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Tailgate
01-13-2013, 11:29 PM
I made a thread on this earlier in the season. We lost Winston, Mario, Dreessen, Briesel, Jones, Demeco, and Schaub coming off a major injury. We lose Cush, we lose Butler, and the rest of our LBs were shredded via injury.

Return game suffered. Running game suffered. Red zone suffered. Middle of the D suffered. The O, the D, and ST SUFFERED.

This was an uphill battle from the get go. We still won 13 games. Was it really that much of a devastating season all things considering?

MEGA SWATT
01-14-2013, 01:20 AM
I made a thread on this earlier in the season. We lost Winston, Mario, Dreessen, Briesel, Jones, Demeco, and Schaub coming off a major injury. We lose Cush, we lose Butler, and the rest of our LBs were shredded via injury.

Return game suffered. Running game suffered. Red zone suffered. Middle of the D suffered. The O, the D, and ST SUFFERED.

This was an uphill battle from the get go. We still won 13 games. Was it really that much of a devastating season all things considering?

Well, when you consider they had two opportunities to win a game for HFA - vikings or colts.....that is pretty devastating.

Just imagine if you had this game at home............


Big picture, it's a good year.....

Focus in on loss of HFA, loss of momentum to close out the year.....it is pretty bad......

Vinny
01-14-2013, 01:22 AM
I made a thread on this earlier in the season. We lost Winston, Mario, Dreessen, Briesel, Jones, Demeco, and Schaub coming off a major injury. We lose Cush, we lose Butler, and the rest of our LBs were shredded via injury.

Return game suffered. Running game suffered. Red zone suffered. Middle of the D suffered. The O, the D, and ST SUFFERED.

This was an uphill battle from the get go. We still won 13 games. Was it really that much of a devastating season all things considering?

how is it rebuilding when you replace good players with lesser players?

Norg
01-14-2013, 01:24 AM
we hopefully 2013 is not rebuilding but just re loading !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

fiasco west
01-14-2013, 01:30 AM
I made a thread on this earlier in the season. We lost Winston, Mario, Dreessen, Briesel, Jones, Demeco, and Schaub coming off a major injury. We lose Cush, we lose Butler, and the rest of our LBs were shredded via injury.

Return game suffered. Running game suffered. Red zone suffered. Middle of the D suffered. The O, the D, and ST SUFFERED.

This was an uphill battle from the get go. We still won 13 games. Was it really that much of a devastating season all things considering?

No, not devastating. Some people will say that but it's more about how the team responds from this season. This is the 2nd year they've been in the playoffs. Lets see if they take steps backwards or step forward.

Championship teams are hard to acquire and sometimes take a good deal of heart-ache and such.

mariowillshine15
01-14-2013, 01:32 AM
No, not devastating. Some people will say that but it's more about how the team responds from this season. This is the 2nd year they've been in the playoffs. Lets see if they take steps backwards or step forward.

Championship teams are hard to acquire and sometimes take a good deal of heart-ache and such.

It takes an elite QB. Get one of those and you contend every year.

AndyWin
01-14-2013, 01:34 AM
We're just fortunate the Jaguars and Titans did nothing and suck dick. Luck and the Colts will be a thorn, and I see a lot of seasons splits between these 2 games every year.

Unfortunately, I see many wild card home games in our future... that is our peak. Watching our offense play compared to the other teams in the playoffs was like watching molasses. Seeing Russell Wilson, Kaepernick, Flacco, Ryan, Brady make plays and get the ball DOWN field was something I envied as a Texans fan. And I will be envying it for years to come until a change is made, and well, we all know where that change needs to be.

fiasco west
01-14-2013, 01:39 AM
It takes an elite QB. Get one of those and you contend every year.

But there are 5 of these guys at any given time.

They are all taken.

I think we should have stacked up on defense. Relied on a game managing QB that is clutch...but tried our best to keep guys like Mario and Demeco. We'd have a Dline like those G-Men team at the very least and that has proven to win rings.

Norg
01-14-2013, 01:57 AM
what type of team does Rick and Mcnair want

a consistent team like our counterparts in the North Ravens and Pittsburg who make the playoffs year after year and get bounced in the Div or AFCC game ever year and if they dont anything less the 9-7 is tabboo


or a team like ATL and SF who take gambles

fiasco west
01-14-2013, 02:19 AM
how is it rebuilding when you replace good players with lesser players?

Yep.

Not sure what it is but we let go of so many good players last year.

Pro-bowl and all-pro players. Yeah I know teams have to let players go all the time but we just let of a bunch of them and replaced them mostly with rookies.

