-common/podcast/single_page.html?podcast=pallilo&selected_podcast=DriveHome3rdHour030713_1362702334 _20123.mp3

thunderkyss
03-08-2013, 10:50 AM
Something also tells me that if the texans weren't willing to restructure his contract last year, they probably won't be offering anything long-term.

Really hard to say. We don't know what the Texans were "willing" to do or not"willing" to do.

We know the Texans were surprised that the Cap did not go up. We know they had a finite amount of time to get under the cap.

For all we know, they approached Winston & he gave them some indication that it was going to be a long, drawn-out process. They had to cut bait & move on.

I think it was past the time we moved on from Eric Winston, but the Texans have never hinted as much prior to cutting him.

thunderkyss
03-08-2013, 10:51 AM
I think Newton is a guard. I don't think he has the feet to play Tackle.

One of the things that impressed me most about Newton were his feet. Prior to the injury, I thought he had excellent feet, a really good kick/slide.

2slik4u
03-08-2013, 09:03 PM
Overrated

But still better than Newton/Harris.

Setting up himself for a career in the media seems to be more important to Winston than improving his craft.

...but he's so ugly.

htowntexans1985
03-11-2013, 09:03 PM
The caveman has begun his treck through the wilds of free agency.

Adam Schefter @ AdamSchefter
Former Chiefs OT Eric Winston visited
the Chargers this weekend

False Start
04-08-2013, 02:53 PM
Looks like he might be a Cowgirl (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/04/08/winston-cowboys-talking/).

Rey
04-08-2013, 04:05 PM
Where do the cowboys get this cap space from? It seems like they are always spending free agent dollars even when they have nothing to spend..

ArlingtonTexan
04-08-2013, 04:10 PM
Where do the cowboys get this cap space from? It seems like they are always spending free agent dollars even when they have nothing to spend..

Basicaly, they have "restructed" at least 10 contracts, and extended Romo to create cap space. he is doing the NFL version of combining credit cards into a bigger, lower interest loan and then going back reusing the credit cards.

steelbtexan
04-08-2013, 04:19 PM
Some teams seem to be able to work the cap and other teams have a history of not being able to manage their $$$$. Where would you rank the Texans/Rick/Olson?

The Pencil Neck
04-08-2013, 04:20 PM
Some teams seem to be able to work the cap and other teams have a history of not being able to manage their $$$$. Where would you rank the Texans/Rick/Olson?

I think they do a pretty good job.

steelbtexan
04-08-2013, 04:22 PM
Basicaly, they have "restructed" at least 10 contracts, and extended Romo to create cap space. he is doing the NFL version of combining credit cards into a bigger, lower interest loan and then going back reusing the credit cards.

Yep

And they've been doing this for the last 10 yrs or so.

It's standard practice for the Cowgirls, but atleast they're able to add players that could help them win. If Jerrah/Jason and crew weren't leading the Titanic.

ArlingtonTexan
04-08-2013, 04:28 PM
Some teams seem to be able to work the cap and other teams have a history of not being able to manage their $$$$. Where would you rank the Texans/Rick/Olson?

Better than the general perception on this board.

ArlingtonTexan
04-08-2013, 04:37 PM
Yep

And they've been doing this for the last 10 yrs or so.

It's standard practice for the Cowgirls, but atleast they're able to add players that could help them win. If Jerrah/Jason and crew weren't leading the Titanic.

Actually, the point is that they have NOT been adding players that can help win...i.e. they have not been winning. They fool the people who get distracted by activity, but they are stupid is stupid does in the draft, free agency, roster construction, and cap management.

Jones and company are the masters at marketing mediocrity as goodness.

paycheck71
04-08-2013, 05:07 PM
Actually, the point is that they have NOT been adding players that can help win...i.e. they have not been winning. They fool the people who get distracted by activity, but they are stupid is stupid does in the draft, free agency, roster construction, and cap management.

Jones and company are the masters at marketing mediocrity as goodness.

They're already something like $20MM over the cap next year. Unless there is a significant increase in the cap in the next 2 years, it will catch up with them HARD.

76Texan
04-08-2013, 05:15 PM
Actually, the point is that they have NOT been adding players that can help win...i.e. they have not been winning. They fool the people who get distracted by activity, but they are stupid is stupid does in the draft, free agency, roster construction, and cap management.

