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panamamyers
01-19-2013, 10:20 PM
I decided to go ahead and attempt to do a mock draft.

1. Dion Jordan, Oregon - May have to trade up to get him depending on which mock you look at. Pass rushers are some of the hardest guys to find though, and we need them.

2. Dallas Thomas, Tenn - I expect him to play guard in the NFL. We need offensive linemen.

3a. Markus Wheaton, Oregon St - Extremely fast receiver. Mike Wallace type

3b. Gavin Escobar, SDSU - Big, athletic tight end

4a. Matt Scott, Arizona - Has good speed for a qb, nice arm, development potential

4b. (assuming we get a 4b) Ray Ray Armstrong, Miami - Big, very athletic, high ceiling safety.

5. Bruce Taylor, VT - Inside linebacker that we need for depth. Pretty athletic guy for this late in the draft.

6a. Tanner Hawkinson, Kansas - developmental, athletic offensive tackle

6b. Zac Stacy, Vanderbilt - Hard to believe that most mocks have him rated this low. Could easily contribute next year as a third down back type of guy. He has playmaking ability.

7a. Greg Reid, Valdosta St. - nickel corner maybe, return man.

7b. TJ Moe, Missouri - possible slot receiver

Rey
01-19-2013, 10:29 PM
Jordan is my guy...so I'm digging the mock just based on that.

I think he'd be the perfect solb for this defense c

WolverineFan
01-19-2013, 10:39 PM
I like Wheaton and I really like Stacy. Been singing his praises all season.

Both Reid and Armstrong have had off the field issues.

NCTexan
01-20-2013, 12:13 PM
Do you think we need a slot receiver?

I'm down with drafting Wheaton with the uncertainty surrounding Posey, but have you pretty much given up on Martin?

badboy
01-20-2013, 05:24 PM
I decided to go ahead and attempt to do a mock draft.

1. Dion Jordan, Oregon - May have to trade up to get him depending on which mock you look at. Pass rushers are some of the hardest guys to find though, and we need them.

2. Dallas Thomas, Tenn - I expect him to play guard in the NFL. We need offensive linemen.

3a. Markus Wheaton, Oregon St - Extremely fast receiver. Mike Wallace type

3b. Gavin Escobar, SDSU - Big, athletic tight end

4a. Matt Scott, Arizona - Has good speed for a qb, nice arm, development potential

4b. (assuming we get a 4b) Ray Ray Armstrong, Miami - Big, very athletic, high ceiling safety.

5. Bruce Taylor, VT - Inside linebacker that we need for depth. Pretty athletic guy for this late in the draft.

6a. Tanner Hawkinson, Kansas - developmental, athletic offensive tackle

6b. Zac Stacy, Vanderbilt - Hard to believe that most mocks have him rated this low. Could easily contribute next year as a third down back type of guy. He has playmaking ability.

7a. Greg Reid, Valdosta St. - nickel corner maybe, return man.

7b. TJ Moe, Missouri - possible slot receiverCurious as to whom your starting Nose and ILBs are going to be?

panamamyers
01-20-2013, 06:53 PM
i personally dont like martin much at all. he seems more like a very small wide receiver as opposed to having slot receiver skills.
earl mitchell plays the nose and cushing and either dobbins or taylor at ilb.
i personally like dobbins ok enough for how much we use that second ilb.

panamamyers
01-20-2013, 07:04 PM
Also, if Sonny Harris is back, I liked the way he was playing in pre-season.

panamamyers
01-20-2013, 07:08 PM
I like Wheaton and I really like Stacy. Been singing his praises all season.

Both Reid and Armstrong have had off the field issues.

Reid and Armstrong would be going much, much higher more than likely if not for the off field issues. I think Armstrong in particular has a pretty high ceiling. Reid could be useful if you have to let McCain walk and Harris doesn't come around.

mussop
01-20-2013, 07:49 PM
i personally dont like martin much at all. he seems more like a very small wide receiver as opposed to having slot receiver skills.
earl mitchell plays the nose and cushing and either dobbins or taylor at ilb.
i personally like dobbins ok enough for how much we use that second ilb.

What are slot receiver skills?

Earl at the nose and who backs him up? Earl is better than Cody for sure. But he still shouldn't be starting. He has 3 sacks in three seasons. He gets no push up the middle and isn't good enough to keep the ILB's clean.