I'm not a cap guy...but it seems we manage it badly.

Bulls on Parade
01-14-2013, 02:28 AM
It was a good season but it could have been great if we hadn't lost control of the 1st seed in the AFC, and lost three of our last four regular-season games in disappointing fashion. We should have beaten the Vikings at home to clinch the 1st seed, and yet we still had a chance to clinch at Indianapolis the final game of the season but lost again to fall to 0-11 all time playing the Colts on the road.

My three goals for 2013: Win at Indianapolis for the first time ever, clinch the AFC's 1st seed and advance to the Super Bowl if not the AFC Championship Game for the first time in franchise history. Anything less would disappoint me. It still pains me that we fell short on all three in 2012.

Heck, I want to win the Super Bowl while the Texans window of opportunity remains somewhat decent. We should still be a very good team for the next three or four years. Maybe longer if we can find a young quarterback and number one wide receiver to eventually replace an aging Schaub and Andre. When you start talking about 2016 and 2017 -- aka we'll need some future superstars on offense.

But I'm only giving realistic goals for now. Having Brian Cushing back will energize the entire defense in 2013, but let's try to upgrade our entire defense this off-season. We need to focus on our front seven. I still feel like our pass rush was lacking when you take away J.J. Watt's incredible season.

The Texans don't have to gamble too much with the changes they have to make with their roster this off-season. We can win with what we have, along with a few upgrades and staying healthy next year. I think rather than criticize Gary Kubiak and Matt Schaub like the majority of Houston fans are doing, I'll take the high road and continue to support both and I look forward to 2013.

Norg
01-14-2013, 02:28 AM
i dont know guys i always thought Winston jus sucked and Demco well he started to suck has well was only taking 25% of snaps at the end

i deff thought Sharpton was a upgrade over Demco till he got hurt and now Dobbins

who do yall think is better right now DObbins or Demco ...????? real talk

infantrycak
01-14-2013, 05:32 AM
i dont know guys i always thought Winston jus sucked and Demco well he started to suck has well was only taking 25% of snaps at the end

i deff thought Sharpton was a upgrade over Demco till he got hurt and now Dobbins

who do yall think is better right now DObbins or Demco ...????? real talk

Sharpton and Dobbins at their best never played as well as DeMeco at his worst.

EllisUnit
01-14-2013, 05:38 AM
Dobbins is a big hitter and pretty good against the run IMO but he stinks it up when he is in coverage. Sharpton when is in has never impressed me and he is always on IR so that should be the end of him.

Only LBs we have who i have liked since cushing went out is Rudd. He did give up that TD yesterday but he was running stride for stride with the TE and had pretty good coverage, but it is Tom Brady and he tends to make perfect throws.

IMO i would like to see Cushing and Rudd in the middle with Reed and Whitney on the outside. I like Barwin but he disappeared this season and got virtually zero pressure when we needed it most.

Tailgate
01-14-2013, 09:06 AM
how is it rebuilding when you replace good players with lesser players?

Huh? That was the whole point and one of the keys for me in 2012. I knew this year would say alot about Kubes and company. Were we simply going to reload this year, or are we in the process of rebuilding? This team took a step back in overall play. But we still won 13 games and we lost Cushing early on.

This offseason will tell us next year if 2011 was simply our best team, and this is a sinking ship... Or if it was always going to take more than 1 year to replace all of these players properly.

And by properly, I do not mean Ruud for Demeco.

Goodwrench3
01-14-2013, 09:10 AM
We had a great year. Hell it's 12-4!! But the team showed some deficiencies, especially since Cushing was shutted down.

deucetx
01-14-2013, 09:56 AM
What worries me about next year is the defense. I think many felt Antonio Smith will be a cap casualty with a Cushing extension on the horizon. The signs seem to really point that way when they gave Tim Jamison an extension.

But after this season...I have no idea how good an idea that is. Outside of Watt, only Smith seemed capable of applying pressure on the pocket. Our edge rushers completely disappeared. It was Watt's show and Smith was his sidekick. Nobody else did much of anything in regards of pass rush. So if we let him go and roll with Jamison/Crick....where is Watt's help rushing? Can't send Cush all the time because he's the only linebacker capable of covering.

I hope Mercilus is ready because we need some sort of pressure from the edge especially if they let Smith go.

Hervoyel
01-14-2013, 10:24 AM
Dobbins is a big hitter and pretty good against the run IMO but he stinks it up when he is in coverage. Sharpton when is in has never impressed me and he is always on IR so that should be the end of him.