Jones and company are the masters at marketing mediocrity as goodness.

^^^ This!

And Steelb loves to criticize McNair, LOL.

thunderkyss
04-09-2013, 07:41 AM
Some teams seem to be able to work the cap and other teams have a history of not being able to manage their $$$$. Where would you rank the Texans/Rick/Olson?

Keep in mind, we're talking about a team with one play off win in over a decade. A team that has failed to make the play offs when they could have won their division with a 9-7 record the last two seasons. Losing the last game of the year, both years cost them the division.


But.... they make salary cap moves that will leave your head spinning.


Man, I wish we could be like the Cowboys. :kitten:

:wadepalm:

steelbtexan
04-09-2013, 08:39 AM
^^^ This!

And Steelb loves to criticize McNair, LOL.

The Cowgirls are a bad example,

The Pats, Broncos, Saints, 49ers, Falcons etc... are examples of teams that manage their caps properly and are able to add in FA/Draft.

BoB adds top tier FA's 1 yr and all of the sudden the Texans are in the playoffs and supposedly SB contenders. Coincedence? The teams mentioned above do this every yr.

76Texan
04-09-2013, 09:15 AM
The Cowgirls are a bad example,

The Pats, Broncos, Saints, 49ers, Falcons etc... are examples of teams that manage their caps properly and are able to add in FA/Draft.

BoB adds top tier FA's 1 yr and all of the sudden the Texans are in the playoffs and supposedly SB contenders. Coincedence? The teams mentioned above do this every yr.

The Broncos benefited from the Cutler trade, and that was due to the previous regime. But they had to suck for awhile to get here.
The Saints are another bad example.

76Texan
04-09-2013, 09:20 AM
The Cowgirls are a bad example,

The Pats, Broncos, Saints, 49ers, Falcons etc... are examples of teams that manage their caps properly and are able to add in FA/Draft.

BoB adds top tier FA's 1 yr and all of the sudden the Texans are in the playoffs and supposedly SB contenders. Coincedence? The teams mentioned above do this every yr.

The Broncos benefited from the Cutler trade, and that was due to the previous regime. But they had to suck for awhile to get here.
The Saints are another bad example.
The Niners endures 8 seasons before they started winning again in 2011.

The Falcons bridesmaid's status isn't going to change anytime soon, some of their fans believe and they want to fire Matty, LOL.
At the moment, they are pretty tight with their cap; we'll see what they do to rework Matt Ryan's contract.

ObsiWan
04-09-2013, 09:57 AM
The Cowgirls are a bad example,

The Pats, Broncos, Saints, 49ers, Falcons etc... are examples of teams that manage their caps properly and are able to add in FA/Draft.

BoB adds top tier FA's 1 yr and all of the sudden the Texans are in the playoffs and supposedly SB contenders. Coincedence? The teams mentioned above do this every yr.

Hmmmm... since Kubiak left the Broncos, they have made the playoffs only twice; once with an 8-8 record (riding Tebowmania) and last year with Peyton at the helm. ...where they were one and done, at home.

The NIners have only made the playoffs twice since 2006. It won't be long before they start losing key pieces they can't afford to hold onto.

Neither the Pats nor the Saints make huge, splashy free agency moves but rather chose to fill the holes left by the veterans they can no longer afford to hold onto.

It is the way of the modern day NFL. The salary cap is restrictive and keeps teams from stockpiling vets. ...well, expensive vets anyway.

steelbtexan
04-09-2013, 10:29 AM
Bottom line is the good teams add to their rosters evey yr in FA

See, Ravens Jacoby/Pollard/Leach.

The Texans just try to hold water every yr in FA. (Replace Quin with Reed and lose everybody else.) That's bad cap management. But go on with the Texans are the greatest managed team in the NFL.

BTW,They are the best marketed team in the NFL. The Texans are a marketing team with a football division.

This is why I dont want the county to give BoB/Jamey what they want (Tearing down the Astrodome)

They've already taken enough from the city of Houston/Harris county without really producing squat on the field. (2 wildcard wins over the Bungles = LOL) They have destroyed Houstons national treasure (Astrodome) Instead of sprucing the old girl up and making her a tourist attraction that Houston is so badly lacking. They did this shortsightedly all in the name of $$$$.

For this reason I hope Harris County lets the Dome rot to the ground before they give in to BoB/Jamey and the henchmen's demands.