Your ok with dobbins or a 5th riund rookie starting? Did you watch Dobbins play this year? He is good in short yardage situations and that is it.

Your first round pick is going to be sitting the Bench even if Barwin leaves. Are you ok with that? Not to mention it won't do any good having a strong stable off outside pass rushers if we don't fix the middle of out defense. Cushing is very good but he can't do it all by himself. Remember he is coming of a major injury and plays all out. What if he gets hurt again?

What do you mean for as little as we use the ILB position?

panamamyers
01-20-2013, 08:08 PM
martin does not have good lateral quickness or stop and start ability, which is what yould prefer for a slot receiver.

harris can back up mitchell or pick up somebody in free agency. dont need to waste a high draft pick on nt or ilb when our nickel corner plays more than both of them.

i dont think its true that he would be sitting the bench even if barwin leaves. if he is good enough he eill play. wouldnt take much to beat out what we got now. i still think its possible that reed moves inside. muchmore better suited for the inside.

if i chose nt or ilb higer then you would be complaining about the lack of ol and wr lol

mussop
01-20-2013, 08:29 PM
martin does not have good lateral quickness or stop and start ability, which is what yould prefer for a slot receiver.

You couldn't be more wrong. Those are his best attributes.

harris can back up mitchell or pick up somebody in free agency. dont need to waste a high draft pick on nt or ilb when our nickel corner plays more than both of them.

So you think we play more Nicole and dime than a base 3/4?

i dont think its true that he would be sitting the bench even if barwin leaves. if he is good enough he eill play. wouldnt take much to beat out what we got now. i still think its possible that reed moves inside. muchmore better suited for the inside.

Wouldn't take much to beat out Mercilous and Reed? Ok!


if i chose nt or ilb higer then you would be complaining about the lack of ol and wr lol

No I wouldn't. IMO the OL simply needs depth that can easily be found later in the draft. WR isn't a problem as far as I'm concerned either. We already have three top notch weapons on offense. Adding more isn't going to make that much difference. Look at my mock and you will see how I think things will go down.

panamamyers
01-20-2013, 08:48 PM
Not sure how else to answer that other than to say, no I am not wrong about Martin.
You have your opinion, I have mine.

The way I would go about any draft is to combine needs with how difficult it may be to get what you are looking for.
Pass rushers very rarely come from somewhere other than the first round.
you can find inside linebackers, some of the best in the game, all through the draft. You can find a nose guard, some of the best in the game, all through the draft.
I don't want to waste picks on Earl Mitchell's back up. Find another way to get a backup at a position which only plays half the snaps on defense anyways.

We need a pass rusher bad, bad. We don't have anyone outside of Watt that can put pressure on the passer. We need more depth and possible starters in the offensive line.

mussop
01-20-2013, 08:53 PM
Not sure how else to answer that other than to say, no I am not wrong about Martin.
You have your opinion, I have mine.

The way I would go about any draft is to combine needs with how difficult it may be to get what you are looking for.
Pass rushers very rarely come from somewhere other than the first round.
you can find inside linebackers, some of the best in the game, all through the draft. You can find a nose guard, some of the best in the game, all through the draft.
I don't want to waste picks on Earl Mitchell's back up. Find another way to get a backup at a position which only plays half the snaps on defense anyways.

We need a pass rusher bad, bad. We don't have anyone outside of Watt that can put pressure on the passer. We need more depth and possible starters in the offensive line.

You don't think having ZERO push up the middle has anything to do with the lack of pass rush from the outside

panamamyers
01-20-2013, 08:58 PM
Most passing downs we have Smith and Watt in the middle. They do an OK job in my opinion.
I just think Barwin and Reed are not dynamic pass rushers.

Insideop
01-21-2013, 09:38 AM
I think both of you are wrong!

Panama, if you think the Texans can get by with what they have at ILB and NT your nuts! It didn't work out too well for them this year. With Cushing, Dobbins, and Sharpton being on IR and Bradie James turning 32 they need to upgrade this position badly. The loss of Cushing probably hurt this team more than anything and if he goes down again next season the same thing will happen again (See article about Cushing http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-2/Texans-look-forward-to-Brian-Cushings-2013-return/775ae5ab-54f0-4e4f-9a98-7161f4fc447c). The same is true for NT. With Cody a FA and having back problems Mitchell and Terrell McClain are the only other NT's on the roster. McClain is a 2nd year player they picked up on waivers mid season. If Cody leaves, or is a cap casualty, which is highly probable, they will need another NT from the draft to groom or start in his place.