Only LBs we have who i have liked since cushing went out is Rudd. He did give up that TD yesterday but he was running stride for stride with the TE and had pretty good coverage, but it is Tom Brady and he tends to make perfect throws.

IMO i would like to see Cushing and Rudd in the middle with Reed and Whitney on the outside. I like Barwin but he disappeared this season and got virtually zero pressure when we needed it most.

Dobbins was an excellent role player. As you said he's exposed in coverage. Where he always shined was down by the goal line. He's got a knack for picking the hole the RB is coming through and delivering a big hit. He looks great if you don't ask him to defend a lot of space.

I'd like to find a way to keep Ruud. He's quality depth for another year if he'll stick around. Get Cushing back, draft a young guy to put in there next to him, and have James and Ruud behind them instead of Dobbins and Sharpton. That's a good unit right there. Your rookie ILB has gotta be a stone cold killer like Cushing though.

Tailgate
01-14-2013, 10:33 AM
2011 offseason GREAT... Put us on the map.

2012 offseason not great... Took us back a step.

2013 will have to be another great one.

Hervoyel
01-14-2013, 11:14 AM
Unavoidable conclusion: When you build on a shoddy foundation you're always rebuilding.

76Texan
01-14-2013, 12:43 PM
I agree with the OP; in many ways, we were in at least semi-rebuilding mode.

We have 3 young guys on the Oline, at least two of them (Brooks and Jones) show promises. Both played better than any of the Guards we ever had under Kubiak (at the same stage in their career.). If they continue to improve on a normal rate, they will be the best we ever had.

The same thing can be said about Graham.

Posey (discounting his injury) showed that he can be more consistent than Jacoby.

On defense, Ryan's dead money will be off the book, giving us more cap space to play around with.

We might be able to find somebody to pair with Cushing next year that can cover worth a crap.

Hopefully McCain comes back to battle it out with Harris.

Or we can find a third safety with the additional money.

One FA at either safety or ILB, and we can draft the other position.

Tailgate
01-14-2013, 01:58 PM
Our next draft will need more players that will impact the game better than the 2012 class did if we want to take a step forward.

TejasTom
01-14-2013, 02:10 PM
Should be a place FA want to come play.

Posted using Tapatalk from my phone. May contain errors.

Doppelganger
01-14-2013, 03:34 PM
what type of team does Rick and Mcnair want

a consistent team like our counterparts in the North Ravens and Pittsburg who make the playoffs year after year and get bounced in the Div or AFCC game ever year and if they dont anything less the 9-7 is tabboo


or a team like ATL and SF who take gambles

Pittsburgh has won 2 superbowls in recent memory...

Texecutioner
01-14-2013, 03:43 PM
Rebuilding year?? Not even close. We lost a few players just like every team does every off season. We were picked to go to a SB by a lot of people. They don't do that to teams that are rebuilding who have almost zero playoff history. We came back with a damn good team this year, but had holes just like any team. We weren't rebuilding by any means though, and we won't be next year either.

The Pencil Neck
01-14-2013, 03:45 PM
It takes an elite QB. Get one of those and you contend every year.

Do the Steelers have an elite QB? The Giants? The Ravens?

The Pencil Neck
01-14-2013, 03:47 PM
Unavoidable conclusion: When you build on a shoddy foundation you're always rebuilding.

12-4 and a playoff win is not rebuilding. And if it is, then you've got a great foundation.

Vinny
01-14-2013, 03:48 PM
Do the Steelers have an elite QB? The Giants? The Ravens?yeah, those are top QB's. Quibbling on the 'elite' tag notwithstanding. I don't see any of those guys schaubing the ball up the field slowly when behind.

The Pencil Neck
01-14-2013, 03:51 PM
yeah, those are top QB's. Quibbling on the 'elite' tag notwithstanding. I don't see any of those guys schaubing the ball up the field slowly when behind.

And yet, the Giants and Steelers were NOT contenders. Therefore, saying that having an "elite" QB means you will contend year after year is wrong. (Although, I don't consider either of those guys elite.)

And I don't consider Flacco even close to elite, and yet he's making it to the playoffs and to the AFCS year after year.

Vinny
01-14-2013, 03:57 PM
And yet, the Giants and Steelers were NOT contenders. Therefore, saying that having an "elite" QB means you will contend year after year is wrong. (Although, I don't consider either of those guys elite.)