End of Rant

thunderkyss
04-09-2013, 11:37 AM
BoB adds top tier FA's 1 yr and all of the sudden the Texans are in the playoffs and supposedly SB contenders. Coincedence? The teams mentioned above do this every yr.

Again, it's perception. Jonathan Joseph was no more a top tier FA than Anthony Weaver or Antonio Smith. Both were considered the second best DE in their FA class. Wade Smith was probably the third best guard available at the time.

Jonathan Joseph was the second rated CB in his FA class, & had Ike Taylor not resigned with the Steelers, probably third.

Jonathan Joseph was not any more a proven commodity than Kevin Walter when we got him.

thunderkyss
04-09-2013, 11:39 AM
Bottom line is the good teams add to their rosters evey yr in FA

See, Ravens Jacoby/Pollard/Leach.


Didn't we add two of those three to this team as FAs before teh ravens did?

The Pencil Neck
04-09-2013, 11:58 AM
Again, it's perception. Jonathan Joseph was no more a top tier FA than Anthony Weaver or Antonio Smith. Both were considered the second best DE in their FA class. Wade Smith was probably the third best guard available at the time.

Jonathan Joseph was the second rated CB in his FA class, & had Ike Taylor not resigned with the Steelers, probably third.

Jonathan Joseph was not any more a proven commodity than Kevin Walter when we got him.

I was with you until the bolded.

Johnathon Joseph was a highly rated FA. Like you said, 2nd or 3rd in his FA class but it was a good year for FA corners.

He was a 1st round pick. He was a 5 year starter.

Kevin Walter was a 7th round pick who was cut by the team that picked him (Giants) and picked up by another team (Bengals). He'd had 3 uneventful seasons with the Bengals where he'd only had 19 catches in his BEST year. THe guy was a fringe guy at best.

They were not comparable as FA pickups. JJoe was a much more proven commodity than Walter.

Brisco_County
04-09-2013, 12:31 PM
Winston is seeking three to four million a year, and no one's biting.

ďItís frustrating, because Iíve never really been in this situation,Ē Winston told SiriusXMSports.

Winston, 29, said the Chargers and he discussed money, ďbut things kind of fell through.Ē

The tackle was set to make $4.9 million in base salary before the Chiefs released him. He said heís seeking $3 million to $4 million this year and isnít asking for a long-term deal.

ďI try to look at myself fairly," Winston said. "I donít ever want to be one of those guys that looks at themselves and thinks they hung the moon.

ďI still feel like Iím still playing at a pretty high level, and I feel I can contribute to a team.Ē

ďI donít think Iím asking for pie in the sky numbers," Winston said. "Middle of the road is fine. But, itís also frustrating from the sense of, there's still a lot of teams with a lot of money to spend, but it doesnít seem like anyone wants to spend it."

Link. (http://www.theredzone.org/BlogDescription/tabid/61/EntryId/34229/Eric-Winston-seeking-between--3-4-million-on-a-one-year-deal/Default.aspx)

Maybe he's not considering that teams are still adjusting to the new cap, or that he's perceived as a zone blocker whose real value doesn't match his expectations. If the needs and limitations of all the teams are changing, then he needs to get a new agent who is going to respect those changes.

badboy
04-09-2013, 01:44 PM
Winston is seeking three to four million a year, and no one's biting.



Link. (http://www.theredzone.org/BlogDescription/tabid/61/EntryId/34229/Eric-Winston-seeking-between--3-4-million-on-a-one-year-deal/Default.aspx)

Maybe he's not considering that teams are still adjusting to the new cap, or that he's perceived as a zone blocker whose real value doesn't match his expectations. If the needs and limitations of all the teams are changing, then he needs to get a new agent who is going to respect those changes.Eric being worth something does not mean you necessarily get it. In real estate it is now a seller's market. In NFL it is a buyers market. Anyway, thought it is not about the money if you are an athlete?

houstonspartan
04-09-2013, 02:48 PM
I was with you until the bolded.

Johnathon Joseph was a highly rated FA. Like you said, 2nd or 3rd in his FA class but it was a good year for FA corners.

He was a 1st round pick. He was a 5 year starter.

Kevin Walter was a 7th round pick who was cut by the team that picked him (Giants) and picked up by another team (Bengals). He'd had 3 uneventful seasons with the Bengals where he'd only had 19 catches in his BEST year. THe guy was a fringe guy at best.