Mussop, I have to disagree with you that we don't need another WR and have enough weapons on offense, and it's for basically the same reason we need help at ILB and NT on defense. Depth! If you look at the WR situation AJ will be 32 next season and there is no other real threat now that Posey went down with an achilles injury. The only WR's left are Jean, who disappointed and may not get another chance, Walter, who will also be 32 and may be another cap casualty, Martin, who will probably be mainly used as a KR/PR and part time slot WR. Way too may ??? there IMO. Don't be surprised in the 1st round, if Allen or Williams are still there, that the Texans take one of them. I'd also like to see them get a big (6'6"+) fast TE in the early rounds. You can never have enough weapons!

panamamyers
01-21-2013, 10:10 AM
Well, I do have them drafting an inside linebacker, so I never said they could get by with what they have. I don't think Minter or Reddick are that much better than Taylor. I do think the types of tight ends we can get in the third round, and the qb we can get in the 4th round are much, much better than what we can get later. So, that is why I waited until the 5th to take Taylor at ILB, because I think he is a better value there than if I took a comparable guy in the 2nd round let's say.

And assuming Cushing and Dobbins are healthy, I think ILB is pretty far down the list of concerns. Not to say it is not a conern, but to me there are plenty of larger concerns on the team. Taylor is there for quality depth and to compete with Dobbins for a starting position.

I do have us taking a big, athletic tight end as well.

Nose tackle we can pick up a free agent. You can't solve all your problems in one draft. Maybe we can get Roy Miller out of TB.

IMO, we have to get an OLB, guard, tackle, tight end, qb, rb, receiver, ilb and safety for sure. If we let Wade Smith walk for salary cap reasons, the guard needs to be fairly good and possibly ready to play. Tough to find good pass rushers in the 5th round. The safety should be ready to possibly play.

The other receiver and slot corner picks are in the 7th round, and you aren't going to get much out of a nose tackle in that round probably. I still think Sunny Harris is a good backup NFL nose tackle assuming he comes back healthy and plays for the Texans.

badboy
01-21-2013, 10:48 AM
I think both of you are wrong!

Panama, if you think the Texans can get by with what they have at ILB and NT your nuts! It didn't work out too well for them this year. With Cushing, Dobbins, and Sharpton being on IR and Bradie James turning 32 they need to upgrade this position badly. The loss of Cushing probably hurt this team more than anything and if he goes down again next season the same thing will happen again (See article about Cushing http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-2/Texans-look-forward-to-Brian-Cushings-2013-return/775ae5ab-54f0-4e4f-9a98-7161f4fc447c). The same is true for NT. With Cody a FA and having back problems Mitchell and Terrell McClain are the only other NT's on the roster. McClain is a 2nd year player they picked up on waivers mid season. If Cody leaves, or is a cap casualty, which is highly probable, they will need another NT from the draft to groom or start in his place.

Mussop, I have to disagree with you that we don't need another WR and have enough weapons on offense, and it's for basically the same reason we need help at ILB and NT on defense. Depth! If you look at the WR situation AJ will be 32 next season and there is no other real threat now that Posey went down with an achilles injury. The only WR's left are Jean, who disappointed and may not get another chance, Walter, who will also be 32 and may be another cap casualty, Martin, who will probably be mainly used as a KR/PR and part time slot WR. Way too may ??? there IMO. Don't be surprised in the 1st round, if Allen or Williams are still there, that the Texans take one of them. I'd also like to see them get a big (6'6"+) fast TE in the early rounds. You can never have enough weapons!These are my thoughts also/considered TE in first but just cannot pull trigger. I like Michael Williams in 5th. Size, blocking skills, soft hands, can play line at 6'5 272, use to lights playing for Alabama.

panamamyers
01-21-2013, 11:36 AM
I actually had Eifert in the first at one point, but I did not like where that put us with the need for a pass rusher.

mussop
01-21-2013, 11:41 AM
I think both of you are wrong!

Panama, if you think the Texans can get by with what they have at ILB and NT your nuts! It didn't work out too well for them this year. With Cushing, Dobbins, and Sharpton being on IR and Bradie James turning 32 they need to upgrade this position badly. The loss of Cushing probably hurt this team more than anything and if he goes down again next season the same thing will happen again (See article about Cushing http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-2/Texans-look-forward-to-Brian-Cushings-2013-return/775ae5ab-54f0-4e4f-9a98-7161f4fc447c). The same is true for NT. With Cody a FA and having back problems Mitchell and Terrell McClain are the only other NT's on the roster. McClain is a 2nd year player they picked up on waivers mid season. If Cody leaves, or is a cap casualty, which is highly probable, they will need another NT from the draft to groom or start in his place.

Mussop, I have to disagree with you that we don't need another WR and have enough weapons on offense, and it's for basically the same reason we need help at ILB and NT on defense. Depth! If you look at the WR situation AJ will be 32 next season and there is no other real threat now that Posey went down with an achilles injury. The only WR's left are Jean, who disappointed and may not get another chance, Walter, who will also be 32 and may be another cap casualty, Martin, who will probably be mainly used as a KR/PR and part time slot WR. Way too may ??? there IMO. Don't be surprised in the 1st round, if Allen or Williams are still there, that the Texans take one of them. I'd also like to see them get a big (6'6"+) fast TE in the early rounds. You can never have enough weapons!

Oh I don't have a problem replacing Walter. Like I said it should of been done a year or two ago. I just think its lower on the list than getting the middle of the defense squared away. IMO the defense is two players away from being elite. Three if you want to count Cushing. If we could get an above average NT the could either command double teams or consistently get penetration, it would really open things up for not only Watt and Smith but also our OLB's.

Yes you can never have too many weapons but with a QB like Schaub how much difference would it really make? How often does a rookie WR come in and make a real impact? Also do you guys think that by adding offensive weapons Schaub will be good enough to win a shoot out against the top QB's?

IMO The best way to build this team to compete with the likes of NE and Denver is to have a top notch pass rush.

76Texan
01-21-2013, 12:23 PM
I decided to go ahead and attempt to do a mock draft.

1. Dion Jordan, Oregon - May have to trade up to get him depending on which mock you look at. Pass rushers are some of the hardest guys to find though, and we need them.

2. Dallas Thomas, Tenn - I expect him to play guard in the NFL. We need offensive linemen.

3a. Markus Wheaton, Oregon St - Extremely fast receiver. Mike Wallace type

3b. Gavin Escobar, SDSU - Big, athletic tight end

4a. Matt Scott, Arizona - Has good speed for a qb, nice arm, development potential

4b. (assuming we get a 4b) Ray Ray Armstrong, Miami - Big, very athletic, high ceiling safety.

5. Bruce Taylor, VT - Inside linebacker that we need for depth. Pretty athletic guy for this late in the draft.

6a. Tanner Hawkinson, Kansas - developmental, athletic offensive tackle

6b. Zac Stacy, Vanderbilt - Hard to believe that most mocks have him rated this low. Could easily contribute next year as a third down back type of guy. He has playmaking ability.

7a. Greg Reid, Valdosta St. - nickel corner maybe, return man.

7b. TJ Moe, Missouri - possible slot receiver
I like Jordan and TJ Moe (haven't watched Moe the last two years, but he made a lot of plays for Gabbert the last time I watched Mizzou.

I would say no to Ray Ray; he's not good on the field.

Haven't watched the other guys enough to have an opinion.

steelbtexan
01-21-2013, 12:41 PM
Oh I don't have a problem replacing Walter. Like I said it should of been done a year or two ago. I just think its lower on the list than getting the middle of the defense squared away. IMO the defense is two players away from being elite. Three if you want to count Cushing. If we could get an above average NT the could either command double teams or consistently get penetration, it would really open things up for not only Watt and Smith but also our OLB's.

Yes you can never have too many weapons but with a QB like Schaub how much difference would it really make? How often does a rookie WR come in and make a real impact? Also do you guys think that by adding offensive weapons Schaub will be good enough to win a shoot out against the top QB's?

IMO The best way to build this team to compete with the likes of NE and Denver is to have a top notch pass rush.

