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View Full Version : So i had an argument..........


Newbsies
06-13-2005, 03:55 PM
With a friend of mine the other night. I insisted that Dunta was a Top ten cornerback in the NFL, but my buddy didn't fully agree with me and listed 18 other "big name" CB's that are better than Dunta :dangit: , even listing our own PB as one of the ones better. Anyway, to get some sort of circulation started and kill some time, can you guys think of fifteen better CB's than Dunta? I can think of about six, maybe seven, but that's about it.

281
06-13-2005, 04:43 PM
Dunta is DEFINITELY top ten. Find me another corner who is blazing fast, doesn't get burned often, and hits like a mack truck (Besides Winfield).

Lucky
06-13-2005, 04:48 PM
I can think of about six, maybe seven, but that's about it.
Name them. We might be able to start a pointless little argument right now. :)

TEXANS84
06-13-2005, 05:08 PM
Ty Law
Champ Bailey
Patrick Surtain
Ronde Barber
Charles Woodson
Samari Rolle
Lito Shepard
Fred Smoot
Rasheen Mathis
Sam Madison
Nate Clements
Ken Lucas

Compare those guys. I think its too early to call Dunta an "elite" cornerback, but if he has another season like he did last year...then yes.

Lucky
06-13-2005, 05:11 PM
Ty Law
Champ Bailey
Patrick Surtain
Ronde Barber
Charles Woodson
Samari Rolle
Lito Shepard
Fred Smoot
Rasheen Mathis
Sam Madison
Nate Clements
Ken Lucas
So you're saying you would trade Dunta straight up for all of these guys?

TEXANS84
06-13-2005, 05:19 PM
So you're saying you would trade Dunta straight up for all of these guys?

No, because I see more upside to Dunta...with this being his 2nd season. And the list was just thrown together. It wasn't a list of the better cornerbacks than Dunta.

It was just a reference list to compare Dunta with other quality and elite cornerbacks.

TheGus
06-13-2005, 05:35 PM
well all those CBS are pretty old and I bet Dunta could beat them in an interception deflect passes contest. As far as I'm concerned Dunta is top ten of the YOUNG CBs. However Andre Johnson is no doubt #1 in YOUNG WRs.

SESupergenius
06-13-2005, 05:40 PM
Without even thinking I could name 15 other guys that are better than Dunta. He'd have to go up against the star recievers to get my nod for being one of the best in the league.

Beastlyman2003
06-13-2005, 05:42 PM
Ty Law
Champ Bailey
Patrick Surtain
Ronde Barber
Charles Woodson
Samari Rolle
Lito Shepard
Fred Smoot
Rasheen Mathis
Sam Madison
Nate Clements
Ken Lucas



Dude, comeon now these guys are probably ranked like this on Madden, but truth be told, Dunta is without a doubt better than the bottom five on your list. I could also argue that he is better than Lito Shepard, TALENT-WISE, and that i would have much rather have had D-Rob than CHUMP bailey last year. I would also rather have him than TY Law anyways. Truth be told he is the best overall CB on this list. My reasons being that a WR (not to mention any QB or RB) think about gettin licked by him, as well as pickin off throws. THis kids a stud!

TEXANS84
06-13-2005, 05:50 PM
Dude, comeon now these guys are probably ranked like this on Madden, but truth be told, Dunta is without a doubt better than the bottom five on your list.

The list is in no particular order. Like I said earlier, its a comparison list. These are some of the better cornerbacks in the leauge.

Doom Capers
06-13-2005, 07:46 PM
Ty Law


OVER RATED!

Lucky
06-13-2005, 10:09 PM
Without even thinking I could name 15 other guys that are better than Dunta.
Do it. It's difficult to have a discussion if you don't share your opinion of who is better.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
06-13-2005, 10:16 PM
Champ Bailey
Chris McAlister
Ty Law
Patrick Surtain
Samari Rolle
Dunta Robinson

Grid
06-14-2005, 06:07 PM
im not gonna go to indepth.. i just want to point out that putting Rasheen Mathis above Dunta Robinson is ignorance of the finest flavor.

Thats like putting Harrington above Roethlisburger.


I also agree that Madison, Clements, and Lucas are not as good as DRob.

That basicly puts Drob at about #8 on your list. a FAIR assessment.. though I dont agree with it.

DRob was the BEST CB in the league last season.. he may not have dominated every stat.. but the ones he didnt lead in, he came close.. and he threw in some sacks and FFs as well.

The only reason I wont rate DRob at the top is because its only his second season.

TEXANS84
06-14-2005, 06:23 PM
im not gonna go to indepth.. i just want to point out that putting Rasheen Mathis above Dunta Robinson is ignorance of the finest flavor.

I am going to assume that this is directed at me.

Like I said in a few times before, it is a comparison list. Dunta is not on that list because I was comparing him to other "equals" and/or greaters at that position.

I personally do NOT think that Rasheen Mathis is better than Dunta. But they both are in the tier of younger defensive backs on the elite rise.