They were not comparable as FA pickups. JJoe was a much more proven commodity than Walter.

Yep.

Remember when we signed him? One of the Bengals' coordinators (can't remember which) was FURIOUS. And was open about it. And the fans were livid for the owner being cheap and letting Jonathan Joseph go.

And the crime is: Jonathan never wanted to leave Cincy! He was settled there with his family and they didn't want to re-locate. Had the bengals even made him a decent offer, he likely would have taken it.

Oh well. Our gain.

Rey
04-09-2013, 03:30 PM
Again, it's perception. Jonathan Joseph was no more a top tier FA than Anthony Weaver or Antonio Smith. Both were considered the second best DE in their FA class. Wade Smith was probably the third best guard available at the time.

Jonathan Joseph was the second rated CB in his FA class, & had Ike Taylor not resigned with the Steelers, probably third.

Jonathan Joseph was not any more a proven commodity than Kevin Walter when we got him.

I don't think I agree with that...

JJo had been around for a while and was still kind of young, but considered one of the top players at his position in the whole league. Not just in the free agent class.

Antonio Smith and Weaver being considered among the best in the free agent class is not relevant. Just means that the free agent class wasn't as strong at those positions in those years.

JJo was only considered the second best corner in his FA class because Aso was considered the #1 or #2 corner in the entire league.

Jjo by far had been the biggest, baddest free agent we had signed and it wasn't close.

Dutchrudder
04-09-2013, 04:28 PM
Again, it's perception. Jonathan Joseph was no more a top tier FA than Anthony Weaver or Antonio Smith. Both were considered the second best DE in their FA class. Wade Smith was probably the third best guard available at the time.

Jonathan Joseph was the second rated CB in his FA class, & had Ike Taylor not resigned with the Steelers, probably third.

Jonathan Joseph was not any more a proven commodity than Kevin Walter when we got him.

First of all, Anthony Weaver was no where near the top 3 DEs in the 2006 free agency class. ND Kalu was signed that year too, and even he was rated higher than Weaver. The Texans overpaid for Weaver for sure, but that doesn't make him the second best DE of that class. There were at least a half dozen other guys ahead of him, including Mathis, Kampman and Abraham.

Antonio Smith was a guy who got paid by a desperate team due to his performance during Arizona's Super Bowl run. He was not in the top 3 DEs of that class, which included Julius Peppers, Chris Canty and Terrell Suggs (who moved to OLB). He might have been 4-6 depending on the rankings you use, but even then he wasn't a hot commodity on the market. He's worked out well since that deal was signed, but let's not rewrite history on this.

Wade Smith in 2010 was a desperation move. We lost Chester Pitts to injury that year and had a huge hole at LG, so we overpaid Wade to keep him from going to Arizona. He was no where near the top 5 guards that year, which included guys like Logan Mankins, Harvey Dahl, Jahri Evans and Shaun Andrews. Wade Smith was/is a journeyman, and a middling prospect at guard.

JJo was certainly a top 5 CB of the free agency class of 2011. Aso was obviously the #1 guy, Cromartie and Grimes were probably the next two best, and then JJo would slot in at #4, with Champ Bailey close behind. At the time, that was pretty reasonable ranking, but you could argue JJo was a better prospect over Cromartie due to character concerns on Antonio. Brandon Carr, Chris Carr, Josh Wilson and Carlos Rodgers would be the CBs behind those guys, and that filled out what was a great CB free agency class.

JJo was definitely the highest rated free agent acquisition that the Texans have made in their brief history, and it was the right choice. We nearly had Eric Weddle to go with him, but SD ponied up more money and kept him from us. Instead we signed D Manning for about 3m AAV less, and wound up with a great overhaul of the secondary.

thunderkyss
04-09-2013, 10:38 PM
JJo was definitely the highest rated free agent acquisition that the Texans have made in their brief history, and it was the right choice.

I'm not against, or down on the Jjo signing at all & we can debate how these FAs were ranked all day (personally, I exclude the guys who did not change teams, like Ike Taylor), but the point is the same.

Jjo was not the #1 guy.

We spent money before to make sure we got our guy.

Most of our "big" FA signings were young players with potential & Jjo fit that bill as he was not even considered the top CB on his team (they might have undervalued him & over valued Leon Hall, but the point is he was not the guy we made him here, a bonafide #1 pro bowl CB).