And I don't consider Flacco even close to elite, and yet he's making it to the playoffs and to the AFCS year after year.You are going to argue this way? Since Schaub has a better record he is better than Big Ben? So I guess you are saying that Rothlisburger and Manning are just good when they win Super Bowls and Schaub is better than those guys in years that his team wins 12 games? Those guys lead their teams and play at a high level more often than not....certainly more often than Schaub. Just mentioning Big Ben and Schaub in the same sentence is laughable.

The Pencil Neck
01-14-2013, 04:20 PM
You are going to argue this way? Since Schaub has a better record he is better than Big Ben? So I guess you are saying that Rothlisburger and Manning are just good when they win Super Bowls and Schaub is better than those guys in years that his team wins 12 games? Those guys lead their teams and play at a high level more often than not....certainly more often than Schaub. Just mentioning Big Ben and Schaub in the same sentence is laughable.

I didn't say anything about Schaub, did I? Did I mention them in the same sentence? No. You did.

The guy I was responding to made the comment that having an elite QB assures you of being in contention. My point is, if those guys are elite, why aren't they in contention?

First: I don't consider those guys elite but like you said, that's a quibble about the definition of elite. If more than 10% of your guys are "elite" then they're not "elite". OTOH, people say you can't win a SB these days without an elite QB... "these days" being defined as starting after Brad Johnson's SB victory.

Second: But to the original guy's point, I don't think just having an elite QB puts you into contention. Look at the Saints. Brees alone is not enough.

Finally: Here it comes, I wasn't going to bring it up but you did, I think Schaub is good enough to win a SB. But he's got to have a superior team around him. He's not going to be able to carry a team into the playoffs and win games by force of will. Very few QBs are able to do that very often. Peyton only did it once and as far as I'm concerned, he's elite. I don't believe you have to be an elite QB to win a SB.

Rey
01-14-2013, 04:48 PM
I didn't say anything about Schaub, did I? Did I mention them in the same sentence? No. You did.

The guy I was responding to made the comment that having an elite QB assures you of being in contention. My point is, if those guys are elite, why aren't they in contention?

First: I don't consider those guys elite but like you said, that's a quibble about the definition of elite. If more than 10% of your guys are "elite" then they're not "elite". OTOH, people say you can't win a SB these days without an elite QB... "these days" being defined as starting after Brad Johnson's SB victory.

Second: But to the original guy's point, I don't think just having an elite QB puts you into contention. Look at the Saints. Brees alone is not enough.

Finally: Here it comes, I wasn't going to bring it up but you did, I think Schaub is good enough to win a SB. But he's got to have a superior team around him. He's not going to be able to carry a team into the playoffs and win games by force of will. Very few QBs are able to do that very often. Peyton only did it once and as far as I'm concerned, he's elite. I don't believe you have to be an elite QB to win a SB.

They are in contention every year...

Hervoyel
01-14-2013, 05:05 PM
Do the Steelers have an elite QB? The Giants? The Ravens?


It's all relative. Compared to the Texans yes, those teams all have elite QB's. I see rings, I see AFC Championship games. I see big throws under pressure in big games.

None of that can be seen here. I'd trade three Schaub's if I had them for one Ben, Eli, or Flacco.

And honestly, if you have to spring for a perfect team to put around a guy to win a Super Bowl then what in the hell do you need him for? Think about it. Schaub's biggest weakness in my opinion is that he cannot create anything. Nothing. He can't make a play out of a busted play to save his life much less win a game. The handful of times he ever did that were years ago and now he's slower and more mechanical than ever before. Your QB has to give you more than that. I saw someone earlier listing what he was best at and it read like a list of things damn near any obedient QB in the league could do. There was nothing special about that list. Just a bunch of "follows orders" and "reads defenses when protected".

This system makes him look good. That's it.

powda
01-14-2013, 05:10 PM
None of that can be seen here. I'd trade three Schaub's if I had them for one Ben, Eli, or Flacco.

Maybe just 2 schaubs for flaco. Ben would be fun to watch in this offense.

Hervoyel
01-14-2013, 05:28 PM
Maybe just 2 schaubs for flaco. Ben would be fun to watch in this offense.

Ben's the QB we should have drafted to build around. 2002 we should have done the smart thing and taken Peppers to build our defense. Start Banks for a couple of years and then grabbed Roethlisberger in 2004.

We got no offensive line? Fine, Ben doesn't need much of one.

The Pencil Neck
01-14-2013, 05:31 PM
They are in contention every year...

If you're not in the playoffs, you're not in contention.

If contending is just being in the mix on the last week of the season, then this team has been in contention a helluva lot more than a lot of people here want to admit.