Panther5407
06-14-2005, 09:15 PM
there is a big time disscussion about this over on the pigskinheaven board right now. Half the people are saying that Dunta is in the top ten when the others say Rasheen Mathis(from the jags) is way bettter and more promising than dunta.

Vinny
06-14-2005, 09:21 PM
Half the people are saying that Dunta is in the top ten when the others say Rasheen Mathis(from the jags) is way bettter and more promising than dunta.Mathis is good but no team in the NFL takes Mathis over Robinson if they were both in the same draft. Jag fans are like a box o' chocolates.

SESupergenius
06-14-2005, 11:58 PM
Do it. It's difficult to have a discussion if you don't share your opinion of who is better.
It's also difficult to cast your vote for Robinson when he's going up against the other teams #2 reciever or is lined up at the nickel. He wasn't even the best CB on the team last year even though we were ranked 24th in the league in pass defense.

TEXANS84
06-15-2005, 12:04 AM
even though we were ranked 24th in the league in pass defense.
3/4th of that problem applies to the linebackers/linemen putting pressure on the quarterback.
If no pressure is applied to the QB, then you'll see defensive backs that can't cover.

beerlover
06-15-2005, 12:08 AM
it takes time to get the recognition to make these all star lists or best @ position polls, its more a function of lag time not accuratly reflecting reality. Dunta showed enough upside in his rookie season to be the next Deion Sanders, you'd have to be a fool to trade him for any CB in the NFL. That being said he will have to continue his prolific play to be considered amongst the elite in the NFL, most of us here of course should agree that he stands an outstanding chance to accomplish this :thumbup

Lucky
06-15-2005, 07:54 AM
It's also difficult to cast your vote for Robinson when he's going up against the other teams #2 reciever or is lined up at the nickel. He wasn't even the best CB on the team last year even though we were ranked 24th in the league in pass defense.
I'm not following your "always goes against the #2 WR" reasoning. The opposition never lines up their top WR on the left side? They never go to the slot receiver on 3rd down?

As far as the pass defense ranking goes, don't you have to take into consideration the lack of a pass rush? For the Texans to be top 5 in interceptions while being dead last in sacks is pretty remarkable accomplishment for the secondary. I think so, anyway. And really, by the end of the season Dunta was head & shoulders the best player on the Texans defense. If you watched the games, that's undeniable.

TheOgre
06-15-2005, 08:03 AM
Robinson was playing like a top 10 CB by the end of the year, but that doesn't make him one. He has to show consistency. With only one season under his belt (and some forgettable weeks early in the season), he needs more time to show us what he's got.

Lucky
06-15-2005, 11:22 AM
Robinson was playing like a top 10 CB by the end of the year, but that doesn't make him one. He has to show consistency.
Robinson was a rookie. He started slow, ramped up his performance as the weeks went by, and was a top flight CB by the end of the season. That doesn't indicate inconsistency, that's evidence of a learning curve. Dunta could even get better. And should get better, while many of the guys on these lists above will regress due to age and physical limitations. Dunta will be mentioned among the top 4-5 corners in the league by the end of the '05 season.

Mr Shush
06-15-2005, 11:39 AM
I'm very much on the pro-Dunta side of this one (Sam Madison? Come on, the dude's been pants for at least a year or two), but if we want to talk about talent and upside as a case for liking him better than CBs more widely regarded as "elite", people like DeAngelo Hall, who missed most of last season injured but has the tools to be, if anything, a better cover corner than D-Rob (though not as good in run support or on the blitz), ought to be brought in by that logic as well.

Lucky
06-15-2005, 12:34 PM
...but if we want to talk about talent and upside as a case for liking him better than CBs more widely regarded as "elite", people like DeAngelo Hall, who missed most of last season injured but has the tools to be, if anything, a better cover corner than D-Rob...
What "tools" does Hall have that are better than Robinson's "tools"?

infantrycak
06-15-2005, 12:50 PM
What "tools" does Hall have that are better than Robinson's "tools"?

Self-promotion.

B.Diddy
06-15-2005, 02:51 PM
This is true Deion Sanders might not have the best corner in the league at times but when he did make a big play he made sure you noticed him
marketing himself he even admitted it on behind the glory.

Panther5407
06-15-2005, 02:59 PM
Mathis is good but no team in the NFL takes Mathis over Robinson if they were both in the same draft. Jag fans are like a box o' chocolates.


What they are trying to say is Mathis had worse stats than D-Rob because people were afraid to throw to his side an always went away from him.

Vinny
06-15-2005, 03:03 PM
That's why you have to watch players play instead of just looking at stat sheets. Their argument is only good if you never watch the guys play. Football is too complex to simply point at stats to determine good players. Nobody in the league would take Mathis over Robinson...trust me on this. Let the fools spew. That's how we identify them. :cool:

TexansNeedRBin05
06-15-2005, 03:26 PM
I really dont know where he ranks (though he is awesome) But lets say this.

Texans are DANG! Lucky to have him! :highfive: