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View Full Version : What happened the offence since 2010?


Maddict5
01-14-2013, 06:02 PM
In 2009 & 2010, it seemed like we went down by 14 or 21 every second week thanks to our atrocious D. yet the majority of the time, schaub brought us back (only to suffer a heartbreaking late game meltdown on D to lose it again). wtf has happened since then that everyone thinks (& it seems) its game over if the texans fall behind by any margin now?

apart from obviously making more of a commitment to the run (which in theory should be making it easier to throw), why cant we throw the ball at will anymore? we have better players everywhere and a better D who will get more stops. if we had the 2010 passing game, i think everybody would be more optimistic about this team going forward.

Lucky
01-14-2013, 06:10 PM
I think the answer is pretty obvious, but we already have a hundred Matt Schaub threads. And it wasn't since 2010. The Texans passing game was very good in 2011, prior to the lisfranc injury. And, it had its moments in the first half of 2012. Give me the Matt Schaub of 2009-2011, and the Texans have a punchers chance in Foxboro. Actually, they never have to go to Foxboro, as the game would have been played at Releiant.

Yes, the Texans need more speed at WR. Yes, the right side of the OL needs to improve. But that could change tomorrow, and the Texans won't be a championship caliber team with the late 2012/2012 Matt Schaub at QB.

Wolf
01-14-2013, 06:17 PM
Missing Baby Shan?

WolverineFan
01-14-2013, 06:22 PM
Missing Baby Shan?

This. Playcalling was atrocious down the stretch. Once teams figured out Kubiak's tendencies he couldn't adapt and we struggled.

Maddict5
01-14-2013, 06:32 PM
I think the answer is pretty obvious, but we already have a hundred Matt Schaub threads. And it wasn't since 2010. The Texans passing game was very good in 2011, prior to the lisfranc injury. And, it had its moments in the first half of 2012. Give me the Matt Schaub of 2009-2011, and the Texans have a punchers chance in Foxboro. Actually, they never have to go to Foxboro, as the game would have been played at Releiant.

Yes, the Texans need more speed at WR. Yes, the right side of the OL needs to improve. But that could change tomorrow, and the Texans won't be a championship caliber team with the late 2012/2012 Matt Schaub at QB.

i dont think it is just schaub and the lisfranc though. it may have affected him a little (not as much as is implied around here though) but how has that changed the passing game so much? he looks about the same as in 2010 in everything he does until the ball leaves his hand. we're only guessing that its affecting him based on the results of the whole passing game. he still has more or less the same arm and can still sling it even if his accuracy and consistency arent quite as good. schaub was never a guy that bought time anyway so his reads etc shouldnt be affected much even if the foot is bothering him some

in 2010, it seemed we'd skin teams so many ways with aj, od, walter, arian/slaton, dreessen, jacoby. maybe its nostalgia but it just seems to have gotten alot more predictable and easy to stop us on offence now

and dont get me started on RZ throws, we used to be decent at passing into the EZ and getting tds (we were still below average overall pre 2010 due to the poor run game back then)

Maddict5
01-14-2013, 06:35 PM
Missing Baby Shan?

This. Playcalling was atrocious down the stretch. Once teams figured out Kubiak's tendencies he couldn't adapt and we struggled.

i thought about this too but c'mon we all know kubiak used to run the show on offence back then too just like he does now. sure the OC's have input, but it was still kubes who calls the plays...

i honestly dont understand it. maybe its a mixture of everything mentioned plus older age maybe affecting the skill guys some??

Premier
01-14-2013, 06:43 PM
big leads, prevent defenses, 5 wide sets..

meaningless stats..

Maddict5
01-14-2013, 06:49 PM
big leads, prevent defenses, 5 wide sets..

meaningless stats..

its not meaningless prevent D when we were coming back to tie and get the leads in those games

Norg
01-14-2013, 10:39 PM
Andre Kevin and OD have all gotten older n slower and they cant get seperation

same with the QB old n slow


so bassically our offesnsive is old n slow now

AJ-80
01-14-2013, 11:13 PM
Andre Kevin and OD have all gotten older n slower and they cant get seperation

same with the QB old n slow


so bassically our offesnsive is old n slow now

You are saying Andre Johnson hasn't gotten separation after he had his best season?:hankpalm:

Walter, now that I can agree with.

dream_team
01-14-2013, 11:53 PM
I thought our offense played well last season... well, considering the circumstances. Foster out the first few games, then AJ out after game 4, then Schaub out after week 10. Then we went to ultra conservative mode with TJ.

This season, I think the loss of Briesel, Winston, and Dreesen hurt more than expected.

CretorFrigg
01-14-2013, 11:58 PM
It's pretty simple, I think. Our offense has regressed since 2010 because we lack talent. We've consistently been drafting defensive players, and understandably so due to our defensive woes. But by doing so, we've neglected the offense.

We still have some of the main stars on offense, but we never added any playmakers. We've just been cutting them, exactly like how we disregarded the right side of our O-line. Think about it. Are there any new stars on offense since 2010? Posey? Martin? Is that the best we'll get?

Combine that with aging superstars, and an immobile Matt Schaub being even less mobile...if that is even possible.

dream_team
01-15-2013, 12:03 PM
Did you guys realize this season was the highest scoring season in franchise history? I didn't know that until I heard it on the Kubiak Show. I would have never guessed.

b0ng
01-15-2013, 12:16 PM
i thought about this too but c'mon we all know kubiak used to run the show on offence back then too just like he does now. sure the OC's have input, but it was still kubes who calls the plays...

i honestly dont understand it. maybe its a mixture of everything mentioned plus older age maybe affecting the skill guys some??

Our passing game was immensely better with Kyle Shanahanahanahanahan as our OC. Problem was our running game was really bad after that one miracle year out of Slaton (And when I say really bad, I don't mean Arian Foster's year this year where he still logged 1400 yards and 17 TD's. We're talking Ryan Moats, Chris Brown, Echemandu Adimchinobe bad). 2010 "felt" like our best offensive year as it seemed like we were in a shootout every other week and both the running and passing game seemed to be working great, it's just that the defense was so so so atrocious, and that was Dennison's first year.

I think age and injuries have a lot more to do with Daniels and Walters decline but overall I think our passing concepts got a little stale near the end of the season and teams were figuring out what was coming, whereas in the beginning of the season teams looked like they didn't know what was coming at any given time.

2012Champs
01-15-2013, 12:21 PM
We became run first. When we had no other choice you had to throw the ball all around the field. Thats changed now imo and we dont open it up like we did when we had no other choice

Mr teX
01-15-2013, 12:56 PM
http://www.bgobsession.com/Om/kyleshanahan.jpg

santo
01-15-2013, 01:05 PM
No Ben Tate and waiting for the right tackles to get up to speed.


Plus Matt not being as mobile as before the injury.

Texecutioner
01-15-2013, 01:09 PM
Sorry, but this whole "we need Shanahan" stuff is not anything we need.

I'll remind people (Even though everyone wants to ignore this) that the Texans were the 2nd highest scoring team in the NFL up until about week 13 or 14 or something like that. After that awful slide at the end of the season though, it knocked us down a few notches. We still finished #8 in total scoring.

http://www.nfl.com/stats/categorystats?archive=false&conference=null&role=TM&offensiveStatisticCategory=SCORING&defensiveStatisticCategory=null&season=2012&seasonType=REG&tabSeq=2&qualified=false&Submit=Go

Being #8 out of 32 other teams is not bad no matter how you slice it. The Texans put up 28 points against NE last week in the playoffs as well, and it would have been 32 had it not been for a dropped TD pass early on by Casey. No one was complaining about this offense for the majority of the season, but now everyone acts as if the offense is like the 25th best offense in the league despite the facts.

The problem is purely Kubiak. Schaub fell off down the stretch big time, but Kubiak refused to adapt and to make adjustments to his scheme and to who he is was playing against. Kubiak never will make adjustments, and that's why I've always hated having him as our HC, because he only will do things on way, and won't change things no matter what the circumstances are unless it involves playing an even more conservative game plan. Schaub will need to be replaced, but once again Gary will be to stubborn to do it or even entertain the idea. So, the problem is clearly Kubiak whether you think Schaub needs to go or not. The problem will be there with or without Schaub in my eyes.

Rey
01-15-2013, 01:49 PM
I think the answer is pretty obvious, but we already have a hundred Matt Schaub threads. And it wasn't since 2010. The Texans passing game was very good in 2011, prior to the lisfranc injury. And, it had its moments in the first half of 2012. Give me the Matt Schaub of 2009-2011, and the Texans have a punchers chance in Foxboro. Actually, they never have to go to Foxboro, as the game would have been played at Releiant.

Yes, the Texans need more speed at WR. Yes, the right side of the OL needs to improve. But that could change tomorrow, and the Texans won't be a championship caliber team with the late 2012/2012 Matt Schaub at QB.


I agree with all of this except I think kubiak could at least allow schaub more freedom at the line/allow him to pick up the tempo more often.

Premier
01-15-2013, 02:06 PM
http://www.bgobsession.com/Om/kyleshanahan.jpg

i remember people saying how much better kubiak was as a coach after shanny left. that he didnt have to keep an eye on baby shanny anymore and could focus on the game and trust dennison. shanny was a liability according to texans fans on here and the bullpen.. this reminds me of all the hate winston and briesel got last year and how after our little losing streak we desperately needed those 2 guys back..

Corrosion
01-15-2013, 02:07 PM
I think the answer is pretty obvious, but we already have a hundred Matt Schaub threads. And it wasn't since 2010. The Texans passing game was very good in 2011, prior to the lisfranc injury. And, it had its moments in the first half of 2012. Give me the Matt Schaub of 2009-2011, and the Texans have a punchers chance in Foxboro. Actually, they never have to go to Foxboro, as the game would have been played at Releiant.

Yes, the Texans need more speed at WR. Yes, the right side of the OL needs to improve. But that could change tomorrow, and the Texans won't be a championship caliber team with the late 2012/2012 Matt Schaub at QB.


/end thread.

welsh texan
01-15-2013, 02:15 PM
Another point is that Schaub is definitely a rhythm passer and he's always struggled to get into a game if he didn't get his eye in early. I seem to remember him having issues when we had Slaton running well although I might be wrong.

If you go back I'm pretty sure you'll find loads of instances where we've pounded the rock for a while, asked Schaub to throw one cold, and it's been a drive killer.

I really think some of these percentage plays need some looking at too, 3rd and long at midfield, why make a 5 yard pass then take a delay of game to give the punter room? It just doesn't make sense.

Playing sound football will keep your record respectable when you are bottom/middle of the pack, but the top teams try to beat you on 3rd and long, it's a momentum changer, says to a defence that all their work was for nothing. It tired them out, they've made super plays to force you into 3rd and long, and you've just negated all that with ease.

I saw the Pats do it a few times against us, and you just know you aren't going to make a stand on that drive when it happens.

Corrosion
01-15-2013, 08:39 PM
Another point is that Schaub is definitely a rhythm passer and he's always struggled to get into a game if he didn't get his eye in early.

Having played the game and the position (ont he highschool level) .... I just dont believe in the "rythym" passer myth.


Each play is a microcosm in and of itself .... Sure one play can have an effect by making down and distance more difficult but thats as far as it goes. One throw doesnt make another easier or more difficult.