So it is wrong (& this is truly my point) to say that the one year the Texans went out & signed a big time FA we made it to the play offs. They were probably more right about Jjo than they were about Weaver & Antonio, but it wasn't for lack of trying.

Doppelganger
04-10-2013, 09:03 AM
I don't think I agree with that...

JJo had been around for a while and was still kind of young, but considered one of the top players at his position in the whole league. Not just in the free agent class.

Antonio Smith and Weaver being considered among the best in the free agent class is not relevant. Just means that the free agent class wasn't as strong at those positions in those years.

JJo was only considered the second best corner in his FA class because Aso was considered the #1 or #2 corner in the entire league.

Jjo by far had been the biggest, baddest free agent we had signed and it wasn't close.

But you can only go after FAs in their given year. The Texans have typically tried to improve the team rather than save money like the Bungels. The Texans went after Smith and Weaver who were top players at position. They brought in Orlando Pace(best LT available) and tried to sign him, but he wasn't interested. They brought in Bolden(best CB available), but he went back to NE. They brought in Green who was the best RB available and got him. This year they upgraded the punter position by getting Lechler and the FB position by getting Jones.

Rey
04-10-2013, 10:00 AM
But you can only go after FAs in their given year.

You don't have to go after anybody. You can always just not overpay mediocre guys...

That's always an option...

drs23
04-10-2013, 10:21 AM
You don't have to go after anybody. You can always just not overpay mediocre guys...

That's always an option...

Just trying to qualify your position Rey. Did the Texans overpay Ed Reed who's not the same player he was at a younger age? Do you see this as "overpay mediocre guys"?

Rey
04-10-2013, 10:34 AM
Just trying to qualify your position Rey. Did the Texans overpay Ed Reed who's not the same player he was at a younger age? Do you see this as "overpay mediocre guys"?

I don't think Reed is mediocre so, no. And Weaver was not mediocre...He was just not very good.

Really there's no comparison.

You're talking about one of the greatest to ever play the position vs. Anthony Weaver.

But my feelings don't have anything to do with what the Texans actually do. If Reed is a bust then yes, they will have poorly spent their money. My opinion on that matter won't change that if it becomes fact.

texan279
04-29-2013, 07:15 PM
Eric Winston visited the Titans today per Adam Schefter....

RTP2110
04-30-2013, 08:30 AM
Eric Winston visited the Titans today per Adam Schefter....

I actually saw him at the Nashville airport yesterday; he was on our same flight back to Houston. Didn't talk any football, but he was nice enough for a hello and a handshake.

IDEXAN
04-30-2013, 09:45 AM
See this Oline strategy by the Titans puzzles me ? They spend tons & tons of money in FA for one guard, then use their 10th overall first round pick in the Draft on the other guard, and then look sift thru the FA dregs for an OT ?

Dutchrudder
04-30-2013, 11:07 AM
See this Oline strategy by the Titans puzzles me ? They spend tons & tons of money in FA for one guard, then use their 10th overall first round pick in the Draft on the other guard, and then look sift thru the FA dregs for an OT ?

That, and their defense will continue to suck. It's almost like they are tanking to get a QB, ala the Suck for Luck sweepstakes. I think we all know Locker is at best an average NFL starter.

Speaking of which, we need to come up with a catchy phrase for the teams like the Jags, Raiders and Titans who will be fighting for the top prospects next year.

Top 5 guys I see are:
Jadeveon Clowney
Tajh Boyd
Teddy Bridgewater
Marquis Lee
Johnny Manziel


Sabo-Tajh
Tank for Teddy
Lose for Lee
Muff for Manziel
Downey for Clowney

Doppelganger
04-30-2013, 11:58 AM
That, and their defense will continue to suck. It's almost like they are tanking to get a QB, ala the Suck for Luck sweepstakes. I think we all know Locker is at best an average NFL starter.

Speaking of which, we need to come up with a catchy phrase for the teams like the Jags, Raiders and Titans who will be fighting for the top prospects next year.

Top 5 guys I see are:
Jadeveon Clowney
Tajh Boyd
Teddy Bridgewater
Marquis Lee
Johnny Manziel


Sabo-Tajh
Tank for Teddy
Lose for Lee
Muff for Manziel
Downey for Clowney

Catastrophe for Clowney
Tank for Taj
Terrible for Teddy
Lousy for Lee
Monotonous for Manziel

Rey
04-30-2013, 12:39 PM
I'd just like to call them the Titans doing what they do...