The Texans defense needs 4 players to get to an elite level. An extra S for the nickle, ILB/OLB and a nickle CB. Even though they had these needs they held the Bengals to 0 TD's in the playoffs. Schaub threw 1 pick six.

The best way to improve the defense is to keep it off the field. You do this by improving the offense. That's why finding a WR with speed to take the pressure off AJ, (Williams from Baylor/Hunter/Hopkins could help right away like Green and Jones did for Atl/Cincy) So yes, WR's can contribute quickly.

Fix the OL and finding a QB for the future (If you believe this season is as good as it's going to get for Schaub) should the top priorities.

If you could get an above RT in FA would you let Barwin walk? Re-sign A.Smith? These are the tough decisions that the Texans FO should be asking right now before the all star games/Combine. If I had to guess what they are doing right now they are probably vacationing or scheduling sleep apnea surgery to be done during the combine. (Atleast that's their track record.)

panamamyers
01-24-2013, 07:46 PM
Markus Wheaton turning heads (http://www.nfl.com/seniorbowl/story/0ap1000000130235/article/markus-wheaton-lane-johnson-among-senior-bowl-standouts)

I'm getting concerned that Wheaton will raise his draft stock too high. I honestly think he is the best receiver in the draft period. Take him in the 2nd if you have to.

badboy
01-25-2013, 11:27 AM
Markus Wheaton turning heads (http://www.nfl.com/seniorbowl/story/0ap1000000130235/article/markus-wheaton-lane-johnson-among-senior-bowl-standouts)

I'm getting concerned that Wheaton will raise his draft stock too high. I honestly think he is the best receiver in the draft period. Take him in the 2nd if you have to.Should be there in second but may be too frail at 5'11" 183. Has a 64.8 rating, lowest of all I reviewed. Swope was at 67.4

panamamyers
01-25-2013, 12:52 PM
I wonder if that NFL grade was pre-Senior Bowl, because everyone I have read is saying that he is one of the top 2 or 3 players there.
I doubt we get him now. We won't draft him before the 3rd, and he won't be there then.

beerlover
01-25-2013, 12:59 PM
I wonder if that NFL grade was pre-Senior Bowl, because everyone I have read is saying that he is one of the top 2 or 3 players there.
I doubt we get him now. We won't draft him before the 3rd, and he won't be there then.

I love this kid too. Really depends on a teams need in the slot. I could see New England taking him when Welker hits the free agent market. Texans probably wouldn't bite, not that I'd mind, because Martin is still a work in progress.

Poyer looks outstanding as well. Looks like a top flight nickle cb. both are smaller in stature, both are niche type players who will succeed in the NFL.

BL :wesmantexanfan:

panamamyers
02-25-2013, 09:33 AM
Going to have to redo this draft big time.
Jordan is probably going to be a top 10 pick now.
Scott will never last that long after the show he put on yesterday.
Wheaton could be a 1st round pick now after what he did yesterday.
Hawkinson possibly moving all the way up to the 4th round now.

Too bad we couldn't have just had the draft real quick before the combine.

b0ng
02-25-2013, 11:23 AM
Going to have to redo this draft big time.
Jordan is probably going to be a top 10 pick now.
Scott will never last that long after the show he put on yesterday.
Wheaton could be a 1st round pick now after what he did yesterday.
Hawkinson possibly moving all the way up to the 4th round now.

Too bad we couldn't have just had the draft real quick before the combine.

After the combine performance I think Escobar is going to be there much later than the 3rd round also. I don't think Wheaton is going to be a first rounder, I think you still have guys like Patterson, Austin, Woods, T. Williams, and Hopkins which will be rated higher than Wheaton on most of their boards.

76Texan
02-25-2013, 12:51 PM
Going to have to redo this draft big time.
Jordan is probably going to be a top 10 pick now.
Scott will never last that long after the show he put on yesterday.
Wheaton could be a 1st round pick now after what he did yesterday.
Hawkinson possibly moving all the way up to the 4th round now.

Too bad we couldn't have just had the draft real quick before the combine.

While I like Wheaton a ton, I don't think you want to draft him in the first.
He will make a very good number 2, but I want a guy with higher ceiling for a first round pick. With Wheaton, it's pretty much what you see is what you get, assuming normal growth.