Thorn
04-30-2013, 01:17 PM
I see the Titans as challenging the Dolts for 2nd place in our division while the kittens end up in 4th place missing the litter box altogeather.

ASidd_1990
05-16-2013, 03:55 PM
Maybe? Maybe no?

Craig.
05-16-2013, 03:56 PM
Depends on what the question is. If its 'Who should be the new pitchman for a wing joint' then I say yes.

badboy
05-16-2013, 03:57 PM
Not at this time. We have ways to go for Newton to heal and also how Harris does.

ASidd_1990
05-16-2013, 03:57 PM
Whatevs

:spin:

The Pencil Neck
05-16-2013, 04:00 PM
He's probably asking too much and I have a feeling there may be some bad blood between him and the organization that we don't know about.

thunderkyss
05-16-2013, 04:22 PM
He's probably asking too much and I have a feeling there may be some bad blood between him and the organization that we don't know about.

Surely he's come down on his asking price by now.

But maybe we've moved on. I think the idea was to get better. We don't get better bringing Eric back.

I understand there was a drop off in play. I'm sure it was expected, especially in the run game, but I noticed a much improved pocket from day one (up until Newton got hurt).

It also appears they see enough in Harris.. I didn't. '76 did. However, maybe they see him as a stop-gap & have hopes the QBerry can be the man if Newton can't.

ASidd_1990
05-16-2013, 04:25 PM
He's probably asking too much and I have a feeling there may be some bad blood between him and the organization that we don't know about.

Wasn't he in Houston for the Gathering of Champions charity thingy a couple weeks back?

HOU-TEX
05-16-2013, 04:31 PM
Been discussed in depth in the correct location

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99008&highlight=eric+winston

ASidd_1990
05-16-2013, 04:32 PM
Been discussed in depth in the correct location

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99008&highlight=eric+winston

Merge this ***** then!

:ahhaha:

Playoffs
07-24-2013, 08:04 PM
Adam Schefter ‏@AdamSchefter
Former Chiefs OT Eric Winston is closing in on a 1-year deal with the Cardinals. It could get done in the next 24 hours.

Norg
07-24-2013, 11:11 PM
To bad we couldn't have gotten WInston and Kevin walter on da cheap LOL

b0ng
07-25-2013, 12:05 PM
Eric Winston signs with Cards for vet min + incentives (http://www.kffl.com/gnews.php?id=862142-cardinals-more-on-eric-winston)

Playoffs
07-25-2013, 12:55 PM
Eric Winston signs with Cards for vet min + incentives (http://www.kffl.com/gnews.php?id=862142-cardinals-more-on-eric-winston)

I'd be interest in what the "incentives if he becomes a starter" are? I bet they're high. He had priced himself out of the league, supposedly demanding something in the $3-$4 million range.

amazing80
07-26-2013, 08:19 PM
There has to be baggage with Winston that we don't know about. The guy is borderline top 10 RT (especially in the run game) and he doesn't get signed until eve of training camp and its a VET MINIMUM on a crap team......

BullBlitz
07-26-2013, 08:28 PM
Good guy. I hope he does well.

thunderkyss
07-26-2013, 09:03 PM
Good guy. I hope he does well.

Classy, classy, classy.

MSR

CloakNNNdagger
07-26-2013, 09:11 PM
There has to be baggage with Winston that we don't know about. The guy is borderline top 10 RT (especially in the run game) and he doesn't get signed until eve of training camp and its a VET MINIMUM on a crap team......

He never showed up with this "problem" on the injury reports last year..........but I do know that, although entirely unpublicized, he underwent elbow surgery the beginning of January. Question marks following this surgery may have left the Chiefs and informed teams hesitant to take a chance with anything more than a vet minimum with incentives as insurance to prove that he is not damaged goods.

TexanSam
07-27-2013, 08:01 PM
Good luck to him with the Cards. I don't know what the rest of their O-line situation is like, but he should help shore it up some. They were flat out awful last season. Almost 2002 Texans O-line bad.

steelbtexan
07-27-2013, 09:40 PM
Good luck to him with the Cards. I don't know what the rest of their O-line situation is like, but he should help shore it up some. They were flat out awful last season. Almost 2002 Texans O-line bad.

Teams don't want overpriced clubhouse lawyers, who are thinking about how they are going to get a job in the media after their career is over, instead of thinking about their current job at hand.

Teams also may have been turned off by the fans suck, we're not gladiators act Winston pulled. He was just politicking to cover up for his extremely avg play at RT last season.

Players turning on the paying customers is never a good idea. It appears to have cost Winston millions.

thunderkyss
07-27-2013, 10:17 PM
I think we are seeing that Eric Winston was not as good as we thought he was. No doubt the best we've seen in a while, but not what a team needs at RT if their goal is to win a Super Bowl & what team doesn't want to win a Super Bowl?



Edit: I'm not one to pat my back, but I think it's due in this case. I've said Eric Winston was our weakest link a long time back, when many of you would bad mouth our Pro Bowl center (& I mentioned he was our most consistent OLman at the time). I may not know everything, but I know a little..... that's all I'm saying.

CloakNNNdagger
07-27-2013, 10:59 PM
I think we are seeing that Eric Winston was not as good as we thought he was. No doubt the best we've seen in a while, but not what a team needs at RT if their goal is to win a Super Bowl & what team doesn't want to win a Super Bowl?



Edit: I'm not one to pat my back, but I think it's due in this case. I've said Eric Winston was our weakest link a long time back, when many of you would bad mouth our Pro Bowl center (& I mentioned he was our most consistent OLman at the time). I may not know everything, but I know a little..... that's all I'm saying.

You did post repeatedly that Winston was "not all that" and I shared your feeling. You nailed it with our Pro Bowl center, while I and many others felt that he was nor never would be the answer. You deserve that pat on the back, but as you know I am still sore from patting myself on the back last night............so please accept my "virtual pat.:)"

IDEXAN
07-28-2013, 08:57 AM
Teams don't want overpriced clubhouse lawyers, who are thinking about how they are going to get a job in the media after their career is over, instead of thinking about their current job at hand.

Teams also may have been turned off by the fans suck, we're not gladiators act Winston pulled. He was just politicking to cover up for his extremely avg play at RT last season.

Players turning on the paying customers is never a good idea. It appears to have cost Winston millions.
You nailed it there Steelbtexan, I think that was the dirty little secret about Winston. He got on the soap box a couple times in KC last year, and that's the last thing coachs want to hear from a player. And even though Winston has always been a good to very good run blocker, he's also always been a liability as a pass-blocker, and more and more NFL teams are throwing the ball, so there's that.

Lucky
07-28-2013, 11:42 AM
And even though Winston has always been a good to very good run blocker, he's also always been a liability as a pass-blocker, and more and more NFL teams are throwing the ball, so there's that.
Yes, Winston had more value on teams like the Texans and the pre-Reid Chiefs, who emphasized the run. I think his deficiency as a pass blocker (and possibly his injury concerns) had more to do with his marketability than his locker room or off the field activities. Having said that, I still think Winston is better than anything the Texans currently have at RT.

steelbtexan
07-28-2013, 11:56 AM
Yes, Winston had more value on teams like the Texans and the pre-Reid Chiefs, who emphasized the run. I think his deficiency as a pass blocker (and possibly his injury concerns) had more to do with his marketability than his locker room or off the field activities. Having said that, I still think Winston is better than anything the Texans currently have at RT.

Which says volumes about the Texans RT situation.

I hope Quessenberry is as good as the coaches have made him out to be. Injuries at RT should be a cause for concern beginning the season. I don't buy into Gary hyping Harris as looking great in practice. Harris is what he is, an injury prone, journeyman, backup OT.

Lucky
07-28-2013, 12:06 PM
I hope Quessenberry is as good as the coaches have made him out to be. Injuries at RT should be a cause for concern beginning the season. I don't buy into Gary hyping Harris as looking great in practice. Harris is what he is, an injury prone, journeyman, backup OT.
I haven't seen the rookies play (obviously), so I haven't really considered them a part of the equation. I don't think Newton has the feet to play tackle. And I think Harris doesn't anchor well enough against bull rushers (which is what is generally coming from that side). Combine Newton and Harris, and you may have a poor man's Winston. Which is still not that great. This is still my biggest concern on this team, because it affects Schaub's confidence.

The Pencil Neck
07-28-2013, 12:13 PM
Harris is what he is, an injury prone, journeyman, backup OT.

But... that's not what he is.

He is injury prone, I'll give you that.

But although he didn't start his rookie year, he started every game (that he was available for) but one for the Broncos after that. He started 16 games his 2nd season, 8 games his third, and then 10 games his fourth season. So the guy was a starter, not a backup.

And for me, a journeyman is a player who bounces around from team to team. Harris has only been with 2 teams in 6 years (so far), so I don't see him as a journeyman.

I'm not saying that he's the answer at RT but I think that's more because of the injury situation with him combined with the fact that we've got some younger guys that might be more talented.

I don't think Kubiak is blowing sunshine at people when he talks about how good the guy is playing.

houstonspartan
07-28-2013, 12:42 PM
I used to get infuriated when he'd have a terrible game, then turn on the radio on Monday listening to him laugh and yuk it up like he didn't have a care in the world.

I have no ill will towards Winston. Nor do I fault him for thinking about his life after football. But, he was more obsessed with getting in front of cameras than he was improving his game.

How long do you think it'll take for him to find his way into the spotlight in Phoenix? He'll probably hitch his wagon to Larry Fitzgerald, since he knows that Fitz is that team's highest profile player.

I wish Winston well, but, I have no issues with him no longer being here.

steelbtexan
07-28-2013, 12:59 PM
But... that's not what he is.

He is injury prone, I'll give you that.

But although he didn't start his rookie year, he started every game (that he was available for) but one for the Broncos after that. He started 16 games his 2nd season, 8 games his third, and then 10 games his fourth season. So the guy was a starter, not a backup.

And for me, a journeyman is a player who bounces around from team to team. Harris has only been with 2 teams in 6 years (so far), so I don't see him as a journeyman.

I'm not saying that he's the answer at RT but I think that's more because of the injury situation with him combined with the fact that we've got some younger guys that might be more talented.

I don't think Kubiak is blowing sunshine at people when he talks about how good the guy is playing.

The Broncos cut him because of a back injury. Harris became available after Philly cut him last preseason. Lucky is spot on, when he said Harris doesn't anchor well enough to be an above avg RT.

Plus it's likely that Harris' back wont hold up as a 16 game starter. But right now he's the best RT they've got. This worries me more than a little.

The Pencil Neck
07-28-2013, 01:03 PM
The Broncos cut him because of a back injury. Harris became available after Philly cut him last preseason. Lucky is spot on, when he said Harris doesn't anchor well enough to be an above avg RT.

Plus it's likely that Harris' back wont hold up as a 16 game starter. But right now he's the best RT they've got. This worries me more than a little.

My bad. I was not aware of the stint with the Eagles. He didn't play any games with them so it didn't show up in the stats. All I remembered was him playing with the Broncos and then getting cut from the Broncos to play with us, I didn't know/remember that was his second stint with the Broncos.

thunderkyss
07-28-2013, 04:10 PM
I'm not saying that he's the answer at RT but I think that's more because of the injury situation with him combined with the fact that we've got some younger guys that might be more talented.

I don't think Kubiak is blowing sunshine at people when he talks about how good the guy is playing.

That's the way I took it when Kubiak said he hasn't seen Harris this healthy in a long time.

He's only 28 years old. That's prime time for an offensive lineman.

CloakNNNdagger
07-28-2013, 07:56 PM
I find some sunshine in that Harris made it through all of last season without his back problem recurring. In doing so, he stands a very good chance that problem is behind him, as long as he continues a constant vigilant concentration on maintaining strong core strength.

Playoffs
07-28-2013, 08:27 PM
I find some sunshine in that Harris made it through all of last season without his back problem recurring. In doing so, he stands a very good chance that problem is behind him, as long as he continues a constant vigilant concentration on maintaining strong core strength.

Harris only took about 35% of total RT snaps last year... should he maintain such a reduced number to help avoid more back issues?

CloakNNNdagger
07-28-2013, 08:40 PM
Harris only took about 35% of total RT snaps last year... should he maintain such a reduced number to help avoid more back issues?

The fact that he took 35% over the entire season still confirms an element of "longevity" without injury. If he has maintained his core strength, I feel that he would have a very good chance of making it through a typical 80% season this year, barring any freak type of trauma.